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MUST READ: Toms Graphics Card Buyers Guide

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November 10, 2004 12:02:01 PM

For anyone asking "Which card should I get??", <A HREF="http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20041110/index..." target="_new">here</A> is a guide to explain all the features and help you decide which card to buy.



XP2800+, Abit NF7, 1GB Dual-Channel DDR333, ATI R9800PRO 128MB, TT PurePower 420W, LG DVD+-R/RW
:redface: <font color=red>My wife says I suffer from premature ejaculation...I don't remember suffering<font color=red> :wink:
November 10, 2004 4:30:10 PM

????

what about our sticky

????

is it dead

????

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue:
November 10, 2004 4:34:49 PM

Of course not. Where do you think they got the basis for this article.

Its just a more in depth explanation of what to look for when purchasing.

XP2800+, Abit NF7, 1GB Dual-Channel DDR333, ATI R9800PRO 128MB, TT PurePower 420W, LG DVD+-R/RW
:redface: <font color=red>My wife says I suffer from premature ejaculation...I don't remember suffering<font color=red> :wink:
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November 10, 2004 4:39:04 PM

thats copyright violation. :lol: 
they shld give credit to Grape and Spitfire. Or the community as a whole.

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue:
November 10, 2004 4:41:42 PM

There is no need for this post because it will just get buried like everything else. If nOobs don't want to take the five minutes required to reference our buyer's guide, then they shouldn't be posting in the first place, but sometimes they do it anyway, or they have questions that weren't answered in the guide. Sometimes they are annoying, but it's one of the things that keeps this forum going.

<A HREF="http://atomfilms.shockwave.com/landing/landingIndex.jsp..." target="_new">DumbLand</A>
November 10, 2004 4:46:16 PM

I think my reply in <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">this</A> post says it all.

XP2800+, Abit NF7, 1GB Dual-Channel DDR333, ATI R9800PRO 128MB, TT PurePower 420W, LG DVD+-R/RW
:redface: <font color=red>My wife says I suffer from premature ejaculation...I don't remember suffering<font color=red> :wink:
November 10, 2004 5:11:23 PM

hey Spit and Grape - shldnt u now update the buyers guide with some elements of the one from THG ?

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue:
a b U Graphics card
November 10, 2004 8:41:54 PM

Actually it's up to Spitfire (and maybe CoolS [though he'll tell you he's not in control anymore]).

Personally I was very dissapointed with LARS' buyer's guide. Where's the Matrox cardss (especially for Video quality), and where's XGI, SIS, S3, Intel (even though intel's integrated) references? Sure they're in the price list, but really, where's the info about them?

It's like an ATI/nVidia guide to the exclusion of all else, and while the best choices for gaming may be with those two, overall there are other aspects to "GRAPHICS CARDS". And a brief section mentioning the 'Workstation' graphics cards would have been good as well.

Still good overall view of tha gaming cards.

Of course that just my view from the cheap seats.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
November 11, 2004 5:28:26 AM

Thanks for the feedback!!!

There are in fact certain products and areas missing in the Guide. Those will be added at a later time. The whole article was made in a way, that it can be updated frequently with new products, technology etc. Like the VGA charts, it's a kind of long-run article.

XGI and S3 are a bit of a problem since they are very rarely available at the (US) market right now. Nevertheless, I've already ordered new samples from XGI to take a new closer look at them.

The Guide is not meant as a replacement of the community guide! Coolsquirtle, Grape, priyajeet and Spitfire do a great job and I hope they keep it alive. I will also add a community part in the next update which also links to the Forum's Guide. :-)

Lars
November 11, 2004 6:35:46 AM

coool :wink:

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue:
November 11, 2004 6:50:19 AM

Our guide isn't dead. I was just waiting for more cards to be avaiable for purchase (PCI-Ex 6600, 6200, X700 series, AGP 6600). Now PCI-Ex cards 6600/6200/X700 series is available and AGP 6600s have started to show up. Update will come very soon.


------------
<font color=orange><b><A HREF="http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox" target="_new">Rediscover the web</A></b></font color=orange>
November 11, 2004 2:26:36 PM

Do you really want XGI??????
a b U Graphics card
November 11, 2004 6:41:05 PM

That's good news. I always feel that you never get the chance to 'finish' your articles, in a way that there's usualy a post script for most things that no one saw coming. That it will be an ongoing concern is great because then it will provide more insight than something that is static and came become dated.

Nice to see all the planned updates, still want Matrox from a personal 'fanboi' perspective, but I realize resources are limited. Funny you should mention the availability of the cards as just last week I linked a few reviews of the low-mid end V8 and I couldn't find a NorthAmerican price for it at all, so it was hard to tell what it was competing for for price. I did notice alot of German reviews of the card, and a guy at 3Dcentre does XGI testing and posts his stuff in the forum.

Also the 'Chrome' series of cards from S3 are barely a blip out there with S4s just showing up, but for people it would be a good reference if they are 'unlucky' enough to get on in their pre-built Dell,HP,Gateway,etc. rigs.

With the new layout I would think it may be easy to have an updatable guide so I look forward to seeing it.

Some quicky additional suggesttions (if I may be so bold :wink: );

Mention of PCI card/connector, just a brief mention with the AGP/PCIe section might be good? Perhaps even some mention (like voltage) pics (keying) of the difference between AGP (1x), 2x, 4x, 8x? Perhaps show the difference between the truely terrible cards (like the FX5200SE and R9200SE) and the ever more capable integrated solutions (yes I know it's a 'card review', but it shows that these cards aren't worth the pennies, marks, francs or yen when you can get the same performance for the ~$10-20 more when buying a MOBO). Maybe also show the differences between DVI-D, DVI-I and DVI-A? Maybe quickly show people the difference (pic) between TSOP and BGA memory and that the latter usually overclocks better than the former when it comes to going beyond rated speeds. I think what would benifit the newbie/uninformed buyer the most would be to quickly bring them up to speed on what the rest of us take for granted.

Maybe I'm putting too much thought into this and thinking of it as a FAQ replacement.

As to replacing the guide, there's no ego here, I hope that the guide does replace the one here to great extent, and that that motivates us to then update and make something worthy of being read itself. The outcome should be benificial to all who read both guides.

Well, remember to have some fun in the testing too. :cool:


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
November 11, 2004 6:46:02 PM

Hey even if it's cautionary mention to say 'avoid the following until they improve' I think every Mfr we can buy should be mentioned. Of course some may take little information from that, and it may not be worth the effort but it does make it more complete IMO. There is a brief, also-ran section which is a good start. Long term flesh it out a bit maybe.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
November 12, 2004 4:59:49 AM

Understand that THG has a whole ton of Pics already in their old reviews, and LARS/BORSTI likely would be reluctant to use your pics for copyright publishing concerns.

But for those reading this is should be enlightening.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
November 13, 2004 12:38:29 PM

Thanks again for the feedback!!!

I keep all suggestions in mind. The AGP/PCIe Performance stuff and demonstrating the performance differences between very-low cost and mainstream is a great idea. The nice part of this "long-term" article - which is also new for us - is that I'm not under time pressure. I can write the parts whenever I'm in the mood to do so :-)

Regarding XGI... well, you can buy them here in europe but there's no partner (yet) in the US. The only XGI cards you can buy in the US are Chaintech V3's.

Regarding DVI, we do have a very big article coming shortly ;-)

Lars
November 13, 2004 12:39:56 PM

And thanks a lot for the link to the pics...! but I already have what I need :-)
November 13, 2004 4:05:14 PM

no problemo :smile:

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue:
a b U Graphics card
November 13, 2004 5:00:23 PM

SWEEEEeeeet! :lol: 

Yeah the lack of a time constraint is a GREAT thing. During the GF6200 'no-paper' stand taken by THG, we were talking about your time constraints and how you always seem pressured by both ATI and nV (and even Valve during the first HL2 preview) to rush things. Glad you can go at your own pace, I know what that's like, adds fun to the process.

Can't wait for the DVI article. I still link to the Old (over a yrea now) <A HREF="http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1558,1367918,00.a..." target="_new">ExtreTech one</A>, so it would be nice to have a 'local' one to point to. :cool:

I have an IBM P260 at work so I have some experience with the DVI-A (as well as my normal DVI-D and I from my graphics card and monitors), and I LOVEs that IBM monitor, wish I could take it home! I had to get the company I work for to get a dongle to work with our new DB-15 only DELLs, few people know that you CAN even get DB-15 to DVI connectors, they think it's only the other way around. Of course it would usually make sense because vga couldn't drive all the needs/features of a DVI-D/I, but it does work with the DVI-A. It was cheaper to get the dongle then to get a replacement VGA cable (which was lost by desktop support over time). While that's not an <i>'interesting'</i> story it is something that people don't consider, as DVI-A is very rare IMO.

Anyways, Thanks as always, and have fun of course.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
November 14, 2004 2:19:46 AM

Quote:
hey Spit and Grape - shldnt u now update the buyers guide with some elements of the one from THG ?


first of all IT IS MY GUIDE, I dont care if i dont get recognition, but i dont even get to improve it. WHAT A BIG WTF on my part.

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 14, 2004 2:47:19 AM

well, i dont know who stole it from whom. i wasnt here when it was made. all i see is spitfire's name there, so as long as thats there its his. fight it with him.

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue:
a b U Graphics card
November 14, 2004 5:39:08 PM

We I thought this was the case;

<i>"As to replacing the guide, there's no ego here,..."</i>

We may have found one. :tongue:

I think it's a little late to do much about it but it does suck that there's no way to collectively do things. But I guess too many cooks and all. And no that doesn't say too many c*ck$ you pervs!

Anywhooo, post it like GW said, and see what happens. I don't think Fredi can grant multiple access to editing, but I don't know. And while it sucks being you inspiration and all, Spitfire has done alot of work to maintain it and now is just as worthy IMO. But then again it's not really my issue/thread I just contribute cosmic relief.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
!