Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

HALF LIFE 2 wont run on NVIDIA cards

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
Share
July 19, 2003 1:50:21 AM

<<<Well, this really bites the big one. xbit is reporting that Valve developers have identified a bug in current DX9 hardware when using FSAA algorithms. It appears that there is a workaround for ATI hardware, but is almost impossible to fix for NVIDIA based graphics cards.

Valve continued that this is a problem for any application that packs small textures into larger textures. The small textures will bleed into each other if you have multi-sample FSAA enabled.


Currently both leading graphics chips designers use multi-sampling or hybrid multi-sampling + super-sampling methods to for FSAA.


The developers of the legendary Half-Life game said that drivers are not likely to solve the problem, however, it still can be solved for graphics cards based on VPUs from ATI Technologies, such as RADEON 9500-, 9600-, 9700- and 9800-series. As for NVIDIA GeForce and GeForce FX-series, there are practically no chances to find a workaround, according to Valve.

>>>>

http://www.anandtech.com/#20106
July 19, 2003 1:54:48 AM

no nvidia cards for me if this is true

its fixable on ATI cards... but no way on nvidia cards

Ati the only choice
July 19, 2003 1:58:32 AM

I would not worry about it, nVidia or Valve will certainly find out how to make it work, otherwise both nVidia or Valve will lose tone of profit..
Related resources
July 19, 2003 2:00:04 AM

looks like a major re-code and a 2 month delay to me
July 19, 2003 2:09:29 AM

LOL it's impossible for Half Life to not be able to run on nVidia cards, so what if there is a DX 9 problem? nVidia has enough money to find a way to work around it, if that means bribing Valve with tons of money, so be it!!

Proud Owner the Block Heater
120% nVidia Fanboy
I'd get a nVidia GeForce FX 5900Ultra... if i had the money and if THEY WOULD CHANGE THAT #()#@ HSF
July 19, 2003 2:10:27 AM

Your title is just a LITTLE misleading... its a bug that results in blurry textures, doesnt even look like nvidias fault more of a direct X issue.
I was set back when reading this at first but I dont know if its that earthshaking of news.
Though it doesnt encourage me to pick up a new nvidia card!

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
July 19, 2003 2:15:18 AM

I won't be running AA or AF anyway, for maximum FPS, so it doesn't matter to me. But then that's me. :cool:

<font color=blue>Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.
-Einstein</font color=blue>
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 19, 2003 3:38:09 AM

However it's a HARDWARE issue for PS 2.0/2.0+/2,0++ (or maybe just 2.0+ since it works on the ATIs) and therefore it's an issue for the Nvidia card.
It doesn't mean that NV won't run it, just not with AA enabled (for now). I would be surprised if there isn't a work around, people will just have to be sure that the work around isn't a control panel 'cheat' to make you THINK AA is on. :wink:

In any case, I guess those advanced features like ULTRASHADOW don't help NV right now. So which is more 'future-proof' now because of it's features?

Ahhh ALL the more reason to wait for a NICE R420/RV380 IMO. :cool:

So everyone stick with your GF4 and Early Radeons. Once again PROVING you should WAIT until a game actually comes out before buying a CARD to play it.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 19, 2003 4:30:04 AM

You almost sound bitter.
You'll be knocked off your powered by ATI high horse someday.

NV took a huge bite out of ATIs market in the past and they will take a bite out of their a$$.

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by kinney on 07/19/03 04:47 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 19, 2003 4:56:53 AM

Quote:
You'll be knocked off your powered by ATI high horse someday.

YOU Definitely sound Bitter! And by the read, also uninformed. I have REASONS to be pissed at NV, which I've supplied here MANY times, yet I STILL recomment their products (GF4ti, GF FX5600UR.2). I try to remain objective, and I bristle at people like yourself who are neither objective or informed, yet want to share that ignorance with everyone at every opportunity, thus making me take sides AGAINST that information, making me appear less objective. Got a problem with that, then do some research, heck he POSTED the Dang link. READ it! The title may be misleading but the content is pretty straight forward. If it was JUST a DX problem then the ATI cards wouldn't have a workaround while the NVs don't, now would they? Since the NV cards cannot be 'fixed' according to VALVE, then it appears to be an NV design issue as well. And despite the fact that many may not use AA, saying otherwise downplays the seriousness of the situation. Especially coming from the company feeling they needed to add a plus to PS 2.0 (which one is the TRUE PS 2.0+ now?).

I guess you also still haven't figured out who I'm rooting for so the 'powered by comment' just proves my point.And if you have a problem with what I posted above try being specific as to exactly HOW I was leading people astray? I said it 'may' be fixed (and even mentioned one of the things NV does that ticks me off, and it ticks me off when ATI does it too). And my final sentence is one I've ALWAYS stated here. WAIT!

Quote:
NV took a huge bite out of ATIs market in the past

Actually that's not really true in the areas you're talking about and I doubt you even know what area that IS true in. And it wasn't the past. They've taken a bigger bite out of Intel NOT Ati really.

Quote:
and they will take a bite out of their canadian a$$.

So you have a problem with Canadians too?
Ah, so you're not only ignorant, but also jingoistic, another admirable quality. :mad: 


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 19, 2003 5:17:37 AM

SPAZ man~~~~~diss canadians again and well u dont want to know what will happen

Proud Owner the Block Heater
120% nVidia Fanboy
I'd get a nVidia GeForce FX 5900Ultra... if i had the money and if THEY WOULD CHANGE THAT #()#@ HSF
July 19, 2003 5:55:51 AM

Ok, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it the software manufacturers responisibility to make their software work with the hardware ... not make the hardware companies come up with fixes to work with the software? If this is a problem, why are they implementing it? From the sounds of it, it won't work on ANY card out there with the way things are now. Isn't that called a bug?
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 19, 2003 6:10:53 AM

Well actually it would likely work well with FRAGMENT AA (based on the story, but that's just a guess), and therefore it would likely work on a MATROX Parhelia! HEhe Matrox Rulz! :cool:

Yes it's a bug, but a bug that seems fixable on an ATI card, but not on the Nvidias (for now). It's kinda like people complaining about the old (since resolved) CS issues and ATI cards. Who's fault is it. The buggy MOD of HL that's very old and can be played on an integrated chipset, or ATI's who should've focused on other newer more pressing issues? Well everyone made it ATI's fault, despite the fact that the CS programmers made a patch for the R8500s because it was their game (too old for the R9XXX series). So it depends on your perspective.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 19, 2003 6:39:21 AM

next thing u know there will be two version of Half Life 2: nVidia version or ATi version lol and Maxtrox will work on both LOL


Proud Owner the Block Heater
120% nVidia Fanboy
PROUD OWNER OF THE GEFORCE FX 5900ULTRA <-- I wish this was me
I'd get a nVidia GeForce FX 5900Ultra... if THEY WOULD CHANGE THAT #()#@ HSF
July 19, 2003 8:48:21 AM

Quote:
You almost sound bitter.
You'll be knocked off your powered by ATI high horse someday.

NV took a huge bite out of ATIs market in the past and they will take a bite out of their canadian a$$.


kinney ive been reading your posts sinse you came here


and just about all of them are biased. you need to get off YOUR horse, a$$

your just insulted because your Nvidia isnt the best anynmore. if you actually read up on whats going on the last year you would understand why. remmeber, its only a grphics card company. you dont HAVE to be loyal to them. they didnt do anything for you, except try to rip you off with lines like "the way its meant to be played" or "DX9+ (when actually ATI supported long pixel shader lenghs from the start as well)"


-------

<A HREF="http://www.quake3world.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001355.html" target="_new">*I hate thug gangstas*</A>
July 19, 2003 9:37:13 AM

Kinney, if your anti-Canadian attitude is because of the war in Iraq, I think there is one thing you should know.
There has been no religious service held in Canada since the start of that war, that did not include a heartfelt prayer for the safe return of our American brothers and sisters. The Canadian leaders may not have felt that President Bush was right in invading a soverign nation, but that does not mean that the Canadian people wish any harm or ill on the American people.
July 19, 2003 11:10:53 AM

If there ever was a time to skip a card generation this looks like it’s it. I may or may not like playing HL2, but would have to get it, because of the hype about the graphics. I heard of a couple other games with problems with AA/AF, but nooo not HL2.

I sure can’t wait, until DX9 is in full swing and all the bugs have been worked out. It should be a real hair pulling experience for everybody involved. As for HL2 I wonder what’s going to happen. Will the DX9.1 help, or will Nv
<A HREF="http://schwippy.com/loader/uploaded/nv2.jpg" target="_new">find a work around, hehe.</A>

Or will we just have to wait for the next cards? Anybody want to take a vote if some how they will manage to get AA/AF to work on the current FX cards. I bet they will, because it will be another slap in the face to Nv and they don’t need that kind of news.
July 19, 2003 6:48:03 PM

I dont dislike canandians, I just prefer products from american companys. Like everyone, I've bought my fair share of products from other countries anyway though.

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
July 19, 2003 7:43:54 PM

WAIT WAIT WAIT, so you're saying if a Canadian company offered a product that was clearly superior product to that of an American company, given the same price, you'd take the American one? That sounds anti-Canadian to me. Hell, I'd bet you own dozens of Canadian products that you didn't even know were Canadian. Now, don't get me wrong, I love America. I live here in the states and always have, probably always will. But I don't like things that are American JUST BECAUSE they're American. I like them because they offer quality/performance/whatever. If they don't, and a Canadian or other foreign company does, I'd pick the foreign one.

These days, no matter what company you like, be it <b>nVidia, ATi, or whatever,</b> no matter how logical your reasons, you're labeled an <b>idiot</b> or a <b>fanboy</b>, or <b>both.</b>
July 19, 2003 7:50:10 PM

Most likely NVIDIA will have to go back to the drawing board on this one and make a new card, which would piss all those that bought the FX cards off for they would have to buy another one just to play the game.
July 19, 2003 7:56:53 PM

Relax man, Ive bought ATI in the past, I have an ATI tv tuner I never got to work once I switched to windows 2000 that still doesnt work and now ATI just discontinued and they told us at RAGE3D (AN ATI WEBSITE I USED TO POST AT REGULARLY) that we'd get new drivers and we NEVER did.

Check my posts, in the tv tuner section, same screenname, you might have to dig tho its been awhile.. i bought a Hauppauge after finding I couldnt get a personal cinema.

Also, when I bought the ATI tuner, it was "clearly superior" in specifications and features and performance to everything else out on the market.
Anyway I'm not going to get into this its silly, I have my reasons for liking what I like and I'll leave it at that.
But yes, a company's origin does play a small role in my buying decisions.. but not overweighing the performance or most importantly IMHO, DRIVER SUPPORT AND RELIABILITY!
*cough ATI* *cough*

sorry for yelling. :smile:

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
July 19, 2003 8:06:58 PM

None of these guys here are having problems with ATi's driver support. Catalyst is a fine setup. So now Canadians can't do drivers? Just give up the whole Canadian thing. If you don't like ATi, fine, but if don't like Canada because of ATi, that's a problem. Plus, if you keep saying antiCanadian things, I think CoolSquirtle is going to kill you. He's crazy like that... :smile: :eek: 

These days, no matter what company you like, be it <b>nVidia, ATi, or whatever,</b> no matter how logical your reasons, you're labeled an <b>idiot</b> or a <b>fanboy</b>, or <b>both.</b>
July 19, 2003 8:08:09 PM

Strange how I've been using the ATI TV Wonder for years on Windows 2000 without an issue. Might want to download the latest drivers. They came out a couple of months ago.

Intelligence is not merely the wealth of knowledge but the sum of perception, wisdom, and knowledge.
July 19, 2003 8:31:25 PM

Really phial? I've been here a whole year longer than yourself and you've been scanning my posts ever since? And you've caught every one of them since you did?

I am not looking to getting into it with you but thats something I wanted to point out.

One thing you'l find in my posts, I admit I'm biased to NV. I listen to guys like daveperman but not greatape, in fact it was daveperman who greatly influenced my opinions years ago when I was at anandtech forums.
Guys like greatape make me want to avoid ATI like the plague, I dont want to be viewed as one of those bandwagon ATI 'bois' posting silly things about ATI when its much to easy to jump on whatever company is 10fps faster right now.

It takes alot for me to switch when NV has been extremely reliable (perfect for me through many generations of hardware since I switched from 3dfx).. is that really so bad? All I have ever heard about ATI is complaints about their software and I've experienced it firsthand.
Their nforce 2 is an A+(+++ haha) product IMO and the geforce cards ive had have had 100% success rate with everygame I've ever tried.
Its not a bad thing to have only good experiences with one company and be reluctant to try someone with a known bad reputation. Its good business.
The canandian comment was silly, I apologize to canandians in the crowd.. I could care less about iraq.. canadians are our brothers not enemys.
Nationality has had nothign to do with the troubles Ive had with ATI or NV. Its actually something unrelated that I thought about after I became bitter over the $100 tv tuner I felt ripped off over.
Apologies to those offended hope you understand my stance.
Now back to some friendly arguments.

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
July 19, 2003 8:35:05 PM

If you can help AMD Man I'd gladly go back to using my ati tuner, but when I last was trying to get it to work under win2k/xp it would come up with a scrambled image everytime I started their program. With ATI cards it worked fine but using NV it produced this scrambled image.. I'll post a new thread in the video/tuner section to reduce further distraction of the original topic of this guys thread.

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
July 19, 2003 8:39:41 PM

i never dragged on the canadian thing, i never claimed their nationality had anything to do with DRIVERS (christ) or anything they do.. it was a snide and unnecessary comment at the end of a 3 sentence post..i dropped it.. so quit trying to proliferate it. sheesh.
have a nice day :smile:

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
July 19, 2003 9:07:17 PM

Oh you DON'T want to see me going crazy!!!!! and addiarmadar your asking for it u fanATic, liked i said, if hl2 really wont work on nVidia cards, it would be hl2 that would be changing, not nVidia. if it take nVidia to bribe them so be it!!

Proud Owner the Block Heater
120% nVidia Fanboy
PROUD OWNER OF THE GEFORCE FX 5900ULTRA <-- I wish this was me
I'd get a nVidia GeForce FX 5900Ultra... if THEY WOULD CHANGE THAT #()#@ HSF
July 19, 2003 9:08:51 PM

Quote:



If you can help AMD Man I'd gladly go back to using my ati tuner, but when I last was trying to get it to work under win2k/xp it would come up with a scrambled image everytime I started their program. With ATI cards it worked fine but using NV it produced this scrambled image.. I'll post a new thread in the video/tuner section to reduce further distraction of the original topic of this guys thread.


Ohh, yea. You're right, I experienced that problem a couple of years ago, but I had since forgotten about it since I switched to an ATI card. If I recall correctly, that problem was fixed one or two driver revisions ago (ATI only updates their TV Tuner driver once or twice a year).

Intelligence is not merely the wealth of knowledge but the sum of perception, wisdom, and knowledge.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 19, 2003 10:37:49 PM

Kinney you can place me in whatever category you want using your usual 'flawed' logic. Your obvious hatred of ATI is warping your sense of objectivity. If you want to try and post ONE thing where I've mislead people due to what you believe is Fanboyism go ahead. I doubt you'll find anything that isn't tongue in check. Whereas for you I can definitely find a TON of instances where your information warped by your blind allegiance to NV will likely be to the detriment of anyone using your advice as factor in their decision making. There are good products from boh but you seem obviously WARPED into the mould/mold of an Nvidiot. Your jingoistic America-first attitude is also to the detriment of those in here. Objectivity is obviously a foreign concept to you. People here know my allegiance, and it's NOT to ATI, you still haven't figured it out yet have you!?!

And Phial IS correct, everything you've posted since coming HERE (Graphics Card forum) has followed a particular pattern, regardless of your time in THGC, your time HERE has definitely NOT been to the benifit of the forum. Contribute something other than PR and perhaps that wil change, but for now you're just another Nvidiot, and a nationalistic one at that. What a waste. And considering you haven't seen ALL my posts either, and your characterisations once again prove you to be ignorant and uninformed.

Don't read my posts, that's fine, but stop wasting our time with yours as well. Simply post a link to <A HREF="http://www.nvidia.com/page/newsandevents.html" target="_new">NV PR</A> an save us the time of reading your posts.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 19, 2003 10:43:39 PM

Hey, I'll hold him down and you can force-feed some <A HREF="http://www.sleeman.com/en/beer/styles.html" target="_new">Sleeman</A> into him. Maybe THAT would help him appreciate Canadian products! :evil: 

And yes likely it would be Valve coding a patch, since it's a current game. Bethesda coded the patch for Morrowind's TrueForm issues (witch itself was a mod), not ATI. As long as it's a current game, usually it's the programmers who code the patch (easier than VPU makers who have to make it work on 1000s of games).


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 19, 2003 11:38:59 PM

as i said over on the webvelosix.com LAB forum

people who are on the fence about thier next video card.......will go with Ati now after reading this HL2 issue
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 19, 2003 11:45:05 PM

An interesting revelation from Beyond 3D's forums is <A HREF="http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=142176" target="_new">THIS</A> thread. Take a look at the post by Forbidden Donut, mmm forbidden donught! Aaaah! :eek: 

It's interesting that it might work better on OpenGL (although it's DX) due to Centroid Sampling (I know what the centroid of an object is, but I've never seen that before in graphics, I have heard of it in forestry [from my time forest fire fighting when I was a pup] but never in graphics. Maybe Dave can explain it :wink: . I think I have an idea but it sounds like it would be VERY slow if it's what I'm thinking [so many extra calc.]). I wonder if it actually WOULD work with Fragment AA (know the Parhelia isn't a true DX9 card, but would it work better?).

Also basically the ATI's won't work until DX9.1 and even then that MAY or may not fix it.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 20, 2003 2:20:20 AM

Whatever. Your the one who cant listen or change, you've decided you dont like my posts and thats just how your going to sit with it eh?
Read my last response to phial, it explains alot for you.

<b> I can definitely find a TON of instances where your information warped by your blind allegiance to NV will likely be to the detriment of anyone using your advice as factor in their decision making. There are good products from boh but you seem obviously WARPED into the mould/mold of an Nvidiot. </b>
Did you read the part about the ATI tuner? It DID appear the better buy.. I think blind allegiance to NV is absolutely silly when I have had ATI parts in the past. Im just a consumer. You are a true jerk.

<b>Your jingoistic America-first attitude </b>
Did you even read the APOLOGY i made, I guess what I meant and shouldve said is your an idiot.


And my final comment to you is, when people bringing different experiences with products post in "your" forum and that is a bad thing (because it doesnt coincide with your opinion) it only shows YOUR close mindedness.

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 20, 2003 3:45:28 AM

I've read the response to phial and it basically admits to being an NVIDIOT! You want a COOKIE for that? So you've had some problems with your ATI TV card, my friend had to get a new ATI All-In-Wonder from ME because his doesn't run with XP. Now considering that the items were sold for specific support of specific OS and current configs. Who's fault is that? ATI alone? MS for making their OSs not backward compatible. BTW Win2K is not supposd to be a personal OS (although I have it on my video rig). Alot of things don't run on Win2K that run on 95/98/ME(well does anything run well on ME?). Alot of companies don't support old products heck MS removed support for 98 for companies about 3-5 months BEFORE the expiry date, because of the gigantice security hole which would be difficult to patch and not worth it for them. So ATI's not alone in abandoning old product, but there was neve a promise of support with other OSs unlike MS's promises for support.
Ok so you're biased. Yippee we figured that out before you admited it. And it appears that ATI DID add a workaround, but obviously your didn't know that 'til it was pointed out to you.

<i>I think blind allegiance to NV is absolutely silly when I have had ATI parts in the past. Im just a consumer. You are a true jerk.</i>

Well so far you've mentioned only an ATI part, and considering your biased statements I'd say one item (which NV doesn't make) doesn't remove the stigma of Fanboi from you.

Quote:
Did you even read the APOLOGY i made, I guess what I meant and shouldve said is your an idiot.

I don't care about your apology, it rings as hollow as that of the Dixie Chicks. You realized you weren't in a US-only forum and then had to backtrack because you REALLY stuck your foot in it. It still underlies what your feelings were, or else it wouldn't have come anywhere near your lips. And I'm not editing my post to cover up your folly. I'd repeat it but it doesn't warrant repeating.
And yeah you should've stuck with the insults you're most familiar with, as creative and entertaining as they are. I don't mind Canada (or any other country) bashing as long as it's done tongue in check (heck I bash my country all the time in jest), but it was obvious you weren't joking, and totally unwarranted in this discussion.

As to your final statement, I don't mind divergent opinions, heck I'm usually in the minority (MATROX Rulz! Get it now?) however I do take umbrage at someone who comes here to spread their ignorance and argues with the people in the forum who actually know what they are talking about. Otherwise I would have written your posts of as ignorant and left it at that. But when dispensing your ignorance as informed advice and simply linking to the SAME website you are posting in is a little much for anyone to take. Especially when you haven't even had experience with any of these cards or even ones in their class.

I'll simply leave everyone with this statement from another one of your posts (without comment);

<i>I also have a GF4 MX 440 and I find its performance admirable</i>


Don't go away mad, just go away. :tongue: - adapted from Motley Crue


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 20, 2003 4:50:58 AM

OMG, now you are comparing me to the DIXIE CHICKS.
Dude listen, I said "and their canadian a$$" there is no comparison. I suppose all cops are racists now since rodney king got beat huh? I know your type, quick to judge and label.. its how you like things.

And my ATI tuner had a nice "works with 2000" sticker slapped on it, making your statement about it being made for "specific support of specific OSs" untrue.
So are you lying or are you just being an a$$ again talking about what you don't even know about?

Oh and the GF4 MX to you might be a curse compared to your shiny new NV or ATI but it isnt that bad. My P4 has one and it plays everything fine at 1024x768 about all the resolution the 17in monitor it has can do...
it is admirable, I would even go to say the GTS core that the gf4mx is based off of is still 'admirable'.. it was a great chip. Not everything has to pump out 200+ fps to be a working, decent card buddy.

The first computer I built was a 286, I started on a Commodore, I taught myself QBASIC then later VB6 on my own for "fun". I have an AAS in network technologies, I'm working on my bachelors in MIS currently. I live and breath computers, I'm an enthusiast. For my age, my experience and opinions are quite varied and lengthy, I highly doubt you have more experience than I. What are you, a forum a$$hole?

You scruntinize my every word but your really a punk who needs to worry about himself.

And FYI, if you want to feel you are making a difference. Daveperman had me convinced ATI and the R300 is best right now.
You've confirmed to me that stupid people shouldnt breed.

Though I'm now somehow a certified nvidiot, I should probably take back my latest recommendation of a 9800 pro to a fellow, my 2d recommondation of a matrox, all my posts at rage3d and my ati tv tuner.

Though you seem deeply troubled by my canadian reference, I've helped out many people in these forums.
Not always in "your" gfx forum but all around. I'm not going anywhere.

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
July 20, 2003 4:55:22 AM

HE'S TOO GOOD FOR SLEEMAN!!!! HOLD HIM DOWN AND I'LL FEED HIM OLD RAGE 128 CHIPS!!! HOW YOU LIKE THAT!!! CRUNCHY ENOUGH FOR YOU?! (okay that's just a bit(ONLY A BIT) too much) LOL

Proud Owner the Block Heater
120% nVidia Fanboy
PROUD OWNER OF THE GEFORCE FX 5900ULTRA <-- I wish this was me
I'd get a nVidia GeForce FX 5900Ultra... if THEY WOULD CHANGE THAT #()#@ HSF
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 20, 2003 9:59:33 AM

Quote:
I suppose all cops are racists now since rodney king got beat huh?

No, that would be a BAD analogy. I'd say however that Mark Fuhrman (sp?) IS a racist based on his personal statements. Just like I'll tend to paint you with YOUR personal statements. Quick to judge? Of course,this is the internet boyo, things move fast. Perhaps maybe in the future you will THINK before you post. I'll be quick to judge if you're too quick to post stuff like THAT! If this were the Real World, a quick reaction might have resulted in a black eye from some in here, although more likely harsh words just like here. However your personal attacks definitely wouldn't receive such light treatment. Just watch you posts, it's that simple!

<font color=blue><i>For my age, my experience and opinions are quite varied and lengthy, I highly doubt you have more experience than I. </i></font color=blue>

All of that experience means NOTHING in the graphics world. My dad has 40 years of advanced cutting-edge engineering experience with IBM, doesn't mean he knows jack about graphics cards. Just like everyone can get an A+ certification and think they're a computer whiz. It doesn't mean they know jack. I've been involved with computers for a LONG time too, and my first self-built was a generic AT from spare parts, but then again I was an IBM-kid who had access to all the newest stuff. So don't throw around your supposed 'experience', Who Cares? SHOW your knowledge by posting valid/current info, and not the stuff that comprises your most recent posts. Personal opinion is great but at least have something current to back it up. And some objectivity wouldn't hurt either.

<font color=blue><i>your really a punk who needs to worry about himself.</i></font color=blue>

Assuming (gotta watch that though) you meant you're, then I'd say you should stop projecting <b>your</b> inadequecies on others. And as for your other personal slights I'd say once again look to yourself my man. Perhaps your parents should've taken your breeding tips, saving us all the 'horror' of their efforts.

As for the ATI product with the 'sticker' on it just make sure it's not a STORE sticker, and that it actually was put on there by ATI. In any case, it appears there was a fix that others here have mentioned (surprised your time at Rage3D didn't already direct you there as there have been MANY fixes posted there over time). ah but none the less you're an 'enthusiast' you didn't need us to tell you what's been readily availible for some time. But based on experience don't expect it to work easily on XP either, just in case you make the switch. However still one product (that's not even a graphics card) colouring your perception is pretty sad. However it sounds like you didn't even check with ATI (since they had a fix) before painting them red. I guess that's the colour they should be being Canadian and all, right?

<font color=blue><i>Though you seem deeply troubled by my canadian reference</i></font color=blue>

I wasn't the only one. And since others here have taken it for their anti-American statements (rightly so to some extent), well so should you. I'd rather you make comments about me, which you have, then make such sweeping statements. It may have been a mistake, but the question is what possible other way could it be meant/taken?

<font color=blue><i>Not always in "your" gfx forum but all around. </i></font color=blue>

Probably migrating when you lose credibility in each forum. And it ain't mine, if it were it'd have a FAQ and maybe avitars for the truely unruly!

<font color=blue><i>I'm not going anywhere.</i></font color=blue>

Well, fine, I'll be here (usually while at work) and so you may see alot of me, then again you may not. We shall see.
I won't waste any more time on your personal attacks, but if your posts are a mirror of past posts I'll do what I did before an call you on it. For I am your Albatross.

However I will likely just create a link to respond to personal attacks to make these replies MUCH shorter.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 20, 2003 10:03:01 AM

<b>I know you are, but what am I? </b> :tongue:


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 20, 2003 10:38:41 AM

Note: I'm completely objective and unbiased towards you and Kinney's argument so I don't want you to think I'm raggin' on you because I'm siding with him.


Quote:
<font color=blue>your really a punk who needs to worry about himself.</font color=blue>

Assuming (gotta watch that though) you meant you're

I really don't think you are in a position to be correcting someone's grammar/spelling...
Quote:
characterisations

And isn't "informed advice" redundant?

Just want to make sure things are fair.

--

"<i>I'm seriously you guys.</i>" - Cartman
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 20, 2003 11:46:02 AM

Touché! :tongue:

Actually <A HREF="http://dict.die.net/characterisation/" target="_new">it CAN be both</A>, however common useage is with a Z (now is it Zed or Zee? :wink: ). But I concede your point because usually I would use a Z myself.
It's like Quayle wasn't completely incorrect in using the oe, it is also in the dictionary, just not in American English; mainly in old english (it's in my Oxford as an alternate not of common useage). But whether that's because they couldn't spell back then is another story. :lol: 

A NEW method for spelling words. <A HREF="http://victorian.fortunecity.com/vangogh/555/Spell/res...." target="_new">http://victorian.fortunecity.com/vangogh/555/Spell/res....;/A>

<i><b>And isn't "informed advice" redundant?</i></b>

I don't know. Advice is used to inform, but what about bad advice or the advice of a crazy person? If I gave you advice to buy Martian Shares, is that necessarily informed? But then again, you may be right. :eek: 


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 20, 2003 8:05:44 PM

Refer to the other thread I've been going rounds with you for my final response to your idiocy.

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 20, 2003 8:26:54 PM

Whatever dude! You still haven't proven your points but there is one thing I do agree on. It's old! If WS says it's out of hand then I'll take HIS word for it.

And in response to the end of your sentence <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">CLICK</A> :tongue:

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 20, 2003 9:04:51 PM

Good one your maturity is astounding

Athlon 1700+, Epox 8RDA (NForce2), Maxtor Diamondmax Plus 9 80GB 8MB cache, 2x256mb Crucial PC2100 in Dual DDR, Geforce 3, Audigy, Z560s, MX500
July 20, 2003 9:27:49 PM

I wrote a school paper titled "Idiocy Reigns Supreme" once. It was pretty damn good. It was my way of venting, after the school administration had royally pissed me off.

Not a good thing to piss me off in real life:) 

2 school administrators (the Vice principal as my trophy kill!) and one dyke monitor are now looking for jobs elsewhere:) 

Exploiting (and/or fixing, if it is in my best interest) loopholes and inconsistancies in laws, rules, and constitutions (etc.) is one of my specialties:) 

I will say this for you Grape. I do not suggest wasting more than a few posts on the flaming or discrediting of anyone addict or below:) 

I will not say who has won here. I of course like Grape, but I currently have nothing against kinney either.

But lets move on, shall we?

"Mice eat cheese." - Modest Mouse

"Every Day is the Right Day." -Pink Floyd<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Willamette_Sucks on 07/20/03 06:04 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 20, 2003 9:40:22 PM

Yeah I'm done; 'cause really, it doesn't make EITHER of us look particularly intelligent!

Off to bed..ZZZzzzz...

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
July 20, 2003 10:37:09 PM

Those are good counter statements Grape.

I wasn't aware of the alternate spelling for "characterizations". And your point about "bad advice" is valid, but doesn't apply. Advice is inherently informative...of course assuming the person giving the advice isn't a complete moron of course. So your point about advice to buy martian shares definately puts a * by my reference to "informed advice" being a redundancy.

--

"<i>I'm seriously you guys.</i>" - Cartman
Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
July 21, 2003 1:27:38 AM

"otherwise both nVidia or Valve will lose tone of profit.."

True, true.

More people own Nvidia cards than ATI. I just don't see Valve releasing a final version of HL2 that doesn't work on most peoples' PC's.

BTW, Canada is great! I can't even imagine what the U.S. economy would be like without our friendly neighbor to the North. WE NEED CANADA. And that's a fact.

<font color=red>Crack Addict=Baaaaad </font color=red>
<font color=green>THG Addict=Goooooood </font color=green>
<A HREF="http://www.tylersite.8k.com/photo.html " target="_new">http://www.tylersite.8k.com/photo.html </A>
July 21, 2003 3:16:48 AM

actually, that could be a valid reason to invade. i shouldnt have said that water statement out loud

*calls Prime Minister to warn of iminent attack*

-------

<A HREF="http://www.quake3world.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001355.html" target="_new">*I hate thug gangstas*</A>
!