Simple AUS/THA combat package for review!

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

9x Apportation
7x Telepathic Tracking
8x Theft of Vitae
6x Walk of Flame

30 cards, and it fits nicely into many Tremere decks. So what do you
think? Not enough Theft? Too much Flame? Would you add dodges to
avoid Breath of the Dragon? Do you think I'm insane for suggesting 7
copies of a hard-to-find card like T.Tracking? Bueller?
22 answers Last reply
More about simple combat package review
  1. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    > T.Tracking is hard to find, but it is an UC, so I presume people can
    > gather up 5+ copies. IF the module only has 5, I'd add another Apportation
    > and another Theft, like this:
    >

    I've had it on my wanted list since Anarchs came out. I currently have
    one, and that's only because it was part of a SW Uncommon Set I bought on
    eBay.

    Just to give an example of its hard-to-findness

    -Gregory Stuart Pettigrew
  2. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    salem wrote:
    > On 10 Mar 2005 09:22:55 -0800, "Dorrinal Blackmantle"
    > <dorrinal@hotmail.com> scrawled:
    >
    > >9x Apportation
    > >7x Telepathic Tracking
    > >8x Theft of Vitae
    > >6x Walk of Flame
    >
    > i'd up the theft by one and down the walk by one.
    >
    (snip)

    A resonable adjustment, IMO. I figured 7 T.Trackings would make Walk
    of Flame more reliable but when I think about it, 6 is still very easy
    to clump on. That and more Theft of Vitae is generally better.

    Dorrinal Blackmantle
    Chronicler of Clan Tremere
  3. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    Mike wrote:
    > My usual 'combat package' for comparison is:
    >
    > 10 Theft of Vitae
    > 6 Walk of Flame
    > 4 Blood to Water
    > 10 Apportation
    > 6 Telepathic Tracking
    > 4 Nose of the Hound

    36 Combat cards and 4 rushes sounds good, but you could probably go
    down to 30 combat cards. I'm a little concerned with the Blood to
    Water. You'll notice that I never include it. That's not because of
    the high cost - generally Theft of Vitae makes up for 2-blood combat
    cards - but because it requires you to be at close range, which can
    often doom the poor Tremere. I see Telepathic Tracking primarily used
    at inferior to get to long range in the second round, making Walk of
    Flame much safer.

    What is your experience with Blood to Water that makes you think it is
    worth it?

    Dorrinal Blackmantle
    Chronicler of Clan Tremere
  4. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    Dorrinal Blackmantle wrote:
    > 9x Apportation
    > 7x Telepathic Tracking
    > 8x Theft of Vitae
    > 6x Walk of Flame
    >
    > 30 cards, and it fits nicely into many Tremere decks.
    > So what do you think? Not enough Theft? Too much
    > Flame?

    Theft is okay, not enough Apportations.

    12x Apportation
    4x Telepathic Tracking
    8x Theft of Vitae
    4x Walk of Flame
    2x whatever you like (possibly more TT or Theft)

    That's if you want to actually burn someone every now and again.

    If you want a *real* combat package, but aren't really concerned about
    burning vampires, try:

    12x Apportation
    4x Telepathic Tracking
    12x Theft of Vitae
    2x Walk of Flame

    Adding a couple of Blood Fury/Rage is an interesting alternative, but
    I'd generally rather just include a couple more Apportations.

    Another alternative:

    6x Apportation
    8x Blood Fury
    8x Serenading the Kami
    8x Taste of Vitae

    > Would you add dodges to avoid Breath of the Dragon?

    No. Can't win, don't try.

    Oh wait, I mean, unless your metagame is heavy with BoD Tzimisce (or
    traditional Assamites), it's all about estimating your chances of
    running into ranged agg. And then realizing that chances are *low*, so
    it's not worth the effort to prepare for it. Maximize usable card
    slots.

    > Do you think I'm insane for suggesting 7 copies of
    > a hard-to-find card like T.Tracking?

    Insane is such a loaded term. :)

    I think that until we see TT reprinted, it's unlikely that most people
    will be able to come up with that many. I've got somewhere in the
    neighborhood of 10 or 12, but mostly because Kevin M kept trying to
    foist them off on me whenever I went to one of his tournaments (that
    and Perfect Clarity).

    Not that I minded.

    It'd be pretty cool if LoB had TT in the pre-cons...

    I find it interesting that I tend to think in groups of 4 cards. I
    wish I had Gomi's discipline...he's good about card grouping. Well,
    and Cherryholmes.


    Xian
    undisciplined
  5. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    Xian wrote:
    > Dorrinal Blackmantle wrote:
    > > 9x Apportation
    > > 7x Telepathic Tracking
    > > 8x Theft of Vitae
    > > 6x Walk of Flame
    > >
    > > 30 cards, and it fits nicely into many Tremere decks.
    > > So what do you think? Not enough Theft? Too much
    > > Flame?
    >
    > Theft is okay, not enough Apportations.
    >
    > 12x Apportation
    > 4x Telepathic Tracking
    > 8x Theft of Vitae
    > 4x Walk of Flame
    > 2x whatever you like (possibly more TT or Theft)
    >

    You know, that might be better in the long run. 12/6/8/4. It's
    possible that ignoring Walk of Flame may make for a better combat
    package but it's always so delightful to pull it off :) Before I owned
    T.Tracking I used something like:

    16x Apportation
    10x Theft of Vitae
    4x Walk of Flame

    You should see the look on your opponent's faces after you outmaneuver
    a Celerity deck with this one ^_^

    > That's if you want to actually burn someone every now and again.
    >
    > If you want a *real* combat package, but aren't really concerned
    about
    > burning vampires, try:
    >
    > 12x Apportation
    > 4x Telepathic Tracking
    > 12x Theft of Vitae
    > 2x Walk of Flame
    >
    > Adding a couple of Blood Fury/Rage is an interesting alternative, but
    > I'd generally rather just include a couple more Apportations.

    Agreed. The only time Blood Fury is the best option is when you are
    playing versus Drawing Out the Beast + Grapple. And even then Flesh of
    Marble makes it an exercise in futility.

    > > Would you add dodges to avoid Breath of the Dragon?
    >
    > No. Can't win, don't try.
    >
    > Oh wait, I mean, unless your metagame is heavy with BoD Tzimisce (or
    > traditional Assamites), it's all about estimating your chances of
    > running into ranged agg. And then realizing that chances are *low*,
    so
    > it's not worth the effort to prepare for it. Maximize usable card
    > slots.

    Yeah, that's why all my Wind Dances sit outside of decks at the moment.
    I would like to experiment with Bond with the Mountain, though.

    > I think that until we see TT reprinted, it's unlikely that most
    people
    > will be able to come up with that many. I've got somewhere in the
    > neighborhood of 10 or 12, but mostly because Kevin M kept trying to
    > foist them off on me whenever I went to one of his tournaments (that
    > and Perfect Clarity).

    I only have 7, myself. It's been a pain in the ass getting them all,
    but I think using 5-7 copies can enable a Tremere deck to get to the
    second round of combat more reliably.

    > Xian
    > undisciplined

    *plays Govern the Undisciplined at superior Thaumaturgy*

    Dorrinal Blackmantle
    Chronicler of Clan Tremere
  6. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    Daneel wrote:
    > T.Tracking is hard to find, but it is an UC, so I presume people can
    > gather up 5+ copies.

    I wouldn't assume that at all. It was an Uncommon, but it's been out of
    completely out of print for years. And it's useful, so the people that
    HAVE copies of it are generally very loathe to trade them away. Lots of
    long-time VtES players have very few, if any.

    And I'll second the comment elsewhere in the thread that I hope it gets
    reprinted in Legacies.

    > Daneel

    -John Flournoy
  7. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    John Flournoy wrote:
    > Daneel wrote:
    > > T.Tracking is hard to find, but it is an UC, so I presume people
    can
    > > gather up 5+ copies.
    >
    > I wouldn't assume that at all. It was an Uncommon, but it's been out
    of
    > completely out of print for years.

    Gah. Brainlock. Not completely out of print, but certainly not always
    easy to find boosters for (barring 'i'd like to buy a whole box,
    please', which many players can't/won't do.) Plus it's an uncommon in a
    large set;
    I don't have the numbers in front of me, but if memory serves buying a
    box of boosters should give you on average about 1 copy of TT, assuming
    the box is uniformly random. (35-or-so boosters in a box, 3 uncommons
    per booster, 100 uncommons in the set.)

    -John Flournoy
  8. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 06:13:38 -0500, Gregory Stuart Pettigrew
    <etherial@sidehack.sat.gweep.net> wrote:

    >> T.Tracking is hard to find, but it is an UC, so I presume people can
    >> gather up 5+ copies. IF the module only has 5, I'd add another
    >> Apportation
    >> and another Theft, like this:
    >>
    >
    > I've had it on my wanted list since Anarchs came out. I currently have
    > one, and that's only because it was part of a SW Uncommon Set I bought on
    > eBay.
    >
    > Just to give an example of its hard-to-findness
    >
    > -Gregory Stuart Pettigrew

    No kidding.

    Problem is, TT isn't too much use alone. It is typically like Psyche
    in that you want either none or five in most decks. ;(

    Hopefully in Africa some clans heavily rely on its use...

    --
    Bye,

    Daneel
  9. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:34:28 GMT, Daneel <daniel@eposta.hu> wrote:

    >On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 06:13:38 -0500, Gregory Stuart Pettigrew
    ><etherial@sidehack.sat.gweep.net> wrote:
    >
    >>> T.Tracking is hard to find, but it is an UC, so I presume people can
    >>> gather up 5+ copies. IF the module only has 5, I'd add another
    >>> Apportation
    >>> and another Theft, like this:
    >>
    >> I've had it on my wanted list since Anarchs came out. I currently have
    >> one, and that's only because it was part of a SW Uncommon Set I bought on
    >> eBay.
    >> Just to give an example of its hard-to-findness
    >> -Gregory Stuart Pettigrew
    >
    >No kidding.
    >Problem is, TT isn't too much use alone. It is typically like Psyche
    > in that you want either none or five in most decks. ;(
    >Hopefully in Africa some clans heavily rely on its use...

    Hope so too.

    I'm in the same situation - only one TT.
    Never saw it in any trade list around here...

    best,

    Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
    V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
    Giovanni Newsletter Editor
    -----------------------------------------------------
    V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
    http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
  10. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

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    John Flournoy wrote:
    | Daneel wrote:
    |
    |>T.Tracking is hard to find, but it is an UC, so I presume people can
    |>gather up 5+ copies.
    |
    | I wouldn't assume that at all. It was an Uncommon, but it's been out of

    It was one of the "rare uncommons". I don't have the details in front
    of me, so I don't have the exact numbers, but it was a situation where
    if a normal uncommon would average, say, 2 per box of boosters, this
    particular one would average 1, and frequently none.

    I remember there was some anomaly in the printing at the time that
    caused this to happen. You'd have to go back and look for what it was.

    | completely out of print for years. And it's useful, so the people that
    | HAVE copies of it are generally very loathe to trade them away. Lots of
    | long-time VtES players have very few, if any.

    Correct. The card is generally useful in any Auspex deck that intends
    to fight; especially with its press-with-a-maneuver capacity, even when
    you don't need to get around Combat Ends, it has a great second use.

    All this combines to mean that it'll be hard to find for trade.

    - --
    Derek

    insert clever quotation here

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  11. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    "Dorrinal Blackmantle" <dorrinal@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:1110475375.594530.305880@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
    > 9x Apportation
    > 7x Telepathic Tracking
    > 8x Theft of Vitae
    > 6x Walk of Flame
    >
    > 30 cards, and it fits nicely into many Tremere decks. So what do you
    > think? Not enough Theft? Too much Flame? Would you add dodges to
    > avoid Breath of the Dragon? Do you think I'm insane for suggesting 7
    > copies of a hard-to-find card like T.Tracking? Bueller?

    My usual 'combat package' for comparison is:

    10 Theft of Vitae
    6 Walk of Flame
    4 Blood to Water
    10 Apportation
    6 Telepathic Tracking
    4 Nose of the Hound


    Regards,

    Mike
  12. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    On 10 Mar 2005 09:22:55 -0800, "Dorrinal Blackmantle"
    <dorrinal@hotmail.com> scrawled:

    >9x Apportation
    >7x Telepathic Tracking
    >8x Theft of Vitae
    >6x Walk of Flame
    >
    >30 cards, and it fits nicely into many Tremere decks. So what do you
    >think? Not enough Theft? Too much Flame? Would you add dodges to
    >avoid Breath of the Dragon? Do you think I'm insane for suggesting 7
    >copies of a hard-to-find card like T.Tracking? Bueller?

    i'd up the theft by one and down the walk by one.

    apportations can be used to try and keep close if you're worried about
    breath of the dragon, and then you can both go down in a screaming
    heap, but the opponent will be down 3 blood (1 for breath, 2 for
    theft), and you'll be up 2. Unless they play breath at superior, in
    which case hopefully they'll burn. :)


    salem
    http://www.users.tpg.com.au/adsltqna/VtES/index.htm
    (replace "hotmail" with "yahoo" to email)
  13. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 20:18:35 +1100, salem <salem_christ.geo@hotmail.com>
    wrote:

    > On 10 Mar 2005 09:22:55 -0800, "Dorrinal Blackmantle"
    > <dorrinal@hotmail.com> scrawled:
    >
    >> 9x Apportation
    >> 7x Telepathic Tracking
    >> 8x Theft of Vitae
    >> 6x Walk of Flame
    >>
    >> 30 cards, and it fits nicely into many Tremere decks. So what do you
    >> think? Not enough Theft? Too much Flame? Would you add dodges to
    >> avoid Breath of the Dragon? Do you think I'm insane for suggesting 7
    >> copies of a hard-to-find card like T.Tracking? Bueller?
    >
    > i'd up the theft by one and down the walk by one.

    I second that.

    Looks cool though.

    T.Tracking is hard to find, but it is an UC, so I presume people can
    gather up 5+ copies. IF the module only has 5, I'd add another Apportation
    and another Theft, like this:

    10x Apportation
    5x Telepathic Tracking
    10x Theft of Vitae
    5x Walk of Flame

    --
    Bye,

    Daneel
  14. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    On 11 Mar 2005 09:12:17 -0800, "Dorrinal Blackmantle"
    <john.mcglynn@gmail.com> scrawled:

    >
    >Xian wrote:

    >> foist them off on me whenever I went to one of his tournaments (that
    >> and Perfect Clarity).
    >
    >I only have 7, myself. It's been a pain in the ass getting them all,
    >but I think using 5-7 copies can enable a Tremere deck to get to the
    >second round of combat more reliably.

    i seem to have managed to end up with 8 TT and 8 Perfect Clarities.
    and, well, that's too much. I have some of each lying around doing
    nothing.

    which means i need to build another trem deck, not that i am going to
    trade any away.

    so, anyone got a good deck list that uses 4 TT and 4 PC? doesn't even
    have to be a trem deck. could be tzim with tha, or something. malk
    with tha? hmmm...

    salem
    http://www.users.tpg.com.au/adsltqna/VtES/index.htm
    (replace "hotmail" with "yahoo" to email)
  15. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 10:41:26 +1100, salem
    <salem_christ.geo@hotmail.com> wrote:

    >On 11 Mar 2005 09:12:17 -0800, "Dorrinal Blackmantle"
    ><john.mcglynn@gmail.com> scrawled:
    >so, anyone got a good deck list that uses 4 TT and 4 PC? doesn't even
    >have to be a trem deck. could be tzim with tha, or something. malk
    >with tha? hmmm...

    Petaniqua?

    Petaniqua, 9, chi AUS DAI DEM OBF THA, Malkavian, 4, [KMW]
    Petaniqua (ADV), 9, chi AUS DAI DEM OBF THA, Baali, 4, [KMW]

    One verion has a press and +1 strength, the other +1 bleed and deals 2
    unpreventable damage before range in any round after the first. Both
    can stand immune from agg damage and have a lot of options regarding
    maneuvers (DAI, OBF, THA).

    Some good bruise n' bleed deck featuring her merged, D'habi Revenant,
    DAI/THA combat goodies?

    Or merged Ambrogino? Bleeding for 3 with +1 stealth and Perfect
    Clarity... Hm... Wish I had more than two of these.

    best,

    Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
    V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
    Giovanni Clan Newsletter Editor
    -----------------------------------------------------
    V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
    http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
  16. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    What about if the deck contains Valerius Maior (not advanced) who many
    theft would you put in? i'm using a deck with him and petaniqua with 13
    thefts, but still it seems a bit awkward, it's lacking... uhm... PUNCH!
  17. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    Omael wrote:
    > What about if the deck contains Valerius Maior (not advanced) who
    many
    > theft would you put in? i'm using a deck with him and petaniqua with
    13
    > thefts, but still it seems a bit awkward, it's lacking... uhm...
    PUNCH!

    I do not have much experience with him yet, but I would probably go
    with 16 strikes. Perhaps 12 Theft of Vitae and 4 Soul Burn? That is
    pretty nasty. You will also want to mix in some Conflagration, but I
    think that goes without saying.

    Dorrinal Blackmantle
    Chronicler of Clan Tremere
  18. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    On 13 Mar 2005 08:20:22 -0800, "Dorrinal Blackmantle"
    <dorrinal@hotmail.com> wrote:

    >
    >Omael wrote:
    >> What about if the deck contains Valerius Maior (not advanced) who
    >many
    >> theft would you put in? i'm using a deck with him and petaniqua with
    >13
    >> thefts, but still it seems a bit awkward, it's lacking... uhm...
    >PUNCH!
    >
    >I do not have much experience with him yet, but I would probably go
    >with 16 strikes. Perhaps 12 Theft of Vitae and 4 Soul Burn? That is
    >pretty nasty. You will also want to mix in some Conflagration, but I
    >think that goes without saying.
    >Dorrinal Blackmantle
    >Chronicler of Clan Tremere

    I've built a deck featuring him using 14 Theft of Vitae, 4 Burst of
    Sunlight and a bunch of Ignore the Searing Flames (and some other
    combat support obviously, like 4 Trap, 8 Apportations, 4 Fear of the
    Void Below, 4 High Ground or something like that).

    I fear there is too much combat in this deck that does not use Auspex
    for nothing besides a few Telepathic Misdirections, but I guess I can
    reliably block using Valerius ADV ability (I plan to merge him), Magic
    of the Smith and Bowl of Convergence, and 1 of each media location
    available besides the London Evening Star. I'll test it next week and
    tell how it goes. The bad thing is that I don't have no anti-S:CE
    tech, but it's not showing up that often in casual play...

    best,

    Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
    V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
    Giovanni Clan Newsletter Editor
    -----------------------------------------------------
    V:tES Brasil Site (only in Portuguese for now)
    http://planeta.terra.com.br/lazer/vtesbrasil/
  19. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    Mike wrote:
    > "Wes" <ghost@NYETSPAMmnsi.net> wrote in message
    > news:d16j190ju6@enews4.newsguy.com...
    >
    > > Sure, but only *if* you have all five cards flowing at the right
    times
    > > (including the unmentioned press needed to get to second round).
    That's a
    > > tall order, even if you are focusing on THA combat...
    >
    > Yes but you don't *need* all five cards on every occaision anyway.
    With
    > plenty of Apportations, the Trackings, and possibly Hawgs or a Mob
    > Connections too, pressing should be an issue. You only really need
    the BTW
    > and WOF combo in the second round to be effective.

    I have used the occasional Blood to Water to take out a War Ghoul or
    Shambling Hordes. If you see those minions, B2W might be handy. What
    would be nicer would be Far Mastery. Rumor has it that Tremere have
    Dominate in-clan.

    Against vampires I would rather be at long range than try to work in a
    Blood to Water.

    >
    > > > Besides, if you equip with a Leather jacket first,
    > >
    > > Sorry, make that "all six cards" :)
    >
    > Yes it's another card, but if you bide your time you'll see it.
    >
    > > > then that should protect you from the opposing strike. And
    > > > BTW also kills War Ghouls.
    > >
    > > Apportation + Theft of Vitae is probably a better way to deal with
    War
    > > Ghouls, since it bypasses their prevention. A smart Tzimisce player
    will
    > > probably choose easier targets than a THA-user.
    >
    > A smart Tremere player wouldn't let the War Ghoul come out in the
    first
    > place... :D

    I agree, but sometimes you can't do anything about Horatio and Jake
    Washington on the first turn. :)

    Dorrinal Blackmantle
    Chronicler of Clan Tremere
  20. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    > > My usual 'combat package' for comparison is:
    > >
    > > 10 Theft of Vitae
    > > 6 Walk of Flame
    > > 4 Blood to Water
    > > 10 Apportation
    > > 6 Telepathic Tracking
    > > 4 Nose of the Hound
    >
    > 36 Combat cards and 4 rushes sounds good, but you could probably go
    > down to 30 combat cards. I'm a little concerned with the Blood to
    > Water. You'll notice that I never include it. That's not because of
    > the high cost - generally Theft of Vitae makes up for 2-blood combat
    > cards - but because it requires you to be at close range, which can
    > often doom the poor Tremere. I see Telepathic Tracking primarily used
    > at inferior to get to long range in the second round, making Walk of
    > Flame much safer.
    >
    > What is your experience with Blood to Water that makes you think it is
    > worth it?

    1st round -> maneuver, theft
    2nd round -> blood to water, walk of flame

    That should be enough to burn a vampire on 7 blood or less, which TBH is
    well worth the risk. Besides, if you equip with a Leather jacket first, then
    that should protect you from the opposing strike. And BTW also kills War
    Ghouls.


    Regards,

    Mike
  21. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    "Mike" <mike@vekn.org.uk> wrote
    >
    > 1st round -> maneuver, theft
    > 2nd round -> blood to water, walk of flame
    >
    > That should be enough to burn a vampire on 7 blood or less, which TBH is
    > well worth the risk.

    Sure, but only *if* you have all five cards flowing at the right times
    (including the unmentioned press needed to get to second round). That's a
    tall order, even if you are focusing on THA combat...

    > Besides, if you equip with a Leather jacket first,

    Sorry, make that "all six cards" :)

    > then that should protect you from the opposing strike. And
    > BTW also kills War Ghouls.

    Apportation + Theft of Vitae is probably a better way to deal with War
    Ghouls, since it bypasses their prevention. A smart Tzimisce player will
    probably choose easier targets than a THA-user.

    Cheers,
    WES
  22. Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

    "Wes" <ghost@NYETSPAMmnsi.net> wrote in message
    news:d16j190ju6@enews4.newsguy.com...

    > Sure, but only *if* you have all five cards flowing at the right times
    > (including the unmentioned press needed to get to second round). That's a
    > tall order, even if you are focusing on THA combat...

    Yes but you don't *need* all five cards on every occaision anyway. With
    plenty of Apportations, the Trackings, and possibly Hawgs or a Mob
    Connections too, pressing should be an issue. You only really need the BTW
    and WOF combo in the second round to be effective.

    > > Besides, if you equip with a Leather jacket first,
    >
    > Sorry, make that "all six cards" :)

    Yes it's another card, but if you bide your time you'll see it.

    > > then that should protect you from the opposing strike. And
    > > BTW also kills War Ghouls.
    >
    > Apportation + Theft of Vitae is probably a better way to deal with War
    > Ghouls, since it bypasses their prevention. A smart Tzimisce player will
    > probably choose easier targets than a THA-user.

    A smart Tremere player wouldn't let the War Ghoul come out in the first
    place... :D
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