Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (
More info?)
Piotr Lopaciuk <stilghar@o2.pl> sent:
> Hi all!
> I have a question about situation like this:
> There are two Engineered Plagues in play (set to Goblin).
So, all Goblins will get -2/-2, which means most of them will be dying,
on account of Goblins not being famous for their high toughness.
> A player plays
> Goblin Pyromancer.
Goblin Pyromancer {3}{R} Creature -- Goblin Wizard 2/2
/ When Goblin Pyromancer comes into play, all Goblins get +3/+0 until
end of turn.
/ At end of turn, destroy all Goblins.
(the power/toughness was missing from the version you gave)
> Does Pyromancer's ability trigger?
The first one does. The second one doesn't. Then active player
tries to gain priority, and in doing so, the Pyromancer is put into
the graveyard for having 0 toughness or less, and then the ability
that triggered is put on the stack.
> As far as I'm
> concerned, he'll go down as a state-based effect before any abilities
> can enter the stack. Or did I miss something?
True, but that didn't stop the ability from triggering, and it
doesn't stop the ability from making it to the stack at the
appropriate time.
> Could anyone point me to fitting rules in Comprehensive Rulebook? I
> browsed through it, yet failed to find anything.
Well, you're looking for something that isn't there, because it doesn't
happen. Here's what _does_ happen:
404.2. Triggered abilities aren't played. Instead, a triggered
ability automatically "triggers" each time its trigger event occurs.
Once an ability has triggered, it goes on the stack the next time a
player would receive priority. See rule 408.1, "Timing, Priority, and
the Stack," and rule 410, "Handling Triggered Abilities."
Did the event occur? Yes, the Goblin Pyromancer came into play,
so the triggered ability that triggers when it comes into play
did trigger.
This is explained again in more detail:
410.2. Whenever a game event or game state matches a triggered
ability's trigger event, that ability triggers. When a phase or step
begins, all abilities that trigger "at the beginning of" that phase
or step trigger. The ability doesn't do anything when it triggers but
automatically puts the ability on the stack as soon as a player would
receive priority. The ability is controlled by the player who
controlled its source at the time it triggered. It has the text of
the ability that created it, and no other characteristics.
The ability waits around until the process of gaining priority, and
only then can it appear on the stack. And what happens when you
try to gain priority?
408.1b Spells and activated abilities are played by players (if they
choose) using a system of priority, while other types of abilities
and effects are automatically generated by the game rules. Each time
a player would get priority, all applicable state-based effects
resolve first as a single event (see rule 420, "State-Based
Effects"). Then, if any new state-based effects have been generated,
they resolve as a single event. This process repeats until no more
applicable state-based effects are generated. Then triggered
abilities are added to the stack (see rule 410, "Handling Triggered
Abilities"). These steps repeat in order until no further state-based
effects or triggered abilities are generated. Then the player who
would have received priority does so and may play a spell or ability,
take a special action (such as playing a land), or pass, as governed
by the rules for that phase or step.
Basically, there's no rule along the lines of "oh, and if the
permanent went away during state-based effects, then ignore that
pending trigger waiting to go on the stack, just sweep it under the red
zone."
--
-- zoe
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