Fist of suns and sunburst

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

"M.G.Palmer" <SatoshiUrotsukidoji@gmx.de> writes:
> What happens if I use Fist of suns to play a card with sunburst, for
> example Pentad Prism ? Does it get the full five charge counters or
> none ?

It gets 5 charge counters, because 5 colors of mana were used in
paying its cost, and that's all Sunburst looks at.

--
Peter C.
"I'm not trying to hack into the system! Or again!"
-- imets

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

M.G.Palmer <SatoshiUrotsukidoji@gmx.de> wrote:

> What happens if I use Fist of suns to play a card with sunburst, for
> example Pentad Prism ? Does it get the full five charge counters or none ?

502.37b Sunburst applies only as the spell is resolving and only if one
or more colored mana was paid for its costs. Mana paid for additional or
alternative costs applies.

And the alternative cost offered by Fist of Suns is no exception to
this.

This was also answered in a Saturday School column:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/daily/rh125

Q: I have Fist of Suns in play, and an artifact with sunburst that costs
less (or more) than five mana in my hand. Can I pay all five colors of
mana to play a spell? if I do so, will it count towards sunburst?
-- Alex Perez

A: You can use all five colors to pay for the spell you play, and this
will count for sunburst. Sunburst looks at the mana you actually paid
for the spell, and is not tied to the usual, printed mana cost on the
card. Fist of the Suns lets you pay one of each mana to play the spell,
and this will cause sunburst to give five counters to the card.
--
Daniel W. Johnson
panoptes@iquest.net
http://members.iquest.net/~panoptes/
039 53 36 N / 086 11 55 W

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

M.G.Palmer, worshipped by llamas the world over, wrote...
> Hello !
>
> What happens if I use Fist of suns to play a card with sunburst, for
> example Pentad Prism ? Does it get the full five charge counters or none ?

Well, how many colors of mana did you pay for it? Five. So you get
five counters.

This is, as I understand it, the main reason Fist of Suns was printed.

>
> Card Name: Fist of Suns
> Color: A
> Cost: 3
> Type: Artifact
> Pow/Tgh:
> Rules Text: You may pay WUBRG rather than pay the mana cost for
> spells that you play.
>
>
> Card Name: Pentad Prism
> Color: A
> Cost: 2
> Type: Artifact
> Pow/Tgh:
> Rules Text: Sunburst (This comes into play with a charge counter
> on it for each color of mana used to pay its cost.)
> Remove a charge counter from Pentad Prism: Add one
> mana of any color to your mana pool.
>
>
> M.G.Palmer
>

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Jeff Heikkinen <oh@s.if> wrote:
>M.G.Palmer, worshipped by llamas the world over, wrote...
>> Hello !
>>
>> What happens if I use Fist of suns to play a card with sunburst, for
>> example Pentad Prism ? Does it get the full five charge counters or none ?
>
>Well, how many colors of mana did you pay for it? Five. So you get
>five counters.

Didn't see the original question for some reason. Jeff's correct. Sunburst
doesn't ever ask what the mana cost -was-; it asks how many separate colors
of mana were used to pay the "play cost" - mana cost or alternate cost, plus
any additional costs, minus any cost reductions. Fist of Suns provides
an alternate cost which _usually_ means you end up paying five different
colors of mana. (Edgewalker can still change this, notice.)

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

M.G.Palmer <SatoshiUrotsukidoji@gmx.de> wrote:
>What happens if I use Fist of suns to play a card with sunburst, for
>example Pentad Prism ? Does it get the full five charge counters or none ?

Generally it will get five counters. Sunburst counts the colors of mana used
to pay the cost; it does NOT specify anything about "used to pay the _mana_
cost", so looks at whatever cost you do end up paying to cast the spell. Fist
of Suns' alternate cost will generally mean you paid with five different colors
of mana.

(If Celestial Dawn or Mycosynth Lattice are out, you might _not_ have paid with
five different colors of mana to pay the RGWUB alternate cost, for example;
Sunburst looks at what you did pay, not at "what you paid as though it were".)

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.