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VIA, too much misunderstandings

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January 29, 2002 7:25:07 PM

I wanna tell you that to me, I don't hate those guys and that the talks of unstable chipsets is plain old wives' tales. Maybe it was before but it's gotten old. I have the Epox 8KHA+ and the chipset has not done anything disappointing, rather performance. I don't know why too many hate VIA, but I do appreciate their latest chipset a lot, as I have the hardware that most people claim it crashes with, such as SB LIVE.
Why so many targetting at VIA, I dunno, but whatever was said about them has to be put in the past as I am not getting anything from those curses and am enjoying my AMD system to its fullest.

--
The other day I heard an explosion from the other side of town.... It was a 486 booting up...

More about : misunderstandings

January 29, 2002 8:29:51 PM

Good for you but many people who refuse to buy VIA (like myself) do it from experience, not hearsay. They're kinda like the boy who cried wolf: I couldn't care less if everyone and their mother says VIA's got their act together now or not, I've been burned one too many times. And judging from the prolific supply of new threads on this newsgroup of people having problems with their Athlon systems (nearly always with VIA chipsets), the company's products look as hit and miss to me as they always have.
January 29, 2002 9:07:35 PM

VIA still has some bugs, but they are far better than before.

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
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January 29, 2002 10:58:02 PM

Ditto here friend. There are some issues with VIA I guess, but I have never ran in to any that were not related to my tinkering to much, I think that is also the culprit from many of these people who bad mouth the products.

Again, any company that sells alot of stuff is bound to have more mess ups or more bad apples out there. Simply put, anyone who wants the most out of AMD uses VIA, no questions asked.

With my board under XP, a clean install with no via 4in1s installed this system never crashes. Oh and I'm using the Sound Blaster Audigy strange how I havent had one problem ever with this combination and I am always a early adopter of new VIA chipsets and SB cards...
it boils down to knowing how to get things to work together.

"dude your getting a dell", is that kid trying to say he wants to stick his 'dell' in you?
a b à CPUs
January 30, 2002 12:02:58 AM

"knowing how to get things to work together" is not always possible, I have found several (older) cards that simply would not work at all, and some newer cards that would not work with each other, on VIA chipsets. The solutions-ditch all your older hardware, remove cards that cause problems...I DON'T THINK SO! Especially if you NEED those cards!

What's the frequency, Kenneth?
January 30, 2002 12:07:54 AM

Well that's how it goes then, some are cursed, others are not.
I for one was lucky and VIA likes me!
Maybe your name has something to do with it...? :) 

--
The other day I heard an explosion from the other side of town.... It was a 486 booting up...
a b à CPUs
January 30, 2002 12:14:56 AM

The simpler the system the more likely VIA chipsets are to work. I haven't tried the KT266A, but for everything I have tried, 4+ PCI cards=big nono.

What's the frequency, Kenneth?
January 30, 2002 2:42:34 AM

I realize I'm just one user, but I've never had a problem with four PCI cards in my VIA systems. I've got a NIC, a Philips Acoustic Edge sound card, a Promise FastTrak100 RAID controller, and a USB port. I also had a SB Live! Value (before I got the Philips) and an ATI TV Wonder in there at one point, still with no problems. They've worked fine on my last three systems (KX133, AMD761, and KT266A). So I guess that's one vote for VIA.

<i>I made you look. But I can't make you see.</i>
a b à CPUs
January 30, 2002 2:54:08 AM

Pretty impressive!

What's the frequency, Kenneth?
January 30, 2002 3:12:06 AM

Thanks ... know anyone who's hiring? lol

<i>I made you look. But I can't make you see.</i>
January 30, 2002 9:24:36 AM

Quote:
"knowing how to get things to work together" is not always possible, I have found several (older) cards that simply would not work at all, and some newer cards that would not work with each other, on VIA chipsets. The solutions-ditch all your older hardware, remove cards that cause problems...I DON'T THINK SO! Especially if you NEED those cards!


A perfectly valid reason not to buy via, if you have 10 year old cards....which 99% of people dont.

"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
No Overclock+stock hsf=GOOD!
January 30, 2002 1:21:08 PM

I've had the same experience. I can fill every PCI slot on my AMD761+VIA686B motherboard and have zero problems--even with three or four bandwidth-hungry bus-mastering cards. Same went for my VIA KX133 motherboard. My father's VIA MVP3 (Super Socket7) motherboard works fine as well.

I even have this SBLive! that everyone's supposed to have problems with. No audio corruption, no static, no lockups, nothing.

<i>If a server crashes in a server farm and no one pings it, does it still cost four figures to fix?
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
January 30, 2002 1:29:01 PM

I agree with you. I am using a Asus PIII motherboard equipped with VIA chipset. I have been using W2k since day one, never have a crush, no problem with any hardware. According to THG, they test tons of MB with VIA chipset, they don't mention there is any problem. Maybe some people had some bad experience at the beginning, that's why they don't want to use VIA again. But VIA is very good in terms of price, and very good performance.
a b à CPUs
January 30, 2002 3:18:22 PM

PCI was introduced 7 years ago on the desktop, cards that matter in this situation are 3 to 7 years old.

What's the frequency, Kenneth?
January 30, 2002 4:08:26 PM

I agree with the VIA user. My system works great till I mess with it and the VIA out numbers the other chips by a great deal. I must not be experience enough to have problems or maybe I was lucky with my last 6 VIA boards. I get so bord over here, because it doesn't take to long to put a system together or update it or run out of money. Sometimes I'm over clocking and testing before I even have windows installed. I get jealous because someone els is having so much trouble, why do I have to be so darn lucky?
January 30, 2002 6:36:13 PM

note this - i have Intels 440BX Seatle 2 MOBO.
and up until this day - if i plus my ISA network card in
the system wont POST... it dosent even let me in the BIOS.
and this network card works great on a VIA Apollo chipset (cant remember which chipset - it runs Celron 800 Socket370).

and the 440BX is considerd by many (including me) as the F*CKING BEST chipset Intel ever made...
January 31, 2002 3:38:17 PM

I also have the AMD761 and the Via 686b, and my system runs very stable.
But when I first assembled it at refused to get stable, tried changing soundcards (PCI128 instead of SBLive0, changing PCI slots, using the Via Latency Patch, installing the newest version of the 4in1 drivers, notting worked to get it stable, till I saw someone posting on this forum that said that disabling the COM-ports might work, I did it and my system has been rock stable since.
I still wonder if it was a software or chipset problem.

My case has so many fans that it hovers above the ground :eek:  .
January 31, 2002 3:53:04 PM

Funny, I didn't have to do anything like that. And I actually <i>use</i> both COM ports...

<i>If a server crashes in a server farm and no one pings it, does it still cost four figures to fix?
January 31, 2002 3:57:24 PM

Me too Mine is loaded to the gills
MSI kt266 pro
I use both commports (remote control and usr 56k fax)
geforce 2 GTS
pci tv tuner
aureal vortex 2
dlink 530tx
realtek 8139as
realmagic hollywood plus
And NEVER a problem

Blame the newbies not the technology
January 31, 2002 4:08:41 PM

That makes me wonder even more, I could try to enable the ports again, but I don't want to get my Windows98 screwed again because I don't have the time and willing to reinstall it again when my drivers are screwed up.
I can give you additionel information about my system and the problems I had, maybe you can explain if it was a chipset or software problem.

My case has so many fans that it hovers above the ground :eek:  .
January 31, 2002 4:14:04 PM

I too have the AMD761 (GA7DXR+)both com port are used for the web cam and the camera device, plus i have a Lava serial/pci card ,SB Audigy ,2 x 3C 905C nic and pci radio card(scanner).
This system is rock stable and i never had to desactivate nothing exept for tunning when I bench it.

It was probably a software problem.

Sorry for my spelling I'm french...hey I ain't perfect!
January 31, 2002 4:23:59 PM

I have the SBLive (which is famous combined with the 686b) and a generic NIC, I also use my onboard RAID controller (Abit KG7-RAID) when I first installed my system I couldn't get my RAID drivers to work in combination with the SBLive without disabling the SB16 emulation, but after it worked my system would almost crash evry 5 minutes and I couldn't play games. So I installed some new drivers... still unstable... used the Latency Patch... worked a little, but when I freed some IRQ my system suddenly got stable even without the Latency Patch, strange strange strange.

My case has so many fans that it hovers above the ground :eek:  .
January 31, 2002 4:30:17 PM

That's something I'd very much like to see myself. Perhaps you could paste your resource configuration--both the one that Windows shows you, and the one that appears at the end of POST. Just IRQ and DMA, I suppose; the rest is just too much to paste.

Just FYI, my card load is:

Guillemot 3D Prophet DDR-DVI (GeForce DDR w/ the "fuzzy" AGP3.9x voltage)
Intel PRO/1000 fiber Gigabit nic (half-length 64-bit bus-mastering hot-plug PCI device)
Adaptec 2940 Ultra SCSI controller (half-length bus-mastering PCI card)
DPT PM2554U2 (full-length, multi-function, bus-mastering PCI SCSI RAID card with a daughterboard on a second layer. 'tis a monster)
SB Live! value (the original, supposedly VIA-crushing thing)
HP LaserJet 6L on LPT1, UPS on COM1, occasional TI-85 calculator on COM2, occasional various USB devices hooked up.

According to Intel fans, by all rights I should have problems and crashes out the wazoo. So far not one such problem.

<i>If a server crashes in a server farm and no one pings it, does it still cost four figures to fix?
January 31, 2002 4:45:38 PM

Maybe a strange question, but where/with which app can I get all the information about Windows IRQ/DMA settings so I can cut and past it (to lazy to type it over). I tried Sandra and the normal Systemcontrol app. (or whatever that is called in English I have a Dutch language version).

But I can give you my card info:
PCI 2 Realthek Ethernet card with normal reathek drivers
PCI 4 SbLive! Value (original) with LiveWare 3.0
AGP Asus V7100 with NVidia 23.11 drivers
Highpoint 370 UDMA/ATA100 RAID controller driver version 2.0.0919.
Via 4in1 drivers 4.37
AMD AGP Miniport driver
Windows98 (with all updates).

My case has so many fans that it hovers above the ground :eek:  .
January 31, 2002 4:57:00 PM

Just right-click on "My computer", click on "Properties," go to the Device Manager, click on the computer at the head of the device list (may be called "Computer", "My Computer", or the name you entered for the computer during setup). You should get a screen where you can list resource settings by IRQ, I/O range, DMA, and memory range.

Another option is to run "winmsd" if you have it. I'm not sure if Win98 has it though.

You should be able to get the settings your BIOS assigns to everything if you simply hit "pause" during boot, just before it starts loading the master boot record.

<i>If a server crashes in a server farm and no one pings it, does it still cost four figures to fix?
January 31, 2002 5:13:52 PM

I know it, but I can't copy - past in that screen :frown: .

My case has so many fans that it hovers above the ground :eek:  .
January 31, 2002 5:31:24 PM

Alt+PrintScreen can get you a graphical shot of the window...

<i>If a server crashes in a server farm and no one pings it, does it still cost four figures to fix?
February 1, 2002 10:37:06 AM

Yes but I don't think you like the Dutch names of the components so I'll translate it:
IRQ
0 Systemtimer
1 Keyboard
2 Programmable interruptcontroler
3 SB Live! Value
3 USB Via VT83C572/VT82C586 (two times)
3 ACPI IRQ Holder
4 SCI IRQ used by ACPI bus
5 NVIDIA GeForce2 MX
5 ACPI IRQ Holder
6 FD
7 LPT1
8 CMOS
9 free
10 32-bit NIC
10 ACPI IRQ Holder
11 HPT370 UDMA/ATA100 RAID controller
11 ACPI IRG Holder
12 PS/2 Mouse
13 Mathematic processor
14 Primary Bus Master IDE controller
14 VIA Bus Master PCI IDE controller
15 Secondary Bus Master IDE controller
15 VIA Bus Master PCI IDE controller

DMA
0,1 free
2 FD
3 free
4 Controller for DMA
5,6,7 free

Maybe a little to detailed...

My case has so many fans that it hovers above the ground :eek:  .
February 1, 2002 2:29:54 PM

No wonder you had to disable your COM ports...look at all the stuff you've got sitting on IRQ 3! :wink: That's COM2/COM4's regular IRQ...and IRQ4 is normally assigned to COM1/COM3.

DISCLAIMER: Though I wouldn't expect them to, the next steps may cause Win98 to complain.

To get around this, you need to find the "PNP/PCI configuration" section of your BIOS. Where it says "Resources Controlled By:" you need to make sure it says "Manual" instead of "Auto."

Afterwards, you should have a list of IRQs and a memory range selection. IRQ2 and IRQ3 are likely to be set for "PCI/PnP"; you need to change those to "Legacy ISA." (While you're at it, do the same for IRQ7, your LPT1 IRQ) Then change "Reset configuration data" to "Enabled."

What all this does:

It tells the BIOS not to assign IRQ 3, 4, or 7 to PCI/PnP hardware, since it expects legacy non-PnP hardware (the COM/LPT ports) to be sitting on those IRQs. Enabling "Reset configuration data" should cause the system to completely reconfigure itself on the next boot, as if it had a hardware change (this field is always reset to "Disabled" after POST, btw--it's just a one-shot deal every time you enable it).

Then try to boot Windows. If you can run Windows without trouble now, check your IRQ tables and make sure (again) that there's nothing on IRQ 3 or 4. Then reboot, enable your COM ports, and see what happens...

<i>If a server crashes in a server farm and no one pings it, does it still cost four figures to fix?
February 2, 2002 7:43:12 AM

That was how I had it set before I disabled the COM ports the IRQ 3 and 4 where used by COM1/2 and IRQ 7 by LPT1, but then the USB ports, soundcard will all take IRQ 9 or 10 (don't know for sure) which made my system very unstable.

My case has so many fans that it hovers above the ground :eek:  .
February 2, 2002 8:04:39 AM

my EPoX is a freak, but i love it, it refuses to run with my XP1800 and the orginal ddr i got, but runs perfect if i replace the cpu or the ram, it worked perfectly for 2 weeks before this compatibility issue turned up... now i run a tbird at 1.52 (AXIA, cant push it much further without lockups) and the original ram and ive got the XP on a ECS SiS735 board K7S5A i think with a gig of SDR, im happy

if in doubt blame microsoft...
February 2, 2002 12:45:17 PM

Peoples got problems with IRQ because newer BIOS, OSes and pci card us to works with IRQ sharing. So, if you put a non-sharing compliant device, and the system configure it with sharing in mind, then the system become instable. By disabling the com ports, or any other ports , you simply free some IRQ for the system to works with so it can put less device on the same interrupt.

Interrupt sharing is necessary because, at first, the designer of the PC never tought that so much card will one day be added to the system...well, it was a long time ago. And didnt put enough interrupt to play with them. Newer hardware can share without problems, because, even if 2 or 3 device sharing the same IRQ, the system can only serve one at time. But the OS has to know which card interrupt it, to give it some time. That why you mostly need newer modern hardware compatible with the newer standard these days.

It is call evolution. But, I'm still waiting for the REVOLUTION. Just like when peoples start complaining that some DOS apps didnt works with windows 3.1...and some Win3.1 apps didnt works with Win95...and some Win95 apps didnt works with Win98...and...until that some older apps that doesnt works win XP.

It is sad and expensive sometimes, but it is that!

-Always put the blame on you first, then on the hardware !!!
February 2, 2002 3:16:43 PM

Hi,
I have a friend here who is going to receive a sparkling new system in a few days. Since it is based upon the Via KT266A, I was wondering wether he is going to need those drivers from VIA. BTW, what are they good for? I never heard of drivers for a mobo ... Or are it drivers for the on-board devices?

Greetz,

Bikeman
February 2, 2002 3:30:13 PM

I would think the new system would be all right.

If it ant broke don't fix it.
February 2, 2002 4:24:20 PM

It's drivers for on-board devices--drivers for the IDE controllers, the AGP slot, the IRQ routing, the sound, and the USB ports. People have had to use them for both Intel and VIA chipsets in the past.

Currently, in Win2K (with Service Pack 2) and WinXP, Microsoft provides their own reference VIA drivers with pretty decent performance. Still, the VIA-supplied chipset drivers usually have support for the latest chipsets and include the latest performance tweaks and bugfixes (which Microsoft reference drivers may lack).

As for evolution and IRQ's, the next "revolution" is supposed to be ACPI IRQ routing--where PCI/AGP devices all sit on a single IRQ, yet the operating system still knows which hardware to service when an interrupt gets raised. The best way to get ACPI IRQ routing is to get Win2K or WinXP; Win98 and earlier won't support it. Generally, if a piece of hardware has drivers for Win2K or greater, it's designed to work under ACPI and should manage just fine.

If everything worked as it should, though, people like me wouldn't have a job. :wink:

<i>If a server crashes in a server farm and no one pings it, does it still cost four figures to fix?
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