Blinkmoth Nexus & Rude Awakening

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I control a Blinkmoth Nexus. I spend 1, making it a 1/1.
Then, I pump it with its "+1/+1" ability.
Finally, I play Rude Awakening with entwine.
According to rule 418.5, I guess I should apply first BN's type-changing,
then RA's one (timestamp order matter) in layer 4, then the +1/+1 effect
in layer 6, so BN is a 3/3 land artifact creature Blinkmoth with flying.
Am I correct, or RA completely overwrite P/T?
Thanks in advance!
AA

Blinkmoth Nexus
Land
{T}: Add {1} to your mana pool.
{1}: Blinkmoth Nexus becomes a 1/1 Blinkmoth artifact creature with
flying
until end of turn. It's still a land.
{1}, {T}: Target Blinkmoth gets +1/+1 until end of turn.

Rude Awakening 4G
Sorcery
Choose one - Untap all lands you control; or until end of turn, lands you
control become 2/2 creatures that are still lands.
Entwine 2G (Choose both if you pay the entwine cost.)

 

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Acherontia <qebm@libero.it> wrote:

> I control a Blinkmoth Nexus. I spend 1, making it a 1/1.
> Then, I pump it with its "+1/+1" ability.
> Finally, I play Rude Awakening with entwine.
> According to rule 418.5, I guess I should apply first BN's type-changing,
> then RA's one (timestamp order matter) in layer 4, then the +1/+1 effect
> in layer 6, so BN is a 3/3 land artifact creature Blinkmoth with flying.
> Am I correct, or RA completely overwrite P/T?
> Thanks in advance!

The +1/+1 is applied after Rude Awakening's effect, just like the 0/2
after Chimeric Sphere's effect in the first example in 418.5b:

418.5b If an effect other than a type-, subtype-, and supertype-changing
effect should be applied in different layers, the parts of the effect
each apply in their appropriate layers. If a type-, subtype-, and
supertype-changing effect should be applied in different layers, all are
applied only in layer four (type-, subtype- and supertype changing
effects).
Example: A player plays an ability that reads "{o2}: Until end of turn,
Chimeric Sphere becomes a 3/2 artifact creature," which is a both a
type-changing effect and a power- and toughness-changing effect. Since
it's a type-changing effect, the entire effect is applied when
type-changing effects are applied, in layer four, even though power- and
toughness-changing effects are normally applied in layer six. Later in
the turn, Chimeric Sphere is affected by an ability that reads "Target
creature becomes 0/2 until end of turn," which is applied only in layer
six since it's solely a power- and toughness-changing effect. At this
point, playing Chimeric Sphere's (layer 4) ability again won't do
anything, as the layer-six effect will always be applied after it. The
artifact creature remains 0/2.
Example: An effect that reads "Wild Mongrel gets +1/+1 and becomes the
color of your choice until end of turn" is both a power- and toughness
changing effect and an "other" kind of effect. The "becomes the color of
your choice" part is applied in layer five, and then the "gets +1/+1"
part is applied in layer six.
Example: Grab the Reins has an effect that reads "Until end of turn, you
gain control of target creature and it gains haste." This is both a
control-changing effect and an "other" effect. The "you gain control"
part is applied in layer two, and then the "it gains haste" part is
applied in layer five.

--
Daniel W. Johnson
panoptes@iquest.net
http://members.iquest.net/~panoptes/
039 53 36 N / 086 11 55 W

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Here wkat is happening
you make Blinkmoth Nexus into a land - creature 1/1 with flying.
you tap it to making +1/+1 so it is a land - creature 2/2 with flying.
You play your SORCERY to make your land a 2/2 land - creature with flying
and it is untap. I think you could tap it to make it 3/3

If you played BN into a creature {end stack}

start a new stack with BN ability "{1}, {T}: Target Blinkmoth gets +1/+1
until end of turn."
and manage to play Rude Awakening as an instant then you would have an
untap
3/3 land artifact creature Blinkmoth with flying.

The only thing I'm not sure in all this is wheter or not after you
played Rude Awakening
if "Artifact creature - Blinkmoth" is still valid or if it is lost ie
become a simple land creature.

Carl

Acherontia wrote:

>I control a Blinkmoth Nexus. I spend 1, making it a 1/1.
>Then, I pump it with its "+1/+1" ability.
>Finally, I play Rude Awakening with entwine.
>According to rule 418.5, I guess I should apply first BN's type-changing,
>then RA's one (timestamp order matter) in layer 4, then the +1/+1 effect
>in layer 6, so BN is a 3/3 land artifact creature Blinkmoth with flying.
>Am I correct, or RA completely overwrite P/T?
>Thanks in advance!
>AA
>
>Blinkmoth Nexus
>Land
>{T}: Add {1} to your mana pool.
>{1}: Blinkmoth Nexus becomes a 1/1 Blinkmoth artifact creature with
>flying
>until end of turn. It's still a land.
>{1}, {T}: Target Blinkmoth gets +1/+1 until end of turn.
>
>Rude Awakening 4G
>Sorcery
>Choose one - Untap all lands you control; or until end of turn, lands you
>control become 2/2 creatures that are still lands.
>Entwine 2G (Choose both if you pay the entwine cost.)
>
>
>
>

 

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On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 16:36:06 -0400, Acherontia <qebm@libero.it> wrote:
>I control a Blinkmoth Nexus. I spend 1, making it a 1/1.
>Then, I pump it with its "+1/+1" ability.
>Finally, I play Rude Awakening with entwine.
>According to rule 418.5, I guess I should apply first BN's type-changing,
>then RA's one (timestamp order matter) in layer 4, then the +1/+1 effect
>in layer 6, so BN is a 3/3 land artifact creature Blinkmoth with flying.

Correct.

>Am I correct, or RA completely overwrite P/T?

>Blinkmoth Nexus Land
>Tap: Add 1 to your mana pool. / 1: ~ becomes a 1/1 Blinkmoth artifact creature
> with flying until end of turn. It's still a land. / 1,Tap: Target Blinkmoth
> gets +1/+1 until end of turn.

The second ability is type-changing, partly, so all gets applied in layer 4
(418.5b). The third just changes power and toughness, so applies in layer 6.

>Rude Awakening 4G Sorcery
>Choose one - Untap all lands you control; or until end of turn, lands you
>control become 2/2 creatures that are still lands. / Entwine 2G (*)

The second effect is type-changing, so applies (again) in layer 4. Neither
of them depend on the other (because both are from resolving abilities/spells),
so apply in timestamp order: the RA applies second, leaving it 2/2. Then in
layer 6 the +1/+1 applies, leaving it 3/3. The "artifact" is not overwritten,
specifically because of 212.1c; the Blinkmoth isn't overwritten because RA
doesn't set a creature type. The flying isn't overwritten because RA doesn't
say it removes abilities. So yes, you have a 3/3 land artifact Blinkmoth
creature with flying, until end of turn.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.

 

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On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 19:22:30 -0400, Carl Joly <palomides@videotron.ca> wrote:
>Here wkat is happening
>you make Blinkmoth Nexus into a land - creature 1/1 with flying.
>you tap it to making +1/+1 so it is a land - creature 2/2 with flying.
>You play your SORCERY to make your land a 2/2 land - creature with flying
>and it is untap. I think you could tap it to make it 3/3

Nope. Doesn't depend at all on what the spell type is; instead, it depends
on the interactions of continuous effects. 418.5a spells this out, and 418.5b
makes it clear that both of the 'animating' effects are applied entirely in
layer 4, while the Blinkmoth's "gets +1/+1" effect is applied on top of that
in layer 6.

You could indeed tap Blinky again ... to make himself a _4/4_ (1/1, overwritten
by 2/2, +1/+1 +1/+1).

>If you played BN into a creature {end stack}
>start a new stack with BN ability "{1}, {T}: Target Blinkmoth gets +1/+1
>until end of turn."

There is never a "new" or "ended" stack; the stack is a zone of play, like
hand or graveyard. It can be _empty_, but it's still in existence even empty.

>and manage to play Rude Awakening as an instant then you would have an
>untap 3/3 land artifact creature Blinkmoth with flying.

Nope; doesn't matter the order of the RA and the +1/+1, _because_ the RA
effect makes things into creatures. That makes it type-changing, so it gets
applied on a "lower" layer than effects that only change power/toughness.

Timestamp and dependency, while important, are only applied inside each
separate layer; anything in layer 6 is always applied after EVERYTHING in
layer 4 or 5 has been applied.

>The only thing I'm not sure in all this is wheter or not after you
>played Rude Awakening
>if "Artifact creature - Blinkmoth" is still valid or if it is lost ie
>become a simple land creature.

Nothing about RA overwrites the "Blinkmoth" part, and 212.1c says that since
RA says "It's still a land" that that means it's also still an artifact.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.