Type combinations

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Just an idle thought:

Outside of play, there doesn't seem to be anything that can mess with
the types of cards, so a card would have to be one of the six basic
types or one of the two combinations that have been printed.

In play, I think the Mirrodin block finally made all 16 (= 2^4) sets of
permanent types possible. I also think that Copy Artifact is needed to
make any permanent which is both a land and an enchantment.
--
Daniel W. Johnson
panoptes@iquest.net
http://members.iquest.net/~panoptes/
039 53 36 N / 086 11 55 W
 
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Daniel W. Johnson <panoptes@iquest.net> wrote:
>Outside of play, there doesn't seem to be anything that can mess with
>the types of cards,

Inside of play, it's too dark to read?

Er, I mean, check out Conspiracy.

>so a card would have to be one of the six basic
>types or one of the two combinations that have been printed.

Oh, types, not subtypes. And for rules-exploding-related reasons, I don't
think we'll ever see an Instant Sorcery (it would take the Rout route
instead I believe), or any cross between either of those two and Land.

"Instant Enchantment" (just add water) is envisionable, but the enchantments
that do tha now do it differently... and where would it go on resolution?

>In play, I think the Mirrodin block finally made all 16 (= 2^4) sets of
>permanent types possible. I also think that Copy Artifact is needed to
>make any permanent which is both a land and an enchantment.

Quite possibly. Since we have nothing other than copy effects that makes things
-into- lands, you can't go through Soul Sculptor productively to get there, or
the Licids.

("Enchantment land" and "enchantment land creature" were the ones previously
missing, as there wasn't a way to landify other things, or to de-artifact a
Copy Artifact of an artifact land; Neurok Transmuter provides that. Oh yes,
and "no type at all" is also provided by it.)

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
 
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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

David DeLaney <dbd@gatekeeper.vic.com> wrote:

> ("Enchantment land" and "enchantment land creature" were the ones previously
> missing, as there wasn't a way to landify other things, or to de-artifact a
> Copy Artifact of an artifact land; Neurok Transmuter provides that. Oh yes,
> and "no type at all" is also provided by it.)

Actually, at what point did the rules start allowing the following to
product an "enchantment land"? (Assuming, of course, that the result
really is an "enchantment land".)

land, Animate Land, Ashnod's Transmogrant, Copy Artifact
--
Daniel W. Johnson
panoptes@iquest.net
http://members.iquest.net/~panoptes/
039 53 36 N / 086 11 55 W
 
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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Daniel W. Johnson <panoptes@iquest.net> wrote:
>David DeLaney <dbd@gatekeeper.vic.com> wrote:
>> ("Enchantment land" and "enchantment land creature" were the ones previously
>> missing, as there wasn't a way to landify other things, or to de-artifact a
>> Copy Artifact of an artifact land; Neurok Transmuter provides that. Oh yes,
>> and "no type at all" is also provided by it.)
>
>Actually, at what point did the rules start allowing the following to
>product an "enchantment land"? (Assuming, of course, that the result
>really is an "enchantment land".)
>
>land, Animate Land, Ashnod's Transmogrant, Copy Artifact

Slightly after 6th Edition, I believe. Before then the older copy rules said
you couldn't copy something that wasn't "naturally" meeting the conditions -
Ashnod's Transmogrant didn't used to qualify something for choosing by Copy
Artifact. Now CA just checks "is this an artifact? Cool, I can choose it" and
becomes a copy of the text part, excluding noncopy effects.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
 
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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

On Wed, 22 Sep 2004 21:33:26 -0500, panoptes@iquest.net (Daniel W.
Johnson) wrote:

>David DeLaney <dbd@gatekeeper.vic.com> wrote:
>
>> ("Enchantment land" and "enchantment land creature" were the ones previously
>> missing, as there wasn't a way to landify other things, or to de-artifact a
>> Copy Artifact of an artifact land; Neurok Transmuter provides that. Oh yes,
>> and "no type at all" is also provided by it.)
>
>Actually, at what point did the rules start allowing the following to
>product an "enchantment land"? (Assuming, of course, that the result
>really is an "enchantment land".)
>
>land, Animate Land, Ashnod's Transmogrant, Copy Artifact

This dosn't result in an "enchantment land"...
Adarkar Wastes = land
+ Animate Land = creature land
+ Ashnod's Transmogrant = artifact creature land
+ Copy Artifact = enchantment artifact creature land


However
Ancient Den = artifact land
+ Copy Artifact = enchantment artifact land
+ Animate Land = creature enchantment artifact land
+ Neurok Transmuter = creature enchantment land

And
Ancient Den = artifact land
+ Copy Artifact = enchantment artifact land
+ Ambush Commander = enchantment creature artifact land - Elf
+ Neurok Transmuter = enchantment creature land - Elf
+ Kill Ambush Commander = enchantment land


The point is that you couldn't remove "artifact" before Neurok
Transmuter.

--
Regards
Simon Nejmann
 
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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Simon Nejmann <snejmann@worldonline.REMOVETHIS.dk> wrote:
>panoptes@iquest.net (Daniel W. Johnson) wrote:
>>Actually, at what point did the rules start allowing the following to
>>product an "enchantment land"? (Assuming, of course, that the result
>>really is an "enchantment land".)
>>
>>land, Animate Land, Ashnod's Transmogrant, Copy Artifact
>
>This dosn't result in an "enchantment land"...

Does.

>Adarkar Wastes = land
> + Animate Land = creature land
> + Ashnod's Transmogrant = artifact creature land
> + Copy Artifact = enchantment artifact creature land

No. + Copy Artifact = enchantment land. The effects of Animate Land and of
Ashnod's Transmogrant are not themselves copy effects, so -are not copied-.
Copy Artifact comes into play as a copy of the bare-bones Adarkar Wastes ...
that's also an enchantment because CA's text says so.

>The point is that you couldn't remove "artifact" before Neurok Transmuter.

Right. And you still can't add "land" without a copy effect.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
 
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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

David DeLaney <dbd@gatekeeper.vic.com> wrote:

> Daniel W. Johnson <panoptes@iquest.net> wrote:
> >land, Animate Land, Ashnod's Transmogrant, Copy Artifact
>
> Slightly after 6th Edition, I believe. Before then the older copy rules said
> you couldn't copy something that wasn't "naturally" meeting the conditions -
> Ashnod's Transmogrant didn't used to qualify something for choosing by Copy
> Artifact. Now CA just checks "is this an artifact? Cool, I can choose it" and
> becomes a copy of the text part, excluding noncopy effects.

Since Animate Land came out in Nemesis (about a year after 6th Edition),
maybe I should avoid ambiguity and replace that example with one using
older cards:

non-forest land, Gaea's Liege, Living Lands, Ashnod's Transmogrant, Copy
Artifact
--
Daniel W. Johnson
panoptes@iquest.net
http://members.iquest.net/~panoptes/
039 53 36 N / 086 11 55 W
 
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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Daniel W. Johnson <panoptes@iquest.net> wrote:

> Since Animate Land came out in Nemesis (about a year after 6th Edition),
> maybe I should avoid ambiguity and replace that example with one using
> older cards:
>
> non-forest land, Gaea's Liege, Living Lands, Ashnod's Transmogrant, Copy
> Artifact

(sigh) or even Mishra's Factory, Assembly-Worker, Copy Artifact
--
Daniel W. Johnson
panoptes@iquest.net
http://members.iquest.net/~panoptes/
039 53 36 N / 086 11 55 W
 
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Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Daniel W. Johnson <panoptes@iquest.net> wrote:
>Daniel W. Johnson <panoptes@iquest.net> wrote:
>> Since Animate Land came out in Nemesis (about a year after 6th Edition),
>> maybe I should avoid ambiguity and replace that example with one using
>> older cards:
>>
>> non-forest land, Gaea's Liege, Living Lands, Ashnod's Transmogrant, Copy
>> Artifact
>
>(sigh) or even Mishra's Factory, Assembly-Worker, Copy Artifact

Yep. Neither of these worked at the time they came out, or for several years
thereafter, because the copy-card rules said Copy Artifact couldn't copy
something that wasn't an artifact -card- (or an artifact token made as an
artifact (creature) token) in play. Once the copy card rules got updated,
-after- the initial brouhaha over the 6E rules and the 6E Oracle problems,
that changed, and now it has no problem picking anything that's an artifact.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
 
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