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Plam OS and Windows Mobile

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Anonymous
June 7, 2005 3:51:50 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Hi Guys,

Why do you prefer Palm OS to Windows Mobile?


--
Mazin


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More about : plam windows mobile

Anonymous
June 7, 2005 3:51:51 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Mazin <mdepth@privacy.net> wrote:
> Hi Guys,
>
> Why do you prefer Palm OS to Windows Mobile?

It can be summed up this way:
With PalmOS, the device waits for the user.
With WinCE, the user waits for the device.

Tap-and-hold: You wait.
Word-based recognition: You wait.
Letting the device figure out whether you meant "-" or the first stroke
in "+" or "=": You wait.
Animations: You wait.

This is important when you want to look up something quickly, which is
one of the main reasons for getting a PDA in the first place.
A 20 MHz PalmOS PDA is *much* snappier than a 400 MHz WinCE device for
things like that. It may run things a lot slower, but the GUI is
designed for immediate response, and not for emulating a desktop OS.

(Unfortunately, PalmOS has screwed things up quite a bit lately, and
adopted some of the shortcomings of WinCE. Including having to wait for
the device, with Graffiti 2, which uses multi-strokes. Luckily, there's
ways to get Graffiti back.)

--
*Art
Anonymous
June 7, 2005 3:51:52 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Arthur Hagen wrote:
> (Unfortunately, PalmOS has screwed things up quite a bit lately, and
> adopted some of the shortcomings of WinCE. Including having to wait for
> the device, with Graffiti 2, which uses multi-strokes. Luckily, there's
> ways to get Graffiti back.)

You have made my day - I'm off to try and find out how to do that now.
Any links you had readily at hand would be greatly appreciated. Graffiti
2 has been a pain in my behind since I got the T|E - I'm still used to 1
and don't like 2 much at all.

--
http://www.simplerich.com/blog
Related resources
Anonymous
June 7, 2005 3:51:53 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Rich G. wrote:
> Arthur Hagen wrote:
> > (Unfortunately, PalmOS has screwed things up quite a bit lately, and
>
>> adopted some of the shortcomings of WinCE. Including having to wait for
>> the device, with Graffiti 2, which uses multi-strokes. Luckily, there's
>> ways to get Graffiti back.)
>
>
> You have made my day - I'm off to try and find out how to do that now.
> Any links you had readily at hand would be greatly appreciated. Graffiti
> 2 has been a pain in my behind since I got the T|E - I'm still used to 1
> and don't like 2 much at all.
>

Not in the habit of responding to myself, but Teoma found it for me. The
instructions were easy, and it worked exactly as described.

If anybody else is looking - I found it at:
http://users.wpi.edu/~ahecht/palm.html

--
http://www.simplerich.com/blog
Anonymous
June 7, 2005 7:25:22 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

It was a time of great turmoil. The strong preyed on the weak, dogs
and cats lived together. One voice cried out in the wilderness:
"Arthur Hagen" <art@broomstick.com> wrote in
<d8338h$ika$1@cauldron.broomstick.com>:

> (Unfortunately, PalmOS has screwed things up quite a bit lately, and
> adopted some of the shortcomings of WinCE. Including having to wait for
> the device, with Graffiti 2, which uses multi-strokes.

This problem is way over-rated IMHO. It's true that Graffiti 1,
because it uses only single strokes, is ultimately faster and more
efficient for people who learn and master it. But Graffiti 2 strokes
resemble actual handwriting more closely. This makes G2 easier to
learn and master. While it is annoying to have to dot your i's and
cross your t's at first, users who've never used G1 will tend to learn
G2 more quickly than they would have learned G1.

G2 also has some nice features which make it more efficient than G1.
You don't for example, have to hunt down a "middlecaps" utility when
you have a Graffiti 2 device because G2 is smart enough to capitalize
letters written in between the number and letter sections of the
Graffiti area. Also, a lot of symbols which require a dot shift on G1
like parentheses, the @ symbol, ironically enough the period require
only one stroke in G2.

So in the end, now that I'm stuck with Graffiti 2 and have had to
actually learn to use it, I find that I don't miss G1 very much at
all.

> Luckily, there's
> ways to get Graffiti back.)

Please note that the Graffiti I libraries do *not* work on the
LifeDrive or on the Tungsten T5 and Treo 650. There is a hacked GI
library available for the T5 and the 600 but it may or may not work on
the Tungsten E2 or the LifeDrive.

--
Roberto Castillo
robertocastillo@ameritech.net
http://www.freewebs.com/robertocastillo/
Anonymous
June 7, 2005 12:19:35 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Zombie Elvis <DELETE-ME-2-REPLY-robertocastillo@ameritech.net> wrote:
> It was a time of great turmoil. The strong preyed on the weak, dogs
> and cats lived together. One voice cried out in the wilderness:
> "Arthur Hagen" <art@broomstick.com> wrote in
> <d8338h$ika$1@cauldron.broomstick.com>:
>
>> Luckily, there's
>> ways to get Graffiti back.)
>
> Please note that the Graffiti I libraries do *not* work on the
> LifeDrive or on the Tungsten T5 and Treo 650. There is a hacked GI
> library available for the T5 and the 600 but it may or may not work on
> the Tungsten E2 or the LifeDrive.

I wasn't specifically thinking of copying the libraries, which in many
cases would be an illegal copyright violation.
I recommend TealScript which lets you choose between G1 and G2, plus
much more.

Regards,
--
*Art
Anonymous
June 7, 2005 1:22:43 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Zombie Elvis wrote:

> It was a time of great turmoil. The strong preyed on the weak, dogs
> and cats lived together. One voice cried out in the wilderness:
> "Arthur Hagen" <art@broomstick.com> wrote in
> <d8338h$ika$1@cauldron.broomstick.com>:
>
>> (Unfortunately, PalmOS has screwed things up quite a bit lately, and
>> adopted some of the shortcomings of WinCE. Including having to wait for
>> the device, with Graffiti 2, which uses multi-strokes.
>
> This problem is way over-rated IMHO. It's true that Graffiti 1,
> because it uses only single strokes, is ultimately faster and more
> efficient for people who learn and master it. But Graffiti 2 strokes
> resemble actual handwriting more closely. This makes G2 easier to
> learn and master. While it is annoying to have to dot your i's and
> cross your t's at first, users who've never used G1 will tend to learn
> G2 more quickly than they would have learned G1.
>
> G2 also has some nice features which make it more efficient than G1.
> You don't for example, have to hunt down a "middlecaps" utility

A _what_? What the H-E-double toothpicks is a "middlecaps utility" and why
would one want such a thing?

> when
> you have a Graffiti 2 device because G2 is smart enough to capitalize
> letters written in between the number and letter sections of the
> Graffiti area.

Like an upstroke is a great hardship?

> Also, a lot of symbols which require a dot shift on G1
> like parentheses, the @ symbol, ironically enough the period require
> only one stroke in G2.

Goody goody.

> So in the end, now that I'm stuck with Graffiti 2 and have had to
> actually learn to use it, I find that I don't miss G1 very much at
> all.
>
>> Luckily, there's
>> ways to get Graffiti back.)
>
> Please note that the Graffiti I libraries do *not* work on the
> LifeDrive or on the Tungsten T5 and Treo 650. There is a hacked GI
> library available for the T5 and the 600 but it may or may not work on
> the Tungsten E2 or the LifeDrive.

Not the only option.

> --
> Roberto Castillo
> robertocastillo@ameritech.net
> http://www.freewebs.com/robertocastillo/

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Anonymous
June 7, 2005 2:02:36 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Arthur Hagen wrote:

> Mazin <mdepth@privacy.net> wrote:
>> Hi Guys,
>>
>> Why do you prefer Palm OS to Windows Mobile?
>
> It can be summed up this way:
> With PalmOS, the device waits for the user.
> With WinCE, the user waits for the device.
>
> Tap-and-hold: You wait.
> Word-based recognition: You wait.
> Letting the device figure out whether you meant "-" or the first stroke
> in "+" or "=": You wait.
> Animations: You wait.

This is the common simplicity/minimalism versus flash situation. You must
understand that different users will run different application, for
different purposes, with different taste.

I practically use my Tungsten only as a diary and MP3 player. I lost
interest in all the fancy stuff 2 years when I realised that a Palm is not
yet a desktop. Certain things I want to do with large monitors and certain
things need to be 3 seconds away from actualising, preferably all booted up
in my pocket.

> This is important when you want to look up something quickly, which is
> one of the main reasons for getting a PDA in the first place.
> A 20 MHz PalmOS PDA is *much* snappier than a 400 MHz WinCE device for
> things like that. It may run things a lot slower, but the GUI is
> designed for immediate response, and not for emulating a desktop OS.

More or less the equivalent of a Web server running KDE or a soda vending
machine running on a computer rather than an embedded circuit.

> (Unfortunately, PalmOS has screwed things up quite a bit lately, and
> adopted some of the shortcomings of WinCE. Including having to wait for
> the device, with Graffiti 2, which uses multi-strokes. Luckily, there's
> ways to get Graffiti back.)

They made a decent number mistakes apart from Graffiti 2.

Roy

--
Roy S. Schestowitz
http://Schestowitz.com
June 12, 2005 1:26:55 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 23:11:13 -0400, Arthur Hagen wrote:

>Mazin <mdepth@privacy.net> wrote:
>> Hi Guys,
>>
>> Why do you prefer Palm OS to Windows Mobile?
>
>It can be summed up this way:
>With PalmOS, the device waits for the user.
>With WinCE, the user waits for the device.

Complete rubbish. I switched to PPC a while back, and I can tell you,
my hp4150 is as fast as my old TT, if not faster, HWR included. What I
love the most about PPC is that I can go do something and come back to
my program where I left off. Real multi-tasking folks!

--
"I'd far rather be happy than right any day."
- Slartibartfast
June 12, 2005 1:43:58 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:26:55 -0400, Bruno wrote:

>On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 23:11:13 -0400, Arthur Hagen wrote:
>
>>Mazin <mdepth@privacy.net> wrote:
>>> Hi Guys,
>>>
>>> Why do you prefer Palm OS to Windows Mobile?
>>
>>It can be summed up this way:
>>With PalmOS, the device waits for the user.
>>With WinCE, the user waits for the device.
>
>Complete rubbish. I switched to PPC a while back, and I can tell you,
>my hp4150 is as fast as my old TT, if not faster, HWR included. What I
>love the most about PPC is that I can go do something and come back to
>my program where I left off. Real multi-tasking folks!

Oh, I forgot! I use the letter recognizer on my PPC (you have a choice
of input methods). It is much, much, much more accurate than anything
I have used on the Palm. All in natural handwriting.

--
"I'd far rather be happy than right any day."
- Slartibartfast
Anonymous
June 12, 2005 4:12:26 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

I will NEVER go back to a Pocket PC. I had an HP Jornada 648 I think was the
model. I had more issues with syncing and installing apps than I had on
every Palm I owned put together. That's not including the bloated, expensive
and limited amount of software available. One of the things that really
annoyed me about it was I bought a CF modem so I can connect to the internet
to send and receive email. I'm not sure if they addressed this issue but HP
had nothing to say when I asked them about it. You can only send an email
with an attachment if the attachment was on the CF card but you can't do
that becuase the CF slot is taken up by the modem. Unless you have two CF
slots the whole thing is useless. HP was speechless when I asked them about
it.

Ever since then I will stay loyal to the Palm OS. On my Tungsten C right now
I have 83 apps and still have 16.6 MB free on the device....... plus files
and emails. I'm only counting the memory on the device, not the SD card. Can
WIndows Mobile do that? I don't think so. Not to mention it has an Intel 400
Mhz processor. I think only the T5 and the Lifedrive are faster (Palm
based). WHat was Microsoft's tag line for Exchange a few years back?
Everything else pales in comparision, I think it was. That's what I have to
say about the Palm platform. I think the PDA population agrees since Palm
has about 80% market share, last I checked and Windows Mobile was about 10%.

"Bruno" <spamthis@notaserver.com> wrote in message
news:o l4na1lr1ddmvja2h3cpbggb5bdlgsqan8@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:26:55 -0400, Bruno wrote:
>
> >On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 23:11:13 -0400, Arthur Hagen wrote:
> >
> >>Mazin <mdepth@privacy.net> wrote:
> >>> Hi Guys,
> >>>
> >>> Why do you prefer Palm OS to Windows Mobile?
> >>
> >>It can be summed up this way:
> >>With PalmOS, the device waits for the user.
> >>With WinCE, the user waits for the device.
> >
> >Complete rubbish. I switched to PPC a while back, and I can tell you,
> >my hp4150 is as fast as my old TT, if not faster, HWR included. What I
> >love the most about PPC is that I can go do something and come back to
> >my program where I left off. Real multi-tasking folks!
>
> Oh, I forgot! I use the letter recognizer on my PPC (you have a choice
> of input methods). It is much, much, much more accurate than anything
> I have used on the Palm. All in natural handwriting.
>
> --
> "I'd far rather be happy than right any day."
> - Slartibartfast
Anonymous
June 12, 2005 9:55:51 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Sat 11 Jun 2005 10:12:26p, Scooterflex, wrote:

> Ever since then I will stay loyal to the Palm OS. On my Tungsten C
> right now I have 83 apps and still have 16.6 MB free on the
> device....... plus files and emails. I'm only counting the memory on
> the device, not the SD card. Can WIndows Mobile do that? I don't
> think so.

Nor do I. And that's based simply on what I know about Microsoft Windows
on the desktop -- I've never tested Windows CE/PPC/Mobile. Complete
bloatware. I use a freeware "Yahtzee" game on my Palms. Takes up a full
12k of memory -- and it works great.

--
RonB
"There's a story there...somewhere"
Anonymous
June 12, 2005 9:55:52 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

I have noticed some of the apps specifically written for OS 5 are fairly
large but they do look like though. I still play Dopewars on my TC and
that's a whole 37KB and Monoploy is a wopping 302KB.

"RonB" <ronbNOSPAM@bliz.org> wrote in message
news:Xns9672F38D7D148ezboard1lycoscom@204.153.244.170...
> On Sat 11 Jun 2005 10:12:26p, Scooterflex, wrote:
>
> > Ever since then I will stay loyal to the Palm OS. On my Tungsten C
> > right now I have 83 apps and still have 16.6 MB free on the
> > device....... plus files and emails. I'm only counting the memory on
> > the device, not the SD card. Can WIndows Mobile do that? I don't
> > think so.
>
> Nor do I. And that's based simply on what I know about Microsoft Windows
> on the desktop -- I've never tested Windows CE/PPC/Mobile. Complete
> bloatware. I use a freeware "Yahtzee" game on my Palms. Takes up a full
> 12k of memory -- and it works great.
>
> --
> RonB
> "There's a story there...somewhere"
June 12, 2005 12:50:52 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On 12 Jun 2005 05:55:51 GMT, RonB wrote:

>I've never tested Windows CE/PPC/Mobile.

So you know nothing about it.

--
"I'd far rather be happy than right any day."
- Slartibartfast
Anonymous
June 12, 2005 3:40:09 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Bruno wrote:

> On Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:26:55 -0400, Bruno wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 23:11:13 -0400, Arthur Hagen wrote:
>>
>>>Mazin <mdepth@privacy.net> wrote:
>>>> Hi Guys,
>>>>
>>>> Why do you prefer Palm OS to Windows Mobile?
>>>
>>>It can be summed up this way:
>>>With PalmOS, the device waits for the user.
>>>With WinCE, the user waits for the device.
>>
>>Complete rubbish. I switched to PPC a while back, and I can tell you,
>>my hp4150 is as fast as my old TT, if not faster, HWR included. What I
>>love the most about PPC is that I can go do something and come back to
>>my program where I left off. Real multi-tasking folks!
>
> Oh, I forgot! I use the letter recognizer on my PPC (you have a choice
> of input methods). It is much, much, much more accurate than anything
> I have used on the Palm. All in natural handwriting.

If it's anything like the one on Office then it's shite.

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
June 12, 2005 7:53:16 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Sun, 12 Jun 2005 11:40:09 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

>Bruno wrote:
>
>> Oh, I forgot! I use the letter recognizer on my PPC (you have a choice
>> of input methods). It is much, much, much more accurate than anything
>> I have used on the Palm. All in natural handwriting.
>
>If it's anything like the one on Office then it's shite.

Apparently, it's not, because it works great.

--
"I'd far rather be happy than right any day."
- Slartibartfast
Anonymous
June 12, 2005 10:44:03 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Sun 12 Jun 2005 06:50:52a, Bruno, wrote:

> On 12 Jun 2005 05:55:51 GMT, RonB wrote:
>
>>I've never tested Windows CE/PPC/Mobile.
>
> So you know nothing about it.

Of course not. No one ever learns anything from other people's
experiences. The ability to read reviews and note reoccurring problems in
a particular platform is absolutely useless -- because that's not
"knowing anything."

What *exactly* do you do on your "fantastic" Windows PDA, BTW? I mean,
besides resetting it after it crashes?

--
RonB
"There's a story there...somewhere"
June 12, 2005 10:44:04 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On 12 Jun 2005 18:44:03 GMT, RonB wrote:

>What *exactly* do you do on your "fantastic" Windows PDA, BTW? I mean,
>besides resetting it after it crashes?

It crashes less than my Palm used to.

--
"I'd far rather be happy than right any day."
- Slartibartfast
Anonymous
June 14, 2005 9:38:36 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

In article news:1118549551.480343bc593d9cc8a26ceeff32356297@teranews, "Scooterflex" <scootertrasher@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On my Tungsten C right now
>I have 83 apps and still have 16.6 MB free on the device....... plus files
>and emails. I'm only counting the memory on the device, not the SD card. Can
>WIndows Mobile do that? I don't think so. Not to mention it has an Intel 400
>Mhz processor. I think only the T5 and the Lifedrive are faster (Palm
>based).

Minor point.... The Tunngsten C is actually still the fastest palm. Benchmark results posted on brighthand reveal it slightly ahead of both the t5 and lifedrive. Not that it makes any real difference except for revealing that the TC was really ahead of its time when it was first released. Very rarely do i care about cpu speed, but it is nice to have it with cpu hungry apps like mapopolis for route planning.

--
Posted via my Palm Tungsten C
Anonymous
June 17, 2005 12:37:56 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 23:51:50 -0300, Mazin <mdepth@privacy.net> wrote:

>
>Hi Guys,
>
>Why do you prefer Palm OS to Windows Mobile?

My first PDA was a Casio, then I upgraded to the M505. I used it for
years, and my wife still uses it with no problems. I tried the Pocket
PC when I purchased an iPaq, don't know the model (would have to go
and dig it out of the closet) and had nothing bought problems with it
after using it for 3 or 4 months. I went back to Palm when I purchased
my T5. Yes there are a few things I wish was imnproved upon, but
overall I am very happy with it and hope that it lasts as long as the
M505 has (still going strong).
!