Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

THGC Graphic Forum Graphic Card Buying Guide

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
Share
November 14, 2004 3:53:26 AM

You guys want a revamp, I'll have a revamp

As oppose to the article created by Tom’s Hardware, This guide is more cut down to help gamer, or computer users to help with their Video Card purchase

First, you have to decide what type of user are you, so it is easier to narrow your selection. Here are a few types and recommendation.
Average Joe- You just want something that can display picture on your monitor and enjoy a little 2D tetris
(Please consider interrogated Graphics or Low end solution)
Gamer- You want to play games. (DUH)
(Your recommendation will be discussed later)
Professional- Graphic is your life and you make money with it
(Professional solution or maybe even Middle/High end will satisfy you)

Once you picked a category or still not sure, there is always the prime factor, money.

No matter if you’re the most hardcore player on earth, if you don’t have cash, you’re still stuck with Intel Extreme Graphics 3, that is why the buyer guide revolves the main issue, money. We call this C/P rating. Picking the best C/P rated card in each category is the best choice. Companies has also separate their line to four basic lineups

Low End- You are looking at about ($100-$200USD) at this range, the price will constantly change as well as the cards in the section. Gaming is possible but if will not make it a very enjoyable experience.
Predicted Performance with current games: (800x600 or 1024x768 max, none or low special effects, no AF or AA( enhancing graphics of gameplay) and it will cause more work for other parts of the computer)

Middle End- They are the biggest pie of the market, you can say the price will range from $200-$350 USD) the price will constantly change as well as the cards in the section. It is very capable of playing games and it is usually above what current games?required SPEC are nowadays.
Predicted Performance with current games: (1024x768, 1280x1024 (if supported by your monitor) (lower resolution are also supported), regular special effects, 4xAF or 2xAA will affect performance of game but will not injure overall experience if configured properly, games will be more graphics indenpendant)

High End- They are the dream cars of Graphics, what company fight over for the top speed crown, they range from ($350-$1000USD) They are made to kickass in games and they will provide the best performance one can want. Many card manufacturers also like to create more powerful versions of the card (water cooled, over clocked) which can increase the price of the video card, keep in mind, only pick what you are capable of purchasing, because Graphic Cards are highly replaceable.
Predicted Performance (1600x1200 (lower resolution are also supported) high special effects, full AF and AA and lag is history in most cases.

Special Use- these are special cards, they can cost up to $10000USD! They are “special?because they are design for a special purpose, like CAD or movie editing or 2D precision and exact Image Qualities. Only pick these card if you really need them. A lot of these cards don’t support gaming because they are made for a special purpose, not gaming.

Okay now you have a better idea of how much you can spend and what you’re looking for? Now let’s choose your Video Card. Oh wait! Before that! We have to find out if your computer can stick one of these bad boys in

There are three types of Graphic card slots
PCI- every computer have these, they are the earliest form for Graphic Cards, nowadays they are pretty much extinct. This guide will not focus on this. If you are not able to update to an AGP interface, you will have to look around for leftovers
Here are some last remaining PCI cards
nVidia
MX400 series
Ti4200 PCI version

ATi
Radeon 7000
Radeon 9000?

XGi
V3?

AGP- this is the most used slot at the moment, although it is being replaced by PCI-EX it will stay for a while, please look below for AGP cards. Also if you have an outdated Motherboard or an old computer, you have to find out if you AGP slot is not 3.3V because they are not supported with all the cards in this guide. Again they are outdated technology. If you have a current AGP slot then get picking!

PCI-Express- the new technology, the PCI-EX slots are x16 so they are longer. You can only find them if you just purchased your computer recently. Also note: some PCI-EX card will require a special power connector to connect to the cards, please assure you have a PCI-EX compatible Power Supply and Motherboard.

If you like to see what are the difference between them in depth, this is from priyajeet

AGP
The advantage of AGP over old PCI was increased bus speed/bandwidth. AGP has its own path way to communicate with the processor as well as to the memory whereas devices on the PCI bus have to share the 133 MB/s bandwidth allocated to it. Both the AGP (66 Mhz clock) and PCI Bus (33 Mhz clock) are on a 32 bit bus. So at 1x, AGP has double the bandwidth (266 MB/s). As it can transfer data multiple times per clock cycle, AGP 8x has ~2100MB/s of bandwith.

vs

PCIe or Nvidia's PCX (not PCI-X, see below)
PCI Express (not PCI-X) has an architecture that is serial based like the SATA while the old PCI is based upon a parallel architecture. So pin count reduces. Also the protocol is much like AGP. Devices do not share bandwidth. Theoritical bandwidth will be 250 MB/s per direction, roughly double the bandwidth of the current PCI and this is available to each device with PCI Express. The above will be the refernce lane x1. Extra lanes with bandwidth multiple of x1 can be added - x2, x4, x8, x12, x16 and x32. x16 is the new generation graphical bus interface. Low latency is also another goal of PCI Express. Nvidia, to be unique have misused the term PCX. It means PCI Express and not the specification below.

vs

PCI-X (Not PCI Express or Nvidia's PCX)
a.k.a PCI-X 2.0. You dont have to worry about this standard. It will not be used for graphics industry. Very few desktop systems support it. It is an acronym for PCI extended, an enhanced PCI bus. PCI-X is backward-compatible with existing PCI cards. It improves speed of PCI from 133 MBps to ~1 GBps. PCI-X was designed jointly by IBM, HP and Compaq to increase performance of high bandwidth devices, such as Gigabit Ethernet and Fibre Channel, and processors that are part of a cluster. It is similar to the old PCI architecture though with 64 bit bus and 66/133/266/533 Mhz clock. Do not confuse it with PCX, a term Nvidia uses for thie PCI Express cards.


Almost forgot! Technology! This guide is a buyer’s guide so I will not go far as to what the technology is. However current games uses Microsoft’s Direct X 9 or Open GL and SM 2.0b/3.0, they are basically what games are made by. New technology will make the card last longer because it will support more games. If your are updating your video card to play a game, make sure the card can take advantage of all the new technology coded into the game
Note: all video cards support Open GL.

GENERAL NOTE: you can notice only ATi and nVidia are in the guide, where’s XGI? S3? Well basically, they should be on the things never to buy list. Any card in this guide will be better than what other companies can offer? More performance for cheaper price? Please don’t fall for the trick, these cards are poorly designed as well as terrible support. Until they provide a noticeable competition and stability avoid them at all cost!

Low End

New Products

ATi Technology

Radeon X300 ($65-$100)
PCI-EXPESS
The basic line up of ATi
DX 9 support
SM 2.0

Radeon 9250 ($47-$100)
AGP
A refresh to the 9200 series which is the 8500 series
DX 8 support
SM 2.0

Radeon 9550($60-$125)
AGP
A slower version of the discontinued 9600series
DX 9 support
SM 2.0

nVidia Technology
FX5500 ($72-$135)
AGP
A refresh of FX5200
DX 9 support
SM 2.0

GeForce PCX 5300 ($88-$100)
PCI-EXPRESS
It is nVidia’s first line up of PCI-EX video cards. It uses the original FX5200 chip with nVidia’s bridge to transform it into a PCI-EX card.
DX9 support
SM 2.0

GeForce 6200 (Not Yet Released)
PCI-EXPRESS
It is the slowest of nVidia’s new 6 series (not the BMW)
DX9 support
SM3.0 support?

Discontinued Products

nVidia FX 5200
nVidia GeForce 4 MX series
ATi Radeon 7000 series
ATi Radeon 9000 series
ATi Radeon 8500 series

So which one is the best for me?
AGP -> you choices are FX5500 VS Radeon 9550 VS Radeon 9250. The FX series was quite disappointing, therefore I recommend
Radeon 9550 > Radeon 9250 > FX 5500

PCI-EX -> there hasn’t been a lot of benchmarks released to find out which is better so the result will come out later, however the GeForce 6200 or X300 is recommended because the PCX still uses the terrible FX series chips

Mainstream (Midend)

New Products

ATi Technology

Radeon X600 ($150-$233)
PCI-EXPRESS
Mainstream version for ATi¡¦s PCI-EXPRESS line-up. Think of this card as a 9600pro with PCI-EX
DX 9 support
SM2.0

Radeon X700 ($179-$219)
PCI-EXPRESS (possible AGP)
Toned down X800, main product in the mainstream line; Provide similar performance as the last generation high-end
DX 9 support
SM2.0

nVidia Technology Corp.

New Products
GeForce 6600
PCI-EXPRESS/AGP
The mainstream version based on the 6800. A direct target at the Radeon X700
DX 9 support
SM 3.0

GeForce FX 5700
AGP
Last generation mainstream card.
Direct X 9 support
SM 2.0

GeForce PCX 5700
PCI-EXPRESS
FX5700 with the HIS bridge, clock speed different
DX 9 support
SM 2.0

Discontinued Products
nVidia GeForce FX 5600
ATi Radeon 9600
ATi Radeon 9500

So which steals the performance Crown in this Sector

PCI-EXPRESS- there only has been in lab result so no winners yet :p 

AGP: Still lack new generation video cards. For now, I would recommend Radeon 9600 over FX5700 due to overall performance.

NOTE: still waiting for newer videocard release, also, please read the high-end section to answer the question, ¡§why isn¡¦t 9800pro in here? It¡¦s the best bang for the buck right now!¡¨


More to come
Highend
Ram selection
Vendors
Tips and Tricks



RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Coolsquirtle on 11/15/04 10:47 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
Related resources
November 14, 2004 5:01:51 AM

as long as i dont disappear for longer than one product cycle its okay :D 

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 14, 2004 5:08:49 AM

maybe i can have a sub editor then :p 


RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 14, 2004 5:48:29 AM

dude, considering this to be a community, one gotta do stuff as a whole community. u just cant just come here one day, start off another thread saying this is a buyers guide. Its a gauranteed failure - considering the original guide isnt that popular among newcomers. Rather u might talk over this with spitfire. have a joint session and request everyone to be a part of this. I bet others will have lot to add.
if need be here are a bit of tit bits from me which u can ignore, ramp, flame, edit, destroy:

I posted this before too.

<b>AGP</b>
<font color=red>The advantage of AGP over old PCI was increased bus speed/bandwidth. AGP has its own path way to communicate with the processor as well as to the memory whereas devices on the PCI bus have to share the 133 MB/s bandwidth allocated to it. Both the AGP (66 Mhz clock) and PCI Bus (33 Mhz clock) are on a 32 bit bus. So at 1x, AGP has double the bandwidth (266 MB/s). As it can transfer data multiple times per clock cycle, AGP 8x has ~2100MB/s of bandwith.</font color=red>

<b><i>vs</i></b>

<b>PCIe or Nvidia's PCX (not PCI-X, see below)</b>
<font color=green>PCI Express (not PCI-X) has an architecture that is serial based like the SATA while the old PCI is based upon a parallel architecture. So pin count reduces. Also the protocol is much like AGP. Devices do not share bandwidth. Theoritical bandwidth will be 250 MB/s per direction, roughly double the bandwidth of the current PCI and this is available to each device with PCI Express. The above will be the refernce lane x1. Extra lanes with bandwidth multiple of x1 can be added - x2, x4, x8, x12, x16 and x32. x16 is the new generation graphical bus interface. Low latency is also another goal of PCI Express. Nvidia, to be unique have misused the term PCX. It means PCI Express and not the specification below.</font color=green>

<b><i>vs</i></b>

<b>PCI-X (Not PCI Express or Nvidia's PCX)</b>
<font color=blue>a.k.a PCI-X 2.0. You dont have to worry about this standard. It will not be used for graphics industry. Very few desktop systems support it. It is an acronym for PCI extended, an enhanced PCI bus. PCI-X is backward-compatible with existing PCI cards. It improves speed of PCI from 133 MBps to ~1 GBps. PCI-X was designed jointly by IBM, HP and Compaq to increase performance of high bandwidth devices, such as Gigabit Ethernet and Fibre Channel, and processors that are part of a cluster. It is similar to the old PCI architecture though with 64 bit bus and 66/133/266/533 Mhz clock. Do not confuse it with PCX, a term Nvidia uses for thie PCI Express cards.</font color=blue>

<A HREF="http://www.intelforums.net/viewtopic.php?p=7626" target="_new">This page has more for a layman</A>

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue: <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by priyajeet on 11/14/04 01:51 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
November 14, 2004 6:07:48 AM

Quote:
dude, considering this to be a community, one gotta do stuff as a whole community. u just cant just come here one day, start off another thread saying this is a buyers guide. Its a gauranteed failure -


I did it before, why can't i do it now? The entire buyer's guide was done by me, so? Is that a big deal?
Please don't tell me what will work and what won't work.

Also team work doesn't work, we tried.

Also what you posted is useful, however, not necessary for a buyer's guide. I have a technical FAQ in mind too but it never worked out. This buyer guide provides more help to the people who wants to buy a video card, hence the name

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 14, 2004 6:12:22 AM

Quote:
u just cant just come here one day, start off another thread saying this is a buyers guide.

You havent been here long enough to know what has taken place.

The original "buyers guide creation" thread was <b>Coolsquirtle's</b> brainchild in the first place.

Spitfire took the information from it, and had Fredi sticky it, under his own name.

Hence the reason why CS is pissed off, and doing all of this ranting.

Do I want a community Buyers Guide? = yes

But there are obstacles we need to overcome before we can make that happen.


<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=2216718" target="_new"><b>3DMark03</b></A>
<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=127163" target="_new"><b>3DMark05</b></A>
November 14, 2004 6:17:00 AM

okay let's drop this for now, I said i'd have a Version 2 here it is, i believe it surpassed what i had before. Please provide feedback. and Midend and Highend should come tom or Monday

However, i dont know what to use to measure performance here....I'm thinking Doom3 for now :p  and HL2 and 3Dmarks2k5 later.

And maybe people can find me prices in different currency? (not just convert, like with their own price match system)

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 14, 2004 6:28:13 AM

Quote:
okay let's drop this for now, I said i'd have a Version 2 here it is

Wow!.....you did all of the work for us!

We didnt even have to give you input or anything!....no discussions!

:lol: 

Your missing the point of this whole thing fucktard.

There are quite a few people in this forum who would like to participate in this, and we arent going to have a recap of what happened last time.


<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=2216718" target="_new"><b>3DMark03</b></A>
<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=127163" target="_new"><b>3DMark05</b></A>
November 14, 2004 6:34:15 AM

well i cant argue on what i havent witnessed. but taking the word of u guys. if he did take it, steal it or whatever, then u have a right to remake it.

i'll help anyone.

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue:
November 14, 2004 6:44:57 AM

the reason i did the vs stuff, bcos a lot of oddballs (strangers) come and ask abt PCIe, whether they shld get it- if its any better - if not y - PCX - nvidias mispled term etc etc.

Oddballs on the irc do that also.

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue:
November 14, 2004 6:50:16 AM

hahah GW remember what happened last time?

this is what I'm thinking, i think this structure for a guide works... whoever has a different idea we can see if it'll work and you guys can say what to improve and I'll do it no problem. Also, we'll have people doing different parts

GW i think if you can write something about what AF and AA does to games and the impact (not in depth)

Someone can do a CAD section and a 2D section for the Special part
as well as AIWs and their functions etc. Also the local price idea. Anyone else have input! I'm asking for some input!


RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 14, 2004 6:53:06 AM

He simply had a sticky made out of an ongoing "idea post" that everyone participated in.

There should have been a vote to see who's name it would go under, but he kinda just took it apon himself to have the work stickied in his name.

Those were more <i>chaotic</i> times back then though.

Having Coolsquirtle be the keeper of the sticky wouldnt have been any better though :lol: 


<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=2216718" target="_new"><b>3DMark03</b></A>
<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=127163" target="_new"><b>3DMark05</b></A>
November 14, 2004 6:56:19 AM

Well if there is a fight for the name i say - put it under GNU license - free to fu*ck around with. No credit to any particula person - i prefer this even if i took part in it and Mr X did not.

Also when u write abt AA/AF - u can give D3 examples - all that forced vs app pref thingy.

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue:
November 14, 2004 6:58:07 AM

added priyajeet's part see if it works... and I'm gonna learn how to bold text tom :D 

Well, back then people weren't interested, i had to point names to make people participe and they still didn't

GRAPE
UFO
DHLUCKE
FLAMETHROWER!

lol :p 

GW shut up and give some input

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 14, 2004 6:59:46 AM

I dont think its ski season yet

and you lazyass GW

Credit will be give on top of FAQ....just wait until tom when i learn how to bold!

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 14, 2004 7:08:59 AM

good guide
<A HREF="http://www.tweaktown.com/document.php?dType=guide&dId=6..." target="_new">http://www.tweaktown.com/document.php?dType=guide&dId=6...;/A>

<A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">This</A> was an earlier [petition for a new guide by lazer.

:tongue: <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/priyajeet/fing.jpg" target="_new"><i><font color=red>Very funny, Scotty.</font color=red><font color=blue> Now beam down my clothes.</font color=blue></i></A> :tongue: <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by priyajeet on 11/14/04 03:11 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
November 14, 2004 9:37:13 AM

Make it quick. Apart from revamp, the guide also needs routine update.

------------
<font color=orange><b><A HREF="http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox" target="_new">Rediscover the web</A></b></font color=orange>
November 14, 2004 9:41:27 AM

Hey didn't I give everyone proper credit? Since there's already 4 people involved with the guide, it's already a community guide. All it needs is a major update.

------------
<font color=orange><b><A HREF="http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox" target="_new">Rediscover the web</A></b></font color=orange>
a b U Graphics card
November 14, 2004 11:19:05 AM

My intial thought was, I don't care for the LOW END being $100-$200. A Radeon 9800 pro is then borderline low end and surely capable of more than what you list a low end card to be. (800x600 low/no effects) Yet where do you place that card seeing as they fall between $160-$250 depending which one/where you buy. Retail stores look to spend $250 still, but I got a BBA retail box for $170 shipped a few months ago. I wouldn't say spending more than $200 in the USA on one is a good idea unless it's a HIS or Saphire Ultimate, etc. Yet what about other countries? 9800 Pro might be a $300 card still there?

IMO low end gaming card's should be up to $150 max, and provide good choices for $50-$150 cards. Maybe $150-300 for mir range, and $300+ for high end.

I also think keeping prices current is going to be difficult as was said. Especially considering how prices vary from Country to Country. We now have $100 9600 Pro's in the USA making the best $100 card here a no brainer really.

Also, what kind of availability is needed for a card to make the list? The newest releases aren't going to be the best buys too often. If someone can get a R9700 pro for close to the price of R9600XT's, they should do it. Yet no everyone will be able to find a new 9700p still.

Anyway, good luck on the task. Hopefully you'll get some constructive input to help out along the way.

ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 1GB Corsair XMS 4000 Pro Series, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
November 14, 2004 3:05:33 PM

v2.0 is supposed to be better than v1.0 anyway. It doesn't need mentioning.

Current guide needs minor update to reflect price change/new products and a PCI-Express section. If v2.0 comes quickly, then we can do without this minor update. This is why I wanted v2.0 to come quick. But if v2.0 takes time, there's no big problem.

------------
<font color=orange><b><A HREF="http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox" target="_new">Rediscover the web</A></b></font color=orange>
November 14, 2004 3:54:21 PM

Job well done guys. Keep up the good work you have going. Long read but helpful. Not an easy task.
November 14, 2004 6:45:08 PM

Well I'm not exactly seperating them by pricing, more like by lineup, by price doesn't really work...and good deals aren't always there.

Midend comes later today, after my driving lesson :p  If I survive that is.

Highend will have to wait...it's gonna be a hard section

Special use.. i'm gonna need experts on this one

PS- GW, stop worrying whos name its gonna go under ok? Shut up or we'll make it under you and you'll have to update it :D 

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
a b U Graphics card
November 14, 2004 8:32:26 PM

Quote:
The original "buyers guide creation" thread was Coolsquirtle's brainchild in the first place.

Actually that's not technically true. It was sorta everyone's idea while humming and haing over a definitive FAQ, however CoolS actually DID something to start it, unlike everyone else talking about it (also hard to get everyone on the same page). I think it was always meant to be a companion to a FAQ, but the main thing is that he did get it started, and it did one of the things we wanted in the creation of this stuff, cut down on the questions, mainly the ones based on the 'what should I get for the $200 range', we now had something to point people to.

Quote:
But I am going to plead with GGA(somehow) to contribute greatly to this project.

Is he skiing right now?

Nope, recovering. Went to a company X-mas party for one of my former departments, and woke up at about noon. Spent all day yesterday getting the car ready (insurance, tune-up, etc) for heading into the mountains for skiing. I was hoping for more time this wekend, but I have to go out for dinner in about 2 hours (so watching football and surfing here).

Anywhoo, I will do my best to contribute what I can, as usual. I'd like to see more of what CS has especially as the other categories flesh-out. I would first recommend colour (like for sections) and bolding (for card models etc) in order to bring what is sure to be alot of information into great detail/clarity.

I'd also like to know the them, is it like the original strictly a buyer's guide? I would like to have a buyer's guide and a FAQ seperate from each other. I think the FAQ would be harder to start, but require less updating. Like you I think a Buyer's guide needs constant renewal, drivers change things, games change things, price changes (FX5900XT, R9800Pro) change choices well within a product cycle. I think the FAQ should include all the information detail; 'What is PCIe, what is Fastwrites, What are nOOb and Fuktard everyone keeps calling me?' :lol: 

BTW, just added Serious Sam to the PalmPhone, freakin' hillarious, reminds me of the original Wolfenstein 3D graphics; the controls are tough to master but fun while waiting for stuff (like waiting for fluids change yesterday), and waiting for the vehicle registry yesterday (got new Vanity Plates [I'll PM you the name]).


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
November 14, 2004 8:41:49 PM

Quote:
I dont think its ski season yet

You're wrong silly man!

<A HREF="http://www.skibanff.com/" target="_new">Sunshine</A> is now open Every Day until May (as their slogan goes) They opened on Rememberance/Veterans Day. But it's early season, and the good runs/hills (like Goat's Eye) aren't open yet, so I'm not going to waste the gas for that, yet! I just hope it keeps snowing, may get a chance to ski next weekend, getting all the stuff ready (gonna start tunning my skis and blades next week forsure).

<A HREF="http://www.skilouise.com/snowreport/" target="_new">Lake Louise</A> is also open but it too is limited (only 1 F'in Lift!).

SOON however, so don't dawdle, eh!


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
November 14, 2004 9:32:16 PM

PS, I've mentioned this before but I don't think anyone ever listens to me, they just nod and wave! :lol: 

A way to clean things up is to link lots of information in a clicky link like this so you don't spend to much realestate 'splainin' stuff;

<A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">Entry Level</A>; yada yada

card 1
card 2
card 3

<A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">AGP/PCI-X/PCIe</A>

nVidia PCX card 1
ATI Xxxx card 6
nV GF card 2

<A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">What's a Shader and why does my NeoMagic not have any?</A>

PS3.0+ cards
PS2.0+ cards
PS1.4+ cards
etc.

I'm telling you, that cleans up a heck of alot of the clutter, and lets you focus on the important stuff.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
November 15, 2004 3:54:50 AM

LOL!

Well it was the idiots question, I direct him to the eliteba$tard's answer! :wink:
(you not the site)


BTW, check your PMs.

Be Back later.



- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
November 15, 2004 4:34:15 PM

I don't necessarily agree that teamwork doesn't succeed- we almost finished a "PCI-Express Explained" guide. A few of us sat down, wrote a bit, and provided links to technical papers. The problem is that there is no way for us to create a locked post.

I think that your Buyer's Guide is really good, I don't think you need to modify it too much. Maybe you could provide links to architectural descriptions and perhaps to benchmarks of the different cards. Also it would help if it were updated a little bit more frequently. However, it's the user's fault if they don't want to take the five minutes to read your guide. Personally I think that PCI-Express should have its own little sticky, separate from the Buyer's Guide. <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">Here</A> is a link to the original thread with the PCIe stuff.

<A HREF="http://atomfilms.shockwave.com/landing/landingIndex.jsp..." target="_new">DumbLand</A>
November 16, 2004 4:48:01 AM

Midend up....... can people help add extra info?

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 16, 2004 11:49:59 PM

damn HL2 threads!!!

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 16, 2004 11:55:51 PM

*smack Pukepile with a FX5500

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 17, 2004 12:21:10 AM

No sking for you this week. I'm sending you lots of sun and nice an warm 78F temps. You will love it. To go with Sunshine Mountain.

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by HardwareBoss on 11/16/04 09:27 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
a b U Graphics card
November 17, 2004 5:21:05 AM

Evil Ba$$turd! :tongue:

I will see the <b>BUMP</b>s soon enough. Actually next weekend (27th) is the Men's downhill @ Louise, I may go just to watch, and then check out the conditions at both Sunshine and Louise.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
November 18, 2004 4:49:30 AM

damn there's like no ski in BC :S

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
a b U Graphics card
November 18, 2004 5:42:05 AM

Yeah, a friend of mine said it's raining @ Whistler.

That's why they moved the Men's Downhill to Louise in the early season rather than Whistler. Too much fog and rain in the early season. Whistler/Blackomb's season goes later into June though.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
November 18, 2004 10:16:53 PM

LOL :smile: Enjoy the snow. Darn sketter. I'll have to kill it soon.
November 22, 2004 1:04:20 AM

bumps

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy :D 
November 22, 2004 3:27:11 AM

Stick it baby.

AMD A64 3200+ Newcastle
ThermalTake Polo735 HSF
MSI K8N Neo Platinum
1GB Corsair DDR400 ValueSelect (CL2.5)
PowerColour R9600Pro @ 500/750 (Im serious about the memory speed)
a b U Graphics card
March 18, 2005 11:03:53 PM

Perhaps the Buyer's Guide needs a refresh to include the latest cards, notable exceptions X800/XL, GF6200 (card to avoid GF6200TC), New XGI and S3 solutions, etc.


Also perhaps add the Spec Comparison sheet from Adrian's RojakPot to the links list;
<A HREF="http://www.rojakpot.com/showarticle.aspx?artno=88&pgno=..." target="_new">http://www.rojakpot.com/showarticle.aspx?artno=88&pgno=...;/A>

Also maybe update the maker's list as some things have changed.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
March 19, 2005 9:24:21 AM

LOL!

I don't know, but it'd be best for the n00bs.

Keeping it updated hopefully reduces the number of repetative questions about what's better an FX5900 or a GF6600GT.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK :evil: 
!