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Changing some political actions

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Anonymous
April 3, 2005 9:02:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

It is a shame that VTES has so many pool damage dealing political
actions but only four are used: KRC, Conservative Agitation, Parity
Shift and Judgement: Camarilla Segregation. And two of these are only
playable with a Camarilla deck. So here are some suggestions how to
change some other political actions to make them playable. And BTW some
suggestions for other political actions that are laughable.

Screw the Masquerade!
Type: Political Action
Political Action-Worth 1 Vote. Called by any vampire at +1 stealth.
Choose a Methuselah. Successful referendum means each Methuselah burns
1 pool and the chosen Methuselah burns an additional pool.

Really a joke. Better would be: "Choose a Methuselah. Successful
referendum means each other Methuselah burns 1 pool and the chosen
Methuselah burns x pool, where x is the number of methuselahs in the
game." That would be one more pool damage than a Conservative
Agitation, but you have the problem getting also one damage, pissing of
all other players and are not able to deal with someone.


Transfer of Power
Type: Political Action
Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any vampire at +1 stealth.
Successful referendum means you gain 1 pool from each Methuselah who
has more pool than you do.

A weak version of Parity Shift. Better would be: "Successful
referendum means you gain 3 pool from each Methuselah who has more pool
than you do." That looks really strong, because you could be able to
get 12 pools. But you have to see the weakness compared with Parity
Shift. You piss of all players with more pool and you are not able to
deal with someone like its possible with PS.


Sabbat Threat
Type: Political Action
Requires: prince,justicar
Political Card -- Worth 1 Vote. Called by any prince or justicar at +1
stealth.
Choose one or more Methuselahs. Successful referendum means each chosen
Methuselah gets a threat counter. Each Methuselah burns 1 pool for each
threat counter he or she has during his or her untap phase. A
Methuselah may never have more than two threat counters, and he or she
may burn the Edge to burn all the threat counters he or she has.

Nice card, if it wouldnt be to easy to burn the edge. My solution would
be (and that will make this card very strong): "Choose one or more
Methuselahs. Successful referendum means each chosen Methuselah gets a
threat counter. Each Methuselah burns 1 pool if he has any threat
counters during his or her untap phase, but not more than 2 pool. He or
she may burn the Edge to burn one threat counter he or she has." That
would give you an effect like Army of rats. You can stack the cards and
make it so difficult to avoid the threat.


Code of Milan Suspended
Type: Political Action
Requires: sabbat
Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any Sabbat vampire at +1
stealth.
Select the Methuselah with the Edge. If this referendum is successful,
that Methuselah burns 1 pool.

Wouldnt it be nice if the Sabbat had only some special votes, that are
not absolutely useless? I would say: "burns x pool, where x is the
number of methuselahs in play". Still a weak card, because you can
only play it in a very special situation.


Tithings
Type: Political Action
Requires: sabbat,capacity above 6
Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any Sabbat vampire with a
capacity above 6 at +1 stealth.
Successful referendum means you gain 1 pool from each Methuselah who
does not a control a vampire with a capacity above 6.

Another candidate for the Sabbat. Wow, you really will get one or two
pool if you are very happy. So let the wennies pay 3 pool. You could
get 12 pool, yes. But playing with 4 wennie decks on a table needs some
prize! And you still cannot target someone.


Regaining the Upper Hand
Type: Political Action
Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any vampire at +1 stealth.
Choose a Methuselah. Successful referendum means the chosen Methuselah
gets the Edge.

Can you believe it? You cannot only look at the Edge, you cannot only
hold it in your hand. With this card you get it! Really game breaking!
I must confess, i have problems to make this card stronger, because its
so absolutely weak. Here is my solution: "Choose a Methuselah.
Successful referendum means you put these card in play. The chosen
Methuselah gets the Edge and takes control of these card. He can burn
these card in the untap phase to get 5 pool. Burn these card if another
methuselah takes control of the Edge."
Anonymous
April 3, 2005 9:33:02 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

> Screw the Masquerade!

This card saw some play waaay back when my group used card limits, and
although it's not strong enough, the pool damage to everyone did come
in handy. (Just like Anarch Revolt, it softens up the table.) If it
was "chosen Methuselah burns an additional 2 pool", then it would be
between KRC and Ancilla Empowerment in its effect, and I think that
would be great.

> Code of Milan Suspended

Sorry, I think this card will be wallpaper forever. Maybe if they lost
pool and you actually gained pool, but still, I think it's loster than
Chainsaw.

> Tithings

I like your suggestion of upping the pool transfer. Many players are
opposed to more card text migrations, but it's a cool thought.

> Regaining the Upper Hand

> I must confess, i have problems to make this card stronger,
> because its so absolutely weak.

Yes, indeed.

-- Brian
Anonymous
April 3, 2005 11:15:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

x5mofr@gmx.de wrote:
> It is a shame that VTES has so many pool damage dealing political
> actions but only four are used: KRC, Conservative Agitation, Parity
> Shift and Judgement: Camarilla Segregation.

The last is not a political action.

LSJ listed a bunch of other commonly used ones (Domain Challenge, etc.)
Let me add that Finding the Path isn't unusual in Chicago.
Related resources
Anonymous
April 3, 2005 12:02:03 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

> Contractual Dispute
> +1 stealth political action.
>
> Choose a Methuselah.
>
> Requires a ready Sabbat vampire.
> Successful referendum means each other Methuselah who has more pool
> than the chosen Methuselah burns 1 pool and the chosen Methuselah
burns
> x pool, where x is the number of methuselahs who burn pool.
>
> Requires a ready Camarilla vampire.
> Successful referendum means each other Methuselah who has less pool
> than the chosen Methuselah gains 1 pool and the chosen Methuselah
burns
> x pool, where x is the number of methuselahs who gain pool.
>
> "I don't give a fig for any contract"
> -Theo Bell

Whoops, that should probably read more like:

Contractual Dispute
+1 stealth political action.

Choose a Methuselah.

Requires a ready Sabbat vampire.
Successful referendum means each other Methuselah who has more pool
than the chosen Methuselah burns 1 pool and the chosen Methuselah
*gains*
x pool, where x is the number of methuselahs who burn pool.

Requires a ready Camarilla vampire.
Successful referendum means each other Methuselah who has less pool
than the chosen Methuselah gains 1 pool and the chosen Methuselah
burns
x pool, where x is the number of methuselahs who gain pool.

"I don't give a fig for any contract"
-Theo Bell
> -Scrote
Anonymous
April 3, 2005 12:23:27 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

x5mofr@gmx.de wrote:
[some stuff about pool-burning political actions]

Don't forget:
Treaty of Tyre Enforced
Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any vampire at +1 stealth.
If this referendum is successful, each Methuselah burns X+1 pool,
where X is the number of Assamites he or she controls.
Anonymous
April 3, 2005 5:44:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Jozxyqk wrote:
> x5mofr@gmx.de wrote:
> [some stuff about pool-burning political actions]
>
> Don't forget:
> Treaty of Tyre Enforced
> Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any vampire at +1 stealth.
> If this referendum is successful, each Methuselah burns X+1 pool,
> where X is the number of Assamites he or she controls.

And Ancient Influence, Reins of Power, Domain Challenge, Ancilla
Empowerment, and Anarchist Uprising.


--
LSJ (vtesrepSPAM@TRAPwhite-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep (remove spam trap to reply)
Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/
Anonymous
April 3, 2005 7:37:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Jozxyqk wrote:

> Don't forget:
> Treaty of Tyre Enforced
> Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any vampire at +1 stealth.
> If this referendum is successful, each Methuselah burns X+1 pool,
> where X is the number of Assamites he or she controls.

I'm really surprised nobody's whipped this gem out on Deckbot.

-Snapcase
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 3:00:57 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

In message <lCX3e.5667$D_2.4676@fe11.lga>, Snapcase
<captainhead@gmail.com> writes:
>Jozxyqk wrote:
>> Don't forget:
>> Treaty of Tyre Enforced Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any
>>vampire at +1 stealth.
>> If this referendum is successful, each Methuselah burns X+1 pool,
>>where X is the number of Assamites he or she controls.
>
>I'm really surprised nobody's whipped this gem out on Deckbot.

Using a Uriah Winter, Revelation of the Sire, trojan horse, Alamut
FRENZY OF DOOM?

--
James Coupe "Why do so many talented people turn out to be sexual
PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D deviants? Why can't they just be normal like me and
EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 look at internet pictures of men's cocks all day?"
13D7E668C3695D623D5D -- www.livejournal.com/users/scarletdemon/
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 11:58:13 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Sabbat Threat can be made playable easily by just saying that they can
only burn the Edge to get rid of the threat counters during their untap
phase.
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 12:20:30 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Certainly the original poster should have said "It is a shame that VTES has so
many pool damage dealing political actions but only <eight> are used: KRC,
Conservative Agitation, Parity Shift, <Ancient Influence, Reins of Power, Domain
Challenge, Ancilla Empowerment, and Anarchist Uprising.>" And included a codicil
about Treaty being pants and deservedly so, with brief mention of how PTO is
actually a damage dealing vote etc etc. I do think the rant about RtUH is apropo.

Finally, card text migration is getting dangerously high. Please consider not
implementing any of his/her suggestions, and instead releasing new cards that
address their concerns (if you find them valid).

best -

chris

LSJ wrote:

> Jozxyqk wrote:
> > x5mofr@gmx.de wrote:
> > [some stuff about pool-burning political actions]
> >
> > Don't forget:
> > Treaty of Tyre Enforced
> > Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any vampire at +1 stealth.
> > If this referendum is successful, each Methuselah burns X+1 pool,
> > where X is the number of Assamites he or she controls.
>
> And Ancient Influence, Reins of Power, Domain Challenge, Ancilla
> Empowerment, and Anarchist Uprising.
>
> --
> LSJ (vtesrepSPAM@TRAPwhite-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep (remove spam trap to reply)
> Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar:
> http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

--
chris shorb
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 12:34:06 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Orpheus wrote:
> Emmit Svenson a écrit :
> > LSJ listed a bunch of other commonly used ones (Domain Challenge,
etc.)
> > Let me add that Finding the Path isn't unusual in Chicago.
>
> Really ? Why would that be ? You risk alienating an ally, even if
it's
> your next prey, and it's less flexible than KRC (not mentionning that

> aberration Parity Shift)...

You gain one, your prey loses one. Not bad for a vote any weenie can
call. In a four- or five-player game, you can win an ally on the vote.
It's certainly better than a Conservative Agitation in a two-player
game. It is less dangerous to your allies than Domain Challenge or
Ancillae Empowerment, and the state of others' controlled region
doesn't affect your referendum. You can use it to help a dying player.

It is less aggressive than KRC, of course. But you don't want to build
a heavy vote deck with 80%+ KRC because of Delaying Tactics. You want
another vote your other minions can call that turn. A mix of KRC, FtP,
and Disputed Territory can be quite effective.
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 1:17:30 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

x5mofr@gmx.de a écrit :

> Screw the Masquerade!
> Type: Political Action
> Political Action-Worth 1 Vote. Called by any vampire at +1 stealth.
> Choose a Methuselah. Successful referendum means each Methuselah burns
> 1 pool and the chosen Methuselah burns an additional pool.

sometime better than domain challenge since you will not harm your
allies too much.
Very cool if you play bribes, btw since you and your fellow voters will
avoid the pool loss and stay your friends.
if you are the only player at the table playing votes, the others are
your enemies anyway ;) 


> Transfer of Power
> Type: Political Action
> Political Card - Worth 1 Vote. Called by any vampire at +1 stealth.
> Successful referendum means you gain 1 pool from each Methuselah who
> has more pool than you do.

It's already a strong card as it is. You can gain 4 pool for no
drawback. Try to use it instead of whining ! :D 
First it makes you look less harmful than if you played a parity shift !
Second 2 or 3 pool at the right time can and will save your life, and
again, if you bribe, the other voters would vote for you since it costs
them nothing.


> Sabbat Threat
> Type: Political Action
> Requires: prince,justicar
> Political Card -- Worth 1 Vote. Called by any prince or justicar at +1
> stealth.
> Choose one or more Methuselahs. Successful referendum means each chosen
> Methuselah gets a threat counter. Each Methuselah burns 1 pool for each
> threat counter he or she has during his or her untap phase. A
> Methuselah may never have more than two threat counters, and he or she
> may burn the Edge to burn all the threat counters he or she has.

you have to make up a cool strategy to avoid your nemesis getting the
edge. Play folderol ! play Ignis fatus ! play Form of corruption ! play
eagle sight :) 
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 1:22:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

In message <4250ecd7$0$26836$626a14ce@news.free.fr>, Orpheus
<orpheus.13@DEADfree.fr> writes:
>Really ? Why would that be ? You risk alienating an ally, even if it's
>your next prey, and it's less flexible than KRC (not mentionning that
>aberration Parity Shift)...

Parity Shift isn't available to people without Princes and Justicars,
for instance. Also, it's not as vulnerable to taking out a key
Prince/Justicar (in a vote deck with some Princes/Justicars, and some
non-P/Js). You might reasonably read the card as saying "Play only if,
for some reason, you can't put Parity Shift in your deck."

Additionally, it can often be only one person you're really bargaining
with over (say) a KRC. "Yeah, give me a pool damage to my prey, and
I'll let it through." On a 5 player table, that's doable. On a 4
player table, that's doable. Once you hit three, it's both other
Methuselahs. Once you hit two, it's one-on-one. So in the early
stages, you still have reasonable negotiating room - they get the pool
damage AND they get a pool back themself.

That sounds like it's often going to be slightly easier to get a
potentially hostile Methuselah to go along with. Typical arguments over
KRC often include whether it goes 3-1 (my choice-your choice), or 2-2
(my choice-your choice). 1 damage, 1 gain for you is a similarly
reasonable chance of getting them on side - and it's still a pool gain
for me.

I wouldn't be betting the house on it, but I can see why it might be
useful. If you call it twice in a turn, that could be 6 pool gain with
two Voter Caps instead of 4, AND still putting some pressure on your
predator and prey (unlike a Con Boon, or similar). If your priorities
are a little more defensive - say, you have expensive tastes in vampires
- it's plausible.

--
James Coupe "Why do so many talented people turn out to be sexual
PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D deviants? Why can't they just be normal like me and
EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 look at internet pictures of men's cocks all day?"
13D7E668C3695D623D5D -- www.livejournal.com/users/scarletdemon/
April 4, 2005 1:29:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Emmit Svenson a écrit :
> LSJ listed a bunch of other commonly used ones (Domain Challenge, etc.)
> Let me add that Finding the Path isn't unusual in Chicago.

Really ? Why would that be ? You risk alienating an ally, even if it's
your next prey, and it's less flexible than KRC (not mentionning that
aberration Parity Shift)...

Orpheus
!