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Tearing, Vsync performance on 6800GT

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August 24, 2004 5:22:47 AM

I wish I could just play games without without having to enable vsync to stop tearing. In UT2004 the game is a lot more laggy when the fps drops below the refresh rate. In Far Cry my mouse lags like hell when the fps drops below the refresh rate. In Doom 3 any time the fps drops below 60 fps it automatically drops to half of my monitor's refresh rate.

If I turn Vsync OFF, all the issues I just mentioned go away.....but then there's horrendous tearing. I can't win either way. My Radeon 9700 Pro didn't give me problems like this.



Intel P4 3.0c, ASUS P4P800, 1024 MB PC3200, eVga Geforce 6800 GT, WinXP Pro SP2
August 24, 2004 6:07:01 AM

lower the resolution...i havve heard...800*600 and lower generally wont require vsync on.

<i> :evil:  <font color=blue>Futile is resistance,</font color=blue><font color=red> assimilate you we will.</font color=red> :evil:  </i>
<b>Hard work has a future payoff. Laziness pays off now.</b>
August 24, 2004 6:32:38 AM

What does Vsync do?

"Go forward until the last round is fired and the last drop of gas is expended...then go forward on foot!" -Patton
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August 24, 2004 6:52:48 AM

i dunno...
i think iits a name of a ethnic dish or something...







trying to pull my leg here ha !!

<i> :evil:  <font color=blue>Futile is resistance,</font color=blue><font color=red> assimilate you we will.</font color=red> :evil:  </i>
<b>Hard work has a future payoff. Laziness pays off now.</b>
August 24, 2004 6:56:37 AM

Vsync basically locks your fps to the value of your refresh rate. So if your refresh rate is 85, then your vsync will be set to 85fps. That is of course as long as you are getting enough performance to hit that high of fps. If so, vsync basically creates a frames per second ceiling at 85 or whatever your refresh rate is set to.

Having fps=RR will make gameplay much smoother than if you are getting 150fps with an 85 refresh rate. It won't be "faster", just smoother. And in most cases, this is good to have on.

Anyways, that's my leymans view on it.

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August 24, 2004 7:00:42 AM

come on man...he knew that...a guy with more than 400 postd on THGC...knows what vsync is...

<i> :evil:  <font color=blue>Futile is resistance,</font color=blue><font color=red> assimilate you we will.</font color=red> :evil:  </i>
<b>Hard work has a future payoff. Laziness pays off now.</b>
August 24, 2004 7:05:56 AM

In fact, no, I didn't exactly know what it was.

Why not have it on all the time then? I have heard a lot of people recommend turning vsync off.

"Go forward until the last round is fired and the last drop of gas is expended...then go forward on foot!" -Patton
August 24, 2004 7:06:44 AM

My bad. I wasn't paying attention to his post count or trying to infer if it was a joke or not. I didn't see any tongues or laughs so I answered it seriously.

Again I apologize. :) 

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August 24, 2004 7:11:22 AM

HAH. What's up now? He didn't know.

Anyways, usually the only reason to leave vsync off is for benchmarking purposes to see how high of fps you can get. This or ppl like to leave it off so they can just sit and drool at the little yellow number on the corner of their screen while they play.

I do actually have a good reason to leave vsync off in a certain game. I play Tron 2.0 lightcycles and you use two keys to turn left and right. I noticed alot of my turns weren't registering for some reason. Well I also noticed I had vsync on which was locking my fps to 85. This apparently wasn't high enough to register all my turns so when I turned it off, I was getting around 150-350 fps and was amazed at the response my keyboard was getting.

So there are certain cases where it might be beneficial to turn it off. Otherwise, leave it on as it dramatically helps with screen tearing and smoothness of gameplay.

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August 24, 2004 8:02:31 AM

"lower the resolution...i havve heard...800*600 and lower generally wont require vsync on."

What's the point in having a $400 graphics card if I'm going to play 800x600? C'mon man...

Whoever said Vsync was hindering their keyboard response: yeah I believe that. Like in Far Cry if Vsync is on my mouse lags like whoa, whereas as if Vsync if off it's perfectly responsive. I don't know what causes that.

Intel P4 3.0c, ASUS P4P800, 1024 MB PC3200, eVga Geforce 6800 GT, WinXP Pro SP2
August 24, 2004 12:50:27 PM

Quote:
come on man...he knew that...a guy with more than 400 postd on THGC...knows what vsync is...


Quote:
What does Vsync do?



sinse when does post count mean anything

-------
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August 24, 2004 3:33:26 PM

Well, what if Eden or Crashman or even you ask whats a GPU ? And you will know thats a joke bcos thats a wierd question to ask when you have been around and answering other questions. Its like my roommate, who saw all the 3 LORD OF THE RINGS and at the end of the final movie the ass clown asks who was ARAGON ?

Anyways as I posted in another thread vsync is to prevent tearing.

"Vsync should only be disabled when benchmarking so that the videocard and processor are not being limited by the display. Frame rates will appear higher with vsync off but the amount of information displayed is limited by your monitor in that instance. A monitor with an 85 Hz refresh rate will only display 85 frames per second even if the videocard is rendering 400 frames a second. The visual quality may decline as a result also because some frames could be skipped as a result of excess rendering so the interpolation between the first frame and the next frame displayed could be off resulting in 'tearing' or jerkiness."

<i> :evil:  <font color=blue>Futile is resistance,</font color=blue><font color=red> assimilate you we will.</font color=red> :evil:  </i>
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August 24, 2004 3:41:54 PM

Well, u asked how to play game well without vsync. So i simply said lower the resolution. If you wanted a big answer/explaination, you should have also said : ......and i dont wanto use my $400 card like a $100 one.

Someone adviced me on this forum to keep answers simple and short.

<i> :evil:  <font color=blue>Futile is resistance,</font color=blue><font color=red> assimilate you we will.</font color=red> :evil:  </i>
<b>Hard work has a future payoff. Laziness pays off now.</b>
August 24, 2004 5:15:12 PM

Quote:
Well, what if Eden or Crashman or even you ask whats a GPU ?

This is not a good analogy. First of all, Eden, Crash, and phial all have WAY more than 400 posts. Secondly, asking what is a GPU is a far more generic/simple question than asking what is Vsync.

And it should be common sense that the guy doesn't plan on playing games at 800x600 with a 6800gt. Furthermore, you should know that it would just be pointless to play at that resolution considering you are CPU limited even at 1280x1024. So to recommend lowering the resolution in his case would not help him at all.

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August 24, 2004 5:20:31 PM

you mean like 405 or 406 posts?

prolly not that high, eh?

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August 24, 2004 5:37:45 PM

i will never play any game at anything less than 1600x1200 lmao. and if a game comes along that taxes my video card's ability to run at 1600x1200 (*cough cough* doom 3 *cough*)... then i buy a bew video card.. heh heh. i have a complex, you think?

800x600 on any game with a good vid card like that is like having a 2005 mustang cobra GT with a 4 banger in it.
August 24, 2004 5:37:53 PM

I have stopped assuming stuff !

He said
"I wish I could just play games without without having to enable vsync to stop tearing."

I said
lower the reso and ur wish is true.

(what I didnt say:
u will be compromising on the reso and on ur card)

That mena i never forced him to that. just gave him an OPTION. No matter how stupid is it, its just an OPTION.

<i> :evil:  <font color=blue>Futile is resistance,</font color=blue><font color=red> assimilate you we will.</font color=red> :evil:  </i>
<b>Hard work has a future payoff. Laziness pays off now.</b><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by priyajeet on 08/24/04 12:42 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
August 24, 2004 5:38:52 PM

will never play any game at anything less than 1600x1200 lmao. and if a game comes along that taxes my video card's ability to run at 1600x1200 (*cough cough* doom 3 *cough*)... then i buy a bew video card.. heh heh. i have a complex, you think?

800x600 on any game with a good vid card like that is like having a 2005 mustang cobra GT with a 4 banger in it.
August 24, 2004 5:43:58 PM

what are ur benchies with Doom 3 ??
And SOURCE if possible ?

<i> :evil:  <font color=blue>Futile is resistance,</font color=blue><font color=red> assimilate you we will.</font color=red> :evil:  </i>
<b>Hard work has a future payoff. Laziness pays off now.</b>
August 24, 2004 5:49:58 PM

Also, in some games.. just cus u have the vsync on you still need to go into the console of the game and unlock the FPS cap.. Examples.. Quake, COD, Ravenshield, HalfLife. All of these games need a console command or edit of a cfg file in order to sync up!

Cheers!

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August 24, 2004 5:52:23 PM

f*ck vsync
vsync is know for causing proformance impacts.
refresh fix + maxfps set the same as refresh rate = i win

Watch out for the <b><font color=red>bloody</font color=red></b> Fanboys!

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August 24, 2004 5:58:35 PM

A part of Doom3 tweak.

"Turn on vertical refresh sync — When you get into the game, the first thing you're going to want to do is enable vertical refresh sync, or vsync. Without vsync enabled (and it's disabled by default) you'll see lots of tearing (a sort of screen fragmentation) in DOOM 3. In my experience, setting vsync to "always on" in the ATI and NVIDIA drivers doesn't help. The game's default setting overrides the drivers, no matter what.

To turn on vsync, use the Advanced Options menu. Alternately, you can hit ctrl-alt-~ to bring down a game console. At the console, type "r_swapinterval 1". Then hit ~ to close the console. You should be all set, and the tearing should be gone. You can thank me later. "

from <A HREF="http://www.techreport.com/onearticle.x/7133" target="_new">http://www.techreport.com/onearticle.x/7133&lt;/A>

<i> :evil:  <font color=blue>Futile is resistance,</font color=blue><font color=red> assimilate you we will.</font color=red> :evil:  </i>
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August 24, 2004 6:00:08 PM

Quote:
refresh fix + maxfps set the same as refresh rate = i win

Uhhhhh, que?

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August 24, 2004 6:04:12 PM

"refresh fix + maxfps set the same as refresh rate = i win"


Does this not just do the same thing as enabled Vsync?

You telling the game to maxfps to XX and refresh fix hard caps ya resfresh in windows/fullscreen games.. hence the same as vsync?

I may be wrong but it just seems that way. I do it the same way u do lol

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August 24, 2004 6:59:45 PM

actually enabling vsync will most likely lock everything at 60fps.
Refresh fix fixes that.
In certain games such as counter-strike, enabling vsync causes a proformance drop. Since counter-strike was the first computer game i really got into, i did it that way.
So i just do the same for the rest of my games because i don't want the problems that i've had with past games.

Watch out for the <b><font color=red>bloody</font color=red></b> Fanboys!

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Addicted, finally.
August 24, 2004 7:05:18 PM

Yea After ussing the "FIX" then enabling Vsync locks the refresh with whateer u set the fix at!
Counterstike u need to go to console and then unlock it in console.. I play with vsync and max it at 99fps as thats the max ingame... with sync enabled after the fixes aplpied to XP/2k

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August 24, 2004 8:55:52 PM

"refresh fix + maxfps set the same as refresh rate = i win"

This won't work in Doom 3 because it tears regardless of what your refresh rate is if you don't have Vsync on (for me at least). That's what I don't understand. Tearing is supposed to be caused when when fps > refresh rate. So why does Doom 3 tear at the 60 fps cap when my refresh rate is 100 Hz? It doesn't make sense to me.

So uncapping the framerate and setting max fps = refresh rate will not get rid of the tearing in Doom 3. It's a good idea for other games though.

Intel P4 3.0c, ASUS P4P800, 1024 MB PC3200, eVga Geforce 6800 GT, WinXP Pro SP2
August 24, 2004 10:51:17 PM

You can't really set max fps to your refresh rate since the refresh rate is limited to what your monitor will allow.

Yes, I use refresh fix too so that all my games play 1024x768 at 85mhz. But this is still using vsync. Just because it's not capped at 60mhz, doesn't mean vsync isn't on. As long as your fps are locked or capped at whatever your refresh rate is set to, then you have vsync enabled.

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February 17, 2005 2:20:15 PM

OK, my recent experience is as follows:

Playing D3 at 1600x1200 got me 46 fps, but the tearing was quite noticible.

Just learned about vsync, so enabled it in the game, all other settings including res still the same. Now it looks beautiful, no tearing, but fps has dropped to 31.

So if my fps were already below 60, vsync shouldn't have helped me, right? I'm thinking that there is more to vsync than just capping the fps to the monitor refresh rate.

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Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
February 17, 2005 3:32:18 PM

Ok, I'm confused here. So how do you play a game w/o v-synch <b> AND </b> not use my $499 ati x850xt like a $100 pos?
Or is it best to use v-synch??
<font color=green> Woohoo!! I am officially a <b> Newbie </b>!! </font color=green><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Wraithfire on 02/17/05 10:11 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
February 18, 2005 9:24:24 AM

anyone? hello? :frown:

<font color=green> Woohoo!! I am officially a <b> Newbie </b>!! </font color=green>
February 18, 2005 4:37:32 PM

The general consensus I'm getting from this and other boards is that you should use v-snych if the game displays any visible tearing with it off, provided that the frame rate does not get pushed down to unbearable levels. I'm still not convinced that vsynch is holding down the fps to the monitor refresh. One post I saw elsewhere claimed that it forces the card not to display the frame until it is fully rendered; this explanation corresponds much better to my experience.

BTW, your sig needs an update. Now you're not even a newbie anymore!
February 18, 2005 5:46:23 PM

Your problem is not normal. This card should not be doing this. Report your situation to eVGA tech support through their web site. If you have not done so yet, you will need to register your card. For that you will need its serial number (found on the sticker typically on the back side of the card, not the GPU/fan side). eVGA support is good and fast to reply. Chances are they have a new BIOS for your card or something else to resolve your problem, including RMA.

<font color=green>"The creative powers of English morphology are pathetic compared to what we find in other languages." (Steven Pinker, The Language Instinct)</font color=green> :cool:
Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
February 18, 2005 11:41:35 PM

Lol, that was my first non-noob post :cool: I fixed it on #2.

Edit: BTW, thank you for the help, was a lil worried there hehe :smile:
<font color=green> Woohoo!! I am officially a <b> Journeyman </b>!! </font color=green><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Wraithfire on 02/18/05 05:43 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
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