Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

Help and Advice needed in challenging new system

Tags:
Last response: in CPUs
Share
June 28, 2002 11:51:21 PM

Below are the components in my new system followed by my intended setup and questions. Any advice and suggestions on the setup will be greatly appreciated. The system is a bit complicated and should be quite challenging to configure. It seems a bit long, but it is in outline format. Thanks ahead of time.

Core:

Motherboard: Asus P4T533
CPU: Pentium 4 2.53 GHZ
RAM: 1GB RIMM4200 ( PC1066 232 pin )

Hard Drives:

(4) Fujitsu 18.4GB 15K RPM ULTRA160 SCSI (MAM3184MP)(68 Pin)
(1) IBM Ultra2 9.1GB 9LZX Ultra2 SCSI
(1) Seagate Cheetah 9.1GB Ultra160 SCSI (ST39205LC) (80 Pin)
(1) Fujitsu 9.1GB Ultra160 SCSI (MAH3091MC) (80 Pin)
(1) Maxtor ATA Ultra 133 160GB IDE
(1)Maxtor ATA Ultra 100 30GB IDE (May put in my sons computer if there are
problems)

AGP Card:

(1) Gainward Geforce4 Ti4600 Powerpack

PCI Cards:

(1) 3400s Adaptec Scsi 4 channel Ultra160 SCSI Raid Card
(1) 39160 Adaptec Ultra160 SCSI Card (2 independent Ultra160
Channels and 1 50 pin)
(1) Soundblaster Audigy Platnium Card
(1) Dazzle Digital Video Creator 2
(1) Maxtor ATA 133 PCI Card
(1) Hauppauge Win TV-D

50 PIN SCSI Devices

(1) Creative DVD-RAM
(1) Onstream 30GB Tape Drive
(1) Iomega JAZ 2GB
(1) Iomega 100MB Zip Drive

IDE Drives:

(1) Plextor 40/12/40A CD-RW/R (ATA 33)
(1) Pioneer DVD 106s/2 (ATA 66)
(1) HP DVD200i DVD+RW/R (ATA 33)

Other Relevant Stuff:

Roughly 20 Fans and 8 Hard Drive Coolers (Sounds like a jet engine—ok for me)
Windows XP Professional

Here are the questions regarding setup for optimal performance:

(1) First, Scsi Hard Drive Placement:
This is what I have come up with:
-On the 3400s I will have two Raid Arrays:
1. 3 of the Fujitsu 18.4GB 15K RPM ULTRA160 SCSI Drives each on its
independent channel in a RAID 0 configuration.
2. Another RAID 0 configuration consisting of the Fujitsu 9.1GB Ultra160
SCSI Drive and the Seagate Cheetah 9.1GB Ultra160 SCSI Drive.
The Questions Regarding this:
1. I’ve talked with Adaptec and they see no problems with having an array over
Multiple channels and will not cause a performance decrease. I just don’t want any bottleneck, which may be a problem with 3 of the Fujitsu 15K drives on one channel. Does anyone see a problem with this or have any input?
2. I know you should always have the exact same drives in a Raid Array, but does
Anyone see a problem with the 2nd array I’m doing, since they are different brands—but they are the same size?
3. As will be seen in a moment I plan on putting my last Fujitsu 18.4GB 15K RPM
ULTRA160 SCSI Drive on the Adaptec 39160 Drive and boot Windows XP Pro
From there. This brings me to one of the most important questions. I have read
many posts and I’ve come to the conclusion that it’s best to separate the operating
system and applications (more of this later) on its on hard drive. I do not
understand this. What is the benefit of having raid (for performance) if the
operating system and applications are not on the RAID Array??? It would seem
to me that I should put all 4 of the Fujitsu 15K Ultra160 Drives in an array and
boot the operating system and applications from that?? If there is a reason for this
please let me know and also what gets stored on the RAID Array for a performance
increase if the OS and Apps are not on the Array?? Please, any input on this
would be greatly appreciated!!!!
4. What about Stripe Sizes? What is the Optimal level? 90% of my files will be
Under 10MB and most of that will be under 5MB. I’ve read that it’s best to have
A 64k stripe size is best for overall performance. Is this right?

-On the Adaptec 39160 this is what I plan. This takes into account that I will boot
the OS and Apps from here (see question 3 right above).
1. On Channel A I will have the Fujitsu 18.4GB 15K RPM ULTRA160 SCSI
Drive if this is the best thing for performance to do. If I do this how do I set it up concerning partitions? I’ve heard it’s best to have one partition for the OS and another for apps(concerning apps I have heard it’s best to have an additional one for games) and another for a Swap/Page file. Also, is it best to do without the swap/page file since I will have over 1GB of ram. This is the 2nd most important question!!
2. On Channel B I will have the IBM 9LZX and on the 50 pin connector I
Will have all the Ultra SCSI Drives. No question here—straight forward.

(2) Hard Drive and DVD/Cd IDE Drive Placement:
--I’m really lost here. Where should I put the 5 IDE Devices (4 DVD/CD drives and
the two hard Drives)? One hard drive is ATA 133 and the other is ATA 100. The
Plextor and HP drive are ATA 33 and the Pioneer 106s/2 is ATA 66.
--On the motherboard I have two ATA 100 connectors and two ATA 133 Raid
Connectors. On the Maxtor PCI card I have 4 ATA 133 Connectors.
(1) How should I set this up? Can I put any of the DVD/CD drives on the
Maxtor PCI Card or on the raid connectors on the motherboard? Can the
Hard Drives be put on the Raid Connectors on the motherboard without a
Raid Array?? Finally, will having say an ATA 66 and ATA 33 on the same channel decrease performance of the ATA 66 Drive?? I’m a bit lost here and need help.

Final Questions:

(1) The server case I have is double sided and has two 400W power Supplies, but I
Believe I will need more. I would like to note that having two 400Watt PS is not like having one 800 Watt PS. I would like to get two 550+ Redundant power supplies, but I’m having trouble finding one. Any suggestions regarding this???

Any more info or advice about anything would be greatly appreciated. Thank You for the help.
June 29, 2002 9:43:39 AM

my god you are creating a monster. We'll have to go slowly with this bad boy. Because it will take awhile to put and build this thing.

First I would put all the apps and os on the Fujitsus. Are you going to set up raid 0? Raid 0 +1? Raid 5?

You have the right stripe size as far as I can see.....you really don't get more out of it.....

lets just go from here.....

MeldarthX
Related resources
June 29, 2002 10:45:39 AM

please don't tell me that you're using this for word processing :) 

:cool: :eek:  :redface: :frown: :lol:  :mad:  :eek:  :smile: :tongue: :wink:
June 29, 2002 2:37:43 PM

I'm going to be putting the Fujitsus in Raid 0 configuration. So you think i should put all 4 in Raid 0 on the 3400s and put my OS and apps on it? If i do this, should i partition the OS, apps, and games from the rest of the raid array??

Bigrat, no not for word processing. I usually multitask with about 20 windows open(for ebay auctions). Databases, and also quite a bit of video editing and rendering and a lot more stuff. I'm not going to be upgrading for a couple of years (that's what i tell my girlfriend) so i went all out.
June 30, 2002 1:41:32 AM

Help me please. I'm dying ove here. Need input.
a b à CPUs
June 30, 2002 3:53:04 AM

I'll sell you an AMI SCSI RAID card with 64MB cache for $100. Each channel is Ultra 80, but it's a three channel card, and PCI is only 133MB/s, so you can get Ultra 160 performance (133MB/s because of PCI limit) out of it by placing drives 1 and 2 on the first channel, drives 3 and 4 on the second. It can controll up to 45 drives.

<font color=blue>At least half of all problems are caused by an insufficient power supply!</font color=blue>
June 30, 2002 4:17:30 AM

Ummm... WOW!... Would you mind posting some pictures (when you get it put together) I just wanna see something that big lol

That video card rocks... (personal experiance) I just wish it had a better heat sink on it (I love to take the best then overclock it what can I say)

AMD XP 1900+
MSI Ultra ARU (MS-6380E)
Geforce 4 Ti4600
PC2100 512MB
June 30, 2002 6:13:12 AM

I appreciate the offer but i love my 3400s. It has 128MB cache instead of the stock 32MB. I've seen your posts quite often crashman and i'm sure you have some input on my system. Let me know your input because i sure need it. As you can imagine putting it together over and over again will be a pain in the ass so before i do it (for max performance) i would like to get all the info available.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
June 30, 2002 8:21:54 AM

Quote:
I'm going to be putting the Fujitsus in Raid 0 configuration. So you think i should put all 4 in Raid 0 on the 3400s and put my OS and apps on it? If i do this, should i partition the OS, apps, and games from the rest of the raid array??

yes, i will do that.
one fujitsu drive per channel on the 3400s. but i will use the RAID0+1 mode instead of the RAID0.
i will set those four drives in a RAID0+1 array to secure your data. i will create 3 partitions. one for the operating system (windows xp), one for the games & one for the apps.
the problem is that your overall capacity will be around 40GB (18.4 * 4 / 2) which is maybe not sufficient for your needs?


<i>if you know you don't know, the way could be more easy ...</i>
June 30, 2002 10:28:36 AM

With all that going on, I'd look pretty hard at a 64bit PCI bus. I think Serverworks is about the only place with a uniprocessor PIV chipset at the moment, but there should be some new boards out shortly (probably using VIA chipset).

But if you're really multitaksing 20 apps, a duallie would be a good move anyway.


<i>Do I look like I care?</i>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
June 30, 2002 1:22:13 PM

have you also some routers & some switchs or others..? i was wondering about your network material ...


<i>if you know you don't know, the way could be more easy ...</i>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
June 30, 2002 1:23:47 PM

yes maybe 2 xeons or even 2 mp?


<i>if you know you don't know, the way could be more easy ...</i>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
June 30, 2002 1:29:31 PM

Quote:
2. I know you should always have the exact same drives in a Raid Array, but does
Anyone see a problem with the 2nd array I’m doing, since they are different brands—but they are the same size?

limited by the lowest disk.


<i>if you know you don't know, the way could be more easy ...</i>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
June 30, 2002 1:37:25 PM

4. What about Stripe Sizes? What is the Optimal level? 90% of my files will be
Under 10MB and most of that will be under 5MB. I’ve read that it’s best to have
A 64k stripe size is best for overall performance. Is this right?
i used to set them to 16 or 32K to avoid a lost of space along to increase the raid performance.


<i>if you know you don't know, the way could be more easy ...</i>
June 30, 2002 2:22:17 PM

I would go for MP's or "just" P4s, because I don't think the extra cost for Xeons is worth it. I think the extra for dualies in general would be worth it, because you get a bigger faster PCI bus, and of course, better multitasking.

<i>Do I look like I care?</i>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
June 30, 2002 2:45:42 PM

(MP) maybe even "just" XPs. i heard they are multitasking as well as MPs?

i think we can going to multitasking simply buying a MP motherboard & a second xp processor.


<i>if you know you don't know, the way could be more easy ...</i>
a b à CPUs
June 30, 2002 4:34:10 PM

Basic ideas on configuration=try to get your disk controllers on slots that don't share IRQs with other disk controllers. The Gigabyte GA-8IHXP is the most fully featured i850E board. The i850E and PC1066 tend to provide the best performance for the P4.

<font color=blue>At least half of all problems are caused by an insufficient power supply!</font color=blue>
June 30, 2002 11:08:51 PM

yes raid 0, +1 would be good......but then he loses 2 of the drives......he would be better off uses raid 5 for that configuration.........he gets the speed of 0 and the protection of 1.......

Actually I would partition the os on to its own raid, and then put the apps and games on its own......that way if you lose the os......you still have your data.....

Those 3400s, should be able to do raid 5......but its been a little while since I've done a system with those cards....

MeldarthX
June 30, 2002 11:13:48 PM

I think you may have something there Corsair....I think he would be better off going with dually here.

I've seen about 75% of the time xps will work as mps. But not always.....he's also got 6 pci cards.......which is a limiting factor in this case.....

MeldarthX
June 30, 2002 11:18:58 PM

(1) 3400s Adaptec Scsi 4 channel Ultra160 SCSI Raid Card
(1) 39160 Adaptec Ultra160 SCSI Card (2 independent Ultra160
Channels and 1 50 pin)
(1) Soundblaster Audigy Platnium Card
(1) Dazzle Digital Video Creator 2
(1) Maxtor ATA 133 PCI Card
(1) Hauppauge Win TV-D

Another question of mine? The win tv-d? unless you are going to be actually watching tv on your computer...this card isn't needed.......If you are getting it for more input for video and stuff.......

You are better off getting AIW card from ATI, it will go perfectly with dazzle card.......

won't have the horsepower of the geforce card, but the geforce card can't compare to the features on the AIW.

Besides if you also getting the win card for dvd playback, the geforce card already has built in hardware decoding, and does it better now......
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
June 30, 2002 11:30:14 PM

Quote:
Actually I would partition the os on to its own raid, and then put the apps and games on its own......that way if you lose the os......you still have your data.....

?!?
you still have your data with only one raid even if the os is crashed because you don't lose your raid array as your os.


<i>if you know you don't know, the way could be more easy ...</i>
July 2, 2002 7:26:16 AM

That's the beauty of raid 5........protection of 1 but speed of 0......you only need 3 drives for it....his fourth drive is even more protection. Plus he will be taping....

This is how I would tap it out.....is two raids.......or one raid 5.....that way if he does lose the os.....he can save his other data.....its a bitch to get to...but its there.....plus with good partitioning......there shouldn't be a fail.....

Question is? Will he go hot swappable? I would......

MeldarthX
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by MeldarthX on 07/02/02 03:27 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
!