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Any ideas about using Mind of a Killer?

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Anonymous
February 26, 2005 5:34:40 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Does anybody think that Mind of a Killer can be played in a tournament
deck, and how?
I was unable to find a reason of using it, but I definitely can miss
something.

Thanks in advance,
Ector

More about : ideas mind killer

February 26, 2005 10:21:18 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

"Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote
>
> Does anybody think that Mind of a Killer can be
> played in a tournament deck, and how?

Use 89 OBF and DEM cards to make a super-focused sneak-bleed deck and then
add 1 Mind of a Killer for flavour.

But watch out for Bowl of Convergence!

Cheers,
WES
Anonymous
February 26, 2005 10:26:13 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Ector wrote:
> Does anybody think that Mind of a Killer can be played in a
tournament
> deck, and how?
> I was unable to find a reason of using it, but I definitely can miss
> something.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Ector

Put it on Muddles and rush a vamp with 4 blood. Put it on Escaped
Mental Patient and rush a vamp with 1 blood.

John
Related resources
Anonymous
February 26, 2005 7:11:55 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

"Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote in message
news:1109414079.955761.10370@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Does anybody think that Mind of a Killer can be played in a tournament
> deck, and how?
> I was unable to find a reason of using it, but I definitely can miss
> something.

Mind of a killer certainly isn't a bad card. It goes well with Madness
Network at the very least. It forces the player to make a choice. Take an
action that they want to get blocked or burn 2 blood. Taking away someones
action with Eddie Gaines is a pretty good effect. It could go well with a
Smiling Jack deck, assuming you are playing some sort of combat. At the very
least, in most cases it will burn 2 blood anyway, hand strikes for 1 on your
prey and grandprey.

There are lots more options out there. I think the card quality in KMW is
quite high in general. Except for that bishop screwing card.

Colin Strauss Riggs
Anonymous
February 26, 2005 11:22:03 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Teemu T Vilen <tvilen@cc.helsinki.fi> wrote in news:cvpmek$95o$1
@oravannahka.helsinki.fi:

> You can use it to give one minion of yours +1 stregth and then rush?
> Hmm.. No.

Er, why not?

pe
Anonymous
February 27, 2005 9:27:50 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Teemu T Vilen wrote:
> Gomi no Sensei <xnews@pollywog.com> wrote:
> : Teemu T Vilen <tvilen@cc.helsinki.fi> wrote in news:cvpmek$95o$1
> : @oravannahka.helsinki.fi:
> :> You can use it to give one minion of yours +1 stregth and then
rush?
> :> Hmm.. No.
> : Er, why not?
>
> Because it's not exactly sensible to spend an actoin to gain +1
strength
> for one combat/action? It's waste.

I have a Malk/!Malk deck that uses both Muddles and EMP. I wouldn't
mind spending Boy Toy's action so that Muddles can beat up a 4-blood
vamp and stay alive.

John
Anonymous
February 27, 2005 1:29:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Gomi no Sensei <xnews@pollywog.com> wrote:
: Teemu T Vilen <tvilen@cc.helsinki.fi> wrote in news:cvpmek$95o$1
: @oravannahka.helsinki.fi:
:> You can use it to give one minion of yours +1 stregth and then rush?
:> Hmm.. No.
: Er, why not?

Because it's not exactly sensible to spend an actoin to gain +1 strength
for one combat/action? It's waste.

Too bad about the post-combat burn option.. Would've been nice addition
after a Lunatic Eruption :) 

//T
Anonymous
February 27, 2005 1:42:25 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Colin Riggs <colinriggs@yahoo.com> wrote:
: "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote in message
: news:1109414079.955761.10370@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
:> Does anybody think that Mind of a Killer can be played in a tournament
:> deck, and how?
: Mind of a killer certainly isn't a bad card. It goes well with Madness
: Network at the very least. It forces the player to make a choice. Take an
: action that they want to get blocked or burn 2 blood. Taking away someones
: action with Eddie Gaines is a pretty good effect. It could go well with a
: Smiling Jack deck, assuming you are playing some sort of combat. At the very
: least, in most cases it will burn 2 blood anyway, hand strikes for 1 on your
: prey and grandprey.

MoaK takes away an action, how? You slap it on your prey's minion, and
if it doesn't end up into a fight, another one of that meth's minions
takes 2 damage. And the minion taps.

Smiling Jack? "Ok, you just hit me with MoaK and have Smiling Jack in
play. Ok, I'll burn Jack. If you block me, I don't have to take 2 damage
later this turn, if you don't block, Jack burns. Doesn't sound like a
dream combo to me.

I'm too pretty sure there must be some use for the card. Eventually I'll
figure it out.

Anyone want to trade nicely balanced Mind of a Killers into ver nicely
balanced Glass Walker Pacts, highly useful Lifeless Tongues and
long-awaited Baals Bloody Talons?

//T
Anonymous
February 27, 2005 3:32:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

"Teemu T Vilen" <tvilen@cc.helsinki.fi> wrote in message
news:cvs86h$hub$2@oravannahka.helsinki.fi...
> Colin Riggs <colinriggs@yahoo.com> wrote:
> : "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote in message
> : news:1109414079.955761.10370@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> :> Does anybody think that Mind of a Killer can be played in a tournament
> :> deck, and how?
> : Mind of a killer certainly isn't a bad card. It goes well with Madness
> : Network at the very least. It forces the player to make a choice. Take
an
> : action that they want to get blocked or burn 2 blood. Taking away
someones
> : action with Eddie Gaines is a pretty good effect. It could go well with
a
> : Smiling Jack deck, assuming you are playing some sort of combat. At the
very
> : least, in most cases it will burn 2 blood anyway, hand strikes for 1 on
your
> : prey and grandprey.
>
> MoaK takes away an action, how? You slap it on your prey's minion, and
> if it doesn't end up into a fight, another one of that meth's minions
> takes 2 damage. And the minion taps.

If you are saying that burning 2 blood isn't a strong enough effect, fine.
If they want to avoid burning 2 blood, if thats a problem for them (and if
you are playing MoaK, then you should make it a problem) then they have a
take a prescribed course of action instead of doing whatever they normally
would have.

>
> Smiling Jack? "Ok, you just hit me with MoaK and have Smiling Jack in
> play. Ok, I'll burn Jack. If you block me, I don't have to take 2 damage
> later this turn, if you don't block, Jack burns. Doesn't sound like a
> dream combo to me.

You would want to make them burn more than 2 blood in the resulting combat,
obviously.


> Anyone want to trade nicely balanced Mind of a Killers into ver nicely
> balanced Glass Walker Pacts, highly useful Lifeless Tongues and
> long-awaited Baals Bloody Talons?

I am not sure exactly what you mean, but all of those cards have decks to go
into. Lifeless Tounges is certainly the sketchiest, a combat intercept deck
that has necromancy and expects to burn minions. There is some
redlist/trophy synergy there. Glass Walker pact goes with a jar the
soul/Baleful doll blood reduction strategy, Baals bloody Talons provides
another level of nut-punchy-ness to the Assamites. Still asssuming your
weighted walking stick is going to burn anyway, you can get some pretty big
agg damage, combine with thin blood and thats a lot of burned minions.

Will these decks be as good as weenie dominate? No.
Can they do well in tournaments? Thats up to you.

Colin Strauss Riggs
Anonymous
February 27, 2005 8:44:16 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

jnewquist@difsol.com writes:

> I have a Malk/!Malk deck that uses both Muddles and EMP. I wouldn't
> mind spending Boy Toy's action so that Muddles can beat up a 4-blood
> vamp and stay alive.

As opposed to Lucky Blow and/or Weighed Walking Stick?

--
hg@ "If you can't offend part of your audience,
iki.fi there is no point in being an artist at all." -Hakim Bey
Anonymous
February 27, 2005 8:44:17 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Janne Hägglund <hg@iki.fi.remove.these.invalid> wrote:
: jnewquist@difsol.com writes:
:> I have a Malk/!Malk deck that uses both Muddles and EMP. I wouldn't
:> mind spending Boy Toy's action so that Muddles can beat up a 4-blood
:> vamp and stay alive.
: As opposed to Lucky Blow and/or Weighed Walking Stick?

This was my reasoning as well.. There are better and more flexible
methods of getting the same or better effect without wasting an action.

And of course, using a combst card is not prone to getting intercepted.

//T
Anonymous
February 27, 2005 9:05:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Colin Riggs <colinriggs@yahoo.com> wrote:
: "Teemu T Vilen" <tvilen@cc.helsinki.fi> wrote in message
: news:cvs86h$hub$2@oravannahka.helsinki.fi...
:> MoaK takes away an action, how? You slap it on your prey's minion, and
:> if it doesn't end up into a fight, another one of that meth's minions
:> takes 2 damage. And the minion taps.
: If you are saying that burning 2 blood isn't a strong enough effect, fine.
: If they want to avoid burning 2 blood, if thats a problem for them (and if
: you are playing MoaK, then you should make it a problem) then they have a
: take a prescribed course of action instead of doing whatever they normally
: would have.

I'm more interested in finding good use for the card, as I'm pretty fond
of dementation nastiness. Unpreventable damage, of course, complements
any Dementation deck with The Hauntings, Society of Leodolds, Sleep of
Reasons and the like. This much is obvious.

Point is however, that the conditions where the unpreventable damage of
MoaK are delivered are bit too uncertain. You complement a
Haunting/Society deck with Arsons, Bleeding the Vines and Sudden
Reversals to counter Blood Dolls and Hunting Grounds as an example. For
MoaK, I haven't yet figured out ways to make it more efficient and
valuable than, say Sleep of Reason.

Too bad MoaK is a rare. Will have to try it out with some proxies. I
always did like my different attempts at Lunatic Eruptions decks and the
like. It's always great fun making opposing Vamps do what they weren't
designed to do. And it's fun to slap Lunatic Eruptions on the Beast as
well, just to make sure he doesn't forget which way the prey was ;) 

:> Smiling Jack? "Ok, you just hit me with MoaK and have Smiling Jack in
:> play. Ok, I'll burn Jack. If you block me, I don't have to take 2 damage
:> later this turn, if you don't block, Jack burns. Doesn't sound like a
:> dream combo to me.
: You would want to make them burn more than 2 blood in the resulting combat,
: obviously.

Again, MoaK has no effect as to what an opposing minion would have
wanted to do anyways. Unless you explicitly want to give an opponent
more motivation to use a specific minion to burn Smiling Jack taking a
possible combat into account that might be feasible. I just fail to
picture the situation.

:> Anyone want to trade nicely balanced Mind of a Killers into ver nicely
:> balanced Glass Walker Pacts, highly useful Lifeless Tongues and
:> long-awaited Baals Bloody Talons?

: I am not sure exactly what you mean, but all of those cards have decks to go
: into. Lifeless Tounges is certainly the sketchiest, a combat intercept deck
: that has necromancy and expects to burn minions. There is some
: redlist/trophy synergy there. Glass Walker pact goes with a jar the
: soul/Baleful doll blood reduction strategy, Baals bloody Talons provides
: another level of nut-punchy-ness to the Assamites. Still asssuming your
: weighted walking stick is going to burn anyway, you can get some pretty big
: agg damage, combine with thin blood and thats a lot of burned minions.

Ah, I always forget those Weighted Walking Sticks :)  Got me there.
Likewise I always forget that the reason I never use Blood Agony is the
"not usable the first round of combat" restriction. Very marginal still,
and a rare combat card you'd like to use half a dozen in a deck with
those sticks.

What I don't quite appreciate with GW Pact is how easily it can be
burned and how it costs you cards. Theoretically it can complement a
deck type nobody uses pretty nicely. :p 

Don't get me wrong, I appreciate threads like this the most in this
newsgroup :)  Anyone been tinkering with the new Ravnos cards, especially
Reality/ Undue Influence/ Trick of Danya? :) 

//T



: Will these decks be as good as weenie dominate? No.
: Can they do well in tournaments? Thats up to you.

: Colin Strauss Riggs
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 12:32:34 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

The Lasombra wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:09:50 -0300, "Fabio \"Sooner\""
> <fabio_sooner@NOSPAMterra.com.br> wrote:
>
> >I agree that Glass Walker Pact and Lifeless Tongues are kind of weak
> >(and I will state that in Gio newsletter KMW special edition),
>
> Remember that your job as a newsletter editor is to help players make
> the best of the cards that exist, not to bitch whine or complain.
>
> The cards have uses, explore them.

I wonder, where did you find "bitch whine or complain"? At least in
this topic?
Prior to call the card absolutely useless, I usually ask another
players' opinion. And that's why I started this topic. Unfortunately, I
was unable to find any effective ways of using Mind of a Killer.

Yours,
Ector
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 1:09:50 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:32:29 -0500, "Colin Riggs"
<colinriggs@yahoo.com> wrote:

>If you are saying that burning 2 blood isn't a strong enough effect, fine.
>If they want to avoid burning 2 blood, if thats a problem for them (and if
>you are playing MoaK, then you should make it a problem) then they have a
>take a prescribed course of action instead of doing whatever they normally
>would have.

Something with Sleep of Reason, maybe?

Stripping off 2 blood from a vampire goes a long way on meeting Sleep
of Reason's requirements.


>> Anyone want to trade nicely balanced Mind of a Killers into ver nicely
>> balanced Glass Walker Pacts, highly useful Lifeless Tongues and
>> long-awaited Baals Bloody Talons?

I agree that Glass Walker Pact and Lifeless Tongues are kind of weak
(and I will state that in Gio newsletter KMW special edition), bit
Baal's Bloody Talons has its uses. It can be played after the
opponent's strike declaration as far as can tell. Nice combo with
Garrote, and you won't waste a card if the opponent goes S:CE or
dodge. Just Psyche! and try again. Of course, it will clog your hand
if you face too much Fortitude, but nothing is perfect.
I'll gladly trade for every Baal's Bloody Talons you ever get :-)


.. Glass Walker pact goes with a jar the
>soul/Baleful doll blood reduction strategy,

I'd agree if it were not burnable by chance if you draw a master card.
It requires a very trim master module to pay off. I don't like it.


Baals bloody Talons provides
>another level of nut-punchy-ness to the Assamites. Still asssuming your
>weighted walking stick is going to burn anyway, you can get some pretty big
>agg damage, combine with thin blood and thats a lot of burned minions.
>Will these decks be as good as weenie dominate? No.
>Can they do well in tournaments? Thats up to you.

I find Selective Silence/Garrote/Baal's Bloody Talons to be powerful,
specially considering that 3 g3/4 Assamites have For to go along
against other rushers. As you say, it won't beat plenty of S:CE or
Fortitude, but it's certainly better than trying to use old Blood
Agony.

best,

Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
Giovanni Clan Newsletter Editor
-----------------------------------------------------
V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 1:09:51 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:09:50 -0300, "Fabio \"Sooner\""
<fabio_sooner@NOSPAMterra.com.br> wrote:

>I agree that Glass Walker Pact and Lifeless Tongues are kind of weak
>(and I will state that in Gio newsletter KMW special edition),

Remember that your job as a newsletter editor is to help players make
the best of the cards that exist, not to bitch whine or complain.

The cards have uses, explore them.



Carpe noctem.

Lasombra

http://www.TheLasombra.com
Your best online source for information about V:TES.
Now also featuring individual card sales and sales
of booster and starter box displays.
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 2:16:22 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On 27 Feb 2005 10:42:25 GMT, Teemu T Vilen <tvilen@cc.helsinki.fi>
scrawled:

>Colin Riggs <colinriggs@yahoo.com> wrote:
>: "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote in message
>: news:1109414079.955761.10370@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>:> Does anybody think that Mind of a Killer can be played in a tournament
>:> deck, and how?
>: Mind of a killer certainly isn't a bad card. It goes well with Madness
>: Network at the very least. It forces the player to make a choice. Take an
>: action that they want to get blocked or burn 2 blood. Taking away someones
>: action with Eddie Gaines is a pretty good effect. It could go well with a
>: Smiling Jack deck, assuming you are playing some sort of combat. At the very
>: least, in most cases it will burn 2 blood anyway, hand strikes for 1 on your
>: prey and grandprey.
>
>MoaK takes away an action, how? You slap it on your prey's minion, and
>if it doesn't end up into a fight, another one of that meth's minions
>takes 2 damage. And the minion taps.
>
>Smiling Jack? "Ok, you just hit me with MoaK and have Smiling Jack in
>play. Ok, I'll burn Jack. If you block me, I don't have to take 2 damage
>later this turn,
....

but i do have to fight the guy you're defending jack with, who's a
kitted out uber tzimisce killing machine, and i take a lot more than 2
damage.

salem
http://www.users.tpg.com.au/adsltqna/VtES/index.htm
(replace "hotmail" with "yahoo" to email)
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 2:32:00 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 20:32:45 -0500, The Lasombra
<TheLasombra@hotmail.com> wrote:

>On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:09:50 -0300, "Fabio \"Sooner\""
><fabio_sooner@NOSPAMterra.com.br> wrote:
>
>>I agree that Glass Walker Pact and Lifeless Tongues are kind of weak
>>(and I will state that in Gio newsletter KMW special edition),
>
>Remember that your job as a newsletter editor is to help players make
>the best of the cards that exist, not to bitch whine or complain.
>The cards have uses, explore them.
>Carpe noctem.
>Lasombra

Rest assured I won't whine about them, that's just not my style (as
any search on my previous post in this forum can atest).

It's just that they're too specific and difficult to maintain. In
general, I tend to find uses even to the most underrated cards - as in
my original post can atest, since I was defending a couple more cards
that are being bitched about in this thread. I bet many players found
some uses granted for Baldesar or other cards too lousy, and they're
there in the first newsletter I wrote anyway.

I assume that it still leave plenty of room to point out what is
difficult to deal with in these two cards, specifically. No need to
whine, just constructive criticism and alerts on how some cards could
be used - Glass Walker Pact in a deck with just a few other master
cards etc. When the newsletter is out, you'll notice that I make the
most to find uses even to cards Orpheus rated "wallpaper" in his site.
In fact, the whole point of this special edition is to provide
different insights - I've already written most of it, and began
explaining that we don't share the exact same opinions.

best,

Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
Giovanni Clan Newsletter Editor
-----------------------------------------------------
V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 3:49:26 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On 27 Feb 2005 21:32:34 -0800, "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote:

>I wonder, where did you find "bitch whine or complain"?

In your newsletters.

No one needs to follow your hideous example.



Carpe noctem.

Lasombra

http://www.TheLasombra.com
Your best online source for information about V:TES.
Now also featuring individual card sales and sales
of booster and starter box displays.
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 5:21:43 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 20:32:45 -0500, The Lasombra <TheLasombra@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:09:50 -0300, "Fabio \"Sooner\""
> <fabio_sooner@NOSPAMterra.com.br> wrote:
>
>> I agree that Glass Walker Pact and Lifeless Tongues are kind of weak
>> (and I will state that in Gio newsletter KMW special edition),
>
> Remember that your job as a newsletter editor is to help players make
> the best of the cards that exist, not to bitch whine or complain.
>
> The cards have uses, explore them.

[sarcasm]

Care to enlighten us noobies with some of the more blatantly obvious
winning strategies opened up or complemented by these particular
cards (for example)?

[/sarcasm]

I know you never said anything about winning, but "uses" somehow
imply at least an honest aspiration. I did happen to have an idea
for GWP, by the way, but I'm not sure it is feasible (or worth
trying), given how the card is rare.

--
Bye,

Daneel
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 5:21:44 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 02:21:43 GMT, Daneel <daniel@eposta.hu> wrote:

>Care to enlighten us

No.




Carpe noctem.

Lasombra

http://www.TheLasombra.com
Your best online source for information about V:TES.
Now also featuring individual card sales and sales
of booster and starter box displays.
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 10:16:10 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:49:26 -0500, The Lasombra
<TheLasombra@hotmail.com> wrote:

>On 27 Feb 2005 21:32:34 -0800, "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote:
>
>>I wonder, where did you find "bitch whine or complain"?
>
>In your newsletters.
>No one needs to follow your hideous example.
>Carpe noctem.
>Lasombra

Ah.

Now I understand...

For a while I wondered if the reminder was somewhat personal or not.
Now I feel better.

best,

Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
Giovanni Clan Newsletter Editor
-----------------------------------------------------
V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 10:18:38 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 09:39:12 GMT, Daneel <daniel@eposta.hu> wrote:

>On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:46:17 +1300, lehrbuch <lehrbuch@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Daneel wrote:
>>> I know you never said anything about winning, but
>>> "uses" somehow imply at least an honest aspiration.
>>> I did happen to have an idea for GWP, by the way,
>>> but I'm not sure it is feasible (or worth trying),
>>> given how the card is rare.
>>
>> Why is the rarity of the card relevant?
>
>Because I am not likely going to trade for a handful of a poor
> rare simply to try out a silly strategy. I will trade for a
> handful of a not-too-great rare that seems to imply multuple
> uses; but I won't bother to trade for the hottest or the
> shittiest rares, because of the hassle.

Ultimately, I don't think we're getting that many rares that could be
used in multiples (for "multiples" I understand 4+ copies and such).
Maybe Chill of Oblivion... Any ideas on this? Since Anarchs, of
course.

I always had the impression Rares were not meant to be something you
need that much, and I like it.

best,

Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
Giovanni Clan Newsletter Editor
-----------------------------------------------------
V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 11:33:11 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

The Lasombra wrote:
> On 27 Feb 2005 21:32:34 -0800, "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote:
>
> >I wonder, where did you find "bitch whine or complain"?
>
> In your newsletters.
>
> No one needs to follow your hideous example.
>
> Carpe noctem.
>
> Lasombra

I started this topic since I'm trying to increase quiality of my next
newsletter, if you don't mind. I could just write "Mind of a Killer is
useless" and proceed to the next card, but I realize that a good
newsletter should provide some ideas of using even
not-obviously-playable cards.
I can assure you that the next newsletter will contain no whinings (not
even about Valerius Maior, advanced). Finally, I realized that
evaluating what's good for the game isn't my job - Malkavians antitribu
would have to adapt to the game changes just like the other clans.

Yours,
Ector
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 2:16:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

"Fabio "Sooner"" <fabio_sooner@NOSPAMterra.com.br> wrote in message
news:0sr521d4ebmg0r7ke80m1dk6pktmbet70i@4ax.com...
> I always had the impression Rares were not meant to be something you
> need that much, and I like it.

Define "need". ;-) I've very needful.

I don't think it's so much that you don't need rares to build good decks.
Some decks you don't but many good deck archetypes you certainly will
need them. Just that there's no "key" rare without which you're blocked
off from experiencing major whole parts of the game. Rares generally
have fairly narrow applications - but no one said they weren't crucial
for whatever it is they're use for.

(All that said, I like it, too.)

Fred
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 2:20:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Little confused here... seems like Mind of a Killer is a pretty good
card.

Dementation decks usually involve a decent about of bleed. Doesn't Mind
of a Killer force a prey's vampire that does "bounce" or reduce to tap
no matter what? Now isn't bleeding the next turn is easier? And in
addition to that due 2 damage to one of his minions.


Frederick Scott wrote:
> "Fabio "Sooner"" <fabio_sooner@NOSPAMterra.com.br> wrote in message
> news:0sr521d4ebmg0r7ke80m1dk6pktmbet70i@4ax.com...
> > I always had the impression Rares were not meant to be something
you
> > need that much, and I like it.
>
> Define "need". ;-) I've very needful.
>
> I don't think it's so much that you don't need rares to build good
decks.
> Some decks you don't but many good deck archetypes you certainly will
> need them. Just that there's no "key" rare without which you're
blocked
> off from experiencing major whole parts of the game. Rares generally
> have fairly narrow applications - but no one said they weren't
crucial
> for whatever it is they're use for.
>
> (All that said, I like it, too.)
>
> Fred
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 2:34:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Janne Hägglund wrote:
> jnewquist@difsol.com writes:
>
> > I have a Malk/!Malk deck that uses both Muddles and EMP. I wouldn't
> > mind spending Boy Toy's action so that Muddles can beat up a
4-blood
> > vamp and stay alive.
>
> As opposed to Lucky Blow and/or Weighed Walking Stick?

AFAIK, Lucky Blow doesn't work with EMP's agg strike. Maybe I'm wrong.
Also MOAK works if you get dodged and have a press.
MOAK can also double as a way to tap a bouncing minion next turn (as
mentioned elsewhere in this thread). Or I can use it to help a
cross-table ally beef up a minion to beat up my predator with. Or I can
influence which of my predator's minions will tap next turn, possibly
preventing him from bouncing to me as much.

The price paid in utility is at least somewhat made up in flexibility.

John
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 5:15:58 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 07:18:38 -0300, Fabio "Sooner
<fabio_sooner@NOSPAMterra.com.br> wrote:

>>> Why is the rarity of the card relevant?
>>
>> Because I am not likely going to trade for a handful of a poor
>> rare simply to try out a silly strategy. I will trade for a
>> handful of a not-too-great rare that seems to imply multuple
>> uses; but I won't bother to trade for the hottest or the
>> shittiest rares, because of the hassle.
>
> Ultimately, I don't think we're getting that many rares that could be
> used in multiples (for "multiples" I understand 4+ copies and such).
> Maybe Chill of Oblivion... Any ideas on this? Since Anarchs, of
> course.

Generally, a good observation. However, 'trick' decks or weird combo
decks often need multiples of crazy rare cards.

> I always had the impression Rares were not meant to be something you
> need that much, and I like it.

Generally true.

--
Bye,

Daneel
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 5:45:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

<jnewquist@difsol.com> wrote in message news:1109619271.530184.119110@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...

> Janne Hägglund wrote:
> > jnewquist@difsol.com writes:
> > > I have a Malk/!Malk deck that uses both Muddles and EMP. I wouldn't
> > > mind spending Boy Toy's action so that Muddles can beat up a
4-blood
> > > vamp and stay alive.
> >
> > As opposed to Lucky Blow and/or Weighed Walking Stick?

> AFAIK, Lucky Blow doesn't work with EMP's agg strike.

Correct.

But I think he meant "Muddles can beat up a 4-blood vamp
and stay alive if he uses Lucky Blow"

--
LSJ (vtesrep@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
V:TES homepage: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/
Though effective, appear to be ineffective -- Sun Tzu
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 6:41:41 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

"Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote in message
news:1109414079.955761.10370@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Does anybody think that Mind of a Killer can be played in a tournament
> deck, and how?
> I was unable to find a reason of using it, but I definitely can miss
> something.

Well, if I was to build a deck around Mind of a Killer, then I would focus
on what the card does.

+1 stealth action. [dem] (D) Put this card on a ready minion. This minion
gets +1 strength. Burn this card when a combat involving this minion ends.
During this minion's discard phase, burn this card, and this minion's
controller must inflict 2 damage on another ready minion he or she controls.
[DEM] As above, and tap this minion when this card is burned.

When I look at the card, I see two effects.

1) transient +1 strength
2) 2 damage on another minion controlled by that player.

To me it looks like a great card. You just have to know how to use it.

To use effect number 1, you are actively trying to improve a vampire. If I
have a table ally playing a wall deck or a rush deck then I can put this
card on on of their vampires to enhance their vampire. Perhaps allowing
them to put just a little more "Umph!" into a combat to get mutually
benificial results.

To use effect number 2 effectively, you just wait until one of your preys
vampires must hunt, then you slap one on him. Sure he hunts and no one
blocks him, but now he inflicts 2 points of damage on another minion. One
vampire's hunt action could potential cause another hunt action which could
cause another hunt action and on... and on... and on... Let's not forget
how it can combo with Pentex Subversion and Society of Leopold.

Also did I mention that they are stackable?


--
Comments Welcome,
Norman S. Brown, Jr.
XZealot
Archon of the Swamp
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 8:20:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Fabio "Sooner" wrote:

> I always had the impression Rares were not meant to be something you
> need that much

Tell that to the designers of the Bloodlines expansion. :)  Fantastic
expansion, my favorite so far, but it's *crawling* with rares you need tons
of. Fortunately after mucho collecting I'm starting to have tons of said
rares, but it's still a bit of a pain.

//Petri
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 8:36:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Ector <Ector@mail.ru> wrote:
: The Lasombra wrote:
:> On 27 Feb 2005 21:32:34 -0800, "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote:
: I started this topic since I'm trying to increase quiality of my next
: newsletter, if you don't mind. I could just write "Mind of a Killer is
: useless" and proceed to the next card, but I realize that a good
: newsletter should provide some ideas of using even
: not-obviously-playable cards.

First try at it for me would be propably in a blood reduction deck, as
mentioned earlier. Against your prey, there might even be occasional
synergy with Lunatic Eruption, as it
- takes away an action to prepare for the MoaK damage
- potentially reduces blood on yet another Vamp
- creates a proper atmosphere of hopelesness :) 

So I'd build propably something like for the module:
3-4 Mind of a Killer
6-8 Haunting, The
3-4 Lunatic Eruption
2-4 Society of Leopold
3-4 Sleep of Reason
2-4 Sacrificial Lamb

Nothing new here, except the addition of MoaK into the ol' "drain,
torpor, eat and fill up" theme. Bit of a variation is fun, of course.

Amounts may wary according to crypt. Might require for/FOR malks/!malks
for Freak Drive, just of counter the heavy amount of actions that don't
directly attack prey's pool. But anyways, this wasn't about making fast,
clean kills. :) 

//T
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 9:03:41 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On 28 Feb 2005 08:33:11 -0800, Ector <Ector@mail.ru> wrote:

> I started this topic since I'm trying to increase quiality of my next
> newsletter, if you don't mind. I could just write "Mind of a Killer is
> useless" and proceed to the next card, but I realize that a good
> newsletter should provide some ideas of using even
> not-obviously-playable cards.
> I can assure you that the next newsletter will contain no whinings (not
> even about Valerius Maior, advanced). Finally, I realized that
> evaluating what's good for the game isn't my job - Malkavians antitribu
> would have to adapt to the game changes just like the other clans.

Great Philosophy. I think a lot of readers will react more favorably to
your contribution. If you're looking at the SWOT for a clan, you should
focus on the Strengths and Opportunities, and disregard (or at least not
get carried away with) the Weaknesses and Threats. Yeah, they exist - but
you don't win games with them. You lose games with them instead. And even
if you don't lose a game - you still don't necessarily win it. ;-)

--
Bye,

Daneel
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 11:20:15 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 17:20:24 +0200, Petri Wessman <nospam@orava.org>
wrote:

>Fabio "Sooner" wrote:
>
>> I always had the impression Rares were not meant to be something you
>> need that much
>
>Tell that to the designers of the Bloodlines expansion. :)  Fantastic
>expansion, my favorite so far, but it's *crawling* with rares you need tons
>of. Fortunately after mucho collecting I'm starting to have tons of said
>rares, but it's still a bit of a pain.
>//Petri

I think that's why the original post said something about "since
Anarchs" ;) 

Certainly, Bloodlines has tons of Rares like that, and even some U/C1
cards you won't get 8+copies if you don't buy three or four boxes,
like Slaughterhouse. Not to mention Camarilla, but at least that
expansion has cards you can use 40+ copies if you want to build 20 or
more decks without card-swapping.

best,

Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
Giovanni Clan Newsletter Editor
-----------------------------------------------------
V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 11:33:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 11:16:07 -0700, "Frederick Scott"
<nospam@no.spam.dot.com> wrote:

>"Fabio "Sooner"" <fabio_sooner@NOSPAMterra.com.br> wrote in message
>news:0sr521d4ebmg0r7ke80m1dk6pktmbet70i@4ax.com...
>> I always had the impression Rares were not meant to be something you
>> need that much, and I like it.
>
>Define "need". ;-) I've very needful.

I'd say somewhat between "you need to have multiple options on
deckbuilding" or "you need to win tournaments". It applies to both.

That said, of course not having certain rares, even recent ones, do
limit your options, but not to the point you can't play clan X or
discipline-based decks without Y. You can play Giovanni rush decks
without Chill of Oblivion or !Gangrel decks without Talons of the
Dead, and even anarch decks without Seattle Comittee. At the most, I'd
concede that a few Rares can still become a staple to a certain, weird
strategy, but I feel like they were not designed to be used that way -
it's just that players' creativity is so amazing that someone will
always find a way to benefit from having 10 copies of such a card in a
deck instead of using 2 or 3. Watch out for Lifeless Tongues :-)

Of course, I was pointing this out as a recent, steady tendence. Some
older sets don't apply.


>I don't think it's so much that you don't need rares to build good decks.
>Some decks you don't but many good deck archetypes you certainly will
>need them. Just that there's no "key" rare without which you're blocked
>off from experiencing major whole parts of the game. Rares generally
>have fairly narrow applications - but no one said they weren't crucial
>for whatever it is they're use for.
>(All that said, I like it, too.)
>Fred

Yeah, this is a way broader view of the issue.

best,

Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
Giovanni Clan Newsletter Editor
-----------------------------------------------------
V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 11:46:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

In message <opsmwibbvjo6j3lh@news.chello.hu>, Daneel <daniel@eposta.hu>
writes:
>Because I am not likely going to trade for a handful of a poor
> rare simply to try out a silly strategy. I will trade for a
> handful of a not-too-great rare that seems to imply multuple
> uses; but I won't bother to trade for the hottest or the
> shittiest rares, because of the hassle.

Certainly, amassing a large number of a rare card before trying out the
strategy is a poor thing to do if you are unsure about it all. So don't
do it.

In friendly games, ask your friends if you can play with proxies for a
cool new deck idea you've worked out. Play Jyhad Online. Use Deckbot.
And so on.

--
James Coupe "Why do so many talented people turn out to be sexual
PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D deviants? Why can't they just be normal like me and
EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 look at internet pictures of men's cocks all day?"
13D7E668C3695D623D5D -- www.livejournal.com/users/scarletdemon/
Anonymous
March 1, 2005 12:47:44 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 20:46:33 +0000, James Coupe <james@zephyr.org.uk>
wrote:

> In friendly games, ask your friends if you can play with proxies for a
> cool new deck idea you've worked out. Play Jyhad Online. Use Deckbot.
> And so on.

I always forget playing proxies is an option. I'm the true consumer. If it
ain't bought, I don't play it. :D 

--
Bye,

Daneel
Anonymous
March 1, 2005 12:47:45 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 21:47:44 GMT, Daneel <daniel@eposta.hu> wrote:

>On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 20:46:33 +0000, James Coupe <james@zephyr.org.uk>
>wrote:
>
>> In friendly games, ask your friends if you can play with proxies for a
>> cool new deck idea you've worked out. Play Jyhad Online. Use Deckbot.
>> And so on.
>
>I always forget playing proxies is an option. I'm the true consumer. If it
> ain't bought, I don't play it. :D 

Me too, to a point where I was building a deck for a proxy-free
tournament to come (of course, non-sanctioned) and was stuck at
including just 2 PTOs. Damn, I can put 10 if I like! More often than
not, I stick with the number of copies I own because I'm so used at it
and work so hard to get what I want that I feel ashamed of using
proxies. It's like I'm not giving my own cards the proper value.

It's stupid, I admit, but... I'm a Victim of Habit (pun intended).

best,

Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
Giovanni Clan Newsletter Editor
-----------------------------------------------------
V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
Anonymous
March 1, 2005 11:03:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

> Does anybody think that Mind of a Killer can be played in a tournament
> deck, and how?
> I was unable to find a reason of using it, but I definitely can miss
> something.
>

It might have some uses in a Blood Denial deck that features the Madness
Network. If you get all of your prey's minions down to one blood and then
Mind of a Killer all of them, none will stay Ready.

Now, no real deck will draw that amazingly, but you could use the card to
force troublesome minions into torpor or put them low on blood. If they
have no blood, they will have a much harder time bouncing bleeds during
their prey's turn.
!