Nvidia NV40 specifications confirmed

<A HREF="http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=14373" target="_new">Full 16 pipelines for NV40</A> says the "gospel" Inquirer :wink: , which predicts NVidia 'ownage'.

What do people think?I wonder how quickly this can descend into fanboy zealotry!

(I am quite happy with my new bargain 9800 Pro by the way :smile: )

no matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd. :]
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More about nvidia nv40 specifications confirmed
  1. I predict a lot of no-name PSU Ownage with that thing installed. I wonder if Nvidia have learnt their lesson, or are we going to see another leaf blower?

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  2. They are currently in talks with a company which manufactures machines for sandblasting the black soot from vehicle pollution off city buildings.

    no matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd. :]
  3. I predict that we'll find out which card is better when the cards are actually released.

    Kudos and good luck to both Ati and Nvidia in this round.
    STRENGTH OF TECHNOLOGY THROUGH COMPETITION!

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  4. Will we though?Granted,we'll be more able to make an educated evaluation but it's always very subjective, even when the cards have been out a while.
    As you say though, it's definitely very good for the consumer if both companies can make a good showing in the next round.We don't want ATI to start resting on it's dx9.0 laurels.

    no matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd. :]
  5. Honestly, I don't think it's all that subjective. I think some people feel the need to MAKE it subjective, because they feel some kind of loyalty to a particular brand.

    Geforce2 Ultra VS Radeon DDR? Geforce2 tech was the clear winner. Who would argue with that?

    Radeon 8500 VS. Geforce4 Ti? Geforce4 Ti is the clear winner, once again. Who disagrees?

    Radeon 9800XT vs GeforceFX 5950? I mean, look at the AA quality and shader power. The 9800XT runs away with this one, I don't even see how a person could argue in favor of the 5950 in good conscience.

    But for some reason, Nvidiots feel some bizarre need to pretend that their beloved video card company is infallable.

    Just why is that?

    The next round will go to whoever has the best technology. Nvidia or Ati, and to the victor will go the spoils. But I'm not going to bet on either one until production versions of both cards have been in everyone's hands.

    ________________
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  6. I can't argue with that.Indeed it <i>shouldn't</i> be subjective but until there is unanimous acceptance of one or other technology as superior it always will be.
    Quote:
    The next round will go to whoever has the best technology.

    I wish it were that simple.That dirty word 'marketing' has a large role to play, especially amongst the vast hordes who really cannot understand technical specifications, let alone their implications.I think the existence of such cards as the 256MB Radeon 9200SE says a lot about the state of the industry!

    no matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd. :]<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by ad_rach on 02/26/04 12:46 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
  7. True enough. I guess "the next round goes to whoever has the best technology" only applies to objective hardware entheusiasts.

    Marketers have allowed the 9200SE and 64-bit 5200 to exist and thrive in a world that should have no place for them.

    ________________
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  8. Quote:
    I guess "the next round goes to whoever has the best technology" only applies to objective hardware entheusiasts.

    Yep.The 'enthusiast' segment which we occupy is a tiny enough minority as it is and it becomes even more pitiful when you sieve it in an attempt to find the 'objective' ones! :smile:


    no matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd. :]
  9. Well I'm looking forward to it, I don't care who makes the fastest card as long as I can afford it, ATI, Nvidia...I've owned em all, but as you say, the last thing I need in my case is a leaf blower.

    Gary

    ....................
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  10. Anyone know if DX9 games can use 16 pipes to full potential?

    <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=7584476" target="_new"> My rig </A>
  11. I have no idea, but lets face it, the more bandwith the better. Thats what chokes the 9600XT and prob a few other cards as well.

    Gary

    ....................
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  12. I'll believe everything when I see it, but I always look for whatever rumour there is. I hope both are competitive, it's interesting that 3Dcentre says the R420 will likely be 8x2, and now the Inquirer says the nV40 will be 16x1, which is completely the opposite of early views on the two cards. Flip-flop is common and until I see it properly benched with IQ shots, I don't trust anything.

    Ownage? Far too early to claim that, I think nV learned that from their experience with the NV30.


    - You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil:
  13. ROFL, watch them all come running back.
    Besides you. You'll never buy NV.

    Quote:
    ATi are now hoping, at best for a close fight…

    NV40 0wnage of ATi R420 coming soon to a store near you?

    We sure think so


    Ouch.
    Better hope and pray, cuz its looking likely to go back to pre-R300 days for the ATI devotees.

    I find it funny how this forum far misjudges and downplays NVIDIA and their capabilities.
    Get ready to eat cake.

    ----
    RESIDENT FORUM WARRIOR
    Support the terrorists, vote democrat
    NV/AMD/IBM axis of evil team leader
    Who cares about HL2/D3 when we have Call of Duty today!!
  14. Nvidia may have the capabilities to out run ATi, but i question their management ability when the competition gets tough.

    Asus A7N8X Deluxe, Xp 2500+(3200+), 512MB RAM, HIS Radeon 9500Pro
  15. I'd completely disagree.
    I think its the other way around.

    ATI got lucky, they aquired ArtX and that technology has lasted for some time now.

    Its starting to wear thin.

    Meanwhile NV had a lackluster product, mainly due to not being inferior.. but not conforming to DX standards as well as ATIs.

    The track record of both companies shows ATI not managing well.

    When the competition gets tough, NV gets going... look at the 2nd half of last year.. no one denys NV stepped up to the plate hardcore.

    5700Ultras, 5900XT/SE/NU, 5950Ultra.
    Good stuff. From the midrange down (although many are too slow reacting to realize it) NV was supreme.
    Only marginally beaten in the upper end.
    So anyway, my theory. ATI seems to run out of smarts, and ability usually and NV doesnt... I'm sure you remember their meteoric rise into the market.

    It was one of the highest rising stocks in the industry.
    They are simply ATIs ultimate challenge and believe me, ATI does not underestimate them.
    They do their best to compete against NV.

    ----
    RESIDENT FORUM WARRIOR
    Support the terrorists, vote democrat
    NV/AMD/IBM axis of evil team leader
    Who cares about HL2/D3 when we have Call of Duty today!!
  16. The biggest disappointment I have with NV is their cheap and blatently obvious marketing schemes.

    <font color=blue>_____________________________________</font color=blue>
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  17. Understandable. But little reason to hate NV, or forgo their products IMO.
    Marketings half the battle, ask intel.

    ----
    RESIDENT FORUM WARRIOR
    Support the terrorists, vote democrat
    NV/AMD/IBM axis of evil team leader
    Who cares about HL2/D3 when we have Call of Duty today!!
  18. All of the pipes are used, regardless of DirectX version.


    ________________
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  19. Yup, I'm almost tired of the hype. I love reading any new news, but really want the full,in-depth, hands-on, comparisons. Bring on the benchies.

    ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
  20. If I was a betting man I would bet that Nvidia would release a pathetic product and market it as a 5400XT, and then a noisy mediocre product that runs dx9 really fast in 8 bit graphics as the 6000XT. They'll market them both like crazy.

    But I'm not a betting man.

    <font color=red>_________________________________________</font color=red>
    <b><A HREF="http://kevan.org/brain.cgi?dhlucke" target="_new">I am watching you!</A></b>
  21. The famous "leafblower", other wise known as the FX5800 Ultra, gets far to much bashing in my opinion. As it happens the FX5800 Ultra still has the highest fill rates, both pixel and texel fill rates, among all of Nvidia's video cards to date. The only thing that held the 5800 back was its limited memory bandwidth due to the 128bit memory. If it had been given a 256bit memory bandwidth it would be faster and better in every way compared to the FX5950 Ultra, performance wise.

    <font color=blue>_____________________________________</font color=blue>
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  22. ifa, woulda, shoulda

    It sucked!!!!!!! Plain and simple!!!!!!!

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  23. and if a TNT2 had 8 pipes, faster ram and GPU it would be a 5950 ultra......

    ....................
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    ....................
  24. NV's sudden rise was greatly helped by 3DFX's self destruction. 3DFX wanted to make cards by themselve which backfired and at same time Nvidia stunt them with TNT2/geforce.

    Nvidia never really had a real competition till ATi released R300 anyway. Their respond was pretty obvious, the leafblower. The next release didn't improve much as well. While 5700ultra is a winner against 9600XT, it is <b>very hard</b> to find due to its monstrous production cost. As for 5900XT/SE/NU, Ape post a link few days back shows that there is no clear winner between them and 9600XT. And don't even talk about high-end, ATi simply spank Nvidia there.(unless u only read Tommy's review...)

    One thing i do agree is that, Nvidia cant offer to screw up again or they will suffer the same fate as 3DFX and the repeat of single chip maker dominance......

    Asus A7N8X Deluxe, Xp 2500+(3200+), 512MB RAM, HIS Radeon 9500Pro
  25. LOL, the soot cleaner eh? :smile:

    <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=7454540" target="_new">Yay, I Finally broke the 12k barrier!!</A>
  26. Quote:
    Besides you. You'll never buy NV.

    LOL!

    Yeah, you know better than that.

    I have my reasons to be sceptical/critical of nV, but if ATI can't pull off reasonably competitive performance then I'll definitely go the nV route (although I do wish I had an XGI [or better still Matrox] option as an alternate). One problem though is that I would be skeptical of initial benchies until all aspects of the PCI-EX bridge versus direct are explored. The problem is I think the cards I'm interested in (PCI-EX) won't hit the stage until a fair bit after the AGP cards (like the R9800Pro-256 came long after the PRO-128.)

    However, whomever wins wins, it's that simple.

    To get a better understanding of my feeling think of it like football or hockey or whatever sport you follow.

    My team didn't make the playoffs last season, but I've decided this past series to favour one team because I like the way they play and their results (no denying the results). As I believe my team is once again going to miss the playoffs this round, I will likely follow/buy whichever one does best. Hey while I'm not worried about price, I'm not wasting my coin simply to avoid having to get a new case badge for my system. I think you're simply being a little defensive of your choice. :tongue:

    Quote:
    Ouch.
    Better hope and pray, cuz its looking likely to go back to pre-R300 days for the ATI devotees.

    I find it funny how this forum far misjudges and downplays NVIDIA and their capabilities.
    Get ready to eat cake.

    Whoa, talk about Cheerleading, the part isn't even out yet! :tongue:

    The Fact is ATI 'won' last round, thus garnered most of the support and glory. Whomever 'wins' the next round will probably get alot of current users from the 'losing' camp. I would tend to think that the majority of people here will follow that treand, however I'm sure there may be some holdouts.
    I might end up being a holdout under two conditions; ATI has close enough performance across the board as to be toe to toe with the nV products (like the R9600XT and FX5700U in DX8 titles) if the difference is 1-2 fps, <i>OR</i> if ATI loses in the AGP performance, but ties/wins in PCI-EX performance, in either scenario I'll stick with ATI for the time being (and see how they handle returning to the underdog/follower position). Otherwise I'll go to nV (though like I said I might wait for the TRUE PCI-EX cards [NV45/43], should the bridge not look like a good idea).

    Whatever else you may think, if you think I'm going to waste my money, then you really haven't heard anything I've said around here about buying the cards that fit people's needs. Also I'm making sure I don't waste my Beer & HO money! :evil:


    - You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil:
  27. LOL, Im just yankin yer chain as usual.

    Pisses me off you dont bite as much anymore.
    :smile:

    About the bridge, I dont really find it a big deal.
    If it makes the card slower than the ATI, then fine its a bad deal :lol: , but if it doesnt impede performance... I dont really care if its a 'true' implementation or not.

    I'm getting a AGP model anyway. I plan on dumping money on the fastest NV40 if it is as great as it sounds.
    I suspect it is going to be, it'll be nice to have a more PO'd NV this round and not let ATI run away with it so easily.

    As long as it means more performance, for a cheaper price.
    I think we have two capable companies in the 'game' finally.
    3dfx was capable but obviously had shortcomings somewhere in the company..

    the others arent worth mentioning IMO. :wink:

    ----
    RESIDENT FORUM WARRIOR
    Support the terrorists, vote democrat
    NV/AMD/IBM axis of evil team leader
    Who cares about HL2/D3 when we have Call of Duty today!!
  28. 16 pipelines mean nothing, if the shaders suck


    modern cards have more than enough fillrate, but i guess this could help nV

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  29. *Disclaimer*



    Kinney will praise Nvidia as if he were sleeping with the CEO. Please, do take his posts with a grain of salt. Example:

    Quote:
    5700Ultras, 5900XT/SE/NU, 5950Ultra.
    Good stuff. From the midrange down (although many are too slow reacting to realize it) NV was supreme.


    .. meanwhile it has been proven that the 9600XT is generally as fast (save for a few nV optimized, like UT2003, and some older games) in current games as the 5700u, and do I really need to explain how it compares in DX9 games?

    sure, if you get the expensive 5700u, you could o/c to 900mhz ram.. but for that much money, you could get a 9800nonpro so whats the point :). midrange ownage, not nearly as you desscribe it

    -------
    <A HREF="http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/you.html" target="_new">please dont click here! </A><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by phial on 02/27/04 11:38 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
  30. indeed.

    _____________
    whompiedompie
  31. The thing is that the bridge won't likely have any effect on anything but the top cards (and thus for me it's no a benifit for future cards they if anything WOULD have issues, and may be a detraction now (depending on optimization for the advanatages of the PCI-EX, but maybe not).

    For the FX5200 and whatever the ATI low end will be (RV370), I doubt it would even come close to affecting it, it would be like 4x vs 8x now, nothing of much consequence.

    Main thing is I hope that the PCI-EX cards offer enough to make me feel comfortable about all my anticipation.


    - You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil:
  32. Man Phial when you're on fire, you make me horny.

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  33. Quote:
    16 pipelines mean nothing, if the shaders suck


    Yeah, 16 pipes will mean nothing. Don't yall remember? Fillrate is SO out, shader power is in!

    Quote:
    modern cards have more than enough fillrate, but i guess this could help nV

    Pfft, the FX5800 Ultra had a lovely huge fillrate (was it 4 or 5000?), and it never helped.
    It's how the shaders work, how optimized they are, how the pipeline is divided that will matter. And for once, at least make longer pipelines, you goddamn companies. Longer pipelines = higher clock speeds. And daym, we're still at 400MHZ lately! Imagine 1GHZ! Sure, they would lose some IPC, but then again, that's only if cards need branch prediction that much. To me it seems they work full time when on load, so I dunno if it's such a problem. I'm not even aware if data dependancy is such a thing for video cards as on CPUs.


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  34. Basically if NVidia can make a leading card again, and show that it can handle high ass temps like the 5950 then i'll buy it.


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    43k mark. 85 dollars went a long way.
  35. fx5800 was hotter. :wink:

    Asus A7N8X Deluxe, Xp 2500+(3200+), 512MB RAM, HIS Radeon 9500Pro
  36. Yeah it would be nicer to have longer pipes (flamethrower can probably add something about that :evil: ).

    One drawback though seems to be performance at those speeds. The PRescott is like 30 stages compared to the Northwood's 20; yet clock for clock the Northwood is currently outperforming. However perhaps we need to see optimizations for that to achieve better results. I can only imagine what a VPU/GPU would achieve with extra stages. The Prescott exceeding 10ghz is very enticing. A VPU even getting 20% of that would be sweet. The thing is that alot of it is also held back by heat generation, hopefully the 0.11 and 0.09 cores will offer some headroom with that respect (although likely they'll crank them to the Nth degree as always.


    - You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil:
  37. Problem is they're going to be twice or thrice the transistor amount of the best desktop CPU out there (either Opteron or Prescott), hence the heat. Plus it must eat a lot of wafers easily, so many costs. 210 million transistors, damn! That's HOT!

    As for stages, theoretically speaking you can't lose IPC over stage increases, but practically speaking it's the opposite, thanks to misses and pipeline bubbles more frequent. I doubt it's as bad on GPUs though. But for Prescott, it must be because its fetching algorithms are not too good or fast enough to recover the misses and bubbles, plus the need for improved branch prediction. If it did work right, it would not have lost IPC. Not when it has SO MANY goddamn improvements in the architecture itself! (1MB L2 cache plus 16K L1 cache and other minor tidbits plus SSE3 (PNI))

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  38. omg lol dude

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  39. He has a point more transistors usually equal more power draw which usually equals more heat output. But with the larger silicon size you increase the surface area thus increase the heat dissapation. In theory the NV40 could be cooler if they dont crank the GPU core beyond 700Mhz (just a guess). Since faster transistors switching always leads to higher heat output.

    But the prescott kinda supports that theory. But well have to wait and see. I personally dont think Nvidia reworked the entire Nv40 specs from the original 8x2 specs that floated around early last year. But hey I'm a Nvidia user I guess in theory they could pull this off.

    Xeon
  40. Go to the OTHER, we can sekz.

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