Rant: Two Bit Score Misleading Auction

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

This really has us pissed off, just wanted to vent a little bit and get
some other opinions on this. We just purchased a Super Pac-Man CPO
from Two Bit on eBay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6186232415

Got the item quickly, well packed, installed to find it was way crooked
(the printing, not our application). Called Two Bit and they claim it
is a factory second and was described.

Quickly glanced over the auction description. Read it twice, didn't
notice any language stating this. On the third pass I see in real fine
print at the bottom that it "may be blemished, scratched or returned
merchandise"....

I *guess* they did disclose this, but the way they did seems very
unethical and dishonest, just wanted to get everyone else's opinion.
Do we have a right to be pissed?

We asked for another overlay and they're charging us full price and
basically said too bad on the auction. I must say they've lost future
business from us...

So any other opinions, are we wrong here?

If anything a word of advice read Two Bits fine print (after reading
the text that describes it as a perfect item) before bidding on their
eBay items.

Thanks for listening,
Anthony
21 answers Last reply
More about rant score misleading auction
  1. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    I completely agree, the only explanation for the fine print at the very
    bottom after describing it as exact is to intentionally rip people
    off. I'd trade negs with him if it was me, but then I don't sell stuff
    on ebay.
  2. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    It stands up in court, but is a deceitful practice. They know their
    clientele are discriminating and couldn't offer a product (at least in
    this instance) that would measure up to standard, so in order to dump
    it on an unsuspecting consumer they "sublimated" the fact that it
    wasn't spec.
    The best thing you can do in the future before bidding is send some
    emails or make a phonecall to a seller and ask some explicit questions
    about the condition of the merchandise. You'll be satisfied or you'll
    know it's junk or doesn't quite measure up. If you're lied to or
    misguided after making conact with the seller, then you have a case for
    fraud.

    Jeff
  3. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    If all they state is "blemished, scratched or returned merchandise"
    then they didn't describe it as CROOKED. I'd argue that crooked is not
    blemished since the very defination of blemished pertains to a minor
    defect. I'd argue that scratched doesn't equal crooked, and returned
    merchandise has nothing to do with crooked either.

    Even their fine print doesn't absolve them of the fault with the
    merchandise unless they include the term crooked or a reasonably
    descriptive term that would lead the buyer to conclude there is more
    than a minor defect.

    Using the term blemish to describe a major defect like crooked
    printing, is like saying there's a "door ding" when you meant to say
    "totaled".

    Just my 2c worth.

    Mike Doyle
  4. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    I'm not sticking up for them, but it has always stated that at the bottom of
    their auctions. I won a set of pac side and front art from them and it was
    fine, but I must say I was a bit worried that something was going to be
    wrong with it when I received it. Maybe someone in the group has an extra
    CPO and can hook you up with a good price. I can't think of ever reading
    any positive feedback in the group regarding them.

    Scott


    "Anthony Pietrak" <anthony@quarterarcade.com> wrote in message
    news:1120060169.204622.160600@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
    >
    > This really has us pissed off, just wanted to vent a little bit and get
    > some other opinions on this. We just purchased a Super Pac-Man CPO
    > from Two Bit on eBay:
    > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6186232415
    >
    > Got the item quickly, well packed, installed to find it was way crooked
    > (the printing, not our application). Called Two Bit and they claim it
    > is a factory second and was described.
    >
    > Quickly glanced over the auction description. Read it twice, didn't
    > notice any language stating this. On the third pass I see in real fine
    > print at the bottom that it "may be blemished, scratched or returned
    > merchandise"....
    >
    > I *guess* they did disclose this, but the way they did seems very
    > unethical and dishonest, just wanted to get everyone else's opinion.
    > Do we have a right to be pissed?
    >
    > We asked for another overlay and they're charging us full price and
    > basically said too bad on the auction. I must say they've lost future
    > business from us...
    >
    > So any other opinions, are we wrong here?
    >
    > If anything a word of advice read Two Bits fine print (after reading
    > the text that describes it as a perfect item) before bidding on their
    > eBay items.
    >
    > Thanks for listening,
    > Anthony
    >
  5. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    Two bit bob is the king of misleading and underhanded dealing on eBay and in
    general. If you absolutely must do business with him, better make sure you
    check and double check what you're buying. In this particular case, his eBay
    auction was misleading and is grounds for a complaint and possible refund
    through eBay. Its a pain in the butt process but it might be worth it.
    Good luck.

    Chris M

    <syncbus@gmail.com> wrote in message
    news:1120067895.753669.162280@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
    > If all they state is "blemished, scratched or returned merchandise"
    > then they didn't describe it as CROOKED. I'd argue that crooked is not
    > blemished since the very defination of blemished pertains to a minor
    > defect. I'd argue that scratched doesn't equal crooked, and returned
    > merchandise has nothing to do with crooked either.
    >
    > Even their fine print doesn't absolve them of the fault with the
    > merchandise unless they include the term crooked or a reasonably
    > descriptive term that would lead the buyer to conclude there is more
    > than a minor defect.
    >
    > Using the term blemish to describe a major defect like crooked
    > printing, is like saying there's a "door ding" when you meant to say
    > "totaled".
    >
    > Just my 2c worth.
    >
    > Mike Doyle
    >
  6. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    Well.. not to defend the seller or anything, but it does say "otherwise
    of second quality" in the fine print, in addition to "blemishes" etc.
    They also do invite you to ask them about the exact condition of the
    item.

    Now OTOH, they say "It is an exact reproduction of the original part as
    to color, material, size and quality" which is obviously not true if
    the type is crooked. And the picture in the auction must not be of
    what they sold you, and that is not explained either. So I guess at
    the very least, the description is contradictory and they should at
    least get negative feedback out of it!
  7. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    We were more than happy to pay the difference plus shipping for a new
    one in perfect condition, but they said no way. We had to order
    another one at full price plus shipping as we really need the overlay
    for game (especially now since we stripped the panel).

    The more I think about it, the more the fact that the text at bottom
    completely contradicts the text at top annoys me. Also the fact that
    the text at the top that describes it has brand new, perfect is some
    much larger than the text at the bottom. Obviously they're doing this
    to intentionally mislead people.

    We'll probably pursue the issue with eBay. You'd think a company like
    this would have enough business sense to give us a refund on the dud
    and sell us the new one.

    Anthony
  8. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    This is justdown right Wrong! No matter how you slice it you can't get
    argue this is fair and above board. Defects in a product should be in
    the description....not in a disclaimer. Even as-is is usually up front
    and in the main description. They don't say that the picture is not
    the one for sale so I would insist on "THAT" one. But, what is really
    odd is they have great feedback! One would think with this type of
    business tactics they would have dozens of negitives....Idunno....
  9. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    I think they have been totally misleading.

    "It is an exact reproduction of the original part as to color,
    material, size and quality"

    I thought that twobits where better than this. They are blackening the
    Namco name.
    If they have seconds they should be sold as seconds. Really they should
    be destroyed
    as they do i the factory is its not up to standard.

    Thats the cost of doing business
  10. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    I almost purchased the full set of Pac art on eBay from the same seller.

    I was fortunate enough to read the whole auction and noticed the fine
    print at the bottom.

    I immediately e-mailed the seller asking for a better description of the
    defect, blemish, etc.

    As yet, I am still waiting on a reply - from the sound of it, I might be
    waiting awhile.

    Glad this thread appeared before I shelled out the $179.00. :-)

    Steve
  11. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    Well I guess what is really upsetting about it is they suggest that
    this was a customer return. So they already attempted to sell this
    once at full price?!
  12. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    You definately got ripped.....thats just wrong...

    --
    ArcadeForever.


    "Anthony Pietrak" <anthony@quarterarcade.com> wrote in message
    news:1120060169.204622.160600@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
    >
    > This really has us pissed off, just wanted to vent a little bit and get
    > some other opinions on this. We just purchased a Super Pac-Man CPO
    > from Two Bit on eBay:
    > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6186232415
    >
    > Got the item quickly, well packed, installed to find it was way crooked
    > (the printing, not our application). Called Two Bit and they claim it
    > is a factory second and was described.
    >
    > Quickly glanced over the auction description. Read it twice, didn't
    > notice any language stating this. On the third pass I see in real fine
    > print at the bottom that it "may be blemished, scratched or returned
    > merchandise"....
    >
    > I *guess* they did disclose this, but the way they did seems very
    > unethical and dishonest, just wanted to get everyone else's opinion.
    > Do we have a right to be pissed?
    >
    > We asked for another overlay and they're charging us full price and
    > basically said too bad on the auction. I must say they've lost future
    > business from us...
    >
    > So any other opinions, are we wrong here?
    >
    > If anything a word of advice read Two Bits fine print (after reading
    > the text that describes it as a perfect item) before bidding on their
    > eBay items.
    >
    > Thanks for listening,
    > Anthony
    >
  13. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    > We were more than happy to pay the difference plus shipping for a new
    > one in perfect condition, but they said no way.

    They're fools for not allowing that.

    > We'll probably pursue the issue with eBay. You'd think a company like
    > this would have enough business sense to give us a refund on the dud
    > and sell us the new one.

    Yes, I would think they would have enough common sense not to screw around
    an estabslished game seller. Even at $25 total for BOTH cpo's, they are
    probably still making money. The bottom line I think is that what they did
    is bad business, even if they had the right to do it.
  14. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    Anthony Pietrak <anthony@quarterarcade.com> wrote:
    :
    : This really has us pissed off, just wanted to vent a little bit and get
    : some other opinions on this. We just purchased a Super Pac-Man CPO
    : from Two Bit on eBay:
    : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6186232415
    :
    : Got the item quickly, well packed, installed to find it was way crooked
    : (the printing, not our application). Called Two Bit and they claim it
    : is a factory second and was described.
    :
    : Quickly glanced over the auction description. Read it twice, didn't
    : notice any language stating this. On the third pass I see in real fine
    : print at the bottom that it "may be blemished, scratched or returned
    : merchandise"....
    :
    : I *guess* they did disclose this, but the way they did seems very
    : unethical and dishonest, just wanted to get everyone else's opinion.
    : Do we have a right to be pissed?
    :
    : We asked for another overlay and they're charging us full price and
    : basically said too bad on the auction. I must say they've lost future
    : business from us...
    :
    : So any other opinions, are we wrong here?
    :
    : If anything a word of advice read Two Bits fine print (after reading
    : the text that describes it as a perfect item) before bidding on their
    : eBay items.

    I woudln't consider a crooked misprint to be a 'blemish'.

    --
    Mark Spaeth mspaeth@mtl.mit.edu
    50 Vassar St., #38.265 mspaeth@mit.edu
    Cambridge, MA 02139
    (617) 452-2354 http://rgvac.978.org/~mspaeth
  15. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    Funny how a known and disliked person like twobits gets slammed over and
    over for something when he *did* disclose that the item may not be perfect
    and the recent Matty-T / ShatterProof issue where the issue wasn't even
    disclosed the same people respond totally different.. Wierd.. same
    situation in my eyes. Seller didn't disclose everything he should have, so
    both should be equally guilty of deception right?

    /b

    "Mark C. Spaeth" <mspaeth@plancherel.mit.edu> wrote in message
    news:42c2fed6$0$563$b45e6eb0@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu...
    > Anthony Pietrak <anthony@quarterarcade.com> wrote:
    > :
    > : This really has us pissed off, just wanted to vent a little bit and get
    > : some other opinions on this. We just purchased a Super Pac-Man CPO
    > : from Two Bit on eBay:
    > : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6186232415
    > :
    > : Got the item quickly, well packed, installed to find it was way crooked
    > : (the printing, not our application). Called Two Bit and they claim it
    > : is a factory second and was described.
    > :
    > : Quickly glanced over the auction description. Read it twice, didn't
    > : notice any language stating this. On the third pass I see in real fine
    > : print at the bottom that it "may be blemished, scratched or returned
    > : merchandise"....
    > :
    > : I *guess* they did disclose this, but the way they did seems very
    > : unethical and dishonest, just wanted to get everyone else's opinion.
    > : Do we have a right to be pissed?
    > :
    > : We asked for another overlay and they're charging us full price and
    > : basically said too bad on the auction. I must say they've lost future
    > : business from us...
    > :
    > : So any other opinions, are we wrong here?
    > :
    > : If anything a word of advice read Two Bits fine print (after reading
    > : the text that describes it as a perfect item) before bidding on their
    > : eBay items.
    >
    > I woudln't consider a crooked misprint to be a 'blemish'.
    >
    > --
    > Mark Spaeth mspaeth@mtl.mit.edu
    > 50 Vassar St., #38.265 mspaeth@mit.edu
    > Cambridge, MA 02139
    > (617) 452-2354 http://rgvac.978.org/~mspaeth
    >
  16. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    well as i mentioned. it's the same sort of 'cover your ass' kind of thing
    with the 'as-is' descriptions.
    though in this case the item pictured clearly wasn't the item being offered
    and the fine print in the first example wasn't buried at the bottom of the
    page in 8 pt type.
    pretty much the same thing though.

    k


    "prOk" <bsonej@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:X9GdnTsy4J43mV7fRVn-oA@usa2net.net...
    > Funny how a known and disliked person like twobits gets slammed over and
    > over for something when he *did* disclose that the item may not be perfect
    > and the recent Matty-T / ShatterProof issue where the issue wasn't even
    > disclosed the same people respond totally different.. Wierd.. same
    > situation in my eyes. Seller didn't disclose everything he should have,
    so
    > both should be equally guilty of deception right?
    >
    > /b
    >
    > "Mark C. Spaeth" <mspaeth@plancherel.mit.edu> wrote in message
    > news:42c2fed6$0$563$b45e6eb0@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu...
    > > Anthony Pietrak <anthony@quarterarcade.com> wrote:
    > > :
    > > : This really has us pissed off, just wanted to vent a little bit and
    get
    > > : some other opinions on this. We just purchased a Super Pac-Man CPO
    > > : from Two Bit on eBay:
    > > : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6186232415
    > > :
    > > : Got the item quickly, well packed, installed to find it was way
    crooked
    > > : (the printing, not our application). Called Two Bit and they claim it
    > > : is a factory second and was described.
    > > :
    > > : Quickly glanced over the auction description. Read it twice, didn't
    > > : notice any language stating this. On the third pass I see in real
    fine
    > > : print at the bottom that it "may be blemished, scratched or returned
    > > : merchandise"....
    > > :
    > > : I *guess* they did disclose this, but the way they did seems very
    > > : unethical and dishonest, just wanted to get everyone else's opinion.
    > > : Do we have a right to be pissed?
    > > :
    > > : We asked for another overlay and they're charging us full price and
    > > : basically said too bad on the auction. I must say they've lost future
    > > : business from us...
    > > :
    > > : So any other opinions, are we wrong here?
    > > :
    > > : If anything a word of advice read Two Bits fine print (after reading
    > > : the text that describes it as a perfect item) before bidding on their
    > > : eBay items.
    > >
    > > I woudln't consider a crooked misprint to be a 'blemish'.
    > >
    > > --
    > > Mark Spaeth mspaeth@mtl.mit.edu
    > > 50 Vassar St., #38.265 mspaeth@mit.edu
    > > Cambridge, MA 02139
    > > (617) 452-2354 http://rgvac.978.org/~mspaeth
    > >
    >
    >
  17. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    i think this is part of a problem with ebay feedback.
    if the buyer has 100% positive feedback with not as many entries as the
    seller in this case...
    the buyer is usually intimidated into just not leaving ANY feedback for fear
    of reprisal.

    sometimes i'd rather just leave no feedback since neutrals mean sqaut.. then
    have someone hit me with a negative when i did nothing wrong and they're mad
    i left them a neg.

    k.


    <emailgsr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:1120080524.509944.202120@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
    > This is justdown right Wrong! No matter how you slice it you can't get
    > argue this is fair and above board. Defects in a product should be in
    > the description....not in a disclaimer. Even as-is is usually up front
    > and in the main description. They don't say that the picture is not
    > the one for sale so I would insist on "THAT" one. But, what is really
    > odd is they have great feedback! One would think with this type of
    > business tactics they would have dozens of negitives....Idunno....
    >
  18. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    I have thought about purchasing from them on Ebay before because
    the "seamingly" same items sell for cheaper on Ebay than their
    website. Never have I seen the fine print that you spoke of. I am
    glad now that I never purchased anything from them, I bet 99% of
    people that buy dont relize that either. I cant stand business like
    this.

    ----------------------------------------------
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    * Binary Usenet Leeching Made Easy
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  19. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    syncbus@gmail.com wrote:
    > If all they state is "blemished, scratched or returned merchandise"
    > then they didn't describe it as CROOKED. I'd argue that crooked is not
    > blemished since the very defination of blemished pertains to a minor
    > defect. I'd argue that scratched doesn't equal crooked, and returned
    > merchandise has nothing to do with crooked either.
    >
    > Even their fine print doesn't absolve them of the fault with the
    > merchandise unless they include the term crooked or a reasonably
    > descriptive term that would lead the buyer to conclude there is more
    > than a minor defect.
    >
    > Using the term blemish to describe a major defect like crooked
    > printing, is like saying there's a "door ding" when you meant to say
    > "totaled".
    >
    > Just my 2c worth.
    >
    > Mike Doyle

    I used to have my pinball pcbs repaired by them, but their service and
    attitudes were so bad that after I received a wpc driver board back
    that they said was fine, and then found out it was not, I finally
    decided to never do business with them again. Their response to the
    board having a problem with it and them telling me it was fine after I
    shipped it to them twice was that sometimes their test fixtures don't
    pick up all problems. ??????? Now when people ask who can repair pcbs
    etc.... I say look here on the post, but at all costs stay away from
    Two Bit . :( Bob (Bobbys World)
  20. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    > We'll probably pursue the issue with eBay. You'd think a company like
    > this would have enough business sense to give us a refund on the dud
    > and sell us the new one.

    Twobit also probably doesn't realize that by treating you poorly they've invited
    a major negative thread on RGVAC. That's going to lose them a whole batch
    of customers, at least for a while. The lesson (IMHO): don't treat customers
    badly, because it'll reflect on your bottom line. It's simple - but yet so many folks
    don't seem to grasp it...

    Alex
    ----
    ayeckley@elektronforge.com
    www.elektronforge.com
  21. Archived from groups: rec.games.video.arcade.collecting (More info?)

    <matrix42@sover.net> wrote in message
    news:1120123853.864838.13040@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
    > I used to have my pinball pcbs repaired by them, but their service and
    > attitudes were so bad that after I received a wpc driver board back
    > that they said was fine, and then found out it was not, I finally
    > decided to never do business with them again.

    Hey, I just wanted to say - if anyone wants someone nice to repair their
    pinball PCBs, try Les Huckeba at www.hucks.biz He is absolutely the nicest
    most patient guy on the planet, and did a great job fixing my pinball PCBs.

    Greg
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