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Shahrazad: do subgame spells count for storm?

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Anonymous
August 25, 2004 4:52:56 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Do spells from a subgame (Shahrazad) count for storm in the main game?

I.e. Shahrazad, subgame with 8+ spells, Tendrils, win?

Thanks,
Arno
Anonymous
August 25, 2004 4:52:57 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

On Wed, 25 Aug 2004 00:52:56 +0200, Arno Beckmann <arno@gmx.de> wrote:
>Do spells from a subgame (Shahrazad) count for storm in the main game?

No. The main game can't see anything that goes on in the subgame, in general;
the Shahrazad effect brings back info about who won and who didn't, used to
adjust the life total, and most other stuff is lost. Similarly, spells cast
earlier in the turn in the MAIN game don't contribute to a Storm spell in
the subgame at any given subgame turn.

(Think of Shahrazad, if you want, as "everyone puts their libraries into
their RFG zones, then performs an incredibly complicated shuffle that reveals
some cards for certain times, then puts the libraries back into their library
and shuffles them, and some players then lose life"...)

>I.e. Shahrazad, subgame with 8+ spells, Tendrils, win?

Nope. 506.5/a notes that the main game is entirely outside the subgame, and
that the subgame is in the main game's RFG zone. Storm in the main game doesn't
trigger off of "spells played inside your RFG zone that stay inside the RFG
zone instead of going onto the main game's stack"; it has no idea they're
happening, because they're not where it's looking (maingame stack) in any way.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
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Anonymous
August 25, 2004 7:28:16 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

"Arno Beckmann" <arno@gmx.de> wrote in message
news:412BC6C8.B4147003@gmx.de...
> Do spells from a subgame (Shahrazad) count for storm in the main game?
>
> I.e. Shahrazad, subgame with 8+ spells, Tendrils, win?
>
> Thanks,
> Arno

No, the subgame's spells have nothing to do with the main game you are
playing. All of the spells from the subgame resolve before there is a
winner of that game. The loser(s) of the subgame lose half of his life,
rounded up. All of the cards from the subgame are shuffled into that
players libraries, and then the main game is resumed. Other than life (&
causing each player to shuffle his library), the subgame has no effect on
the main game. That is assuming you are not playing for ante.

~Ryan
Anonymous
August 25, 2004 7:28:17 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Griffyn 16 (rlcarper31@mchsi.com) wrote:

: "Arno Beckmann" <arno@gmx.de> wrote in message
: news:412BC6C8.B4147003@gmx.de...
: > Do spells from a subgame (Shahrazad) count for storm in the main game?
: >
: > I.e. Shahrazad, subgame with 8+ spells, Tendrils, win?

: No, the subgame's spells have nothing to do with the main game you are
: playing. All of the spells from the subgame resolve before there is a
: winner of that game. The loser(s) of the subgame lose half of his life,
: rounded up. All of the cards from the subgame are shuffled into that
: players libraries, and then the main game is resumed. Other than life (&
: causing each player to shuffle his library), the subgame has no effect on
: the main game. That is assuming you are not playing for ante.

However, once back *in* the main game, the Shahrazad itself counts as a
spell for Storm spells played later that same turn. (and if someone's even
thinking about playing Storm, how many spells have been played that turn
before the Shahrazad is something you need to record for after...)


Keith "one day I'll have to get a Shahrazad; it sounds like so much fun!"
Anonymous
August 26, 2004 1:12:13 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Griffyn 16 schrieb:
> > Do spells from a subgame (Shahrazad) count for storm in the main game?
> >
> > I.e. Shahrazad, subgame with 8+ spells, Tendrils, win?
>
> No, the subgame's spells have nothing to do with the main game you are
> playing. All of the spells from the subgame resolve before there is a
> winner of that game. The loser(s) of the subgame lose half of his life,
> rounded up. All of the cards from the subgame are shuffled into that
> players libraries, and then the main game is resumed. Other than life (&
> causing each player to shuffle his library), the subgame has no effect on
> the main game. That is assuming you are not playing for ante.

Sorry for my quick question - but it was not asked to be answered
with a short "NO" followed by a personal and uncomplete* (=wrong)
interpretation of what Shahrazad does.

(* just FYI: the subgame has more effekts on the main game than just
life loss, i.e. the lib returns shuffled (read the card!) and other
funny things like RFG'ed or wished cards during the subgame.)

Shahrazad, Sorcery, WW
Players play a MAGIC subgame, using their libraries as their decks.
Each player who doesn't win the subgame loses half his or her life,
rounded up. After the subgame, players shuffle all subgame cards they
own into their libraries. Players don't ante a card for the subgame,
and libraries with less than the required number of cards are legal.

I don't only want to know IF subgame spells count for storm in the
main game or not, but also exactly WHY (=because of which rules)
it works or not.

Thanks in advance for a clear and usable answer,
Arno
Anonymous
August 26, 2004 1:38:16 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Arno Beckmann, worshipped by llamas the world over, wrote...
> Griffyn 16 schrieb:
> > > Do spells from a subgame (Shahrazad) count for storm in the main game?
> > >
> > > I.e. Shahrazad, subgame with 8+ spells, Tendrils, win?
> >
> > No, the subgame's spells have nothing to do with the main game you are
> > playing. All of the spells from the subgame resolve before there is a
> > winner of that game. The loser(s) of the subgame lose half of his life,
> > rounded up. All of the cards from the subgame are shuffled into that
> > players libraries, and then the main game is resumed. Other than life (&
> > causing each player to shuffle his library), the subgame has no effect on
> > the main game. That is assuming you are not playing for ante.
>
> Sorry for my quick question - but it was not asked to be answered
> with a short "NO" followed by a personal and uncomplete* (=wrong)
> interpretation of what Shahrazad does.

You had, by the time you posted that, gotten the same answer from WotC's
official netrep. The only one looking like a "noob" is you.

Even if Griffyn had been wrong, insulting people who are trying to help
you is very poor form in any situation and ESPECIALLY unwelcome here.
Don't do it again.

--
Let's not let this drift into a topic about playing your alignment. I
have too much to do to be able to properly ridicule and post whore.
- Rob Singers
Anonymous
August 26, 2004 3:57:56 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

"Arno Beckmann" <arno@gmx.de> wrote in message
news:412CE48D.3BBEAA25@gmx.de...
> Griffyn 16 schrieb:
> > > Do spells from a subgame (Shahrazad) count for storm in the main game?
> > >
> > > I.e. Shahrazad, subgame with 8+ spells, Tendrils, win?
> >
> > No, the subgame's spells have nothing to do with the main game you are
> > playing. All of the spells from the subgame resolve before there is a
> > winner of that game. The loser(s) of the subgame lose half of his life,
> > rounded up. All of the cards from the subgame are shuffled into that
> > players libraries, and then the main game is resumed. Other than life
(&
> > causing each player to shuffle his library), the subgame has no effect
on
> > the main game. That is assuming you are not playing for ante.
>
> Sorry for my quick question - but it was not asked to be answered
> with a short "NO" followed by a personal and uncomplete* (=wrong)
> interpretation of what Shahrazad does.
>
> (* just FYI: the subgame has more effekts on the main game than just
> life loss, i.e. the lib returns shuffled (read the card!) and other
> funny things like RFG'ed or wished cards during the subgame.)

Which is why he *said* the library ends up being shuffled before the
main game resumes. Read the explanation.
!