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odd, yet interesting.

Forum Old Man/Woman's Club : Other - odd, yet interesting.

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<A HREF="http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/09/13/MTFH89819_2005-09-13_18-35-28_EIC358139.html" target="_new">http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/09/13/MTFH89819_2005-09-13_18-35-28_EIC358139.html</A>

Bush takes responsibility for failures of federal governments involvement in the aftermath of Katrina.

Discuss.

<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com/nutshell.mp3" target="_new">"Like a scrotum, there it is in a nutshell."</A>
<font color=red>Roll Tide!</font color=red>
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Apathetic As<i></i>shole.}=-</A>

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ultimately all responsibility falls on his shoulders. He is our Commander in Chief,the Prez.
But at the same time it does not excuse the incompitance of the Mayor of NO nor the govenor of La For not evacuating according to plans.

I aint signing nothing!!!

Reply to Rick_Criswell

He's in charge, it's his responsibility. Is it his fault? Nowhere near so, but that doesn't matter. The buck stops there. Have to admire a stand-up person like that.

I tend to keep my political views to myself, especially since they're quite different than most opinions I've seen, but as much as I think many of his decisions were the wrong ones (nothing to do with Katrina), I just have to admire and support him in this. Is he a good president? IMO, so-so. Is he a good person deserving of much more respect than many people accord him? <b>YES!</b>

Blame the NO Mayor and LA Governor.

His political career is over (after President, what is there?*), so he can take the blame for others in the short term and suffer no long-term effects from it.

* I know there's a lot he can still do, but he doesn't have to save political face for the next election...

Mike.

<font color=blue>Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside the dog its too dark to read.
-- Groucho Marx</font color=blue>

Reply to fishmahn
- 0 +

but it should fall amongst the checks and balances, we have a balance of between the state government and federal government; hence there should be a balance of blame, i feel that he is the bigger man by standing up to this an admitting and trying to help rather than letting dems and reps argue over who is to blame.

<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com/nutshell.mp3" target="_new">"Like a scrotum, there it is in a nutshell."</A>
<font color=red>Roll Tide!</font color=red>
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Apathetic As<i></i>shole.}=-</A>

Reply to mrface
- 0 +

oh i agree there is alot more he(anyone for that matter) can do and it will be seen in the future what/how he will respond. he is supposed to address the nation on thurs.

what do you think of the new FEMA dir.?

<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com/nutshell.mp3" target="_new">"Like a scrotum, there it is in a nutshell."</A>
<font color=red>Roll Tide!</font color=red>
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Apathetic As<i></i>shole.}=-</A>

Reply to mrface

I'm much more impressed with him than his predecesser. At least he has experience in that 'industry' and isn't a political hire. I get enough of that in the city I live near (look at Chicago's political hiring scandals...). Whether it is a good choice for the long run remains to be seen, but he's the right man today.

Mike.


<font color=blue>Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside the dog its too dark to read.
-- Groucho Marx</font color=blue>

Reply to fishmahn

Yes, I fully understant that.
But at this point in time he has the lowest approval rating he has ever had.
Trying to blame others would of only made things worse.
.
So I give him the nod of agreement for taking blame and kicking everyone else in the assp to get help rolling in the right direction.

As a side note ,my best friends dad is a retired officer for the Army Corps of Engineers. He and about 600 others have been contacted and reinstated. To arrive on site as soon as possible to clean up and rebuild the levee systems.
Hate to say it but a lot of NO will be bulldozed and incinerated because of contamination.

I aint signing nothing!!!

Reply to Rick_Criswell

The Mayor of NO and the Gov of LA. are the ones that should shoulder the majority of the blame. Bush is taking heat mostly because of the left choosing to use this as an opportunity to gain support for the next pres. election.

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Reply to mozzartusm
- 0 +

Like I said from day one. It just took HIM some time to figure it out.

<font color=red><b>Long live Dhanity and the minions scouring the depths of Wingdingium!

Reply to dhlucke

Phuks, from an outsiders perspective, I believe that the Bush administration felt it had to shoulder a large amount of the blame or face political suicide at your next general election. Louisiana is a Republican state and I have no doubts that to deny the federal gov's lack of responsibility would only hurt them in key states later on. The aftermath will go on for years - there's no quick fix solution, politically speaking, for NO's problems and to deny now would hurt the Republicans for years to come.

<b><font color=green> "Nobody ever lives their life all the way up except bullfighters." - Ernest Hemingway, <i> The Sun Also Rises </i> </b> </font color=green>

Reply to BomberBill

LA, is a traditionaly Democratic state.

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Reply to mozzartusm
- 0 +

The trend was changing. I think this next election is going to be far more interesting than any of the Bush elections.

Actually I'm almost thinking that the midterm elections will be more exciting. The landscape is probably going to really change over and over again for the next couple of elections due to the massive amount of social, political, and military changes we've seen in the last couple of years.

<font color=red><b>Long live Dhanity and the minions scouring the depths of Wingdingium!

Reply to dhlucke

Interestingly, I've seen a couple of polls taken from the US post-Katrina and of the people who called themselves 'moderate Republicans' the majority felt Bush had let his countrymen down. In the same poll, these people also felt that the State and city administrations had not done enough too but Bush was not seen in a positive light.

Bush's domestic advisors have to respond to that information knowing full well that it may cost them votes otherwise. There's nothing more politically damning than a leader losing his constituents faith in his/her leadership.

<b><font color=green> "Nobody ever lives their life all the way up except bullfighters." - Ernest Hemingway, <i> The Sun Also Rises </i> </b> </font color=green>

Reply to BomberBill

Perception definately matters more than truth when it comes to issues such as these. In our form of Gov. things work alot smoother when the local and state Gov do their job. The federal level just doesnt do a very good job at getting things done especially in a situation where time is the key. The federal level also does a horrible job at managing money. This is why everyone here is bieng advised to give to charitys and not to FEMA. The media is the problem. They are so far left and they pick and choose what and how they will cover an event.

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Reply to mozzartusm

I was just pointing out that LA was a mostly democratic state.

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Reply to mozzartusm

It probably will, but in which direction do you see it going?

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Reply to mozzartusm

I apologise, Mozz. I watched a report over here stating that Louisiana is currently a Republican state. Is that not right? The report came from the Australian 60 minutes and I would not put it past them to fock up basic facts.

I would have thought that it would have been a Democratic state also, thus my surprise at seeing otherwise.

What's the bet it will be at the next election?

<b><font color=green> "Nobody ever lives their life all the way up except bullfighters." - Ernest Hemingway, <i> The Sun Also Rises </i> </b> </font color=green>

Reply to BomberBill
- 0 +

I'm not sure. I live in such a polarized state that's I can't tell since I doubt much will change here.

However, I see myself voting a bit more towards the middle or left than I have in the last 6 years or so. I just feel like the country has given the republicans a chance and I have yet to see any real positive results. I'm not saying they couldn't finish the war in Iraq, work on the economy, etc, but maybe a change would spur some results a bit quicker. We're going to have a 1% dip in the GDP and about 500,000 more unemployed people due to Hurricane Katrina alone and I'm really not thinking the Republicans are up for the job of making things right. If they really wanted to help the people they wouldn't have lifted the rule that states contracters have to pay a competative wage. Not only are they not providing for a competative wage, they're providing no bid contracts with guaranteed profit margins. Any employer with this type of power would fleece the government and its workers. These workers who by the way just lost everything but their lives. It's going to cost 4 times as much as it should. They're currently throwing tens of billions towards the recovery without any real accountability. It'll probably cost taxpayers an extra $100,000,000,000 because the goverment was not prepared or had no plan for this type of scenario. How is it possible that the goverment wouldn't have a better plan after the 9/11 attacks? Our post disaster organization skills should be a lot better. What the hell have they been doing? Granted local and state government screwed up a lot, but the federal government should have been saying to themselves, "Hmmm, category 4 hurricane, levees breaking, flooding..., this is probably something bigger than the state and local governments are capable of, lets get in there NOW." Better yet, when there was a category 5 hurrican on a direct path for New Orleans they should have been mobilizing in record numbers.

Fuel prices are at record highs. What is the government's solution? I have yet to see a plan to lower fuel costs or provide for a replacement to the combustion engine.

The war in Iraq was severely undermanned due to this theory that a small force could do the job. They forgot about the post war scene. No police forces and not enough troops. The second they realized they needed more boots on the ground (which was years ago) they should have brought them over within months. The whole Sunni triangle should have been filled with 300,000 soldiers. The insurgancy should have ended a long time ago.

Stem cell research? If the USA falls behind on this it's because of this administration. That will really piss me off.

We currently are appointing a supreme court justice (and soon another) who won't take a stand on abortion. I think the guy sounds sharp as sh1t, but he won't take a stand on abortion? Yes or no buddy, you're going to be on the court for probably 30 years.

Anyways, that's on my mind right now. I'm one of those people who likes change but I'm going to be sore as hell if they put Hilary on the ballot since I can't imagine voting for her.

People are going to ask big questions and they're going to require real answers and not the political bullshit we got nowadays.

<font color=red><b>Long live Dhanity and the minions scouring the depths of Wingdingium!

Reply to dhlucke
- 0 +

I don't see that the Dem.s have any plan, other than their hatred of Bush... That doesn't translate into votes though... I don't see them getting back in control of the house or senate in the mid term elections, myself....



Dazzle them with Brilliance, or Baffle them with BS! :wink:

Reply to RCPilot
- 0 +

I don't see them having a plan either. That's been the problem for years. However, if they do get a plan...

<font color=red><b>Long live Dhanity and the minions scouring the depths of Wingdingium!

Reply to dhlucke
- 0 +

I think it was a savvy move on Bush's part... Give them something, while you change the supreme court for the next 30 or so years.... Good move!!!!!

Plenty of time to bring out the rest of the failures of local & state government's....




Dazzle them with Brilliance, or Baffle them with BS! :wink:

Reply to RCPilot
- 0 +

Quote :


However, I see myself voting a bit more towards the middle or left than I have in the last 6 years or so.



So your vote is going to Hillary then, in 2008? [/snicker]

BigMac

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Reply to BigMac
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Quote :


ultimately all responsibility falls on his shoulders. He is our Commander in Chief,the Prez.
But at the same time it does not excuse the incompitance of the Mayor of NO nor the govenor of La For not evacuating according to plans.



Actually, as far as I understand the US constitution this is not completely correct.

Both the Mayor and the govenor were elected by the people, themselves, right? So in part they have a direct responsibility to the people themselves who elected them into office. Bush has to work with them. I guess he could put them on a sidetrack through some procedure, but I'm sure that takes some time and that wouldn't help the immediate aid operation.

Having said that, Bush is not blame free, he should have reacted sooner than he did. The signal that almost nothing was done in preparation for the storm should have reached the federal government and so they should have moved into action a lot sooner. Actually the situation in New Orleans before the storm should/could have been enough reason to intervene regardless of a storm.



BigMac

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Reply to BigMac
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Quote :


The media is the problem. They are so far left and they pick and choose what and how they will cover an event.



O come on mozz. You can complain about the media with good reason but don't make such generalized statements. There are left and right media and you can pick out either side to watch.


BigMac

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Reply to BigMac
- 0 +

Fox news is pretty much the only non-left leaning news service. My opinion, though.

<font color=red>GO BUCKEYES!</font color=red>

Reply to TeeTewl
- 0 +

Then, for some reason, the capitalist system is failing here because if there's enough demand for a right wing oriented news source, there would be plenty of them.

Or perhaps the demand is not there? I wonder.



BigMac

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Reply to BigMac
- 0 +

You may have hit the nail right on the head...The irony is talk radio...The right seems to dominate that IE: Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck, so on and so forth...

<font color=red>GO BUCKEYES!</font color=red>

Reply to TeeTewl

TTs correct. Fox is just about the only non left news agency in the states. Non-left IMO is a very accurate way to describe Fox. All the other big boys like ABC, CBS, NBC, and CNN hate Fox and claim that they are radical right. Fox and Drudge are my main sources of info.

As for me, im in the middle. I vote right almost always in the national elections but wouldnt ever vote party just for the sake of being Republican or Democrat. In our state and local elections I always vote the democratic primary and 90% of the time the local officals that I vote for are democrat. This is partly due to our states screwed up Primary crap which I truely hate, but that another story.

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Reply to mozzartusm

This is a confusing issue. I guess it would depend on what criteria that you base the answer on. Take MS. for instance. We have become more and more republican in the presidential elections so you will hear the media often refer to us as a Republican state. We currently have a Gov. that is republican also. When you look at the overall state and local elections you find that almost everyone that is in office or expects a fighting chance of winning office is democrat or runs the democratic ticket.

I dont remember how LA. voted in the pres. election, but it wouldnt surprise me if that is what your news agency is using as the basis of their conclusion. LA. however has a democratic Gov and the Mayor of NO. is Democrat and so are the majority of local officials. I think that you were reading more spin than anything. Thats not your fault however, its the media. BTW, MS. has democrats as mayors for almost all of its major citys. To take that one step further, they are all Black. Now this should really confuse you since the majority of Blacks are democrat and so is the overwhelming majority of our state and local officials "Democrat that is" but we have turned into a republican stronghold in the pres. elections.

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Reply to mozzartusm
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