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Nvidia Offers no Trade??

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May 24, 2004 5:15:39 AM

I wrote this email to Nvidia today. Call me a sap for buying the 5950 Ultra and wasting $500.00, sure...I admit it, the money was burning a hole in my pocket and that card was talkin to me. However, as outlined in this letter...Nvidia has fallen short in a FAR more important category than losing a benchmark war with ATI over and over...

""To Whom it May Concern;

I have been a loyal Nvidia customer since the end of the Monster 3D days. I am at the point now where I may not only NOT purchase another Nvidia product but may in fact refer my customers to your competitor, ATI, as well.

Approximately 4 months ago I purchased a PNY video card with the Nvidia 5950 Ultra chip for the going rate of about $500.00. At the time I purchased this card there was no word of the the new GeForce 6800. I was careful to read everything from "Tom's Hardware" to your page here. After only a month I began to read that a new card, one actually able to compete with the best ATI card, was to be released in May of this year. First, I feel I was duped by Nvidia based on the fact that the 5950 Ultra was hyped as the premier card right up to that point and was demanding TOP dollar, even though it trailed behind the ATI in almost all categories and was widely criticized in the "tech media". Second, your loyal customers deserve better.

ATI has in place a program to compensate their customers that are caught in the awkward position that I have been caught. They will give almost full retail credit to customers who own for example: http://www.ati.com/buy/traderebate/tradeup.html Why is it that they treat their customers with respect and concern whereas Nvidia appears to be more the "take the money and run" company?

Out of the group of people I know, I am the only one left using Nvidia products. Can anyone at your company tell me why that should continue in light of what I have just told you?""


If anyone else is getting shafted here are the email address's for their corp officers, let em know.

ccowan@nvidia.com; bburke@nvidia.com; bdelrizzo@nvidia.com; lschaffzin@nvidia.com; ccole@nvidia.com;dperez@nvidia.com

More about : nvidia offers trade

May 24, 2004 8:44:04 AM

No offense mate, but if you knew the 9800 pro was better, then why buy the 5950? Also there's been talk of the next gen cards for a very long time, its ot like it was a suprise! I do agree on the no trades issue - that is a little dissapointing, but what other makers do it? AMD? Intel? Matrox? No...its not like it's an industry standard.

Again, dont mean to sound harsh, thats just the way I see it.

XP2000, 512 ddr 2700ram, GF4 MX440, XP Pro
May 24, 2004 11:05:19 AM

First of all, you did not waste money on 5950U for a simple reason: While it IS slightly inferior to 9800 series in terms of FPS it can generate it does have more features comparable to AIW cards. I may be wrong, but I don’t think there is a AIW in the 9800 series. So the extra features of 5950 make it comparable to any 9800.

Quote:
ATI has in place a program to compensate their customers that are caught in the awkward position that I have been caught

Second, ATI Trade-up program is a despicable LIE. Use your brain, read the fine print, pull out your calculator and do some math. You will see that participating in ATI’s program will have you spend MORE on the new card because there is no discount while you have to pay for shipping of your old card. Ah, also add to this the headache of filling out forms and going to the post office, packing, etc..

<font color=red>EDIT:</font color=red> I researched the trade-in programs from different vendors, including ATI a few weeks back. ATI was NOT offering any better trade-in deals on ANY of its cards compared to regular prices you would get from www.newegg.com, for example. And while you would generally be getting a slightly better price from newegg (compared to ATI’s trade-up) you would also get free shipping and no headaches related to shipping your old card. <font color=red>End of EDIT</font color=red>

Third, you bought your card from PNY. Unlike ATI, nVIDIA does not sell cards directly at all. You may have chosen your vendor poorly (Who knows, did you check with PNY? Maybe they too have a trade-in program.). If you bought your card from eVGA you would have a chance to trade it in for the new 6800. In fact, eVGA’s trade-in program works better than ATI’s: You send your card back to them within 90 days of the purchase date in its original package in resellable condition + your proof of purchase/receipt indicating how much you paid, and they will send you a new card of your choice priced at its current retail price MINUS the amount on your invoice.

In the end, you cannot blame nVIDIA for your poor timing: They are not obligated to announce upcoming products before they feel they are ready to do so and certainly they were under no obligation to have announced the 6800 six months ago. If you bought your card from eVGA two months ago for $500.00 you would be able to exchange it for the 6800 in June FOR FREE!

<font color=green>"The creative powers of English morphology are pathetic compared to what we find in other languages." (Steven Pinker, The Language Instinct)</font color=green> :cool: <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Slava on 05/24/04 07:19 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
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a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
May 24, 2004 1:22:23 PM

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you did not waste money on 5950U for a simple reason: While it IS slightly inferior to 9800 series in terms of FPS it can generate it does have more features comparable to AIW cards.
Quote:


What? Mind explaining that statement?

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I may be wrong, but I don’t think there is a AIW in the 9800 series.

<A HREF="http://www.ati.com/products/radeon9800/aiw9800pro/" target="_new">Yes, definitely wrong on that.</A> <A HREF="http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/radeon/9800-aiw.htm..." target="_new">Saphire's got one too</A> , <A HREF="http://www.hisdigital.com/html/aiw9800pro.htm" target="_new">As does HIS</A>

Pretty funny since you mention that very card in <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">your previous rant</A> about the Trade-up program.

So I'd love to see these features that you are talking about, that aren't Personal Cinema features or features only found in an AIW.

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Second, ATI Trade-up program is a despicable LIE.

<b>WTF</b>!?!?!

"Despicable lie" would better fit the information you provided above.
Seriously, you don't like it, fine don't use it, but none the less it's something offered, not forced, and it's better than no program. IF you are going to buy from ATI anyways, like I did, then you would benifit from the discount (not offered when I ordered my card). Right now NewEgg sells the <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti..." target="_new">X800Pro for $479</A>, even after shipping costs ATI is cheaper, especially since <A HREF="http://www.ati.com/buy/pricespcusa.html" target="_new">ATI's site says $399US</A>. When it will be added to the list of trade-up cards, then you can bitch. Right now NewEgg is $crewing everyone who buys from them, so well done in pointing people there instead of saving them money by buying directly from ATI.

The fact is nothing similar is being offered by nV's OEM-partners, or any other Mfr. Matrox does have a program but it is for their Proffesional line, and it's a much more limited loyalty program.

Quote:
eVGA’s trade-in program works better than ATI’s:

No it doesn't it works differently (if at all). What you are essentially getting is a REFUND, not a trade-in. Try that with a card that's 91+ days old by your description (31 days by theirs), what's your "trade-in" worth now? Surprisingly enough there is NO MENTION of this program you speak of from <A HREF="http://www.evga.com/products/storeterms.asp" target="_new">their site</A>, there is mention of a 30day return policy (shipping not included of course), and that would be exactly the same as the industry standard, even ATI's. The only mention of Trade-in in their search is their <A HREF="http://www.evga.com/tigerdirectoffer/stepup.asp" target="_new">Step-Up program</A> which is exclusive to TigerDirect customers, and that is not within 90 days, but a minimum of 3 months before you can use their program which is not as you describe it. Were you 'wrong' on that too?

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In the end, you cannot blame nVIDIA for your poor timing:

Only thing I'd agree on. Caveat Emptor, be it for ATI's trade-in program (which may not be right for you) or when purchasing something that's obsolete even before you pay for it.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
May 24, 2004 2:01:37 PM

Look, Ape,

First, he is not talking about buying a new card from ATI. He is talking about trading a card in. If he trades his card in for an ATI card he is going to pay the full price.

He says:

Quote:
They (ATI) will give almost full retail credit to customers who own for example

He is confused because the prices quoted in his link are the prices the customer pays, not the amount of credit he gets for his old card. In fact, ATI trade-up program offers no credit whatsoever. It is funny that they ask you to send them some card (whatever card) at your expense and on your time cuz doing so does absolutely nothing for you.

Second, the fact that ATI X800 is currently cheaper than the X800 card from newegg is inconsequential because if he traded his card in for one of the cards <font color=red>currently IN the trade-up program</font color=red> he would LOSE his current card and save ZIP $ + he would spend time and $ on shipping.

Third, by the time X800 is included in the trade-up program it will cost more to get it from ATI through this program than from an online vendor just the way it is with other ATI cards that are currently included in this program.

Quote:
Yes, definitely wrong on that. Saphire's got one too , As does HIS

Okay, I said I did not know for sure. What do you want from me? Just make your correction if you feel like it. Why all the personal attacks in your post?

<font color=red>EDIT:</font color=red> ... it does have more features comparable to AIW cards.

Quote:
What? Mind explaining that statement?

Explaining: To the best of my knowledge, none of the 9800XTs as of 2-3 weeks ago had any AIW features while 5950s do have them. Therefore, IMO, while 5950 crunches out fewer FPS it compensates by offering extra, AIW-like features that 9800XT does not have.

<font color=red>End EDIT</font color=red>

Quote:
So I'd love to see these features that you are talking about, that aren't Personal Cinema features or features only found in an AIW.

I was thinking 9800XT since it is much faster than 5950 while 9800 Pro AIW is closer in performance to 5950. Personally, I don’t think that there is much difference between 5950 and 9800 Pro AIW and the choice between the two is basically a matter of brand preference.

Quote:
Seriously, you don't like it, fine don't use it, but none the less it's something offered, not forced, and it's better than no program.

ATI program is not forced, you are right, but it is designed to fool people into thinking they are getting a great deal while in reality most of the time they end up getting a worse deal than available elsewhere (X800 excluded because it is NOT in the trade-up program.)

Quote:
Try that with a card that's 91+ days old

LOL. Yes, the rules are clear: You have to do it within 90 days of purchase, which is a reasonable term specifically for those who goofed and bought something only to find out the next day that they goofed. So, basically, Crash068’s post is as misguided as it gets because ATI program has nothing to do with helping those who goofed while eVGA’s program, though limited to 90 days only, is there specifically for those you made a mistake when buying the card. Who cares that ATI program is not time limited? You cannot save anything by trading in any card for any of the cards in the trade-up program. But you do get a discount from eVGA on your new card equal to the purchase price of your 90-day old card. Simply put, when I get my 6800 in June I will pay $500-$185= $315 for it.

This is NOT about which line of cards (5950s or 9800s) is better. Everyone knows that 9800s are better though 5950s are not that far behind in performance and/or features. This is about the alleged merits of ATI trade up program vs. nVIDIA partners’ trade-in programs.

I am sure you know very well that ATI program offers no benefit whatsoever and that it only creates an illusion that the company is offering their customers awesome deals across the board. Why are you defending it? As far as I am concerned it is better to offer no program at all than to offer a misleading, illusory one.

<font color=red>EDIT:</font color=red>

Here is the <font color=red>math:</font color=red> If I am an average Joe who does not know that ATI will accept ANY card even if it is a 10-year old 2-meg VESA Local BUS, or if the only card I have to mail to ATI is the one currently in my PC, and I decide "to take advantage" of ATI’s benevolent trade-up program I will have to send my two-month old FX5700U that I bought for $185.00 to ATI hoping to get credit for it. If I had a 9800 Pro purchased in the last couple of months for some $220 I would be sending it instead of the FX5700U, again, hoping to get credit. But there ain't any credit!

In either case my trade-up options are

1. RADEON 9800 XT 256MB AGP for $449.00 USD + a $50 refundable deposit + $15 shipping of the new card + some $10 cost of shipping my old $185 or $220 card for which I get the whole ZERO dollars of credit.

and

2. ALL-IN-WONDER 9800 PRO 128MB AGP $349.00 USD + a $50 refundable deposit + $15 shipping of the new card + some $10 cost of shipping my old $185 or $220 card for which I get the whole ZERO dollars of credit.

At newegg you get

1. ATI AIW RADEON 9800PRO Video Card, 128MB DDR, 256-bit, DVI/CATV/VIVO, 8X AGP, Model "ALL-IN-WONDER 9800 PRO" –RETAIL for $335 + free two-day shipping, no trade in of any kind which means I CAN SELL MY CURRENT CARD ON EBAY!

and

2. POWERCOLOR ATI RADEON 9800XT Video Card, 256MB DDR, 256-bit, DVI/TV-Out, 8X AGP, Model "XR98T-D3" -RETAIL for $405 + free two-day shipping, no trade in of any kind which means I CAN SELL MY CURRENT CARD ON EBAY!

There are many other 9800XT options on newegg and elsewhere and they all cost the same or less than in ATI trade-up program with no hassle and you keep the option of selling your old card to a friend or something.

So tell me, Ape, how can you in good faith criticize me for criticizing ATI’s trade-up program? Of all people YOU?! You who seems to be a bit smarter than the average bear. Or your fanATIcism has impaired your judgment?

<font color=red>End of Edit</font color=red>

<font color=green>"The creative powers of English morphology are pathetic compared to what we find in other languages." (Steven Pinker, The Language Instinct)</font color=green> :cool: <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Slava on 05/24/04 01:59 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
May 24, 2004 8:23:14 PM

I just realized that you flamed me in one more place in your hateful post. No, I am not bumping my thread. I just read your post again hoping to find some merit in it and I had to rub it <font color=red>in your face</font color=red> since you seem to be enjoying doing this to me for no good reason:

Quote:
The only mention of Trade-in in their search is their Step-Up program which is exclusive to TigerDirect customers, and that is not within 90 days, but a minimum of 3 months before you can use their program which is not as you describe it. Were you 'wrong' on that too?

So I say: <A HREF="http://www.evga.com/stepup/" target="_new">Up Yours</A> I bought my card from a fairly unknown <A HREF="http://www.essencompu.com/" target="_new">vendor</A> and I have successfully registered for the eVGA step-up program which works exactly as I <A HREF="http://www.evga.com/stepup/default.asp?switch=2" target="_new">described</A> and an eVGA rep confirmed my registration and eligibility in an email. I don't even know anything about Tiger Direct you mentioned. If the 6800 launches before June 15 I will mail my FX5700U and get the 6800 for $315 or so. If not, I will get a 5950 Ultra and skip X800/6800 generation altogether to get a PCI-Ex solution in about a year.

Again, I suggest you go argue about the taste of Caspian caviar with the ones who actually tried it.

<font color=green>"The creative powers of English morphology are pathetic compared to what we find in other languages." (Steven Pinker, The Language Instinct)</font color=green> :cool:
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
May 25, 2004 2:32:51 AM

I typed a bunch of things, and then just erased it because really, you're backed into a corner and there's no point. I don't even care what you think this was more about pointing out your obvious bias and bogus info more than anything remotely personal.

Your assumptions and misconceptions about the program are simply colouring your statments like "lie", "fool" etc. Yes he's very confused too, but that's not an excuse for you, and leads you to post misinformation IMO. You may have problems with me pointing it out, but I don't think you were too worried when making brash blanket statements like <i>"ATI Trade-up program is a despicable LIE."</i>

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Why all the personal attacks in your post?

Point out ONE personal attack other than using your own words to reply to the above statement. You seem to be reading in more than is there.

Quote:
Explaining: To the best of my knowledge, none of the 9800XTs as of 2-3 weeks ago had any AIW features while 5950s do have them. Therefore, IMO, while 5950 crunches out fewer FPS it compensates by offering extra, AIW-like features that 9800XT does not have.

Explain these AIW features, you still haven't done that yet.
VIVO? HIS and ASUS always had them. Tuner? Not available on their base card, only Available on their Personal Cinema line in which case you arne't comparing equals.

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I am sure you know very well that ATI program offers no benefit whatsoever and that it only creates an illusion that the company is offering their customers awesome deals across the board.

No, I'm sure of the opposite. You're new and obviously haven't even been watching the time when this came out. It wasn't the be all and end all but it DID offer benifit, and may sitll dop so once there are enouh X800s to add it to the list. What will you say if in 2 months time the NewEgg price is $450 and ATI adds it to their list? Your limited experience once again colours your perception and you use that to spread disinformation. Willfully or not. A warning fine, adding inuendo as ulterior motives is simply irresponisble on your part.

Quote:
Why are you defending it? As far as I am concerned it is better to offer no program at all than to offer a misleading, illusory one.

I'm not defending the porgram as a great this, but I am defending it against the FUD and BS you're adding to it. Ask me today if I think most people should use it, my general answer would be 'no', 6 months ago, the snwer would be 'yes', in one or two months that answer may also be 'yes' depending on the offer. But really better question is why do you HATE the program so much you feel the need to attach ulterior motives? Seriously!

Quote:
So tell me, Ape, how can you in good faith criticize me for criticizing ATI’s trade-up program? Of all people YOU?! You who seems to be a bit smarter than the average bear.

Simply put, I don't like the Bush method of attacking things by calling them GOOD or EVIL or assigning arbitrary BS label and motives to things. I' criticizing your methods. Simply put you would have received no reply (except about the AIW features?) had you simply said, "I think it SUX", "I think it's for suckers for what is currently offered", "Don't do it, the program ends up still costing more than other sources" Stuff like that would have been faultless, but you invest so much more in their actions. I would have worded (had I not felt the need to point out this unwarranted attack) along these lines "Unless you're already buying directly from ATI for whatever reason, it's not a good deal, but NEWEGG currently offers better prices even after rebate". And as for buying directly from ATI, even in your sticky you mention;
<i>"Better yet, buy your cards directly from ATI or nVIDIA’s distributor eVGA. Granted, you won’t always get the best deal, but truth be told most people never use all the cute little extra features that come with their cards partly because they often don’t really work all that well."</i>
So for those people it remains a good deal as shipping is still less than the discount. So try to refine your statements.

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Or your fanATIcism has impaired your judgment?

So now with the Personal Attacks, eh! Yeah, I erased my reply but simply put, $crew you nVidiot!


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
May 25, 2004 6:19:15 AM

O.H.M.Y.G.O.D.......... Not that you would care, but I officially remove you from my list of sane posters :evil:  at the THGC. Please, do not respond to my further posts and I will to the same for you. (But, by all means, feel free to flame me for THIS one!) Cease-fire after this one? O.K.?

It is obvious (to me) though that you cannot think straight. Have a nice life and bathe in the glory of being the first and the only one to cross-link posts at various web sites. By all means, do all of us a favor: ALWAYS mention that you have already posted about XYZ. This really helps all the newbies and strangers. Oh, this will surely help you too by boosting your confidence.

Hasta la vista, amigo.

<font color=red>WHO said that common sense was indeed common? Show me the a$$hole and I’ll spit in his face.</font color=red> :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
May 25, 2004 6:40:35 AM

Quote:
Cease-fire after this one? O.K.?

What cease fire AFTER saying your piece?

Seriously you get all worked up about saying it's already been posted, to the point of feeling the need to PM me, but you have no problem maligning companies or people simply because their actions don't meet your high standards. I didn't flame you when you posted about Language Skillz, because I thought, ahh, your new and it's a valliant attempt, but really if you want to be the mod, then the stuff you did above would be out, so don't try and act hollier than thou.

Either way it doesn't matter to me. I'm not sure that being taken off the list of sane posters really matters, if it means I can continue to post counterpoints when you're not being objective so be it. For that right, I'd gladly give up that priviledge. And I'm sure your misinformation is of so much more help to nOObs and strangers than my "It's alreayd been posted here" statements. Sorry to have crushed your fragile ego with what everyone else here takes as a game.

My advice to you, RELAX, or you won't make it past the end of the year.

Truce? Whatever, I'm not gunning for you, I'm simply call it as I see it, and I expect the same from you. If this means locking horns occasionally, so be it.

Either way I don't expect us to change much.

As for the sig nice touch. I could do the same, but I like my sig the way it is.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
May 25, 2004 6:56:16 AM

LOL, d00d, you're messed up. ATI's trade up programe doesn't reimburse you at all for your card. They give you a $50 trade in value on ANY card, be it a 9800XT or an old Cirus Logic ISA. The prices you see are NOT trade in values, but the price the SALES price with the $50 rebate. You don't get $449 trade in for your 9800XT, they CHARGE you $449 for a 9800XT if you send them any old card!

<font color=blue>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to a hero as big as Crashman!</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to an ego as large as Crashman's!</font color=red>
May 25, 2004 7:06:48 AM

Quote:
LOL, d00d, you're messed up. ATI's trade up programe doesn't reimburse you at all for your card. They give you a $50 trade in value on ANY card, be it a 9800XT or an old Cirus Logic ISA. The prices you see are NOT trade in values, but the price the SALES price with the $50 rebate. You don't get $449 trade in for your 9800XT, they CHARGE you $449 for a 9800XT if you send them any old card!

Now, <font color=red>THIS</font color=red> is sane and almost true! (Except for the rebate part because ATI first charges you a $50 security deposit which is refundable contingent on their receipt of an old VGA card from the customer.) I welcome you, man.

<font color=green>"The creative powers of English morphology are pathetic compared to what we find in other languages." (Steven Pinker, The Language Instinct)</font color=green> :cool: <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Slava on 05/25/04 03:13 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
May 25, 2004 9:56:42 AM

Well, I guess I expected most of the posts that I've been reading:)  A couple things (there's no way I can address all 10 posts).

I didn't necessarily believe the 9800 Pro was a better card to start with. I've been buying video cards for for the better part of 13+ years along with all the other hardware of course. If there is one thing that I do swear by is that there are other factors besides benching and money that should determine what is the "better" piece of hardware. Most important is reliability and compatability. Nvidia was a nightmare in the mid 90's with there TNT cards...they would work with some software/games but not others. I along with others stuck 3dfx until they packed up shop...ATI had similiar problems when they began to emerge as a contender for the Vid-Card title. Soooo.. I stayed with what had become the industry standard and rocksolid Nvidia cards. You could prolly infer by my letter that the pendulum is probably swinging the other way once again for me, towards a now solid, stable ATI product.

As far as "Also there's been talk of the next gen cards for a very long time, its ot like it was a suprise!" That's not really a relevant point. Of course there has been "talk" of nextgen cards for a very long time, that is a year round topic for video cards as much as it is for Intel and AMD..it's a never ending "talk". I wasn't stating that I was "surprised" that Nvidia developed the 6800 just pissed that it was within 6 months of the 5950 Ultra which was supposed to hold it's place on the market much longer. The firs mention I can find of the 6800 is in April of this year. That card was kept under wraps as longs as possible in order to peddle their then-current flagship the 5950 Ultra for top dollar. Nvidia has developed a reputation over the years not only for reliability and compatibility but for releasing cards that drastically improved with the continuous release of new drivers. That cycle until now lasted usually around a year or so ..till the next flagship card was unveiled, this one was about 6-8 months.

I read a couple of the posts about the refund being bogus and lots of snickers etc...While it's true that it's not the fat chunk of change a friend led me to believe it's not a laughing matter either. I am still looking for the specific dollar amounts from ATI and will probably just email them for the info. Listen though, bashing a company that is offering you some options, albeit $50 or $200 It looks alot like it's working much like a "core" charge on an car part. So, even if the rebate or whatever is nominal and basically just evens out the price with what the lowest internet retailer is charging then the fact that you are getting a card from the chip manufacturer direct, able to "test drive" it and send it back if you change your mind and are incurring a lower risk of problems than you might from saving $10 by buying it from a Net-Shack retailer who may never even answer the phone if your box shows up with a broken card upon delivery...options are nice.


Yes, there is an ATI AIW 9800Pro. http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NTc2

Everything I have read says PNY is a quality card maker although Evga may be better in the customer service area, I realize that Nvidia only makes the chips but thats true about more electronics than most people know. How many actual different manufacturers of dvd players do you think there are? :) 

"Caveat Emptor" No argument there, started the hole thing offf by calling myself and a "sapp". No doubt that if you want to ride the bleeding edge you will get cut if not very careful. I almost never do by-the-way:)  It was an evening when my old card was making EQ more miserable than usual and there was cold vodka in the fridge, internet shopping while drinking is dangerous.

Wow, the thread is startin to remind me of QC's flames board...Easy guys:)  Even though there was a misunderstanding about the "trade-up" program on my part (I addressed that above) my complaint is still valid for the other reasons I mentioned I believe (also above:)  Hell, I haven't even touched on the issues with Nvidias lame customer service trend and total lack of info on their website, try to find some serious detail on the AIW features of on the 5950 at their site for example...

Lastly..."First, he is not talking about buying a new card from ATI. He is talking about trading a card in. If he trades his card in for an ATI card he is going to pay the full price."

Can you link this "fine print here please...I have yet to see the details. Except for the fact that it does state "no matter who made it" so I doubt I would be paying full price with a 5950 Ultra trade in...There has to be a $$ difference between trading in the 5950 or one of the 8mb cards that I have so many of in the garage...lol

Cya...
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
May 25, 2004 1:28:18 PM

Quote:
There has to be a $$ difference between trading in the 5950 or one of the 8mb cards that I have so many of in the garage...lol

Actually that's the thing, there is no difference, an old Matrox Millenium 2MB PCI card will fetch the same discount as your card. Ati doesn't use appraisers to determine arbitrary values for the cards. In your case it's not a good deal at all, and like I said, you'd be better off really selling it on e-bay and turning those funds into a 'rebate'.

In the end I agree the trade-in is a terrible deal for your situation, and you shouldn't go that route, my issue was with other things said.

The question becomes how much do you want the NEXT Generation of cards? Perhaps the best bet would be to sell your 5950Ultra while there's no replacement in stores yet (well not local stores at least) when you can get the most money for it, and roll that money into an X800Pro or a GF6800series card. Once the GF6800GT/PRO/SE cards hit the market your card's value will drop dramatically. If you can get $400 for your card you can get an X800Pro directly from ATI, or even a few places online have them for below that (not NEWEGG as pointed out, but CDW has it cheaper than ATI) or put that towards the GF6800.

Not sure if that clears it up for you, but basically, you will never get more than the $50 discount for whatever card you send in.




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