[LSJ] Trophy Wording Question

[Name]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Hi,

We had a question about trophies tonight, and it basically boiled down to a
wording question.

The red list rules say, "If a vampire burns a Red List minion in combat or
as a (D) action (including diablerie), his controller may go through her
library, ash heap and/or hand to get a master trophy card to put on that
vampire and then reshuffle her library or draw back up to her hand size as
necessary."

The trophy rules say, "A trophy may be put into play using a master phase
action (or can be retrieved as listed on the other side of the card). . .
When any vampire burns a Red List minion in combat or as a (D) action
(including diablerie), the controller of the trophy may choose to move the
trophy to that vampire. Any number of trophies in play may be moved to the
vampire in this way (in addition to the the single trophy that the vampire's
controller may retrieve from her library, ash heap or hand).

Since the red list rules specify "and/or," one player assumed that meant you
could go through your library, ash heap, and hand and get a trophy card FROM
EACH to put on your vampire. If not, he wondered, why would it specify
"and/or" instead of just "or"?

This contrasts what it says on the trophy rule, where it specifies a
"single" trophy.

Did a search for this, but couldn't find anything.

Thanks,

N. Withheld

 

[Quetzalcoatl]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

The statement states the following

"...his controller may go through her library, ash heap and/or hand to
get a master trophy card to put on that vampire..."

What does it say ... it says you may do something ... " to get a master
trophy card to put on that vampire..."

How is that to be achieved? " ... his controller may go through her
library, ash heap and/or hand "

Therefore you may search 3 locations to get a single trophy card.

Hope that helps.

David

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Name wrote:
> Since the red list rules specify "and/or," one player assumed that meant you
> could go through your library, ash heap, and hand and get a trophy card FROM
> EACH to put on your vampire. If not, he wondered, why would it specify
> "and/or" instead of just "or"?

What if someone burns a Red List minion, and then goes through their
library to look for a trophy, only to find no trophies in their library
-- they'd discarded it to their ash heap and forgotten about it. If it
was only "or", then it would be arguable that, well, too bad, you got to
choose one place to search, and they chose the wrong one.

Regardless: You get *a* trophy, that is, a single one. The trophy rule
even reinforces this in the paranthesized reminder text where it
mentions "single trophy".

--Colin McGuigan

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

quetzalcoatl wrote:
> The statement states the following
>
> "...his controller may go through her library, ash heap and/or hand to
> get a master trophy card to put on that vampire..."
>
> What does it say ... it says you may do something ... " to get a master
> trophy card to put on that vampire..."
>
> How is that to be achieved? " ... his controller may go through her
> library, ash heap and/or hand "
>
> Therefore you may search 3 locations to get a single trophy card.

Correct. "A trophy card".

--
LSJ (vtesrepSPAM@TRAPwhite-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep (remove spam trap to reply)
Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Colin McGuigan wrote:
> Name wrote:
> > Since the red list rules specify "and/or," one player assumed that
meant you
> > could go through your library, ash heap, and hand and get a trophy
card FROM
> > EACH to put on your vampire. If not, he wondered, why would it
specify
> > "and/or" instead of just "or"?
>
> Regardless: You get *a* trophy, that is, a single one. The trophy
rule
> even reinforces this in the paranthesized reminder text where it
> mentions "single trophy".
>
Indeed. If you consider the Red List rule to be ambiguous (it
certainly does not unambiguously state that you can get more than one,
at best it's ambiguous), the Trophy list is quite unambiguous and
resolves the uncertainty. It's not a contradiction in the wording of
the two rules, just a case where one section of the rules resolves what
some might find to be confusing wording.

 

[Name]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

LSJ <vtesrepSPAM@TRAPwhite-wolf.com> wrote in message
news:Jslge.894$wM2.103@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> quetzalcoatl wrote:
> > The statement states the following
> >
> > "...his controller may go through her library, ash heap and/or hand to
> > get a master trophy card to put on that vampire..."
> >
> > What does it say ... it says you may do something ... " to get a master
> > trophy card to put on that vampire..."
> >
> > How is that to be achieved? " ... his controller may go through her
> > library, ash heap and/or hand "
> >
> > Therefore you may search 3 locations to get a single trophy card.
>
> Correct. "A trophy card".

Thanks for the answer.

But just for argument sake . . .

"You may look in the red, green, and/or blue jar to get a cookie for
yourself."

This could mean that you could get a cookie from each jar, or that that you
can only take one cookie.

NW

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Name wrote:
> Thanks for the answer.
>
> But just for argument sake . . .
>
> "You may look in the red, green, and/or blue jar to get a cookie for
> yourself."
>
> This could mean that you could get a cookie from each jar, or that that you
> can only take one cookie.

"First class passengers will embark and disembark before economoy class
passengers."

Could mean that all first class passengers have to get on the plane, and
then get off on the plane, before any economy class passengers are
allowed on.

But it doesn't.

--Colin McGuigan

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

> "First class passengers will embark and disembark before economoy class
> passengers."
>
> Could mean that all first class passengers have to get on the plane, and
> then get off on the plane, before any economy class passengers are
> allowed on.
>
> But it doesn't.

I hate English. This example is only one instance why I am seething with
unholy anger and hatred for English. Stupid languages.

This message was brought to you by the Society for Making the World a
Better Place with Pig Latin (SMWBPPL) and the number 9.

Ankur

P.S. Stupid English.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

"Ankur Gupta" <agupta@cs.duke.edu> wrote in message
newsine.GSO.4.62.0505111752200.23560@peso.cs.duke.edu...
>> "First class passengers will embark and disembark before economoy class passengers."
>>
>> Could mean that all first class passengers have to get on the plane, and then get off on the plane, before any economy class
>> passengers are allowed on.
>>
>> But it doesn't.
>
> I hate English. This example is only one instance why I am seething with unholy anger and hatred for English.

Many American school children feel the same way, I assure you.

Fred

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Ankur Gupta wrote:
> I hate English. This example is only one instance why I am seething with
> unholy anger and hatred for English. Stupid languages.
>
> This message was brought to you by the Society for Making the World a
> Better Place with Pig Latin (SMWBPPL) and the number 9.

I nominate you to translate the rulebook and all the cards into Esperanto.

--Colin McGuigan

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

>> This message was brought to you by the Society for Making the World a
>> Better Place with Pig Latin (SMWBPPL) and the number 9.
>
> I nominate you to translate the rulebook and all the cards into
> Esperanto.

Finally, I get the recognition that I deserve!
Mi akiri la famisi tio mi meriti!

Ankur
Ankur (in Esperanto)

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

But the beauty of the English language IS it's ambiguity. How else
would the lawyers of the English speaking world make a living? Unless
you used them as shark bait.....

"You WANT to go to long range? Oh all right then...
-Sandmage, Ur-Shulgi's Huntmaster"