ATI GPU Shim: should it stay or should it go?

Titanion · Sep 25, 2003

I have a Crystal Orb on its way, and I have been reading about this whole shim being higher than the GPU issue. Those of you who have added on your own fan/heatsink to these ATI cards (mine is a red PCB 9500 non-pro with L shaped ram—mod works perfectly), how have you handled this problem. I have read that some people just removed the shim altogether and used AS3; others have left the shim there and used a thick layer of AS Adhesive to raise the contact level to the shim.

How important is the shim. What is it for? It seems like the best way would be to just remove the shim and use AS3. I have read that the pins fit on the Crystal Orb, so no adhesive is necessary.

And if the shim stays, how do you create a thick layer of adhesive and not have it spill over? Is there anything near the GPU that the spill over adhesive would ruin?

I am going to use the adhesive to add ramsinks as well, so how much is enough? Details on using paste are a lot more common on the Internet than the adhesive.

The last thing I want to do is screw up this awesome card, so suggestions are welcome. So, you successful moders out there, how did you guys get the job done? And those of you who fried your cards, we can learn from you too.

“Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”

–George Santayana

To reign is worth ambition though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heav'n.
John Milton, Paradise Lost, II 262-263

GeneticWeapon · Sep 25, 2003

I've done all this

Once you remove the stock HSF, you'll see some thick yellow goop undereath that fills the gap between the chip and the HSF. If your going to replace the HSF with an aftermarket model, you need to remove the shim. If you leave the shim on, and try to fill the gap with AS3, the AS3 will boil when the card heats up and you'll get tiny air bubbles, and your card will overheat.
Do not use thermal epoxy on your card
Use a stiff razor knife and pop the shim off starting at one corner, then work your way around.
Good luck.

<--- Winner of the Sept. Oklahoma Quake3 championship.
Sponsored by Nvidia

<A HREF="http://www.okgg.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=24&pos=8" target="_new">http://www.okgg.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=24&pos=8</A>

darko21 · Sep 25, 2003

Yeah I did it too. Just make an informed decision cause your most likely voiding the warranty. I was pleased with the results and kept the stock heatsink..
You might have seen this link earlier but I'll post again in case you have not
http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=1288

Titanion · Sep 25, 2003

After I have the shim off and have cleaned off the GPU, for there must be some pad there or something, I suppose I should treat the GPU just like a CPU in terms of using AS3 on it, i.e., a bb sized drop or smaller spread all around.

When you suggest/warn about no epoxy, are you talking about on the ramsinks as well? I researched the frag tape vs. thermal adhesive, and the adhesive seemed the best bet all the way...

To reign is worth ambition though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heav'n.
John Milton, Paradise Lost, II 262-263

lhgpoobaa · Sep 25, 2003

Ive used Arctic Silver Epoxy Resin with considerable success on my R9800pro attaching ramsinks.

Havnt touched the core however.

If you are mounting a heavy heatsink you will ened the shim to take the load.
If not, remove it.

I am not a AMD fanboy.
I am not a Via fanboy.
I am not a ATI fanboy.
I AM a performance fanboy.
And a low price fanboy.

Regards,
Mr no integrity coward.

ufo_warviper · Sep 25, 2003

Pardon my ignorance, but what is "the shim"?

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!

lhgpoobaa · Sep 25, 2003

Aint u ever seen a R9x00 with the heatsink off?
Its the square platic 'ring' around the GPU core that supports most of the weight of the heatsink. protects the core from getting crushed or damaged.

I am not a AMD fanboy.
I am not a Via fanboy.
I am not a ATI fanboy.
I AM a performance fanboy.
And a low price fanboy.

Regards,
Mr no integrity coward.

darko21 · Sep 25, 2003

UFO
there is a picture in the link I posted above..

Titanion · Sep 25, 2003

Is the Crystal Orb considered heavy? Is the shim eneded?

To reign is worth ambition though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heav'n.
John Milton, Paradise Lost, II 262-263

darko21 · Sep 25, 2003

I dont know the wieght of the crystal orb but the shim is glued.. listen to GW in the second post its the best way to remove it

lhgpoobaa · Sep 25, 2003

I dont think so.
But i could be thinking about some other orb cooler.

Anything over 200 gramms iwould want to have the shim there just in case.

I am not a AMD fanboy.
I am not a Via fanboy.
I am not a ATI fanboy.
I AM a performance fanboy.
And a low price fanboy.

Regards,
Mr no integrity coward.

GeneticWeapon · Sep 25, 2003

I tried both the Crystal Orb and the Vantec Iceburq bling bling on my R300, neither one of them got me more then 5Mhz over what the stock HSF could do. As far as ramsinks go, I used thermal epoxy. I also got lower overclocks with the ramsinks on, then when I didnt use any at all. Too late though, they were permanent.

<--- Winner of the Sept. Oklahoma Quake3 championship.
Sponsored by Nvidia

<A HREF="http://www.okgg.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=24&pos=8" target="_new">http://www.okgg.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=24&pos=8</A>

TheGreatGrapeApe · Sep 25, 2003

It ain't all of them, there's no shim on the R9600s. :tongue:

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

TheGreatGrapeApe · Sep 25, 2003

Too late though, they were permanent.

Still got those pics? You should post them to scare the little ones. :evil:

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

Titanion · Sep 25, 2003

Well that is damn discouraging! Sounds like I am stuck with close to $30 of useless computer parts… Crystal Orb, 8 cheap ramsinks, and AS Adhesive… I guess I really wanted something to do that didn’t cost too much money… that would both scare the hell out of me and be fun all at once… and I did want to make my card perform better as well, though…

I suspect the cooler on my 2nd rig (XFX GF4 4200) is doing its job as well…

I have been having weird glitched in NWN, though, where after playing for a while and loading a game several times, the character's head would lose all color and be silver... I thought it might be a heat issue... it has always been resolved by changing the resolution and refreshing the screen, though... I was hopiong this would help...

Ram overclocked worse? Really? Damn!

To reign is worth ambition though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heav'n.
John Milton, Paradise Lost, II 262-263

GeneticWeapon · Sep 25, 2003

Still got those pics? You should post them to scare the little ones.

No...the server that was hosting them went bye bye

<--- Winner of the Sept. Oklahoma Quake3 championship.
Sponsored by Nvidia

<A HREF="http://www.okgg.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=24&pos=8" target="_new">http://www.okgg.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=24&pos=8</A>

lhgpoobaa · Sep 25, 2003

Thats gotta be the strangest thing. Your're wierd!

Maybe u didnt use enough thermal transfer compound and too much epoxy? *shrugs*
or didnt put enough on.

then again i only got an extra 3% on my ram with ramsinks... But i was mainly in it for stability anyway.

I am not a AMD fanboy.
I am not a Via fanboy.
I am not a ATI fanboy.
I AM a performance fanboy.
And a low price fanboy.

Regards,
Mr no integrity coward.

speeduk · Sep 25, 2003

If your watercooling your card, leave the shim on and use a thin layer of AS Ceramique and check the block for contact. Most new cards don't have problems with the shim.

If you go extreme like me, a layer of AS ceramique a few mm thick was enough to make contact with a 1700 heatsink. Got an extra 10mhz out of the gpu even with a slightly thicker layer.

I will take the sink off later though, and the shim with it (don't you love epoxy), and try a zalman heatpipe and see how far it goes.... But 380/348 24/7 on a 9700pro will do me for now.

<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=7000747" target="_new"> 3D-2001 </A>
<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=1284380" target="_new"> 3D-03 </A>
 120% overclocker (cheapskate)

Titanion · Sep 27, 2003

My GPU seems to be slightly higher than my shim, so I am going to leave it on... I could be decieved, but it seems so...

To reign is worth ambition though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heav'n.
John Milton, Paradise Lost, II 262-263

Willamette_sucks · Sep 28, 2003

Thats how mine was. The GPU was at about the same height, maybe a fraction of a milimeter higher. I attatched a Volcano 10 to my 9800 Pros GPU using artic silver thermal epoxy, worked great, didn't need to remove the shim. I also used that stuff to attatch some ramsinks. Im not sure how the ramsinks affected my memory OC, because I never pushed the card before I put them on, I did it mainly to prolong their life at overclocked speeds. Since I first put them on though, my max memory overclock (without overclocks) has decreased

Thats just how it goes.

"Mice eat cheese." - Modest Mouse

"Every Day is the Right Day." -Pink Floyd

Titanion · Sep 28, 2003

After a thin layer of AS3, I set the sink on the shim/gpu, moved it in several small circles, then lifted it up, and I had only made contact with about 75% of the GPU. I added a bit more on the low corned, did it again, and more contact was made... but contact with AS3... oh, well, I pinned the crystal orb on and am up and running... I just hope I am getting good contact... the pins did not seem to be holding the crystal orb on very tight... at least compared to a cpu, etc... (it does seem secure, but it has left me a bit worried).

To reign is worth ambition though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heav'n.
John Milton, Paradise Lost, II 262-263

speeduk · Sep 28, 2003

If after putting heatsinks on the memory of a video card your overclock is lower, that means you just put too much compound or not enough of the transfer mix on the memory. I did the same thing with my old card, but my new sinks are stuck on with a thin thermal tape that does a great job compared to thermal epoxy.

Because the chips are so small, its best to use thin but long sinks on memory or ones with a thin base so the heat doesn't build up and long thin fins to disperse the heat.

<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=7000747" target="_new"> 3D-2001 </A>
<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=1284380" target="_new"> 3D-03 </A>
 120% overclocker (cheapskate)

Willamette_sucks · Sep 28, 2003

You mean small like the core of a tbred b? Flawed argument.

Stop asking people "whats up" or "hows it goin", you know you don't give a sh*t. And noone cares how you're doing either.

"We are far less than we knew." - Bright Eyes

GeneticWeapon · Sep 28, 2003

You asked for advice, but didnt take it.
You went ahead and filled the gap between the core and the hsf with AS3 anywayz....and what do you know?....the thing overclocks like a piece of crap....

I help because you suck

Titanion · Sep 28, 2003

If I take the shim off, it is off for good, but if I test it and it does suck, I can still take it off... at least I didn't use thermal adhesive! The GPU really is above the shim, but it does not seem to be level... I am still debating the best course of action. Some people claim their shim is level with their GPU. It doesn't seem like a big deal taking it off, cleaning it up, and measuring it again... I know i will, for I was not left with a good feeling after it was on. And my layer of AS3 is still fairly thin. So I am not done with the asking for or listening to advice part of this, never that...

If I posted tonight that my card was kicking @ss at 400 MHz and posted tomorrow that I needed a new card, then I would suck... no, wait, then I would start building a collection of dead video cards under my desk...

To reign is worth ambition though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heav'n.
John Milton, Paradise Lost, II 262-263

ATI GPU Shim: should it stay or should it go?

Distinguished

Splendid

Distinguished

Distinguished

Illustrious

Distinguished

Illustrious

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Illustrious

Splendid

Champion

Champion

Distinguished

Splendid

Illustrious

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Splendid

Distinguished

Share this page