Should I change it...MSI FX5600 256MB ?

Supersteve54

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I just bought an MSI FX5600 256MB card and having now searched about on the net realise that this maybe wasn't such a great choice. I paid NT$5600 in Taiwan 'bout US$160 at the current exchange rate, and this seems very high compared to what I could get it for online. Anyway, I can exchange the card for something of similar cost or higher at the store within 7 days. Does anyone have anything positive to say about this card? Anyone have any suggestions for a better card at about the same or slightly higher cost? I'm using it for games - flight simulators/americas army/Operation Flashpoint etc. My present MB only supports 4X AGP, but I'm upgrading very soon. While the card seems to perform OK even at 4X, will I see a dramatic increase at 8X AGP? Are ATI cards at a similar cost dramatically better? Any help apreciated, I've 3 days left to make a decision!
 

cleeve

Illustrious
The Ati 9600 PRO is dramatically better and should be about the same price.

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Radeon 9500 (hardmodded to PRO, o/c to 322/322)
AMD AthlonXP 2400+ (o/c to 2600+ with 143 fsb)
3dMark03: 4055
 
And an FX5600Ultra with less memory (128mb) will perform much better. So will and R9600Pro which will perform better than both. And if you feel frisky, then the FX5700U and R9600XT are much better choices and worth a SMALL price bump over an R9600Pro. IF you have to stick with MSI then try to get an FX5600<b>Ultra</b> VTD-128 Revision 2, or an FX5700<b>Ultra</b>.

<A HREF="http://www.hardwarezone.com/articles/articles.hwz?cid=3&aid=865" target="_new">Here's a review of the MSI FX5600Ultra VTD-128</A>
<A HREF="http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/gffx/gffx-24.html" target="_new">Here's the difference between Revision 1 and 2</A>

So if you can, get an R9600PRO/XT or FX5700U, but if you are stuck, or if the only money-viable option is an MSI and an FX5600U at that, then try and make sure it's a revision 2 with the 400mhz core (often they are not named differently which is sneaky).

<b>EDIT:</b> Dang, you Cleeve I spent all that time writing that (and grabbing/finding the links) and you snuk in ahead of me! Dang! No Ditto This time at least! :wink:

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <b>RED GREEN</b> GA to SK :evil:

<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/" target="_new">-NEW PIC IN THGC ALBUM-</A><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by TheGreatGrapeApe on 11/28/03 07:21 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
 

cleeve

Illustrious
Heheh, being succinct has it's advantages.

I figure, why bother to justify my opinion when noobs blindly take the advice anyway? ;)

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Radeon 9500 (hardmodded to PRO, o/c to 322/322)
AMD AthlonXP 2400+ (o/c to 2600+ with 143 fsb)
3dMark03: 4055
 
LOL!

Ah... Pure Genius! - Homer

EDIT: Oh yeah, didn't work in <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=378498#378498" target="_new">THIS thread</A>. I tried to be brief, and then got unwanted 'input'.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <b>RED GREEN</b> GA to SK :evil:

<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/" target="_new">-NEW PIC IN THGC ALBUM-</A><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by TheGreatGrapeApe on 11/28/03 09:25 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
 

Supersteve54

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Hey, thanks for the fast replies! Although I see it's daytime with you guys! I'll take it back tomorrow, as far as I can see from the purchase receipt there's not onus to stick with the same brand or model, 'though I don't read Chinese too well :>. Looks like an ATI will be finding a new home :) Thanks for the links, checking them out now...should have done that befoe I bought it...but you know how pretty they look in the store and 256mb screaming at you from the box...worst thing is the Best Of Toms 2003 big sticker on the box (with small print referring to the VTDR128 :\), oh well that's what brought me to this site and help from you guys...thanks again....I'll update you with the (hopefully) good news when I exchange it!
 

coolsquirtle

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YAY! another Taiwanse in the forum! i'm not alone. Hey dude last time i check in NOVA u can get a R9600pro for about 6200$NTD which i guess is a bit more. Go argue and try to get a FX5600Ultra or 5700Ultra, pay the extra money if u have to

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy
FX5700Ultra, the next Ti4200? seems so
 
Yeah unfortunately that recommendation for BEST OF/ Editor's Choice is very dated. Even the Author Lars/Borsti said he should update it (hasn't happened yet though).

Good luck with your next purchase.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <b>RED GREEN</b> GA to SK :evil:

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Supersteve54

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Well I got back to the store and they have no problem exchanging the card! Good news indeed. Having spent the last half day checking prices in various stores and trawling the net for reviews the 9600 is the new target, I think the XT is probably the best bet, although the pro is very close and a little cheaper. Next big headache is which board maker to go with.Powercolor are the cheapest, putting even the 9800np almost within reach, though their customer support and quality seem questionable, got excited by their 256mb version, then noticed the mem speed is crap, plus their website is down. Gigabyte and Elsa's prices seem pretty good, anyone have any comments on them? Price of an ATI made card is ridiculous here, so have to give that a miss. Leaves the ASUS 9600Pro/XT as probably the best choice. It's a little more expensive than the others, but it does have video in, Samsung 2.8ns mem and I think their quality and customer support is pretty much guaranteed. Only problem is I have to order it and wait 3 days :<. Any comments...Asus worth the extra money over Gigabyte? XT versus Pro?
 
Asus is a GREAT Mfr (proabbly my next card in '04).

Gigabyte make a nice R9600Pro board, but it sometimes has slow memory, here's a few reviews (most with the 2.86ns memory);

Gigabyte:

<A HREF="http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews/9600/" target="_new">http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews/9600/</A>
<A HREF="http://www.hardavenue.com/reviews/gb9600pro1.shtml" target="_new">http://www.hardavenue.com/reviews/gb9600pro1.shtml</A>
<A HREF="http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/gig-9600pro_2.html" target="_new">http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/gig-9600pro_2.html</A>
<A HREF="http://www.tweaktown.com/document.php?dType=review&dId=518" target="_new">http://www.tweaktown.com/document.php?dType=review&dId=518</A>

Two of the best Asus R9600XT reviews IMO:

<A HREF="http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/radeon/asus-ati.html" target="_new">http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/radeon/asus-ati.html</A>
<A HREF="http://www.beyond3d.com/reviews/ati/rv360/" target="_new">http://www.beyond3d.com/reviews/ati/rv360/</A>

And XT isn't necessarily worth ALOT of extra money, just a bit of extra money. If you plan on overclocking at all then the ASUS will be far superior. If you also plan on buying HL2, if this card comes with a free copy it makes the prices closer.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil:

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Supersteve54

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Once again thanks to TheGreatGrapeApe (the story behind that name must be fantastic) for some very good links...I think my search is finally over, just awaiting a final phone call tomorrow.....If I spent as much time on research at work as I have on this I reckon I'd be CEO by now! Whilst choice is always a good thing, too much is just a brainache...for instance now that powercolors website is back up, they seem to be producing 3 (yes 3!) vesions of the 9600XT so due to the fact that I don't even want to think about what their differences are I blocking them out completely before my brain shuts down and I go back to using my Atari 800XL. The store I bought the card in will swap it for anything I can find in the mall they're located in and will generally match prices, a trip around the mall dug up these....

Powercolor 9600XT......7000NT (205US) god only knows what version
Powercolor 9600Pro.....5750 (168) as above

Elsa 9600XT............7000 (205)...nice ram heatsinks
Elsa 9600Pro...........6150 (180)

Gigabyte 9600Pro.......6200 (181)...Reviews say solid build...store assistant laughed at it...in light of her 'advice' and thinking of the warantee, discounting this one even though it's cheap.

Asus 9600XT............8000 (234)...This is the price quoted at the original store and they don't have it in stock....www.senfu.com is in the same mall and list it at 7300NT (213US) which seems a moe realistic price and that's what I'll push for in the call tomorrow. I think I'll still take it at 234US if they don't move, as TGGA points out, Asus are a solid Mfr and trustworthy on RAM specs etc., it's also got a cool heatsink, video in, and HL2 coupon (although it'll be interesting to see how that works in Taiwan). The guy selling the P.C.'s and Elsa's advised against it as he claims it's outside Ati's reference design, but I don't see any mention in reviews and the Powercolors he was selling are hardly conforming to the reference. At 234US it's 54US more than the cheapest Pro (excluding P.C.), at 213 it's just 33US more, which I think is more than acceptable considering the extras.
Sorry for the long post, but it may be of use to someone else in Taiwan or elsewhere, I've ended up spending more than the original 5600 (164US) for the FX5600, but as it was a bit of a donkey the extra money will be well spent. Thanks again to all, hopefully will have the card in hand in a day or two!
 
Gigabyte does make a nice piece of work, but it's not a storied name like Hercules or ASUS or Sapphire (which gets too much respect for it's basic cards if you ask me), It's 'OK'but not something people say is AWESOME. As for Powercolor, it is notoriously poor quality. They do have an R9600XT that is interesting, it's the BRAVO edition, which is overclocked a HUGE amount, likely has very fast memory (like 2.5ns Samsung or 2.2ns Hynix), but they have too many issues to recommend. But yes Powercolor is notorious for nor conforming to spec. The sell underclocked cards, and poorly named cards (for 4+ months they called their R9700non-pro a PRO [later renamed it to R9700GOLD]), they often use cheaper memory as well. Eve review site have gotten strange cards. Take a look at the overclocking section of <A HREF="http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDgzLDI=" target="_new">THIS review</A>.

In any case, the problem with CHEAP R9600Pros is that often they aren't REAL R9600Pro, they just have that in their name. Like the GigaPuke err GigaCube (now GeXcube) line whihc has 'Pro'(s) that are really just slightly different non-pros which will never come anywhere near REAL Pro performance. So usually cheap means you have to do alot more work to be sure of what you are getting. Also a good warranty (no hassle return policy type of one) is a good idea for those.

The ASUS does add alot of features and is very attractive, but if you won't be using VIVO and such, then the extra may not be worth it. The HL2 coupon should be good (it's an online activation code, so it should work from anywhere in the world I would think).

In any case, like I said originally, if you want to stay close to your original investment, then the Gigabyte is a GOOD choice. It's pretty solid, and the company has always done me right by my MOBO choices (they have contacted retailers for me an arranged replacements within 3 hrs of my e-mailing them). Not sure if that extendeds to the same support for Video Cards.

The ASUS is a great choice, but more expensive. The rebate of the HL2 coupon is nice. But seriously, the R9600XT is NOT SIGNIFICANTLY better than the R9600Pro. $50US difference, yeah, for that you better want all the extras. The performance increase is there and MAY let you play one or two more titles than the R9600Pro, but I doubt that. It's like the Porsche 911 series. Do you wants the Screaming fast Carrera 4s (aka C4s) for $150K or do you want to spend an Extra $25K for the Turbo? They are both awesome and Screamin' fast. The Turbo just gives you a little extra. But likely the C4s is more than enough car, and likely beyond 90% of turbo owners needs anyways. Sometimes we just want the best, even though it's no really a wise choice. You really need to lopk at what you need/want. Temp monitoring, COOL granted, VIVO nice if you want to watch/record TV on your PC, a little extra overclocking headroom, also nice. But will all this matter that much? That's up to you, you have gone from ~$165 to ~$235 ($70) and that's not 'cheap', especially since you're already paying a premium over US prices in the US and Canada.

Now, not to colour your decision, just throwing this out there. What would I take, I would take the ASUS, but then again, I'm looking for features more than prices (I WILL look for the best deals on the ONE I choose). The ASUS has what I like, but most people will be more than happy with a powercolor that meets the basic R9600PRo spec. My next card will be an ASUS (unless ATI offers something special that they didn't with the XTs).

Anywhoo as always that's just my view from here.

FYI, I have a Built By ATI R9600Pro and I'm very happy with it.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil:

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LOL!

We shall see if that 2.2ns memory helps you. :evil:


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil:

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Supersteve54

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Well I just got a call that my card has arrived, back from the store now, haven't had a chance to install it yet, might do a windows re-install just to clear out the old nVidia drivers. On first impressions I am VERY impressed with the package! Very sexy card with that heatsink, build quality looks solid, I like the vivo port, solid piece of kit, CD case is a nice idea and the manuals look good. On appearance alone it's definitely worth the extra money! I am very glad to have traded in the FX5600 for it, and that's without having tried it yet! Thanks again for all the advice and time you guys spent helping me, much appreciated. I see several other posts on here about changing FX5600 for 9600XT, I'm sure nVidia must be feeling some pain. Once I get the card up and running I'll pitch in and take some of the burden of answering queries off you guys! Thanks again all!
 
Hey no problem, and the idea of paying it forward is a good one that alot of people here work by. I received some good info here when I started out, so I try to supply it too. Of course we also like to bust people's Ba11$ every once in a while, but that's to be expected too. :evil:

Yeah let us know how it goes. And as usual if you've got problems we'll still be here. :wink:

A fresh install of XP is a good idea if it's not too mcuh of a problem, but using Detonator RIP also helps if you don't want to go through the whole hassle. Although a fresh start is usually the best idea.

Good Luck!


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil:

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