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Intelligence Modifer Bonus Spell slots and Metamagic quest..

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Anonymous
July 5, 2005 10:07:14 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

I think I am handling this correctly but I wanted to make sure. I have
read over the rules but I'm not always good at picking that stuff up
so I wanted to ask people if I was handling this situation correctly.

I have a level 4 character who has an 18 intelligence. She has 4
levels of wizard.

Her intelligence grants her a bonus 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th level spell
slot.

But only can cast up to 2nd level spells. So if I apply a metamagic
feat that requires the spell to be prepared at one level higher, I
can't
yet use my 3rd or fourth level bonus spell slots for this spell right?
The reason being I don't actually have access to spell slots of these
levels yet. Gaining 3rd level slots at 5th.

Is this the correct way to view the rules or is there something else
out there that points to another way to handle it?

More about : intelligence modifer bonus spell slots metamagic quest

Anonymous
July 5, 2005 10:07:15 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

You are correct. You only get the bonus slots of a spell level when
you are of a class level that gets them normally, with a caveat that
anytime you have a "0" as opposed to a "-" for a spell level that does
allow you to utilize bonus spells due to your relevant ability score
modifier.

Gerald Katz
Anonymous
July 5, 2005 11:50:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Hadsil wrote:
> You are correct. You only get the bonus slots of a spell level when
> you are of a class level that gets them normally, with a caveat that
> anytime you have a "0" as opposed to a "-" for a spell level that does
> allow you to utilize bonus spells due to your relevant ability score
> modifier.
>
> Gerald Katz
>

Good try, though.
July 6, 2005 2:23:14 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"Decaying Atheist" <harker@coxdot.net> wrote in news:yuDye.62014$%Z2.36717
@lakeread08:

> I think I am handling this correctly but I wanted to make sure. I have
> read over the rules but I'm not always good at picking that stuff up
> so I wanted to ask people if I was handling this situation correctly.
>
> I have a level 4 character who has an 18 intelligence. She has 4
> levels of wizard.
>
> Her intelligence grants her a bonus 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th level spell
> slot.
>
> But only can cast up to 2nd level spells. So if I apply a metamagic
> feat that requires the spell to be prepared at one level higher, I
> can't
> yet use my 3rd or fourth level bonus spell slots for this spell right?
> The reason being I don't actually have access to spell slots of these
> levels yet. Gaining 3rd level slots at 5th.
>
> Is this the correct way to view the rules or is there something else
> out there that points to another way to handle it?

Yes, that is correct. You can't use bonus spell slots when you can't cast
at their spell level. The 4th level wizard will be able to use Extend Spell
on cantrips and first level spells only for example.
Anonymous
July 6, 2005 11:47:27 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Not out of the question, just not all that useful at your current
level.

Has the wizard considered the "Sudden" Metamagic feats (from complete
arcane, I think).
These allow you to apply the effect of a metamagic feat once per day as
a free action, do not increase the caster level of the spell and count
as Metamagic feats for later feat prerequisites.

My wizard character in one campaign is getting quite a lot of Mileage
out of "Sudden Widen Spell" taken at 1st level.
Applied to "Colour Spray" it takes out quite a lot of mooks in one go.

BTW - Anyone else noticed that the 3.5 version of CS no longer has a
cap on the number of creatures which can be affected?

Blath
Anonymous
July 6, 2005 1:09:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"Joseph" <void@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:Xns968ABB0FE4428619void@199.45.49.11...
> "Decaying Atheist" <harker@coxdot.net> wrote in
> news:yuDye.62014$%Z2.36717
> @lakeread08:
>
>> I think I am handling this correctly but I wanted to make sure. I
>> have
>> read over the rules but I'm not always good at picking that stuff
>> up
>> so I wanted to ask people if I was handling this situation
>> correctly.
>>
>> I have a level 4 character who has an 18 intelligence. She has 4
>> levels of wizard.
>>
>> Her intelligence grants her a bonus 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th level
>> spell
>> slot.
>>
>> But only can cast up to 2nd level spells. So if I apply a metamagic
>> feat that requires the spell to be prepared at one level higher, I
>> can't
>> yet use my 3rd or fourth level bonus spell slots for this spell
>> right?
>> The reason being I don't actually have access to spell slots of
>> these
>> levels yet. Gaining 3rd level slots at 5th.
>>
>> Is this the correct way to view the rules or is there something
>> else
>> out there that points to another way to handle it?
>
> Yes, that is correct. You can't use bonus spell slots when you can't
> cast
> at their spell level. The 4th level wizard will be able to use
> Extend Spell
> on cantrips and first level spells only for example.

So not a complete waste of a feat, and as I level the feat will become
more useful. Not to mention that many metamagic feats require that you
have at least one other metamagic feat.

Does anybody think that a 1st level Wizard taking a metamagic feat
that adds 2 or more levels to a prepared spell is out of the question?
I don't see it being a problem, just a wasted feat since he or she
won't be able to use it for quite awhile.

DA
Anonymous
July 6, 2005 1:10:30 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"Hadsil" <forumite@netzero.com> wrote in message
news:1120602249.307786.191910@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> You are correct. You only get the bonus slots of a spell level when
> you are of a class level that gets them normally, with a caveat that
> anytime you have a "0" as opposed to a "-" for a spell level that
> does
> allow you to utilize bonus spells due to your relevant ability score
> modifier.
>
> Gerald Katz

Yeah, that rule didn't really stump me, as my Dwarven Paladin
who gets 0 1st level spells, can manage to cast as single spell
due to his Wisdom.

Also, thanks for taking the time to answer this.

DA
Anonymous
July 6, 2005 1:11:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"Shawn Roske" <shawn_roske@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:61Fye.4284$is5.408560@news20.bellglobal.com...
> Hadsil wrote:
>> You are correct. You only get the bonus slots of a spell level
>> when
>> you are of a class level that gets them normally, with a caveat
>> that
>> anytime you have a "0" as opposed to a "-" for a spell level that
>> does
>> allow you to utilize bonus spells due to your relevant ability
>> score
>> modifier.
>>
>> Gerald Katz
>>
>
> Good try, though.

?

Are you saying that this doesn't work? Your response
is cloudy. Could you further explain what you mean?

DA
Anonymous
July 6, 2005 3:18:21 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Decaying Atheist wrote:
> "Shawn Roske" <shawn_roske@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:61Fye.4284$is5.408560@news20.bellglobal.com...
>
>>Hadsil wrote:
>>
>>>You are correct. You only get the bonus slots of a spell level
>>>when
>>>you are of a class level that gets them normally, with a caveat
>>>that
>>>anytime you have a "0" as opposed to a "-" for a spell level that
>>>does
>>>allow you to utilize bonus spells due to your relevant ability
>>>score
>>>modifier.
>>>
>>>Gerald Katz
>>>
>>
>>Good try, though.
>
>
> ?
>
> Are you saying that this doesn't work? Your response
> is cloudy. Could you further explain what you mean?
>
> DA
>
>

I mean it is a very creative interpretation of the rules. One I had not
thought of. It was a good try at maximizing the potential of the
wording. Hadsil, here, points out the full and correct interpretation
of the rule, however.
Anonymous
July 6, 2005 7:28:19 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"Shawn Roske" <shawn_roske@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:0DSye.4549$is5.516584@news20.bellglobal.com...
> Decaying Atheist wrote:
>> "Shawn Roske" <shawn_roske@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>> news:61Fye.4284$is5.408560@news20.bellglobal.com...
>>
>>>Hadsil wrote:
>>>
>>>>You are correct. You only get the bonus slots of a spell level
>>>>when
>>>>you are of a class level that gets them normally, with a caveat
>>>>that
>>>>anytime you have a "0" as opposed to a "-" for a spell level that
>>>>does
>>>>allow you to utilize bonus spells due to your relevant ability
>>>>score
>>>>modifier.
>>>>
>>>>Gerald Katz
>>>>
>>>
>>>Good try, though.
>>
>>
>> ?
>>
>> Are you saying that this doesn't work? Your response
>> is cloudy. Could you further explain what you mean?
>>
>> DA
>>
>>
>
> I mean it is a very creative interpretation of the rules. One I had
> not thought of. It was a good try at maximizing the potential of
> the wording. Hadsil, here, points out the full and correct
> interpretation of the rule, however.

Ahhhh, thanks.

I was always under the impression that you couldn't use spell slots
you didn't have access
to but wondered if I might have been wrong. It kind of seems like
wasted potential for my
wizard's high intelligence score to net him bonus spells per day, that
he just can't access at all
yet.

Of course, there is always the argument that spell slots of a certain
level require a certain understanding
of magic that this character just hasn't grasped yet.

The rules do make the point clear after looking at the explanation and
rereading them. I'm also
not trying to work around the rules, just wanted them clarified a bit.

Thanks for taking the time to answer :) 
Anonymous
July 7, 2005 4:56:07 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Behold! for aramil_silvermane@hotmail.com spake unto the multitude
thus:

>My wizard character in one campaign is getting quite a lot of Mileage
>out of "Sudden Widen Spell" taken at 1st level.
>Applied to "Colour Spray" it takes out quite a lot of mooks in one go.
>
>BTW - Anyone else noticed that the 3.5 version of CS no longer has a
>cap on the number of creatures which can be affected?

Oy vey. I hadn't seen that. That's vicious. That's seriously powerful
all of a sudden. That's a huge number of gnolls (for example) out for
the count. Not sure I'd be allowing that...one wonders if the ones at
the back ought to be getting a cover bonus to their save to balance it
a bit.

--
Jim or Sarah Davies, but probably Jim

D&D and Star Fleet Battles stuff on http://www.aaargh.org
Anonymous
July 7, 2005 8:39:05 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Decaying Atheist wrote:
> "Shawn Roske" <shawn_roske@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:0DSye.4549$is5.516584@news20.bellglobal.com...
> > Decaying Atheist wrote:
> >> "Shawn Roske" <shawn_roske@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> >> news:61Fye.4284$is5.408560@news20.bellglobal.com...
> >>
> >>>Hadsil wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>You are correct. You only get the bonus slots of a spell level
> >>>>when
> >>>>you are of a class level that gets them normally, with a caveat
> >>>>that
> >>>>anytime you have a "0" as opposed to a "-" for a spell level that
> >>>>does
> >>>>allow you to utilize bonus spells due to your relevant ability
> >>>>score
> >>>>modifier.
> >>>>
> >>>>Gerald Katz
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>Good try, though.
> >>
> >>
> >> ?
> >>
> >> Are you saying that this doesn't work? Your response
> >> is cloudy. Could you further explain what you mean?
> >>
> >> DA
> >>
> >>
> >
> > I mean it is a very creative interpretation of the rules. One I had
> > not thought of. It was a good try at maximizing the potential of
> > the wording. Hadsil, here, points out the full and correct
> > interpretation of the rule, however.
>
> Ahhhh, thanks.
>
> I was always under the impression that you couldn't use spell slots
> you didn't have access
> to but wondered if I might have been wrong. It kind of seems like
> wasted potential for my
> wizard's high intelligence score to net him bonus spells per day, that
> he just can't access at all
> yet.
>
> Of course, there is always the argument that spell slots of a certain
> level require a certain understanding
> of magic that this character just hasn't grasped yet.
>
> The rules do make the point clear after looking at the explanation and
> rereading them. I'm also
> not trying to work around the rules, just wanted them clarified a bit.
>
> Thanks for taking the time to answer :) 

In a campaign with many encounters a day and if group and DM think of
low
level wizards as weak, you could house-rule the bonus slots as being
of the stated level *or one level lower*.

Makes low level smart wizards more powerful.

LL
Anonymous
July 10, 2005 12:19:08 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Decaying Atheist wrote:
> So not a complete waste of a feat, and as I level the feat will become
> more useful. Not to mention that many metamagic feats require that you
> have at least one other metamagic feat.
>
> Does anybody think that a 1st level Wizard taking a metamagic feat
> that adds 2 or more levels to a prepared spell is out of the question?
> I don't see it being a problem, just a wasted feat since he or she
> won't be able to use it for quite awhile.

I think it's somewhat wasteful (unless you take it to meet a
prerequisite that will arrive soon), but it is certainly not
unrealistic. Just think of it as your character having
studied a magical technique that he can't yet make use of.

--
Peter Knutsen
sagatafl.org
!