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AGP 4x slot for 8x Card?

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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November 26, 2004 2:58:31 AM

I'm thinking of buying the GeForce 6800STD AGP 8x 128mb, but might be waisting my money. My motherboard has only a 4x AGP slot. I would think this means I'll loose about half of the performance of the 6800? I saw no benchmarks to show me this in my research on Tom's site. Anyone know how many FPS I'll be losing on say Flight Sim 2004? Considering my current card can't even run it in 32 bit, I wanted to go with the 6800 based on DirectX9.0c performance and the problems that exist in the 5xxx series. I don't want to get a new mother board at this point. Just want to know what performance I'll lose by putting the 6800 into a 4x slot.

Pavelow

Dell 8250, 2.4ghzCPU, 512 RDRAM, 120gbATA/100, GeForce4 MX 420, SBLive5.1, SamSung 48xCDRW, LiteOn 851S DVDRW

More about : agp slot card

November 26, 2004 4:09:33 AM

System aint from nasa, but itll benefit greatly from the card, although might not utilize every last of power either.

Asus p4c800 Deluxe,1 Gig Mushkin PC3200 Dual Channel Level II V2,Pentium 4 3.0 512k 800fsb HT, Thermaltake Xaser III, Thermaltake Spark 7+, Sound Blaster Audigy2 ZS Platinum Pro, eVGA GeForce 6800 GT
a b U Graphics card
a b V Motherboard
November 26, 2004 5:00:36 AM

!d00d! He has his systems specs right there! It's an i850E chipset board, VASTLY SUPERIOR to the i845. Dual-channel RDRAM is vastly superior to single-channel DDR!

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<font color=red>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to an ego as large as Crashman's!</font color=red>
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November 26, 2004 12:02:38 PM

Sorry, I have a more fundamental question - Do the AGP8X cards (I target ONLY for GeforceFx 5200 or above) auto-downclock to AGP4X usually? i.e. I don't have to worry about compatibility or jumper settings? My mobo is Asus CUSL-2, which supports only up to AGP4X.
November 26, 2004 8:12:57 PM

Theres no downclocking involved. If you put an 8x card in the 4x slot it will just utilize the 4x bandwidth. You dont have to do anything.

I think we need a sticky entitled: <font color=red> 8X AGP CARDS WILL WORK IN 4X MOTHERBOARDS!! </font color=red> because i swear it gets asked every 3 days.

"Who is General Failure, and why is he reading my drive?"
P4 3.0C HT, Intel D865GBF, 1GB Crucial PC3200 DDR, 2x WD 36GB Raptor 10kRPM, BBA Radeon 9800PRO, SB Audigy, Hauppage WinTV
November 27, 2004 12:38:49 AM

You might wanna check to make sure that your power supply is sufficient for the 6800.
Dell's usually have wimpy power supplies.
November 27, 2004 2:54:09 AM

My 5 year old Dell has a 400watt PSU

<font color=red><pre>\\//__________________________________
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>
November 27, 2004 1:52:01 PM

Thanks everyone for the info. I'll double check my power supply, but I think it is at least 350w.

An 8% loss in performance is a whole lot better than 50%.

My system is 1.5 years old with Dell OEM stuff. Planning on another 1gb of RDRAM, a new Graphics card, and just bought 200gb EIDE/ATA WD HD (for $50 with rebates at Office Max).

Went through the Graphics Purchase Guide and all the archives. Glad I did. Don't play a lot of games anymore, but my sons do. Looks like I don't need a high end screeming card, but it would be nice to keep up with the DX 9.0c games that are coming out. The Verto 6800STD only has 128mb of DDR, but I'll have to check the bit rate to see if the manufacturer hosed the card to less than 256bit rate.

Looks like the 6600GT would also fit my needs, but haven't seen it around.

Pavelow

Dell 8250, 2.4ghzCPU, 512 RDRAM, 120gbATA/100, GeForce4 MX 420, SBLive5.1, SamSung 48xCDRW, LiteOn 851S DVDRW
November 27, 2004 2:19:59 PM

Quote:
My system is 1.5 years old with Dell OEM stuff. Planning on another 1gb of RDRAM, a new Graphics card, and just bought 200gb EIDE/ATA WD HD (for $50 with rebates at Office Max).

a gig of rambus is going to cost you around 400$! that's definitely not worth it. Your better off selling that system and building a new one. That memory and cpu is going to be bottlenecking you.

Watch out for the <b><font color=red>bloody</font color=red></b> Fanboys!

AMD64 2800+ :: MSI Neo-Fis2r :: 1024mb Kingmax ddr400 :: Sapphire 9800pro 128mb :: 10K WD Raptor

Addicted, finally.
November 27, 2004 2:36:31 PM

Good point. I priced the RDRAM. The 512mb sticks are still $245 each and you have to buy in pairs, $490. But the 256mb sticks are only about $80 each, $160 pair. I think I'll just go with 512mb upgrade.

Absolutely have no need to upgrade the mother board/CPU system at this time. Figure I've got another 3-5 years on this one. I don't buy the latest games when they come out. And I don't need a screaming system to do Video editing.

I still play Descent3 on this system. It runs quite well in 16bit graphics. Would like to play it smoothly in 32bit. Also would like to play some of the one year old DX 9 games in 32bit.

Nope, not going to go with a new system. Heck, I still have my old Compaq Presario 9660, 233mhzCPU, 104mb FastPage RAM, with 2mb 2D video & Vodoo2 12mb add on.

I play the old Descent 1 & 2 games on it in 3dfx modified.

Never been a fan of Halo or Doom. I'd rather see space ships blow up instead of body jiblets.

Oh, and BTW, the Verto 6800STD has the 256bit processing. So, looks like I might buy it today at CompUSA.

Pavelow

Dell 8250, mother board i850e chipset w/ 4xAGP slot, 2.4ghzCPU, 512 RDRAM, 120gbATA/100, GeForce4 MX 420, SBLive5.1, SamSung 48xCDRW, LiteOn 851S DVDRW<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Pavelow on 11/27/04 11:39 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
November 27, 2004 2:45:05 PM

cefosky,

That information can be found when reading FAQs, archives, and Guides...and the manufacturer's box. All 8x AGP can work in 4x AGP slots. The performance drop is the unkown.

Pavelow

Dell 8250, mother board i850e chipset w/ 4xAGP slot, 2.4ghzCPU, 512 RDRAM, 120gbATA/100, GeForce4 MX 420, SBLive5.1, SamSung 48xCDRW, LiteOn 851S DVDRW
November 27, 2004 5:19:32 PM

Errr, a 8x card will work if it will run @ that voltage eg 1.5v, 3.3v etc... so some 8x will not run in a 4x slot as there is too high a voltage going through the slot (the cards spec will say what AGP levels it will run at... ie 1/2/4/8x, delete as appropiate)

Trust me I know what I'm doing... ooops, grab the cat...
a b U Graphics card
a b V Motherboard
November 27, 2004 8:15:43 PM

Quote:
so some 8x will not run in a 4x slot as there is too high a voltage going through the slot

You've brought this lie up before, but it was simply a mistake until I corrected you the first time!

ALL AGP8x cards are 1.5v/0.8v compliant. MOST are 3.3v/1.5v/0.8v compliant. The information you linked to the last time was blatently wrong.

The reason? There are no cards that <i>only</i> run AGP8x/AGP3.0. All support <b>multiple modes</b> of operation, either 8x/4x or 8x/4x/2x, using AGP 3.0/2.0 or AGP3.0/2.0/1.0, meaning ALL support either 1.5v/0.8v or 3.3v/1.5v/0.8v.

<font color=blue>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to a hero as big as Crashman!</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to an ego as large as Crashman's!</font color=red>
a b U Graphics card
a b V Motherboard
November 27, 2004 8:20:47 PM

The performance drop of using 4x rather than 8x is dependant on several factors and should therefor only be considered at it's maximum and average. For example, the 9800 Pro showed maximum performance differences of less than 5% (highest settings in newest games) and average performance differences of 0% (normal settings). As hardware gets more powerfull (and games put that power to use), the performance differences become more pronounced, so that a 6800GT is showing maximum performance losses of around 8% as I recall. You can check the benchmarks of various sites to get exact numbers for the games you're considering.

<font color=blue>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to a hero as big as Crashman!</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to an ego as large as Crashman's!</font color=red>
November 30, 2004 3:44:44 PM

Excellent info from everyone. Thanks. And now I have the difficulty of upgrading my power supply from the meek 250w that I found in the case to say a 450w. Don't they come with standard PINs and wire connections? Or should I pay throught the nose and get one from Dell?

Pavelow

Dell 8250, mother board i850e chipset w/ 4xAGP slot, 2.4ghzCPU, 512 RDRAM, 120gbATA/100, GeForce4 MX 420, SBLive5.1, SamSung 48xCDRW, LiteOn 851S DVDRW
a b U Graphics card
a b V Motherboard
November 30, 2004 11:15:20 PM

Most P4 Dells use standard power supplies. Most PIII and earlier Dells used proprietary power supplies with the same style ATX connector. Back then, putting a standard power supply in a Dell would usually set the power supply on fire or simply blow circuits. Since the P4 systems, most Dells have been standard.

Look inside to figure out what you have. In all likelyhood you have a standard power supply in your Dell. If so, it should have the ATX connector, a 4-pin ATX12v connector (square), and should NOT be using a 6-pin flat connector.

<font color=blue>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to a hero as big as Crashman!</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to an ego as large as Crashman's!</font color=red>
December 1, 2004 9:41:53 PM

I continued the PSU discussion on the appropriate board. My solution is expensive, $149 for exact fit upgrade at PC Power & Cooling...TurboCool 425 Dell Delux (ATX). Has all the proprietary pin connections.

Pavelow

Dell 8250, mother board i850e chipset w/ 4xAGP slot, 2.4ghzCPU, 512 RDRAM, 120gbATA/100, GeForce4 MX 420, SBLive5.1, SamSung 48xCDRW, LiteOn 851S DVDRW
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