Iron Heroes: a couple of weapon questions

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

How come the bastard sword is a finesse weapon? Is this the whole
katana-wielding speed-demon ninja thing?

How come the longsword is neither a power nor finesse weapon (especially
since bastard is finesse...)? Doesn't that mean that it is, for most
people, a suboptimal choice, since you don't get to use many of Power
and Finesse feats with it? That's a bit strange, since the longsword was
somewhat of a mainstay of the D&D adventuring population since I started
playing 2E.

How come the example executioner, with his Weapon Finesse feat, uses a
greatsword? Is the executioner using Weapon Finesse with the greatsword
in some way I'm missing, or is the idea that he's using it with the
dagger (which is also a part of his starting equipment), and just
carrying the greatsword for cosmetic effect?


--
Jasin Zujovic
jzujovic@inet.hr
7 answers Last reply
More about iron heroes couple weapon questions
  1. Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

    Also, the example harrier has a scimitar, but she doesn't appear to be
    proficient with it since it's a sword; power, slashing, and harriers are
    proficient with simple weapons and martial projectile and finesse
    weapons.


    --
    Jasin Zujovic
    jzujovic@inet.hr
  2. Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

    Jasin Zujovic wrote:
    >
    > Also, the example harrier has a scimitar, but she doesn't appear to be
    > proficient with it since it's a sword; power, slashing, and harriers are
    > proficient with simple weapons and martial projectile and finesse
    > weapons.

    The scimitar is a finesse weapon in the errata.

    --
    Christopher Adams - Sydney, Australia
    The geek with roots in Hell!
    http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/prestigeclasslist.html
    http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/templatelist.html

    Who do you blame when your kid is a - brat?
    Pampered and spoiled like a Siamese - cat?
    Blaming the kids is a lie and a - shame!
    You know exactly who's - to - blame:
    The mother and the father!
  3. Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

    "Jasin Zujovic" <jzujovic@inet.hr> wrote in message
    news:MPG.1d66dd29782fc7259897ae@news.iskon.hr...
    > How come the bastard sword is a finesse weapon? Is this the whole
    > katana-wielding speed-demon ninja thing?

    Yes.

    >
    > How come the longsword is neither a power nor finesse weapon (especially
    > since bastard is finesse...)? Doesn't that mean that it is, for most
    > people, a suboptimal choice, since you don't get to use many of Power
    > and Finesse feats with it? That's a bit strange, since the longsword was
    > somewhat of a mainstay of the D&D adventuring population since I started
    > playing 2E.

    Who knows?

    >
    > How come the example executioner, with his Weapon Finesse feat, uses a
    > greatsword? Is the executioner using Weapon Finesse with the greatsword
    > in some way I'm missing, or is the idea that he's using it with the
    > dagger (which is also a part of his starting equipment), and just
    > carrying the greatsword for cosmetic effect?
    >
    I suspect that whoever created the sample character misread the
    executioner's
    ability to use power feats with finesse weapons and reversed it.

    Geoff.
  4. Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

    In article <WZbLe.82170$oJ.56191@news-server.bigpond.net.au>,
    mhacdebhandia@yahoo.invalid says...

    > > Also, the example harrier has a scimitar, but she doesn't appear to be
    > > proficient with it since it's a sword; power, slashing, and harriers are
    > > proficient with simple weapons and martial projectile and finesse
    > > weapons.
    >
    > The scimitar is a finesse weapon in the errata.

    Yeah, I though about checking the errata short time after I posted.

    Errata doesn't help with my other issues, though. I'd be interested to
    hear your thoughts, though...?


    --
    Jasin Zujovic
    jzujovic@inet.hr
  5. Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

    In article <AcbLe.27023$Le2.210144@nasal.pacific.net.au>,
    geoffwatson@pacific.net.au says...

    > > How come the bastard sword is a finesse weapon? Is this the whole
    > > katana-wielding speed-demon ninja thing?
    >
    > Yes.

    Eh. I like bastard swords, visually, and I like that I can play a
    harrier modelled on Michelle Yeoh in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon,
    jumping off walls with a bastard sword in hand, but still... eh. You can
    do fancy wuxia tricks with a bastard sword, but not a longsword?

    > > How come the longsword is neither a power nor finesse weapon (especially
    > > since bastard is finesse...)? Doesn't that mean that it is, for most
    > > people, a suboptimal choice, since you don't get to use many of Power
    > > and Finesse feats with it? That's a bit strange, since the longsword was
    > > somewhat of a mainstay of the D&D adventuring population since I started
    > > playing 2E.
    >
    > Who knows?

    One thing I just noticed: a longsword can be used with Combat Expertise,
    while a bastard sword can't, since Combat Expertise has a negatively
    phrased requirement: no power weapons allowed (and the bastard sword is
    both a power and a finesse weapon).

    > > How come the example executioner, with his Weapon Finesse feat, uses a
    > > greatsword? Is the executioner using Weapon Finesse with the greatsword
    > > in some way I'm missing, or is the idea that he's using it with the
    > > dagger (which is also a part of his starting equipment), and just
    > > carrying the greatsword for cosmetic effect?
    >
    > I suspect that whoever created the sample character misread the
    > executioner's ability to use power feats with finesse weapons
    > and reversed it.

    That was the first thing that crossed my mind too. A shame, really; I'd
    prefer it if it were like that, since I like the "precise control even
    with a bigass weapon" concept better than "brute force even with a wimpy
    weapon" concept. Oh well; there's still the bastard sword-wielding
    harrier... :)


    --
    Jasin Zujovic
    jzujovic@inet.hr
  6. Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

    Jasin Zujovic wrote:
    >
    > Errata doesn't help with my other issues, though. I'd be interested to
    > hear your thoughts, though...?

    You know you're a jerk for making me look back at what you said, right? ;)

    > How come the bastard sword is a finesse weapon? Is this the whole
    > katana-wielding speed-demon ninja thing?

    Possibly. Perhaps Mearls wants to encourage people to use it because it's
    slightly mechanically better than a longsword, perhaps it's a mistake they
    didn't catch yet.

    > How come the longsword is neither a power nor finesse weapon (especially
    > since bastard is finesse...)? Doesn't that mean that it is, for most
    > people, a suboptimal choice, since you don't get to use many of Power
    > and Finesse feats with it? That's a bit strange, since the longsword was
    > somewhat of a mainstay of the D&D adventuring population since I started
    > playing 2E.

    Maybe Mearls is sick of the longsword being the mainstay - but maybe it's a
    mistake too. On the other hand, while the Hunter is the only class which doesn't
    get a default Finesse or Power feat mastery progression at some point (except as
    part of his "all feat mastery" progression), there's a large number of feats in
    those two categories which don't require the use of the weapons that share their
    descriptor:

    FINESSE - Combat Expertise (it can't be used with a power weapon), Improved
    Critical (lacking any descriptors, the longsword qualifies for the base
    mastery), Mounted Combat, Two-Weapon Fighting (which is available under Finesse
    and Power, and can be used with weapons of the mastery type you selected the
    feat with *or* weapons like the longsword which lack the other descriptor),
    Weapon Focus, Whirlwind Attack.

    POWER - Cleave, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Critical, Improved Overrun,
    Improved Sunder, Mounted Combat, Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon Focus.

    > How come the example executioner, with his Weapon Finesse feat, uses a
    > greatsword? Is the executioner using Weapon Finesse with the greatsword
    > in some way I'm missing, or is the idea that he's using it with the
    > dagger (which is also a part of his starting equipment), and just
    > carrying the greatsword for cosmetic effect?

    Perhaps the sample executioner is built for efficiency - at low levels, he
    carries a greatsword for dealing damage, but has taken Weapon Finesse 1 as
    prerequisite for all of those awesome dice of sneak attack later? Perhaps later
    he'll discard the greatsword once he's pumped up Razor Fiend et cetera.

    --
    Christopher Adams - Sydney, Australia
    The geek with roots in Hell!
    http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/prestigeclasslist.html
    http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/templatelist.html

    Who do you blame when your kid is a - brat?
    Pampered and spoiled like a Siamese - cat?
    Blaming the kids is a lie and a - shame!
    You know exactly who's - to - blame:
    The mother and the father!
  7. Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

    One of the voices in my head - or was it Jasin Zujovic? - just said...
    > How come the bastard sword is a finesse weapon? Is this the whole
    > katana-wielding speed-demon ninja thing?
    >
    > How come the longsword is neither a power nor finesse weapon (especially
    > since bastard is finesse...)? Doesn't that mean that it is, for most
    > people, a suboptimal choice, since you don't get to use many of Power
    > and Finesse feats with it? That's a bit strange, since the longsword was
    > somewhat of a mainstay of the D&D adventuring population since I started
    > playing 2E.
    >
    > How come the example executioner, with his Weapon Finesse feat, uses a
    > greatsword? Is the executioner using Weapon Finesse with the greatsword
    > in some way I'm missing, or is the idea that he's using it with the
    > dagger (which is also a part of his starting equipment), and just
    > carrying the greatsword for cosmetic effect?

    If you haven't already, wouldn't the Malhavoc boards be the best place
    to ask?
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