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Purchasing commons from The Lasombra's store

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Anonymous
June 24, 2005 12:49:02 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Dear The Lasombra,

Our playgroup has got so accustomed to purchasing cards from you that
each player can easily evaluate the possibility of building any deck
sfter reading your inventory list :) 
Unfortunately, we can't order some needed commons, and this sometimes
makes them more precious than rares in our playgroup. For instance, I
currently need Jacks of Both Sides, Instinctive Reactions and some
Crocodile Tongues, but there aren't any Gehenna commons in your
inventory. I also want some Majesties, and our players would happily
purchase a lot of other commons that aren't currently available.
We all know that some commons are better that certain rares. Maybe, it
would be better if you create a separate page for such commons to make
them available in any time?

Yours,
Ector
Anonymous
June 24, 2005 4:37:23 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On 23 Jun 2005 20:49:02 -0700, "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote:

> there aren't any Gehenna commons in your
>inventory.

This really isn't the place to discuss it, but I have contemplated a
"Best of Commons" inventory. The problem with that, is determining
which commons will actually sell in a sufficient quantity to be worth
my time, and which commons will have to be thrown away.

Currently, I sell 'Playgroup Starter Kits' on Ebay which contain all
of the commons for the booster displays I have recently opened.

You can find out about that, and all other updates to my inventory by
joining this email mailing list:

http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/VTES_Trading/

I will attempt to inventory the Gehenna commons sometime this weekend
(or early next week), but I make no promises.







Carpe noctem.

Lasombra

http://www.TheLasombra.com
Your best online source for information about V:TES.
Now also featuring individual card sales and sales
of booster and starter box displays.
Anonymous
June 24, 2005 12:35:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

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Ector wrote:
|
| Derek Ray wrote:
|
| How do you propose that he obtain those commons in such quantities that
| both you, and everyone else in the world who purchases from his page,
| will be able to have as many as they want... without going broke in the
| process and/or overflowing his inventory with cards that DON'T sell and
| are wasted space?
|
| Why should I purchase "a box or two of Gehenna" if I already ordered
| all rares, uncommons and vampires I need from The Lasombra?

Wouldn't it have been easier to do so in the first place? Then you
wouldn't be in this position.

| Note that a box of boosters costs much more here than it would cost in
| USA, considering the delivery payments, customs fee etc. etc. Would you
| pay $90 for a box just to get 20-30 commons?

Assuming Gehenna still runs the standard 7-3-1 distribution and you get
36 boosters in a box, a single box of Gehenna will net you 252
commons... about 10 times more than you claim. I seriously doubt you
will be wanting only 25 of those commons, and I seriously doubt you have
5x of each Gehenna vampire.

I see that when it comes down to it, you'd rather The Lasombra spend HIS
time and effort obtaining all the commons you need, whether or not the
business case can support this, AND inventory and sort them, and then
selling just the ones you'd like to you for a nice, cheap price in a
convenient location, right? So you have to put forth no effort at all?

| I just suggested creating a separate page for "good commons" in order
| to prevent "overflowing the inventory". Some commons can be easily sold
| per $0.25-$0.50, so why not?

The answer to your question is identical to the answer to my original
question.
Which you conveniently ignored because it said things you didn't want to
hear.
Which is no surprise, considering it's you.
When you answer my original question, you will see why it is more
difficult to do so than you are vainly attempting to portray it as being.

- --
Derek

insert clever quotation here

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Related resources
Anonymous
June 24, 2005 1:34:20 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Derek Ray wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Ector wrote:
> |
> | Derek Ray wrote:
> |
> | How do you propose that he obtain those commons in such quantities that
> | both you, and everyone else in the world who purchases from his page,
> | will be able to have as many as they want... without going broke in the
> | process and/or overflowing his inventory with cards that DON'T sell and
> | are wasted space?
> |
> | Why should I purchase "a box or two of Gehenna" if I already ordered
> | all rares, uncommons and vampires I need from The Lasombra?
>
> Wouldn't it have been easier to do so in the first place? Then you
> wouldn't be in this position.

OK, maybe purchasing 2-3 boxes (or more) of each set is normal for
american or european players, but we simply can't afford it. Actually,
most of our people can't even afford ordering rares from The Lasombra.
We are happy if we can get just what we need.

> | Note that a box of boosters costs much more here than it would cost in
> | USA, considering the delivery payments, customs fee etc. etc. Would you
> | pay $90 for a box just to get 20-30 commons?
>
> Assuming Gehenna still runs the standard 7-3-1 distribution and you get
> 36 boosters in a box, a single box of Gehenna will net you 252
> commons... about 10 times more than you claim. I seriously doubt you
> will be wanting only 25 of those commons, and I seriously doubt you have
> 5x of each Gehenna vampire.
>
Look, I don't NEED 5x of each Gehenna vampire, and I don't need those
252 commons. Maybe, you have enough money to buy them - keep my
congratulations!

> I see that when it comes down to it, you'd rather The Lasombra spend HIS
> time and effort obtaining all the commons you need, whether or not the
> business case can support this, AND inventory and sort them, and then
> selling just the ones you'd like to you for a nice, cheap price in a
> convenient location, right? So you have to put forth no effort at all?

I really can't understand your accusations. The Lasombra's inventory
has a THRONG of vampires for 25 cents each. Why selling the good
commons, which are also 25-50 cents each,
would not be profitable? After all, nobody needs 10-20 copies of a
vampire, but there are people that need 10-20 Majesties.
I'm definitely not asking The Lasombra to do ANYTHING that he doesn't
want to do. It was just a fair suggestion. Clearly, no demands were
intended.
What's your point in this? What "effort" of mine do you wish? I've
already explained that I cannot purchase boxes.
And if you aren't willing to help me or my playgroup, you may easily
consider all of us poor losers and forget about us. Think all you wish,
but we'll still play VtES.

> | I just suggested creating a separate page for "good commons" in order
> | to prevent "overflowing the inventory". Some commons can be easily sold
> | per $0.25-$0.50, so why not?
>
> The answer to your question is identical to the answer to my original
> question.
> Which you conveniently ignored because it said things you didn't want to
> hear.
> Which is no surprise, considering it's you.
> When you answer my original question, you will see why it is more
> difficult to do so than you are vainly attempting to portray it as being.
>

OK, is the following text your "original question" or not:

"How do you propose that he obtain those commons in such quantities
that both you, and everyone else in the world who purchases from his
page, will be able to have as many as they want... without going broke
in the process and/or overflowing his inventory with cards that DON'T
sell and
are wasted space?"

Holy Cow! Show me WHERE I proposed him to "obtain these commons in such
quantities that me and everyone else would be able to purchase from his
page". I just assume that he has a few dozens (or a few hundreds, or a
few thousands) of the commons which may be sold. BTW, the assumtion was
based on your note about 7304245 (or something like this) Majesties you
have. Well, you have an immense bunch of them, and you even pretended
that ANY old player also has a similar bunch, but we have almost
nothing. So, why not trade?
If you mean OTHER "original question", please let me know.
And I would be very grateful if you stop accusing me of a strange
"crimes".

Yours,
Ector
Anonymous
June 25, 2005 4:08:16 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

carl wrote:
> It's not really the place for it but ...
>
> If there's a demand because a card is worth having then it should push up
> the price ("common" rating not withstanding) just what are you prepared to
> pay for each majesty?

Good question! I'd purchased at least 6 Majesties for $0.5 each. AFAIK,
the market price for them is lower, but spending $3 on them would be
much better than looking for them in boosters.
BTW, there are some commons in The Lasombra's inventory that cost even
$1 (Carrion Crows, Sanguine Instruction), and this is normal. I still
can get them if I would need them - nothing is worse than being unable
to get the cards you need.

Yours,
Ector
Anonymous
June 25, 2005 5:57:50 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

James Coupe wrote:
> In message <1119683296.900192.230490@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
> Ector <Ector@mail.ru> writes:
> >Good question! I'd purchased at least 6 Majesties for $0.5 each. AFAIK,
> >the market price for them is lower, but spending $3 on them would be
> >much better than looking for them in boosters.
>
> Hunting through boosters seems silly when they're a guaranteed pull
> (four of them) in the Ventrue starter. The Ventrue starter also has a
> wide variety of other useful cards that are often in demand with players
> - 2nd Tradition, Minion Tap, Blood Doll, The Barrens, Dominate Kine,
> Freak Drive (x2!), Wake (x3), Banishment and so forth.
>
> --
> James Coupe
> PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR.
> EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING.
> 13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.

You are completely right - that's why it's nearly impossible to get the
Ventrue starter here :)  Everybody wants it!
Four Majesties in the Ventrue starter is the only reason that I need
ONLY 6 Majesties :)  Both me and my wife plan to build decks that rely
on Majesty as a single combat defense, so we need 22-24 copies total. I
managed to get two Ventrue starters (people wait for months to get
them!), traded some Majesties and found some in the boosters, but I
still need at least six more.

Yours,
Ector
Anonymous
June 25, 2005 7:01:29 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

James Coupe wrote:
> In message <1119689870.411698.179200@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
> Ector <Ector@mail.ru> writes:
> >You are completely right - that's why it's nearly impossible to get the
> >Ventrue starter here :)  Everybody wants it!
>
> The Barons starter may also be potentially useful - 2 copies only. Also
> has various other useful/in demand cards. Anarch Revolt, Anarch
> Troublemaker, Wakes, Bewitching Oration, Change of Target, Bribes,
> Secure Haven, Sudden Reversal, Minion Tap (3 of them!). Potentially
> enough to offset the cost of the starter, if you know people who want
> them, what with your group not buying vast numbers of boosters.

You've just reminded me of the another source of my Majesties :)  I
purchased one Barons starter for the cards you listed and for the Fee
Stakes, but I don't need more Barons. One Anarch Troblemaker is enough
for me, and we have a lot of Minion Taps, Wakes, Bewitching Orations
and Secure Havens. I even managed to order Ira Rivers and Michael
Luther from The Lasombra's store :) 

> Given how easy S:CE is to combat, Majesty as a single card defence is...
> awkward. That, and the blood cost, can really start to add up. With so
> many potent anti-S:CE cards available, and things like Pack Alpha to
> build up the fact that S:CE doesn't matter, you're not using up my
> combat, I'd be (at least) very wary of relying on it.
>
> --
> James Coupe
> PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR.
> EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING.
> 13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.

Considering the fact that I'm looking for Majesties (common), you may
easily evaluate chances of encountering those "potent anti-S:CE cards"
here :)  We have a couple of decks with Immortal Grapples and/or
Psyche!, but most players just cannot find or cannot afford them.
Superior Majesty also allows to overload intercept/Wakes and push some
actions even without stealth. Attempt to bleed, play Majesty if
blocked, then untap and play a political action.

Yours,
Ector
Anonymous
June 25, 2005 7:19:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

James Coupe wrote:

> I'd be surprised if, from an "average" box of most sets, you couldn't
> find some that would heavily subsidise the cost of the box for you.
> Take out the few dozen commons or uncommons you want, sell or trade the
> rest. Will you make a profit? Possibly, possibly not. But you're not
> aiming to make a profit. Just to get the cost of the whole thing down.
> At $60-$65 a box (a typical price from TheLasombra or Potomac, for
> recent sets), you have 36 rares potentially at a dollar to two dollars
> each. Possibly more, possibly less, but that's a rough overall figure.
> How many of those do you need to pass on to others before the cost of
> the box becomes potentially affordable?

Unfortunately, I live in the "uncivilized" country (did you ever hear
about Belarus or Alexander Lukashenko?) The ordered box may easily
"disappear" at the customs, and nobody would be able to find it. And
even if I get it, it would cost me $90, not the $60-$65 you've listed,
since I'd have to pay for delivering it and the customs fees.
Once I ordered a Sabbat War box for $90. No, I didn't opened War Ghoul,
but I opened Black Metamorphosis and Disarm. If I'd ordered all the
opened cards I need from The Lasombra's store, I'd spend not more than
$60, including the delivering fees.
Thus, purchasing boxes is almost never profitable for our playgroup,
though we still purchase some boxes to play booster drafts and have
prizes for tournament winners.

Yours,
Ector
June 25, 2005 12:12:56 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

It's not really the place for it but ...

If there's a demand because a card is worth having then it should push up
the price ("common" rating not withstanding) just what are you prepared to
pay for each majesty?
Anonymous
June 25, 2005 12:30:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

In message <1119683296.900192.230490@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
Ector <Ector@mail.ru> writes:
>Good question! I'd purchased at least 6 Majesties for $0.5 each. AFAIK,
>the market price for them is lower, but spending $3 on them would be
>much better than looking for them in boosters.

Hunting through boosters seems silly when they're a guaranteed pull
(four of them) in the Ventrue starter. The Ventrue starter also has a
wide variety of other useful cards that are often in demand with players
- 2nd Tradition, Minion Tap, Blood Doll, The Barrens, Dominate Kine,
Freak Drive (x2!), Wake (x3), Banishment and so forth.

--
James Coupe
PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR.
EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING.
13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.
Anonymous
June 25, 2005 1:34:14 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

In message <1119630860.037658.57250@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
Ector <Ector@mail.ru> writes:
>OK, maybe purchasing 2-3 boxes (or more) of each set is normal for
>american or european players, but we simply can't afford it.

1) Buy box. (This may be multiple boxes, if you prefer.)

2) Take cards you want and/or need. Potentially, leave out cards you
think will fetch a premium (in trading or cash).

3) Find cards that other players want. Trade them for cards you want,
or cash if appropriate.

4) With the remaining cards, find any rares you don't want, don't need,
already have enough or which you think will fund this little
escapade. Sell them on Ebay, or other auction house of your
choice.

I'd be surprised if, from an "average" box of most sets, you couldn't
find some that would heavily subsidise the cost of the box for you.
Take out the few dozen commons or uncommons you want, sell or trade the
rest. Will you make a profit? Possibly, possibly not. But you're not
aiming to make a profit. Just to get the cost of the whole thing down.
At $60-$65 a box (a typical price from TheLasombra or Potomac, for
recent sets), you have 36 rares potentially at a dollar to two dollars
each. Possibly more, possibly less, but that's a rough overall figure.
How many of those do you need to pass on to others before the cost of
the box becomes potentially affordable?


Additionally, any cards you get which you don't want and which aren't
that in demand can be used as a starter pool for new players.


Typically, if you think you're going to want a clutch of commons from a
set (rather than literally just cherry picking a few cards, because it's
a Sabbat set and all the cards are heavily Sabbat oriented and you don't
care for them, say, or there are a lot of reprints in there), it's often
better to bulk buy a chunk of boosters, trade away/sell what you don't
want and then go chasing specific cards.

--
James Coupe
PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR.
EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING.
13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.
Anonymous
June 25, 2005 2:24:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

In message <1119689870.411698.179200@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
Ector <Ector@mail.ru> writes:
>You are completely right - that's why it's nearly impossible to get the
>Ventrue starter here :)  Everybody wants it!

The Barons starter may also be potentially useful - 2 copies only. Also
has various other useful/in demand cards. Anarch Revolt, Anarch
Troublemaker, Wakes, Bewitching Oration, Change of Target, Bribes,
Secure Haven, Sudden Reversal, Minion Tap (3 of them!). Potentially
enough to offset the cost of the starter, if you know people who want
them, what with your group not buying vast numbers of boosters.

>Four Majesties in the Ventrue starter is the only reason that I need
>ONLY 6 Majesties :)  Both me and my wife plan to build decks that rely
>on Majesty as a single combat defense,

Given how easy S:CE is to combat, Majesty as a single card defence is...
awkward. That, and the blood cost, can really start to add up. With so
many potent anti-S:CE cards available, and things like Pack Alpha to
build up the fact that S:CE doesn't matter, you're not using up my
combat, I'd be (at least) very wary of relying on it.

--
James Coupe
PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR.
EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING.
13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.
Anonymous
June 26, 2005 11:45:14 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

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Hash: SHA1

Ector wrote:
|
| Derek Ray wrote:
|>| Why should I purchase "a box or two of Gehenna" if I already ordered
|>| all rares, uncommons and vampires I need from The Lasombra?
|>
|>Wouldn't it have been easier to do so in the first place? Then you
|>wouldn't be in this position.
|
| OK, maybe purchasing 2-3 boxes (or more) of each set is normal for
| american or european players, but we simply can't afford it. Actually,
| most of our people can't even afford ordering rares from The Lasombra.
| We are happy if we can get just what we need.

So if you pool your money you can't manage this? Even purchasing from a
store in Europe, which is closer?

While you are in an inconvenient position, there _are_ ways around
dilemmas such as this.

|>Assuming Gehenna still runs the standard 7-3-1 distribution and you get
|>36 boosters in a box, a single box of Gehenna will net you 252
|>commons... about 10 times more than you claim. I seriously doubt you
|>will be wanting only 25 of those commons, and I seriously doubt you have
|>5x of each Gehenna vampire.
|
| Look, I don't NEED 5x of each Gehenna vampire, and I don't need those
| 252 commons. Maybe, you have enough money to buy them - keep my
| congratulations!

You said you need commons. Now you say you don't. Which is it?

Perhaps you don't need 5x of each Gehenna vamp. But I'm sure you can
find people to trade commons for those vampires; because there are
plenty of people who DO.

|>I see that when it comes down to it, you'd rather The Lasombra spend HIS
|>time and effort obtaining all the commons you need, whether or not the
|>business case can support this, AND inventory and sort them, and then
|>selling just the ones you'd like to you for a nice, cheap price in a
|>convenient location, right? So you have to put forth no effort at all?
|
| I really can't understand your accusations. The Lasombra's inventory
| has a THRONG of vampires for 25 cents each. Why selling the good
| commons, which are also 25-50 cents each,
| would not be profitable? After all, nobody needs 10-20 copies of a

Again, do the math.

How much does it cost to buy a box for him?
How many commons are available for sale as a result?
How many will actually EVER sell?
When the ones he's out of sell out in a single day, ...because, again,
it's not just you who wants them... how long will it take to sell the rest?
How much does it cost to store the cards that don't sell instantly?

What you may find, should you do the math, is that the good commons
might have to be significantly increased in price to make such an
undertaking worthwhile... which would put them comparable to the rares,
which you say you can't afford. Oops.

| What's your point in this? What "effort" of mine do you wish? I've
| already explained that I cannot purchase boxes.

Make an effort to understand it from his point of view perhaps?

| OK, is the following text your "original question" or not:
|
| "How do you propose that he obtain those commons in such quantities
| that both you, and everyone else in the world who purchases from his
| page, will be able to have as many as they want... without going broke
| in the process and/or overflowing his inventory with cards that DON'T
| sell and are wasted space?"

Correct.

| Holy Cow! Show me WHERE I proposed him to "obtain these commons in such
| quantities that me and everyone else would be able to purchase from his
| page". I just assume that he has a few dozens (or a few hundreds, or a
| few thousands) of the commons which may be sold. BTW, the assumtion was

Dude, when a common is listed as "OUT", what do you think the true
status is of the common in his inventory?

a) He has none left
b) He has a few unsorted somewhere, but not enough to be worth sorting
and listing
c) He has sixty boxes in a back room, all presorted, and he's just
listing them as "out" to create an artificial demand and SCREW EVERYONE
FOR ALL THEIR MONEY BWWWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!111one!11!1!eleven!!11

Now. Assuming you can figure out the correct answer, why do you think
he is out of certain commons?

a) Lots of people want them
b) He doesn't like that set, so he doesn't buy any
c) They were all lost in a tragic fire set by his pet goldfish "Schmoopie."

So given the two things we now know... if he orders a single box, he'll
get a bunch of cards. Some of those cards he is currently out of.
Given that it's not just you, but MANY people who want these cards,
they'll vanish rapidly and he will now have to buy more boxes to satisfy
the artificial need created. The question is:

Can he make enough money selling you and the other 29405187 people out
there those commons to make it even remotely worth his time to purchase
the boxes and do the work in the first place?

| based on your note about 7304245 (or something like this) Majesties you
| have. Well, you have an immense bunch of them, and you even pretended
| that ANY old player also has a similar bunch, but we have almost
| nothing. So, why not trade?

I will never trade with anyone I have not met in person. Plus, quite
frankly, I don't trust you.

- --
Derek

insert clever quotation here

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Anonymous
June 27, 2005 1:35:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:45:14 -0400, Derek Ray <lorimer@yahoo.com> wrote:

> So if you pool your money you can't manage this? Even purchasing from a
> store in Europe, which is closer?

I think overseas shipping (plus funny taxes, retailer margins, etc.)
generally increases the cost of VTES in all of Europe. In Hungary we
are paying about the equivalent of $160-$180 for a Booster Display.

> | Look, I don't NEED 5x of each Gehenna vampire, and I don't need those
> | 252 commons. Maybe, you have enough money to buy them - keep my
> | congratulations!
>
> You said you need commons. Now you say you don't. Which is it?

Guess he needs a bunch of *specific* commons.

> Perhaps you don't need 5x of each Gehenna vamp. But I'm sure you can
> find people to trade commons for those vampires; because there are
> plenty of people who DO.

In a tight group that might be harder than it seems.

> | I really can't understand your accusations. The Lasombra's inventory
> | has a THRONG of vampires for 25 cents each. Why selling the good
> | commons, which are also 25-50 cents each,
> | would not be profitable? After all, nobody needs 10-20 copies of a
>
> Again, do the math.
>
> How much does it cost to buy a box for him?
> How many commons are available for sale as a result?
> How many will actually EVER sell?
> When the ones he's out of sell out in a single day, ...because, again,
> it's not just you who wants them... how long will it take to sell the
> rest?
> How much does it cost to store the cards that don't sell instantly?
>
> What you may find, should you do the math, is that the good commons
> might have to be significantly increased in price to make such an
> undertaking worthwhile... which would put them comparable to the rares,
> which you say you can't afford. Oops.

Actually, he said he already bought the rares he needed. Because they are
cheaper for him.

> So given the two things we now know... if he orders a single box, he'll
> get a bunch of cards. Some of those cards he is currently out of.
> Given that it's not just you, but MANY people who want these cards,
> they'll vanish rapidly and he will now have to buy more boxes to satisfy
> the artificial need created. The question is:
>
> Can he make enough money selling you and the other 29405187 people out
> there those commons to make it even remotely worth his time to purchase
> the boxes and do the work in the first place?

Singles retail prices are heavily influenced by the supply and demand
present. If TheLasombra (or any other business) sells out of Majesties
quickly, he can increase the price. If a card does not sell, he can try
lowering the price. Of course, heavily cornercase cards like Rayzeel's
Song will never sell, and cards that are abundant in starters, like
Flash will probably go the same way, but more sought-after cards probably
have a price they can go for.

--
Bye,

Daneel
Anonymous
June 27, 2005 1:50:49 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Derek Ray wrote:

> So if you pool your money you can't manage this? Even purchasing from a
> store in Europe, which is closer?

Don't think we didn't try. But the box price in Europe is very high.
For instance, KMW box costs 86 EURO at
http://www.tellurian.de/katalog/p-engtcgvampiretheetern...,
and this shop is one of the cheapest. Considering that EURO costs more
than dollar now, it would cost even more than $90.

> While you are in an inconvenient position, there _are_ ways around
> dilemmas such as this.
We are searching for these ways. For instance, we've got some precious
Ventrue starters from the mentioned German shop - there aren't more,
alas :) 

> You said you need commons. Now you say you don't. Which is it?
IMHO, it should be clear - I don't need 252 random commons, but I'd
like to get 20-30 certain commons for my decks.

> Perhaps you don't need 5x of each Gehenna vamp. But I'm sure you can
> find people to trade commons for those vampires; because there are
> plenty of people who DO.
I really wish that it would be that simple. Unfortunately, there are
only 15-20 players in a 10-mln Belarus, and I should travel at least
1000 km to find an experienced player to trade with.
Note that all our players got accustomed to order the needed vampires
at The Lasombra's store. Why should they trade precious commons like
Majesty for the vampires that can be easily ordered?

>
> Again, do the math.
>
> How much does it cost to buy a box for him?
I don't know this, and I don't think it matters here.

> How many commons are available for sale as a result?
> How many will actually EVER sell?
> When the ones he's out of sell out in a single day, ...because, again,
> it's not just you who wants them... how long will it take to sell the rest?
> How much does it cost to store the cards that don't sell instantly?
>
> What you may find, should you do the math, is that the good commons
> might have to be significantly increased in price to make such an
> undertaking worthwhile...

Let's assume that he ALREADY orders and opens some boxes to refill his
inventory of rares and uncommons, right? I simply can't believe that he
prints those cards himself :)  Then, he should open a plenty of commons.
Now, let's imagine that he selects "good" commons of the set (not more
than 10-15) prior to opening the boosters and separates them along with
the rares & uncommons. That's all additional work. All the rest commons
may rest in peace where the unwanted cards lie.
There may be even less than 10 "good commons" - some sets are poor for
them. In Camarilla, there are just a few "stars" like Majesty or
Kindred Spirits. BTW, I was forced to purchase a second !Malk starter
several months ago just to get 5 Kindred Spirits.
I really didn't suggested anything else. Why should I calculate "how
many commons would be available" and "how many will actually EVER
sell"? Good commons should sell pretty well, and any profit is better
than zero.

> which would put them comparable to the rares,
> which you say you can't afford. Oops.
Did I say that I can't afford rares? I said that I can't afford boxes!
If I really need a card, I order it. For instance, I've got Aranthebes,
The Hungry Coyote and Mylan Horseed (prior to KMW) for $6 each.

> | What's your point in this? What "effort" of mine do you wish? I've
> | already explained that I cannot purchase boxes.
>
> Make an effort to understand it from his point of view perhaps?
Well, I'm making such effort now...

> Dude, when a common is listed as "OUT", what do you think the true
> status is of the common in his inventory?
>
> a) He has none left
> b) He has a few unsorted somewhere, but not enough to be worth sorting
> and listing
> c) He has sixty boxes in a back room, all presorted, and he's just
> listing them as "out" to create an artificial demand and SCREW EVERYONE
> FOR ALL THEIR MONEY BWWWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!111one!11!1!eleven!!11

Hey, dude, you can be really funny if you want to!

Surely, if I see number ZERO in The Lasombra's inventory, it's clear
that he has NO such cards. No cards - no deal.
But if I don't see the card at all, answers a) and b) are both
possible. Let's assume that the commons are present and discuss variant
b).
Sorting cards is a job. When I see a new bunch of commons per 0.10 or
even 0.05, I applaud to The Lasombra for his job. But separating 10-15
good commons is much less difficult, and these cards should sell well
enough. And if you're trying to convince me that he aren't looking at
the commons AT ALL, just separates rares and uncommons, since the
commons aren't worth such job... Man, you are living in a blessed
country! I couldn't even imagine such behaviour, but it should be quite
normal from your perspective.

> Now. Assuming you can figure out the correct answer, why do you think
> he is out of certain commons?
>
> a) Lots of people want them
> b) He doesn't like that set, so he doesn't buy any
> c) They were all lost in a tragic fire set by his pet goldfish "Schmoopie."
>
> So given the two things we now know... if he orders a single box, he'll
> get a bunch of cards. Some of those cards he is currently out of.
> Given that it's not just you, but MANY people who want these cards,
> they'll vanish rapidly and he will now have to buy more boxes to satisfy
> the artificial need created. The question is:
>
> Can he make enough money selling you and the other 29405187 people out
> there those commons to make it even remotely worth his time to purchase
> the boxes and do the work in the first place?

Again, you make a very strange presumptions. I don't suggest purchasing
boxes just to get the commons - I just suggest separating good commons
with the rares and uncommons when the boxes are already purchased. Note
that some commons of this sort were already separated (Carrion Crows,
Sanguine Instruction).
And if The Lasombra is out of certain common, I don't suggest anything.
Nobody can sell things he hasn't.

> I will never trade with anyone I have not met in person. Plus, quite
> frankly, I don't trust you.
>
It was just a theoretical thoughts. Quite frankly, I wouldn't even
accept a gift from you.

Ector
Anonymous
June 27, 2005 8:27:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On 27 Jun 2005 09:50:49 -0700, "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote:

>IMHO, it should be clear - I don't need 252 random commons, but I'd
>like to get 20-30 certain commons for my decks.

Let me see if I can add something to this issue...

I often stumble on this kind of discussion with players who can't
afford/ are not willing to buy a booster box to get the 20-30 commons
they want (The difference is that they keep buying *separate* boosters
every month - say, 3 this month, 2 next month etc. - hoping to get
this or that common, but that's not relevant to the point).

Anyway, back to issue. I guess the point is where to put your
perspective. This is a CCG. Buying a booster box to get what you need
and live with the rest is the point of the product. While it's exactly
the unfulfilled needs of certain playgroups who can't satisfy
themselves with the "regular" market that supports the existence of a
second market, sometimes it's good to remember that it's the regular
market that makes the game possible.

Sometimes you just won't find exactly what you need available. That's
not to say your idea is not viable. It just could be that it's not
viable for the second market right now. So the regular way - buy the
booster/starter box - is the way to go, and it has its own benefits.
Try to make the best of it.

best,

Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
Giovanni Newsletter Editor
-----------------------------------------------------
V for Vendetta on the big screen!
http://vforvendetta.warnerbros.com/
Anonymous
June 28, 2005 12:46:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

Fabio "Sooner" wrote:
> On 27 Jun 2005 09:50:49 -0700, "Ector" <Ector@mail.ru> wrote:
>
> >IMHO, it should be clear - I don't need 252 random commons, but I'd
> >like to get 20-30 certain commons for my decks.
>
> Let me see if I can add something to this issue...
>
> I often stumble on this kind of discussion with players who can't
> afford/ are not willing to buy a booster box to get the 20-30 commons
> they want (The difference is that they keep buying *separate* boosters
> every month - say, 3 this month, 2 next month etc. - hoping to get
> this or that common, but that's not relevant to the point).
>
> Anyway, back to issue. I guess the point is where to put your
> perspective. This is a CCG. Buying a booster box to get what you need
> and live with the rest is the point of the product. While it's exactly
> the unfulfilled needs of certain playgroups who can't satisfy
> themselves with the "regular" market that supports the existence of a
> second market, sometimes it's good to remember that it's the regular
> market that makes the game possible.
>
> Sometimes you just won't find exactly what you need available. That's
> not to say your idea is not viable. It just could be that it's not
> viable for the second market right now. So the regular way - buy the
> booster/starter box - is the way to go, and it has its own benefits.
> Try to make the best of it.
>
> best,
>
> Fabio "Sooner" Macedo
> V:TES National Coordinator for Brazil
> Giovanni Newsletter Editor
> -----------------------------------------------------
> V for Vendetta on the big screen!
> http://vforvendetta.warnerbros.com/

Surely, I know what is CCG and how it was meant to be distributed.
After all, I'm playing CCGs for seven years :) 
And I'm already "trying to make the best" of the situation.

Yours,
Ector
Anonymous
June 28, 2005 6:14:47 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 09:35:07 +0200, Daneel <daniel@eposta.hu> wrote:

>On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:45:14 -0400, Derek Ray <lorimer@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> So if you pool your money you can't manage this? Even purchasing from a
>> store in Europe, which is closer?
>
>I think overseas shipping (plus funny taxes, retailer margins, etc.)
> generally increases the cost of VTES in all of Europe. In Hungary we
> are paying about the equivalent of $160-$180 for a Booster Display.

Order via Lasombra (or another online seller). I ordered a box of
Sabbat War Boosters, and about 40 single cards. Shipping was $23.25.
Same box, shipped to Hungary is $17.50. Remove the singles, and just
include the box of boosters (keeping same shipping), and anything
except KMW is going to be under $80US. That's 'to your door' in about
a week (for Australian residents, can't figure Hungary would be THAT
different).

And note, that's on just a single box. Boxes beyond the first on an
single order are only about an additional $8.

I'm all for supporting local business, but if they can't be reasonably
competitive (and in my case, can't offer reasonable customer service),
then I'm forced to look elsewhere.

Morgan Vening
Anonymous
June 28, 2005 7:11:53 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad (More info?)

On Tue, 28 Jun 2005 02:14:47 +1000, Morgan Vening <morgan@optusnet.com.au>
wrote:

> I'm all for supporting local business, but if they can't be reasonably
> competitive (and in my case, can't offer reasonable customer service),
> then I'm forced to look elsewhere.

Yes, I've been ordering from overseas for some time now. I too would
gladly support local businesses (heck, I've told folks running shops
that if they can get anywhere *close* to the price I'm paying for
individually imported boxes, I'll buy from them instead). Still, as
long as that isn't the case, I'm stuck with ordering...

--
Bye,

Daneel
!