Activating Defense of the Heart

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Looking to build a Green deck based around Defense of the Heart to fetch
creatures like Darksteel Colossus and Platinum Angel.

To speed it up and to trigger it against decks that don't rely on creatures
I need to create token creatures under my opponent's control. My question
is which cards would do this best? I know of Forbidden Orchard but there
must be others. Any suggestions of the best way to go about getting the
tokens out quick?

Thanks
LT.
 
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Varchild's War Riders

MonoJoker wrote:

>Looking to build a Green deck based around Defense of the Heart to fetch
>creatures like Darksteel Colossus and Platinum Angel.
>
>To speed it up and to trigger it against decks that don't rely on creatures
>I need to create token creatures under my opponent's control. My question
>is which cards would do this best? I know of Forbidden Orchard but there
>must be others. Any suggestions of the best way to go about getting the
>tokens out quick?
>
>Thanks
>LT.
>
>
>
>
 
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From the Collected Witterings of MonoJoker, volume 23:
> Looking to build a Green deck based around Defense of the Heart to fetch
> creatures like Darksteel Colossus and Platinum Angel.
>
> To speed it up and to trigger it against decks that don't rely on
> creatures I need to create token creatures under my opponent's control.
> My question is which cards would do this best? I know of Forbidden
> Orchard but there must be others. Any suggestions of the best way to go
> about getting the tokens out quick?

You could use Endless Whispers and a sac engine to give him control of junk
creatures like Walls, then use Defence to get the big boy who wins the game.

--
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"MonoJoker" <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote in message
news:hHrsd.58986$K7.43687@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Looking to build a Green deck based around Defense of the Heart to fetch
> creatures like Darksteel Colossus and Platinum Angel.
>
> To speed it up and to trigger it against decks that don't rely on
creatures
> I need to create token creatures under my opponent's control. My question
> is which cards would do this best? I know of Forbidden Orchard but there
> must be others. Any suggestions of the best way to go about getting the
> tokens out quick?

Quick? Not really. Forbidden Orchard would be the quickest. It can come
down on Turn 1. The next fastest would be Varchild's War-Riders as if cast
on
turn 2, it would start dropping Survivors on Turn 3. The other 2 methods
won't start churning out creatures for them until turn 5 ... which might be
a good
thing as Defense of the Heart costs 4 (Well 3G)

To give your opponent creatures though, you'll most likely need extra
colours.
You could run Black, Endless Whispers and Walls. You then kill off the
Walls (Sacrificing them to Spawning Pit sounds good), let them reanimate
themselves on your opponent's side and let the Defense of the Heart pull up
your Good Stuff.

A warning: With Endless Whispers out, if your Good Stuff dies and stays in
the
graveyard, you'll be fighting it. Make sure you have Naturalizes for when
you don't need to hear the Whispers anymore. And since you're the ever
so nice opponent and sending him walls, then you should be nice back
and beat your opponent with a Juggernaut.

So the deck would be a Green/Black build with Walls, finishers, and things
to kill off or sacrifice stuff.

Another way is that you could use the Phelddagrifs. One ability on either
of them gives your opponent a 1/1 Hippo token. Wouldn't take long to
get 4 creatures in the enemy camp that way. Plus Blue and White are
good for contolling creatures. And it's a 4/4 body to boot. Only drawback
is that both of them cost 1GWU to cast. Three colours might mean that your
deck might not be a smooth as it could be.

Though Ghostly Prison or Propaganda might make it a bit hard for your
opponent to actually attack with anything substantial. Plus if you have
Blue already ... you could Donate them something.

This deck would most likely be GUw or GWu depending on the "control
colour" chosen, at least in my opinion.

I suppose the third way is to use Varchild's War-Riders. That would be a
Green/Red deck. Big creatures + Tremor/Pyroclasm to get rid of any
pesky Survivors that you've given your opponent. Plus if you add
Lure on the War-Riders, you can clear the field of Survivors AND deal
damage (barring any combat tricks that is). Ah the joys of Rampage.

The Black/Green one would probably be the cheapest one to build though.
But I would like to try the Phelddagrif one on Apprentice just for fun.
It's a
funny word, plus I'm hip with the Hippos.

-------
Clayton

Random Tagline:
I see dead creatures!
 
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"MonoJoker" <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote in message
news:hHrsd.58986$K7.43687@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Looking to build a Green deck based around Defense of the Heart to fetch
> creatures like Darksteel Colossus and Platinum Angel.
>
> To speed it up and to trigger it against decks that don't rely on
creatures
> I need to create token creatures under my opponent's control. My question
> is which cards would do this best? I know of Forbidden Orchard but there
> must be others. Any suggestions of the best way to go about getting the
> tokens out quick?
>
> Thanks
> LT.

Thanks for all the replies. Was hoping to keep it mono-Green to take
advantage of artifact destruction (especially Isochroned Counterspells and
the like).

A related question would be if I have a Lightning Greaves in play and my
opponent targets the Darksteel Colossus with a Swords to Plowshares can I
Greaves it in response and thus save it or will the Plowshares take effect
first thus removing it from the game? Is there any other (Green) way to
protect the Colossus as this seems to be the only way I'd lose it?

Thanks
LT.
 
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"MonoJoker" <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote in message
news:4hCsd.59914$K7.50851@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> "MonoJoker" <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote in message
> news:hHrsd.58986$K7.43687@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Thanks for all the replies. Was hoping to keep it mono-Green to take
> advantage of artifact destruction (especially Isochroned Counterspells and
> the like).
>
> A related question would be if I have a Lightning Greaves in play and my
> opponent targets the Darksteel Colossus with a Swords to Plowshares can I
> Greaves it in response and thus save it or will the Plowshares take effect
> first thus removing it from the game? Is there any other (Green) way to
> protect the Colossus as this seems to be the only way I'd lose it?

Unfortunately, for the most part, Equipping is played as a Sorcery, thus it
won't be able to be done "in response" to the Swords.

*checking..*

The only ways to Equip as an Instant that I can find typically are:

Auriok Windwalker (white)
Leonin Shikari (white)
Magnetic Theft (red)

Cranial Plating (Equipment with optional equip cost to play as instant)
Healer's Headress (Equipment with optional equip cost to play as instant)
Horned Helm (Equipment with optional equip cost to play as instant)
Neurok Stealthsuit (Equipment with optional equip cost to play as instant)
Sparring Collar (Equipment with optional equip cost to play as instant)

Best I can do for that.. so for what you want, you'd either have to splash
white or red, and you have twice as many options for white as red.

Erich
 
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On Sun, 05 Dec 2004 11:28:00 GMT, MonoJoker <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote:
>A related question would be if I have a Lightning Greaves in play and my
>opponent targets the Darksteel Colossus with a Swords to Plowshares can I
>Greaves it in response and thus save it or will the Plowshares take effect
>first thus removing it from the game?

Generally, no: "Play this ability (Equip) only any time you could play a
sorcery" stops you from responding with the Equip ability.

> Is there any other (Green) way to
>protect the Colossus as this seems to be the only way I'd lose it?

Oh mercy no, that's not the only way. It just can't be -destroyed-. It can
be sacrificed, returned to hand, removed from the game, caused to die because
three Shrinks were cast on it and it's now -4/-4, etc. Green does have Avoid
Fate, and for special cases Lifeforce, but in general its countering targets
abilities from permanents. You might look at Null Brooch or Ring of Immortals
for other artifact countering, and Alexi's Cloak, Ghosthelm Courier if you've
made your Colossus into a Wizard, Hisoka's Guard, Mage's Guile, Mystic Veil,
Neurok Stealthsuit (using its UU: cost ability, not its Equip), Relic Ward,
Soratami Rainshaper, Svyelunite Priest (THERE'S a card we don't mention here
very often) if they happen to try to Swords it during your upkeep, and Sylvan
Safekeeper all can give your Colossus "can't be the target of spells or
abilities" in response to a spell or ability being played that targets it.

But nearly none of those are Green specifically, no.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
 
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David DeLaney <dbd@gatekeeper.vic.com> sent:
> On Sun, 05 Dec 2004 11:28:00 GMT, MonoJoker <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote:

[Swords to Plowshares, Darksteel Colossus]
>> Is there any other (Green) way to
>>protect the Colossus as this seems to be the only way I'd lose it?

> Oh mercy no, that's not the only way. It just can't be -destroyed-. It can
> be sacrificed, returned to hand, removed from the game, caused to die because
> three Shrinks were cast on it and it's now -4/-4, etc.

Shrink {G} Instant
/ Target creature gets -5/-0 until end of turn.

Maybe Pull Under will work better for this example?

Pull Under {5}{B} Instant - Arcane
/ Target creature gets -5/-5 until end of turn.

--
-- zoe
 
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Zoe Stephenson <zrs1@uk.ac.york.reversed> wrote:
>David DeLaney <dbd@gatekeeper.vic.com> sent:
>> On Sun, 05 Dec 2004 11:28:00 GMT, MonoJoker <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote:
>
>[Swords to Plowshares, Darksteel Colossus]
>>> Is there any other (Green) way to
>>>protect the Colossus as this seems to be the only way I'd lose it?
>
>> Oh mercy no, that's not the only way. It just can't be -destroyed-. It can
>> be sacrificed, returned to hand, removed from the game, caused to die because
>> three Shrinks were cast on it and it's now -4/-4, etc.
>
> Shrink {G} Instant
>/ Target creature gets -5/-0 until end of turn.

?? I was sure it said -5/-5, my mistake.

>Maybe Pull Under will work better for this example?

Yes please, or Waste Away.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
 
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"David DeLaney" <dbd@gatekeeper.vic.com> wrote in message
news:slrncr6kj3.250.dbd@gatekeeper.vic.com...
> On Sun, 05 Dec 2004 11:28:00 GMT, MonoJoker <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote:
> >A related question would be if I have a Lightning Greaves in play and my
> >opponent targets the Darksteel Colossus with a Swords to Plowshares can I
> >Greaves it in response and thus save it or will the Plowshares take
effect
> >first thus removing it from the game?
>
> Generally, no: "Play this ability (Equip) only any time you could play a
> sorcery" stops you from responding with the Equip ability.
>
> > Is there any other (Green) way to
> >protect the Colossus as this seems to be the only way I'd lose it?
>
> Oh mercy no, that's not the only way. It just can't be -destroyed-. It can
> be sacrificed, returned to hand, removed from the game, caused to die
because
> three Shrinks were cast on it and it's now -4/-4, etc. Green does have
Avoid
> Fate, and for special cases Lifeforce, but in general its countering
targets
> abilities from permanents. You might look at Null Brooch or Ring of
Immortals
> for other artifact countering, and Alexi's Cloak, Ghosthelm Courier if
you've
> made your Colossus into a Wizard, Hisoka's Guard, Mage's Guile, Mystic
Veil,
> Neurok Stealthsuit (using its UU: cost ability, not its Equip), Relic
Ward,
> Soratami Rainshaper, Svyelunite Priest (THERE'S a card we don't mention
here
> very often) if they happen to try to Swords it during your upkeep, and
Sylvan
> Safekeeper all can give your Colossus "can't be the target of spells or
> abilities" in response to a spell or ability being played that targets it.
>
> But nearly none of those are Green specifically, no.

Thanks David, I think Avoid Fate is exactly what I'm after. Bringing the
Colossus or whatever into play with Defense is harder for opponent to
counter but Swords is what I really want to protect it against initially.
So if I bought in a Colossus and Platinum Angel with Defense then opponent
tries to Swords one or the other I am able to counter that for only G! And
since the activated ability of Sylvan Safekeeper can be used as Instant that
would be useful too.

Cheers
LT.
 
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On 2004-12-05, MonoJoker <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote:
> "MonoJoker" <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote in message
>
> Thanks for all the replies. Was hoping to keep it mono-Green to take
> advantage of artifact destruction (especially Isochroned Counterspells and
> the like).

If you do add white, it looks like you're already playing extended, so you
could add in disenchants for the artifact hate.

K


--
In vino veritas
http://openwine.net
 

clayton

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"Kevin" <ktneely@no.spam.astroturfgarden.com> wrote in message
news:VsudnagkrbKupyjcRVn-gg@speakeasy.net...
> On 2004-12-05, MonoJoker <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote:
> > "MonoJoker" <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote in message
> >
> > Thanks for all the replies. Was hoping to keep it mono-Green to take
> > advantage of artifact destruction (especially Isochroned Counterspells
and
> > the like).
>
> If you do add white, it looks like you're already playing extended, so you
> could add in disenchants for the artifact hate.

As green has Naturalize, which does the exact same thing ... well it's a
personal
preference I suppose. Plus, one could also use Creeping Mold or Oxidize to
destroy artifacts if really needed.

-------
Clayton

Random Tagline:
So many spells, so little mana
 
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MonoJoker <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote:
>Thanks David, I think Avoid Fate is exactly what I'm after. Bringing the
>Colossus or whatever into play with Defense is harder for opponent to
>counter but Swords is what I really want to protect it against initially.
>So if I bought in a Colossus and Platinum Angel with Defense then opponent
>tries to Swords one or the other I am able to counter that for only G! And
>since the activated ability of Sylvan Safekeeper can be used as Instant that
>would be useful too.

Plus which nobody EVER, but _ever_, expects Avoid Fate. Somehow.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
 
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David DeLaney <dbd@gatekeeper.vic.com> sent:
> MonoJoker <Monojoker@bigjobs.com> wrote:
>>Thanks David, I think Avoid Fate is exactly what I'm after. Bringing the
>>Colossus or whatever into play with Defense is harder for opponent to
>>counter but Swords is what I really want to protect it against initially.
>>So if I bought in a Colossus and Platinum Angel with Defense then opponent
>>tries to Swords one or the other I am able to counter that for only G! And
>>since the activated ability of Sylvan Safekeeper can be used as Instant that
>>would be useful too.

> Plus which nobody EVER, but _ever_, expects Avoid Fate. Somehow.

My deck 'Faeries Kill You' uses Avoid Fate, and it actually won me
a game (opponent at 1 life needed to resolve Spinning Darkness against
one of my Faeries to power Yawgmoth's Bargain abilities...) People
do kind of expect it from me whenever I play green these days.

--
-- zoe