Crocodile Temple question

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You may tap this card at the end of a successful (D) action against you to
inflict 1 damage on the acting minion (after resolving the action).

Does a "(D) action against you" include (D) actions directed at cards you
control? Or is it just for actions like Bleed and Enticement?

 

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Joshua Duffin wrote:
> "Colin McGuigan" <maguaSPAM@BGONEspeakeasy.net> wrote in message
> news:sNSdnSiwk65gQLnfRVn-jg@speakeasy.net...
> > The former. It's directed against you if it's a (D) action that
only
> > you can attempt to block (barring Eagle Sight, etc).
>
> I thought so too, but someone pointed out that there are cards using
the
> slightly wordier template "directed at you or something you control"
> (e.g. Black Sunrise). Which implies that "directed at you" might
mean
> only actions that affect you directly, and not your controlled cards.

If "Directed at you" means actions that affect you directly, and not
your cards (controlled, hand, library, ashheap, uncontrolled region,
crypt), can you give me an example of such an action other than
'bleed'? Can't think of any offhand, and if no other such action
exists, why not say 'a bleed against you'?

I'd view that "or something you control" pretty much as reminder text
since the rulebook uses it as reminder/expanded text like this:

"If the action targets another Methuselah (or something controlled by
another Methuselah), then the action is called directed, and the
Methuselah who is the target (or controls the target) of the action may
use her ready untapped minions to attempt to block the action."

The rules then say "As a convenience, when a card describes an action
that is typically directed at another Methuselah, the card's text will
usually include a (D) symbol as a reminder that the action is typically
directed." Note the absence of that reminder text here, yet cards that
are directed at something a Methuselah controls (yet isn't the player
himself) also have that (D) reminder.

Plus, the rulebook defines 'Directed action' as "An action of one
Methuselah's minion that directly affects another single Methuselah or
her minions or other cards she controls."

So saying 'a (D) action against you' would inherently include 'or cards
you control'.

Look at it this overly semantic way: If I attempt to Graverob your
vampire in torpor, who am I taking a directed action against? If you
answer "Against the vampire, not me", then why can you block it with
other minions of yours - you just told me it's not directed against
_you_, and therefore you must be unable to block, right? Right?

> Josh
>
> the midatlantic josh

-John Flournoy

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Jozxyqk wrote:
> You may tap this card at the end of a successful (D) action against you to
> inflict 1 damage on the acting minion (after resolving the action).
>
> Does a "(D) action against you" include (D) actions directed at cards you
> control? Or is it just for actions like Bleed and Enticement?

The former. It's directed against you if it's a (D) action that only
you can attempt to block (barring Eagle Sight, etc).

--Colin McGuigan

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

"Colin McGuigan" <maguaSPAM@BGONEspeakeasy.net> wrote in message
news:sNSdnSiwk65gQLnfRVn-jg@speakeasy.net...
> Jozxyqk wrote:
> > You may tap this card at the end of a successful (D) action against
you to
> > inflict 1 damage on the acting minion (after resolving the action).
> >
> > Does a "(D) action against you" include (D) actions directed at
cards you
> > control? Or is it just for actions like Bleed and Enticement?
>
> The former. It's directed against you if it's a (D) action that only
> you can attempt to block (barring Eagle Sight, etc).

I thought so too, but someone pointed out that there are cards using the
slightly wordier template "directed at you or something you control"
(e.g. Black Sunrise). Which implies that "directed at you" might mean
only actions that affect you directly, and not your controlled cards.


Josh

the midatlantic josh

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Joshua Duffin wrote:
> I thought so too, but someone pointed out that there are cards using the
> slightly wordier template "directed at you or something you control"
> (e.g. Black Sunrise). Which implies that "directed at you" might mean
> only actions that affect you directly, and not your controlled cards.

Elaboration on other cards doesn't imply that the lack of elaboration
on some means something other than what is stated.

--
LSJ (vtesrep@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

"LSJ" <vtesrepSPAM@TRAPwhite-wolf.com> wrote in message
news:Ig6Vd.11697$Ba3.2229@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> Joshua Duffin wrote:
> > I thought so too, but someone pointed out that there are cards using the
> > slightly wordier template "directed at you or something you control"
> > (e.g. Black Sunrise). Which implies that "directed at you" might mean
> > only actions that affect you directly, and not your controlled cards.
>
> Elaboration on other cards doesn't imply that the lack of elaboration
> on some means something other than what is stated.

Quite right, and John Flournoy's argument from the rulebook makes it quite
clear. Unfortunately, inconsistency in elaboration does lead to confusion
sometimes; if I remember right, it was ruled incorrectly at the Sunday draft
event at TotalCon last weekend, on the basis of the differing-card-texts
argument (no one thought to double-check with the rulebook at the time). It
probably didn't make too much of a difference in that game, though.


Josh

easily misled

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

In message <1109714719.431097.73080@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, John
Flournoy <carneggy@gmail.com> writes:
>If "Directed at you" means actions that affect you directly, and not
>your cards (controlled, hand, library, ashheap, uncontrolled region,
>crypt), can you give me an example of such an action other than
>'bleed'? Can't think of any offhand, and if no other such action
>exists, why not say 'a bleed against you'?

Not that it's relevant (as LSJ has confirmed) but Enticement would seem
to fit the "directed at you but not something of yours" criterion in the
same way bleed does.

--
James Coupe "Why do so many talented people turn out to be sexual
PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D deviants? Why can't they just be normal like me and
EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 look at internet pictures of men's cocks all day?"
13D7E668C3695D623D5D -- www.livejournal.com/users/scarletdemon/

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Joshua Duffin wrote:

>
> "LSJ" <vtesrepSPAM@TRAPwhite-wolf.com> wrote in message
> news:Ig6Vd.11697$Ba3.2229@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>> Joshua Duffin wrote:
>> > I thought so too, but someone pointed out that there are cards using
>> > the slightly wordier template "directed at you or something you
>> > control"
>> > (e.g. Black Sunrise). Which implies that "directed at you" might mean
>> > only actions that affect you directly, and not your controlled cards.
>>
>> Elaboration on other cards doesn't imply that the lack of elaboration
>> on some means something other than what is stated.
>
> Quite right, and John Flournoy's argument from the rulebook makes it quite
> clear. Unfortunately, inconsistency in elaboration does lead to confusion
> sometimes; if I remember right, it was ruled incorrectly at the Sunday
> draft event at TotalCon last weekend, on the basis of the
> differing-card-texts
> argument (no one thought to double-check with the rulebook at the time).
> It probably didn't make too much of a difference in that game, though.

Yeah, we got this one wrong too, last weekend. We ruled that Crocodile
Temple didn't work on rush actions against your minions, when it apparently
does. So yeah, unfortunately differing levels of text specificity ("(D)
actions against you" vs "(D) actions against you or minions you control",
which both mean the same thing apparently), can lead to confusion. Oh well,
one more thing to remember :}.

//Petri