Challenge of (ultimate) "law" needed

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Hi,

in my campaign, the player characters are on a quest looking for the
Iron Bastion, the 'lawful cathedral' of my universe.

It is situated on Mechanus, but just going to Mechanus is not going to
help you. Instead, you need to traverse the lawful planes, going to
their heart and finding the 'lawfulness' in yourself.

They are currently en route from The Nine Hells (LE), via Celestia (LG
- IMC, there is a portal "Triel's Gate" which is where Baalzebul
entered Hell). This makes sense for the party. A next stop is Acheron.

The 'heart' of Acheron is the black wall of ice on the lowest layer
(Thundellin or something? IDHTBIFOM) where also the deity Wee Jas
dwells. She puts wizards 'to the test'.

The party 'wizard', a LG Sorcerer/Archmage (lvl. 15/3) with some extra
spells due to house rules and the Vow of Povery feat, will likely pick
up that challenge.

So, I need a 'wizardly' challenge. I could give the list of his known
spells, but I'd like to keep it generic.

Ideas for other 'challenges of ultimate law' (could or could not be
specific to Nine Hells, Celestia, Acheron, Arcadia and / or Mechanus)
are also appreciated.

How does one show 'lawfulness'?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Arandor wrote:
> Hi,
>
> in my campaign, the player characters are on a quest looking for the
> Iron Bastion, the 'lawful cathedral' of my universe.
>
> It is situated on Mechanus, but just going to Mechanus is not going to
> help you. Instead, you need to traverse the lawful planes, going to
> their heart and finding the 'lawfulness' in yourself.
>
> They are currently en route from The Nine Hells (LE), via Celestia (LG
> - IMC, there is a portal "Triel's Gate" which is where Baalzebul
> entered Hell). This makes sense for the party. A next stop is Acheron.
>
> The 'heart' of Acheron is the black wall of ice on the lowest layer
> (Thundellin or something? IDHTBIFOM) where also the deity Wee Jas
> dwells. She puts wizards 'to the test'.
>
> The party 'wizard', a LG Sorcerer/Archmage (lvl. 15/3) with some extra
> spells due to house rules and the Vow of Povery feat, will likely pick
> up that challenge.
>
> So, I need a 'wizardly' challenge. I could give the list of his known
> spells, but I'd like to keep it generic.
>
> Ideas for other 'challenges of ultimate law' (could or could not be
> specific to Nine Hells, Celestia, Acheron, Arcadia and / or Mechanus)
> are also appreciated.
>
> How does one show 'lawfulness'?
>

Start with logic puzzles. If you want to really go in deep proceed to
Confuciousism or Judaic Kabbalah--the tree of life--for spiritual things
to traverse. The holy 10 numbers of the tree of life, for example,
would be a neat metaphor to walk around in.

Look at the comic book Promethea by Alan Moore. There is an excellent
pictoral walk through of the tree of life somewhere in there. I forget
the issue numbers.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Shawn Roske wrote:
> >
>
> Start with logic puzzles. If you want to really go in deep proceed to
> Confuciousism or Judaic Kabbalah--the tree of life--for spiritual things
> to traverse. The holy 10 numbers of the tree of life, for example,
> would be a neat metaphor to walk around in.
>

A nice idea.

Anyway, it would probably be corny to go for the obviousness such as
how far are the characters willing to go to obey a law, but perhaps one
test of working with the literal of a law and the spirit of that law
might be ok. The characters aren't "wrong" in the eye of the "judge"
of the test whichever they choose. Rather, it's a self-understanding
of themselves in relationship to that ethical struggle which is
important.

Another aspect of lawfulness is team work. Apply some test where the
party really needs to work together to succeed. If two characters are
at "odds" with each other, make the test especially for them to work
together and hopefully bond with each other. To be stereotypical, a
challenge for a paladin-rogue team or a chaotic barbarian-lawful cleric
of deity of peace team would be good examples.

Gerald Katz

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Thank you.

The "at odds" is a little difficult. The party started more diverse,
but some roleplaying, characters dying and players leaving, out of the
party of six (five PCs, one NPC), four (three PCs, one NPC are now LEG
(Lawful Exalted Good). The other two are "only NG and NEG. (And the NEG
is a Barbarian who is getting dangerously close to lawful, too.)

I was also thinking, since lawful also means 'consistent', a possiblity
of a maze where 'always going left', even if it does not seem a good
idea, would work. Not quite sure how that would work out.

And some guardian who asks questions... but since he never stated that
he needed the CORRECT answers... letting the PCs make Knowledgde checks
to answer, but answering correctly will not get them further (can they
stray from their consistency?)

No ideas for a 'wizardly' challenge?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Hmm...perhaps a test or two where the point is that
you abide by principles even if it is tactically
inconvenient, or personally disadvantageous. Say,
if a particular act must be punished, then it must
be punished even if a PC does it. You do what is
proper *because it is proper*; whether it benefits
you personally is irrelevant.

Another test that has the basic point that you keep
your promises and hold up your end of the bargain.
(Maybe even if the other person doesn't keep their
end).

Other Lawful principles could be demonstrated:
the idea that the needs of the group outweigh the
desires of an individual member of that group;
the virtue of self-control and self-discipline;
the importance of making a plan and sticking to
it even if distractions appear; the importance of
maintaining tradition; duty; honor; obedience;
loyalty.

Note that some of these principles may be offensive
to some readers, or to your players. But I believe
they would fit as Lawful principles. (This is a test
of Law, not of Good, after all.)