Vedalken Shackles and Treetop Village

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Hi,

what happens when i gain control of an opponents Treetop Village (let's
say it's a 3/3 creature in opponents turn) with my Vedalken Shackles.

Does the Treetop Village swap sides in my upkeep because it's no longer
a creature at this time?

Thanks

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Thomas Warratz <thomas.warratz@t-online.de> sent:
> Hi,

> what happens when i gain control of an opponents Treetop Village (let's
> say it's a 3/3 creature in opponents turn) with my Vedalken Shackles.

Vedalken Shackles {3} Artifact
/ You may choose not to untap Vedalken Shackles during your untap step.
/ {2}, {T}: Gain control of target creature with power less than or
equal to the number of Islands you control as long as Vedalken
Shackles remains tapped.

> Does the Treetop Village swap sides in my upkeep because it's no longer
> a creature at this time?

Nope, you get to keep it until you untap the Vadalken Shackles. It
only has to be a creature with that much power or less when you play
the ability of the Shackles and when that ability resolves. Things
that happen after you've gained control of the creature, such as the
power becoming higher, your islands being destroyed or the creature
no longer being a creature, can happen just fine and don't affect the
control of the creature.

--
-- zoe

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Thomas Warratz <thomas.warratz@t-online.de> writes:
> what happens when i gain control of an opponents Treetop Village
> (let's say it's a 3/3 creature in opponents turn) with my Vedalken
> Shackles.
>
> Does the Treetop Village swap sides in my upkeep because it's no
> longer a creature at this time?

Nope. Targets are checked at just two times: When you announce the
ability, and when it resolves. If the target is still legal when the
ability resolves, you gain control of it for as long as the ability
says: as long as Vedalken Shackles remains tapped. This is true no
matter what type of permanent it later becomes or how many Islands you
later control.

,----
| Vedalken Shackles
| {3}
| Artifact
| You may choose not to untap Vedalken Shackles during your untap
| step.
| {2}, {T}: Gain control of target creature with power less than or
| equal to the number of Islands you control as long as Vedalken
| Shackles remains tapped.
`----

--
Peter C.
"The corn muffin shall be the official muffin of the commonwealth."
-- Mass. General Law, Chapter 2, Section 28.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Thomas Warratz <thomas.warratz@t-online.de> wrote:
>what happens when i gain control of an opponents Treetop Village (let's
>say it's a 3/3 creature in opponents turn) with my Vedalken Shackles.

You jump up and down and do the Happy Landgrabbing Dance?

>Does the Treetop Village swap sides in my upkeep because it's no longer
>a creature at this time?

First off, there's no reason at all to think ANYTHING would happen during
your upkeep. The Shackles doesn't use that word anywhere; neither does the
Village. Neither do the rules governing how "until end of turn" effects
work and when they wear off.

Secondly, there's no particular reason for you to lose control of the Village
after it stops being a creature. [Really easy pop quiz: when DOES that occur?]
The Shackles says its ability -targets- a certain thing: "creature with power
less than or equal to the number of Islands you control". Targetting specs
are checked twice: on announcement, and again on resolution. They are never
EVER checked again after that [even partway through resolution you're already
past the last targetting check]. The "gain control of it" effect has a duration
given: "as long as ~ remains tapped". So if the VS untaps, the effect ends.
(If the VS leaves play, the effect also ends, because things that aren't in
play aren't "tapped" _or_ "untapped".)

Nothing on VS says anything about "as long as it's a creature and ~ remains
tapped"; whether or not the permanent stays a creature, or what its power
might change to, matters not at all after that last targetting check.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

On Mon, 14 Jun 2004 11:11:11 +0200, Thomas Warratz wrote:

>what happens when i gain control of an opponents Treetop Village (let's
>say it's a 3/3 creature in opponents turn) with my Vedalken Shackles.
>
>Does the Treetop Village swap sides in my upkeep because it's no longer
>a creature at this time?

No. Targets are only checked twice - first when you announce the
ability, then when it resolves. After that, the artifact doesn't care
about what happens to Treetop Village (or to your Islands, for that
matter). As long as both the artifact and the land stay in play and
Vedalken Shackles doesn't become untapped, you will keep control of the
land.

Ingo Kemper
--
__ _ __ __ __ __
__/ /_/ \/ /_/____/_ |___SkyGlider@uni-muenster.de___---===> \
/_/ /_/\_/ |__/ |__/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ---===>__/