Looking for Card under $150

tylerbc · Dec 8, 2003

Hey folks. I'm in the market for a new graphics card for my Compaq s3000nx (512 PC2100 RAM, 1.6 Ghz AMD). I don't do any gaming but the onboard graphics is crappy and slow for movies and stuff. I'm also planning on geting into doing some digital video editing with Adobe Premier. I'd like to get a card with this in mind. So my uses are: Internet/Word processing/Watching DIVX, AVI movies/Video Editing. Would I be able to get a sufficient card under $150? I'd also like to be able to run my video card out to my TV.
If possible I'd like something thats easy to install. I've installed ram and PCi cards before but I'm far from being a computer whiz. THanks so much!

daddywags214 · Dec 8, 2003

I'd say shoot for something basic like an ATi Radeon 9000, which will suffice your needs

AMD 2500+, 1gb DDR333, Radeon 9800 Pro, Audigy 2. Yummy...

cleeve · Dec 8, 2003

Radeons have awesome TV out.

Get yourself a nice Radeon 7500 if you don't play any games. If you want to play good games now and again, go for the 9600 PRO.

Both cards have excellent 2d and TV output. The 9600 PRO has better 3d capabilities. And like Daddywags said, the 9000 is decent too, with 3d capabilities between the 7500 and 9600 PRO.

All video cards are very easy to install. Just plug it in to the AGP port like a PCI card!
________________
Radeon 9500 PRO (hardmodded 9500, o/c 322/322)
AthlonXP 2600+ (o/c 2400+ w/143Mhz fsb)
3dMark03: 4,055

tombance · Dec 8, 2003

I would get the Radeon 9600 Pro just for the Video Editing raw power. You might as well get the best you can in that budget, which would be a Radeon 9600 Pro (even possible an XT).

<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=6752830" target="_new">Yay, I Finally broke the 12k barrier!!</A>

mrface · Dec 9, 2003

yeah definitely the 9600pro you can get them for under 150

<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Apostalic Alcoholic.}=-</A>

Spitfire_x86 · Dec 9, 2003

Get a Radeon 9600 PRO

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TheGreatGrapeApe · Dec 9, 2003

Is that $150 US?

If so I would recommend the Matrox P650 it's ($169 $19 over your budget) from their site, but it's likely cheaper at an e-tailer (<A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=48&manufactory=1291&DEPA=1&sortby=14&order=1" target="_new">NewEgg has it for $159</A>). Even for that $19 more it would be the very best card for your needs.

Here's Matrox's Info/US Price;

<A HREF="http://shopmatrox.com/usa/products/datasheet.asp?ID=428" target="_new">http://shopmatrox.com/usa/products/datasheet.asp?ID=428</A>

Now with slightly older technology you could get the G450 ($88 from NewEgg) or the G550 ($103), which also have great 2D quality (although at this level the Radeon 9XXX series of cards is VERY close). These cards also have unparalleled TV-out quality. Their only shortcoming is their 3D gaming performance, which you aren't looking for. They are as easy to install as any nV or ATI card, and usually sometimes have a few less issues because they aren't oriented at breakneck gaming tweaks.

For your needs a Matrox solution is the very best card you could hope for, this is what they do well. I would strongly recommend the P650 if you can get it as it has more modern features, better RAMDACs (very important to 2D quality [especially at hi-res.]). If $159 is a little more then you can spend then the others are ok. The P650 also offers 16X AA on regular text in applications like Word and IE. Quite a nice feature if you want your text and images to look it's best.

Otherwise I would recommend a cheap R9600(non-pro or even SE in this case). An R9000/9100/9200 would likely also meet your needs. There is one nice ATI advantage in the DIVX watching category, and that is Fullstream video-smoothing. There is an ATI-specific addition to the latest DIVX player (last 4 releases I think) that uses the pixel-shader engine to smooth out jaggies in Divx video. It's a nice feature, but doesn't add much to the 'editing' part of the equation.

For nV I would think an FX5200non-ultra or Fx5600non-ultra would be fine, but I would go from Matrox to ATI to nV in my recommendation for a 2D+TV-out card.

As always that's just my two frames worth.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

-NEW PIC IN THGC ALBUM-

TheGreatGrapeApe · Dec 9, 2003

An R9600(pro) would have negligeable diff. over an R9100 for video editing. It 'might' show some rendered scenes or added effects quicker in a preview window, but I doubt it would even make much difference. It's as big a difference in 2D apps.

If he was doing 3D animation or effects, then it'd make a noticeable difference, but otherwise it will likely perform very closely to an R9100 or R9600SE.

An XT is definitely a wasted effort in this case IMO.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

-NEW PIC IN THGC ALBUM-

Vapor · Dec 9, 2003

I second the entire Matrox notion.

As for G550 vs G450, there is no difference, the G550 has DVI output while the 450 does not, that's all.

A cheap 9XXX would also suit his needs, but if he can afford the extra 9 for the Matrox, he should get it. However, I agree that ATi's Fullstream is nice...

I think I'm going to throw up.

GeneticWeapon · Dec 9, 2003

He forgot to mention his PC has no AGP slot....

Play MotoGP 2
<A HREF="http://us.f1f.yahoofs.com/bc/3f8c6371_13d5d/bc/My+Documents/Misc./Moto1.jpg?BCPbQ1_AN7ObvsBt" target="_new">http://us.f1f.yahoofs.com/bc/3f8c6371_13d5d/bc/My+Documents/Misc./Moto1.jpg?BCPbQ1_AN7ObvsBt</A>

TheGreatGrapeApe · Dec 9, 2003

Oh if that's the case, Matrox is still an option with the G450, but for ATI the R9600 definitely is not.

Hmm, PCI really makes it difficult. The ATI R9000/9200 and 9100 all have PCI variants whihc would be good. I know that the FX 5200 and 5600 have PCI variants too.

I'm not sure about the pricing though.

With the limit of PCI I think it's a toss-up between the features and benifits of the Matrox and ATI cards. The ATI does have slightly higher RAMDACs which would be useful for large res. 2D. The FXs would add some DX9 support, although it would be for very limited use.
Most people still prefer the IQ of the ATIs over the nV. But I have never seen a serious PCI review that made the effort for image comparison.
The advantage of the Matrox's P series 16X AA on all 2D stuff is lost I believe. But still great 2D and TV out (no TV in without AGP or an add-in though). Of course he could go with the HR256, but I think that's a little over budget.

Anywhoo, I'd say when stuck with just PCI. The cheapest R9XXX he could get would be ok, as would the Matrox G450. And even the FXs wouldn't be bad, but may be expensive for that kind of 'option', and the image quality would be equal at best IMO.

As always, just my view from here.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

-NEW PIC IN THGC ALBUM-

cleeve · Dec 9, 2003

Oh I just remembered!

If you're using the new Adobe Premiere PRO, a fast 3d card helps with real-time previews, so the 9600 PRO becomes the obvious choice.... but if you're limited to a PCI slot, hmmm... maybe you can find a 9600SE PCI? I'm sure you could find a PCI 8500/9000/9100/9200...

In older versions of Premiere, it doesn't matter if the card is 3d capable or not, it won't make any difference when video editing.

________________
Radeon 9500 PRO (hardmodded 9500, o/c 322/322)
AthlonXP 2600+ (o/c 2400+ w/143Mhz fsb)
3dMark03: 4,055

TheGreatGrapeApe · Dec 10, 2003

Yeah I mentioned that, but I'm still not sure what the overall effect would be of an R9600(pro or non) over an R9100np/9200Pro (especially jammed into/restricted by a PCI slot). I still haven't seen any benchies (don't know if you could do one very well/easily with a preview screen. Likely that kind of review will be an impression thing, and I've not seen enough reviews out there yet.

I'm thinking the R9100 would do a much better job than an R7000 or less, but would it make much of a difference once the minimum strength is attained?

As for the R9600SE, I haven't seen any yet, but I'm sure there's something on it's way (I know of R300 chips on PCI boards, but those are for professional uses [like Simulators and display walls, and they cost a fortune])

Considering the 4X/8X (08.v/1.5v) limit of the R9600, there may be voltage issues as well for the (3.3v/5v) PCI slot. Although I'm sure they could do a work around on the board (but likely at a large cost). An R9800 SE series card would likely make more sense to release as a PCI variant.

Also considering <A HREF="http://www.sudhian.com/showdocs.cfm?aid=445" target="_new">this recent review</A> (by Dan Akroyd it seems) the FX5600 doesn't offer much advantage over the other cards, almost always loses to the 9100 at higher res.
Of course it has an 3Dmk03 advnatage, but that's for obvious reasons, and I would highly doubt that there would be any DX9 advantage needed for Premiere.

Anywhoo, that's just my take on it.

EDIT; And the increase in cost of an R9600 or FX5600 PCI would likely be high enough to be better off buying a new mobo/cpu/memory.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

-NEW PIC IN THGC ALBUM-Edited by TheGreatGrapeApe on 12/09/03 04:16 PM.

kinney · Dec 10, 2003

I ordered a Gainward 4200 GF4 for $80 shipped.
The ATI dont have as good driver support and the 4200 matches the 9600Pro in many benchmarks.
Later I'd recommend moving to a faster one, but only once you upgrade your entire system (faster processor, more mem).
Good luck

----
I just tell it like it is and some can't handle it. If your experience is different, well congratu-fukulation.
I’M NOT A ATI FANBOY, I’M NOT A NV FANBOY, I’M A STABILITY FANBOY

tylerbc · Dec 10, 2003

This computer does have a 4X AGP slot.
So would something like a 9200PRO be sufficient? I don't wanna waste money if I'm not gonna use the extra power. I don't intend on playing 3d games at all. Let me know what the consensus is. Thanks everyone for all your input.

Spitfire_x86 · Dec 10, 2003

If you don't use it for gaming, then get a Radeon 9200 (not "SE").

AGP 8x cards will work fine in AGP 4x slot. AGP 8x has no performance advantage over AGP 4x

Since last year, ATI has better driver support than nVidia

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TheGreatGrapeApe · Dec 10, 2003

IF you have AGP, then Matrox gives you the very best 2D and TV image quality bar none. Nearby would be the ATIs.

See what nV News ( decidely nVidia-centric site) had to say about their image quality in their Parhelia review.

<A HREF="http://www.nvnews.net/reviews/matrox_parhelia/page_3.shtml" target="_new">http://www.nvnews.net/reviews/matrox_parhelia/page_3.shtml</A>

The ATI Radeon 9000/9100/9200series has some nice features, and if you want good 2D (2nd place) and good tv support then they are a good cheaper choice and would likely offer you most of the features you would need (except DX9 of course which isn't liekly to give you much more). The R9600SE might also be a consideration if you can get one for fairly cheap (I've seen them listed for less than $90 US.), and they will give you those nice little extras. Plus like I said above Fullstream is nice.

The Geforce4 series has much slower Ramdacs and notoriously poor image quality compared to the cometition. If you are going with an nV you should go ith at least an FX5200, as they have much improved image quality, 40-bit colour (10 per channel) and 400mhz ramdacs just like the Matrox(s) and ATIs. The FX5200Ultra would be a waste of money IMO, so either an FX5200non-ultra or an FX5600non-ultra (even the 64-bit XT/SE/LX versions) would be ok choices.

So if you are willing to pay the slight premium you can get one best video/photo editing cards out there, or for a nice savings you can get some very nice cards. If you aren't anal about your image quality then your likely wouldn't notice the difference.

All three card makers have good support and very few issues in 2D apps other than just their image quality comparisons.

IF you are considering an LCD monitor you may wanna take a glimpse at this extremetech article about DVI component quality on some cards. You will find some of the same chips/cards made by diff. mfrs have diff. quality parts sometimes. If you are running a CRT it won't matter much except if you add a second montior on that DVI port.

<A HREF="http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,1370516,00.asp" target="_new">http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,1370516,00.asp</A>

Once again that's just my view on it.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

-NEW PIC IN THGC ALBUM-

kinney · Dec 10, 2003

Yeah either 4200 or the 9200...

----
I just tell it like it is and some can't handle it. If your experience is different, well congratu-fukulation.
I’M NOT A ATI FANBOY, I’M NOT A NV FANBOY, I’M A STABILITY FANBOY

kinney · Dec 11, 2003

Since last year, ATI has better driver support than nVidia

What?!
What grounds are you basing that one on?
Just because ATI overtook NV (in public opinion, which is fickle and a judge of NOTHING...) and while 95% of THIS forum uses them, and their driver support got to the point of bearable doesnt mean they are superior.

I used the cat 3.8s and they were a terrible release, for many others also.
Cat 3.9s were nothing to write home about either.
Many ppl still stick with the cat3.4/3.5s because they've had problems with the 3.7 and up..

I'm going to pull out my NVCannon and blast some of you blatant fanboys.

----
I just tell it like it is and some can't handle it. If your experience is different, well congratu-fukulation.
I’M NOT A ATI FANBOY, I’M NOT A NV FANBOY, I’M A STABILITY FANBOY

TheGreatGrapeApe · Dec 11, 2003

Just be sure that cannon doesn't backfire and take out the biggest Fanboi in the forum.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internet account) ! - RED GREEN GA to SK :evil:

-NEW PIC IN THGC ALBUM-

kinney · Dec 11, 2003

Thats what you may think about me...

all I can say is that if thats true, then-
my only equal would most definitely be YOU. :lol:

----
I just tell it like it is and some can't handle it. If your experience is different, well congratu-fukulation.
I’M NOT A ATI FANBOY, I’M NOT A NV FANBOY, I’M A STABILITY FANBOY

Looking for Card under $150

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