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Two Games to rule them All

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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September 16, 2003 12:58:23 PM

Buzz. That's what we're seeing. Nothing but the buzz of thousand of Nvidabeez and ATI drones trying to defend their territories and claim the coveted crown as their own. Both parities are not blameless. Both have 'optimized' drivers...whether in the near past (Nvidia futuremark UT2k3 fiasco) or the past (ATI 8500 Quake fiasco). But I think everyone has overlooked an interesting point. In fact, I know everyone has overlooked it. Oh sure, they are probably aware of the fact....but they haven't linked the two of them. But before I spill the proverbial beans about what the point of this post is...I'm going to delve into some background info. Bear with me...

Pretend for a second that you have designed a game. You are putting the final touches on it and have decided that it is time to call a press conference and show everyone the DEMO. You want your product to look the best and perform the best at that critical time right? You don't want any snags...no freeze ups...no hangs...no crap scenes. You want everything to be perfect. Yeah....anyone who disagrees with this has their head crammed in their ar$e. And the point speaks for itself.

<b>POINT</b>: Both Doom ]|[ AND Half Life 2 had their demo's using ATI RADEON graphics cards. <A HREF="http://www6.tomshardware.com/business/20020817/quakecon..." target="_new">Carmack</A> (quakecon 2002) and <A HREF="http://www.gamersdepot.com/hardware/video_cards/ati_vs_..." target="_new"> Newell</A> (press conference). Now of course, I know that old Gabe Newell used GF cards as well...and that's fine and dandy...but he also bashed the hell out of them at the same time. What's this tell us? Well, if you gussy up for the visitors when they have your product under scrutiny...you want to look your best....I guess ATI is how they chose to do so. After all the words that have flown and the mud that has been slung from both sides of the fence and from fanboi's worldwide...<b>I think that actions speak louder than words..</b>

<font color=blue>other people's lives
seem more interesting
cuz they aint mine
</font color=blue>
<font color=green>Modest Mouse</font color=green>

TKS

More about : games rule

September 16, 2003 1:05:55 PM

Absolutely right, I just bwana add something.
When the d00ds that made HL2/D00m3 were going to show their demos they probably (definitely) checked to see on which card their game runs best and for that they benchmarked it using different cards, and that's nothing different than when you compare cards at a THG review to see which performs best at which games.

Roses are <font color=red>red</font color=red>, violets are <font color=blue>blue</font color=blue>, post something stupid and I won't reply to you!
September 16, 2003 5:40:53 PM

I take the silence to this post as verification that I'm right on my speculations...or everyone has the same speculations. :wink:

<font color=blue>other people's lives
seem more interesting
cuz they aint mine
</font color=blue>
<font color=green>Modest Mouse</font color=green>

TKS
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September 16, 2003 6:10:45 PM

Actually...
If I understood correctly, you say that since game makers demonstrate their games with certain cards, those are the ones to get and benchmarking is irrelevant. But since game makers benchmark their game to see on which card it runs best, isn't that the same thing as looking at benchmarks. Furthermore, you won't be able to know which future card to get...

Roses are <font color=red>red</font color=red>, violets are <font color=blue>blue</font color=blue>, post something stupid and I won't reply to you!
a b U Graphics card
September 16, 2003 7:37:24 PM

My silence was a feeling of little else to add, but let me clarify a bit.

I agree somewhat, but you must also put the timeframe into perspective. At the early demo of D]|[ at QuaeCon the R9700P was really the only DX9-class card availible. And then with HL2 it appears that particular to that game is some serious issues on the FX series. Now the main thing is that there is no way we can truely draw concrete conclusions from only those two examples, but it is a strong bonus in ATI's favour. However it could also be an exception (although not seeming tooo likely). The FX5900's still do well in some areas, and the Quadro versions obviously have their place too. I think that it's to ATI's benifit that the two most highly anticipated games in recent history happen to play well and demo well on their cards. Call it good fortune and good design. If MaxPayne 2 or UT2K4, etc. were the games to look for and they did well on the FX, while doing OK (within 5-10%) on the ATIs, and yet in HL2 and D]|[ (obscure titles in this scenario) the ATI dominated and blew away the FXs, no one would take notice of the structural flaws (except one would hope nV would notice) nor care to such a great extent. Imagine if it was WILL ROCK or Chaser or even Freelancer that was the game that had an issue, would anyone really care as much, no probably not, as long as it played our anticipated favourites.
The biggest issue here is that it seems to have a problem with one of the big games, and like oyu say that trumps all other successes or failures. If the R9700 and R9800 sucked at HL2 and the FX5800U got twice as many frames then you would see people saying that it was always an underrated card and all the other games obviously were just not up to it's power, etc.

It all comes down to a question of chance and good anticipation of design requirements. ATI gambled that meeting the standard was the thing to do, and nV gabled that their method (which could be awesome under CG or some other method) would be the best route to follow. It appears at least that in recent history the reliance/anticipation of a dramatic change in the industry (like easy adoption of CG) didn't pay off.

Who knows the future may still hold alot of surprises and perhaps in some ohter anticipated game (that just happens to be coded in CG [Stalker?]) the FX line will anihilate the ATIs. I just wouldn't bet/invest my money on that possibility.

Anywhoo, you wanted input, there's my two frames worth.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
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