what is manufacturing process? (microns)
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SoDNighthawk
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A die typically is a glass diode containing the network of traces (connections).
CPU's and other optical components are made from die.
The die starts life as a chemical mixture of materials that are mixed together to grow into many complex layers of glass. (Crystal) Crystalline structures grown in the lab for electronics purposes.
The die need to be later cut from the wafer they are grown together in using what is called die_gas_saw (machine that cuts the glass crystalline structures free from each other out of the main wafer.
The term TRACE goes back to circuit boards that have copper connections through the layers of fibreglass. They are of various thickness and widths depending on how much voltage/current they need to carry through the circuit board.
Basically a trace is a wire from point A to point B, in Engineering terms we call any wire or trace a conductor.
A die cannot function by it's self it has to be installed into a supporting substrate so the very small connections in the die can be connected to larger more usable physical connections on the substrate.
A single average hair on your head is 3.6 Microns thick. A typical DIE has conductors as small as 1 nano micron or in most cases the connections between the die and the substrate are around 3.3 microns. Workable at around 800 times magnification by skilled optical workers. Micro tools used to tune or adjust die onto the substrates. (basically brain surgery)
A substrate is generally made out of materials that look and feel like hard porcelain but are made of unique materials only used in electronics manufacturing.
Once a DIE is mated to a substrate by manufacturing robots that can physically hold and position parts to around 2 microns the component can be mated into other parts of the hardware to form a working component such as a CPU or a clock or mux or OD5 module used in internet connections in main frame servers using fibre optic connections.
The main duty of any DIE is to send and receive data and do it very quickly. How each die works is a patent under the company that had their engineers design it.
As a quick example a MUX die used in internet connections along with a driver die will send your email to another computer by taking the email apart into bits of data the clock die will add a clock timer to the data being sent and at the other end the receiving die will reassemble your email exactly as it was sent simply by re-assembling the data using the clock cycle it was sent with.
This is about as easy a description as I can give you without going Nuts on Engineering terms. I also cant explain exactly how components work my hands are tied so to speak.
<font color=red>GOD</font color=red> <font color=orange>LOVES</font color=orange> <font color=red>CANADA</font color=red>
CPU's and other optical components are made from die.
The die starts life as a chemical mixture of materials that are mixed together to grow into many complex layers of glass. (Crystal) Crystalline structures grown in the lab for electronics purposes.
The die need to be later cut from the wafer they are grown together in using what is called die_gas_saw (machine that cuts the glass crystalline structures free from each other out of the main wafer.
The term TRACE goes back to circuit boards that have copper connections through the layers of fibreglass. They are of various thickness and widths depending on how much voltage/current they need to carry through the circuit board.
Basically a trace is a wire from point A to point B, in Engineering terms we call any wire or trace a conductor.
A die cannot function by it's self it has to be installed into a supporting substrate so the very small connections in the die can be connected to larger more usable physical connections on the substrate.
A single average hair on your head is 3.6 Microns thick. A typical DIE has conductors as small as 1 nano micron or in most cases the connections between the die and the substrate are around 3.3 microns. Workable at around 800 times magnification by skilled optical workers. Micro tools used to tune or adjust die onto the substrates. (basically brain surgery)
A substrate is generally made out of materials that look and feel like hard porcelain but are made of unique materials only used in electronics manufacturing.
Once a DIE is mated to a substrate by manufacturing robots that can physically hold and position parts to around 2 microns the component can be mated into other parts of the hardware to form a working component such as a CPU or a clock or mux or OD5 module used in internet connections in main frame servers using fibre optic connections.
The main duty of any DIE is to send and receive data and do it very quickly. How each die works is a patent under the company that had their engineers design it.
As a quick example a MUX die used in internet connections along with a driver die will send your email to another computer by taking the email apart into bits of data the clock die will add a clock timer to the data being sent and at the other end the receiving die will reassemble your email exactly as it was sent simply by re-assembling the data using the clock cycle it was sent with.
This is about as easy a description as I can give you without going Nuts on Engineering terms. I also cant explain exactly how components work my hands are tied so to speak.
<font color=red>GOD</font color=red> <font color=orange>LOVES</font color=orange> <font color=red>CANADA</font color=red>
cleeve
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- Mar 7, 2003
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Holy crap! SoD knows his shite.
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TheGreatGrapeApe
Champion
- Feb 18, 2003
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Makes you wonder doesn't it. :lol:
Did he get someone to help him, or WTF is with all his other posts!?! :tongue:
- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK
Did he get someone to help him, or WTF is with all his other posts!?! :tongue:
- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK
SoDNighthawk
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I have mentioned I do this sort of thing for a living more then a few times.
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TheGreatGrapeApe
Champion
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LOL!
It's just funny based on your 'Other' posts.
Don't take that too seriously man, I prefer these posts of yours.
Glad to see there's a few of us in tech related fields here, too many of my friends had to flee south to get jobs.
Anywhoo, just taking the pi$$ out of ya', no worries.
- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK
It's just funny based on your 'Other' posts.
Don't take that too seriously man, I prefer these posts of yours.
Glad to see there's a few of us in tech related fields here, too many of my friends had to flee south to get jobs.
Anywhoo, just taking the pi$$ out of ya', no worries.
- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK
SoDNighthawk
Splendid
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Well you can try to kick the piss out of me, but remember I am old and you might hit your foot on a kidney stone.
<font color=red>GOD</font color=red> <font color=orange>LOVES</font color=orange> <font color=red>CANADA</font color=red>
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TheGreatGrapeApe
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Nah, not kick the Pi$$, out of ya, take the Pi$$ out of ya. Poke fun for shits and giggles. More of an Eastern/Maritime (and British) phrase I guess.
Anywhoo, no problems, just razing you like we razz, scammy, dh, Eden, phial and any other long timer who's now spending more time in the Other section than here with the rest of the great un-washed. :lol:
Well, nice blurb dude, definitely raised my respect bar for ya'.
Don't take the rest seriously though. If I weren't at work, I could've blamed the Rickards or Keith's, but it must just be my nature.
- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK
Anywhoo, no problems, just razing you like we razz, scammy, dh, Eden, phial and any other long timer who's now spending more time in the Other section than here with the rest of the great un-washed. :lol:
Well, nice blurb dude, definitely raised my respect bar for ya'.
Don't take the rest seriously though. If I weren't at work, I could've blamed the Rickards or Keith's, but it must just be my nature.
- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK
mrface
Champion
whats your point?
"Never underestimate the predictability of Stupidity."
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>
<font color=blue>R.I.P. O.D.B.</font color=blue>
"Never underestimate the predictability of Stupidity."
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>
<font color=blue>R.I.P. O.D.B.</font color=blue>
mrface
Champion
heheh your obsessed w/ post counts arent u?
"Never underestimate the predictability of Stupidity."
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>
<font color=blue>R.I.P. O.D.B.</font color=blue>
"Never underestimate the predictability of Stupidity."
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>
<font color=blue>R.I.P. O.D.B.</font color=blue>
TheGreatGrapeApe
Champion
- Feb 18, 2003
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Why cause they post long threads just to increase their post count?
Hey, you just gave me an idea.
- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK
mrface
Champion
so do you think our convo here should count towards posts?
"Never underestimate the predictability of Stupidity."
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>
<font color=blue>R.I.P. O.D.B.</font color=blue>
"Never underestimate the predictability of Stupidity."
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>
<font color=blue>R.I.P. O.D.B.</font color=blue>
mrface
Champion
exactly my point.
"Never underestimate the predictability of Stupidity."
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>
<font color=blue>R.I.P. O.D.B.</font color=blue>
"Never underestimate the predictability of Stupidity."
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Psychotic Sociopath.}=-</A>
<font color=blue>R.I.P. O.D.B.</font color=blue>
SoDNighthawk
Splendid
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Ok I did not break this computer chip called a PLCC J-Hook lead component I got this part out of a manufacturing robot after it got jammed in the tape feeder cutters and was snapped in half.
I bothered to get this based on your post and the first picture shows the tiny glass DIE in the middle of the copper carriage that supports the component leads out to the J-Hook leads that are soldered to the circuit board.
This first picture is out of my Scanner at 1600 DPI.
<A HREF="http://img148.exs.cx/img148/1308/dieinsubstrate23jg.jpg" target="_new">http://img148.exs.cx/img148/1308/dieinsubstrate23jg.jpg</A>
The following 2 pictures are from my digital camera at 18 X's digital magnification.
<A HREF="http://img76.exs.cx/img76/9970/im00000428gu.jpg" target="_new">http://img76.exs.cx/img76/9970/im00000428gu.jpg</A>
<A HREF="http://img76.exs.cx/img76/1482/im00000525xu.jpg" target="_new">http://img76.exs.cx/img76/1482/im00000525xu.jpg</A>
As a point of reference you will see a pencil tip under the component.
The small crystal rectangular shaped die in the in the middle of the copper supporting substrate and component package is very small. If I get the chance to show you a snapshot from under an 800 X's magnification Endoscope I can let you see that on that small DIE there is writing on it. In fact there is on some of these DIE almost as much text on them as in this post. Now imagine how small the structures are within the DIE.
As to further inform you as to how sensitive those structures are a 5 volt discharge of what is called ESD discharge will blow those small traces and the die will fail. To further inform you that as human beings we do not even feel an electro static shock until 5000 volts you can very easily damage one of these components and never even know you did it.
Electronic components are rated for extreme temperature handling and they are very robust and mechanical strong as indicated that a robots cutting jaws severed this one in half. You can get them soaking wet in water dry them out and they still work. You could shoot this part out of a slingshot into a cardboard box and it would still work.
Just don't walk across your carpet in socks and pick it up it's toast
ESD failure is the greatest cost in electronic components industry world wide. DOA or dead on arrival hardware. These components in the industry do have a shelf life and if they exceed the shelf life or the package they are delivered in shows on sample litmus paper that they were subject to moisture they are not used in production. To much of anything is not a good thing.
<font color=red>GOD</font color=red> <font color=orange>LOVES</font color=orange> <font color=red>CANADA</font color=red>
I bothered to get this based on your post and the first picture shows the tiny glass DIE in the middle of the copper carriage that supports the component leads out to the J-Hook leads that are soldered to the circuit board.
This first picture is out of my Scanner at 1600 DPI.
<A HREF="http://img148.exs.cx/img148/1308/dieinsubstrate23jg.jpg" target="_new">http://img148.exs.cx/img148/1308/dieinsubstrate23jg.jpg</A>
The following 2 pictures are from my digital camera at 18 X's digital magnification.
<A HREF="http://img76.exs.cx/img76/9970/im00000428gu.jpg" target="_new">http://img76.exs.cx/img76/9970/im00000428gu.jpg</A>
<A HREF="http://img76.exs.cx/img76/1482/im00000525xu.jpg" target="_new">http://img76.exs.cx/img76/1482/im00000525xu.jpg</A>
As a point of reference you will see a pencil tip under the component.
The small crystal rectangular shaped die in the in the middle of the copper supporting substrate and component package is very small. If I get the chance to show you a snapshot from under an 800 X's magnification Endoscope I can let you see that on that small DIE there is writing on it. In fact there is on some of these DIE almost as much text on them as in this post. Now imagine how small the structures are within the DIE.
As to further inform you as to how sensitive those structures are a 5 volt discharge of what is called ESD discharge will blow those small traces and the die will fail. To further inform you that as human beings we do not even feel an electro static shock until 5000 volts you can very easily damage one of these components and never even know you did it.
Electronic components are rated for extreme temperature handling and they are very robust and mechanical strong as indicated that a robots cutting jaws severed this one in half. You can get them soaking wet in water dry them out and they still work. You could shoot this part out of a slingshot into a cardboard box and it would still work.
Just don't walk across your carpet in socks and pick it up it's toast
ESD failure is the greatest cost in electronic components industry world wide. DOA or dead on arrival hardware. These components in the industry do have a shelf life and if they exceed the shelf life or the package they are delivered in shows on sample litmus paper that they were subject to moisture they are not used in production. To much of anything is not a good thing.
<font color=red>GOD</font color=red> <font color=orange>LOVES</font color=orange> <font color=red>CANADA</font color=red>
thank you very much 
I really appreciate the enormous help I've been getting here at THG. (I think I learned more in a week than I would have in a month if I had just tried to Google it all up hehe)
-------------------------------------------------
Athlon64 Newcastle, 2800+, 640KB Cache, 1800 MHz
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I really appreciate the enormous help I've been getting here at THG. (I think I learned more in a week than I would have in a month if I had just tried to Google it all up hehe)
-------------------------------------------------
Athlon64 Newcastle, 2800+, 640KB Cache, 1800 MHz
MSI K8M Neo-V, VIA K8M800 + 8237 chipset
Sapphire Atlantis Radeon 9600 256MB
SoDNighthawk
Splendid
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Where I work we develop and build DIE we also build circuit boards using many different manufacturers components.
The robots that assemble these components onto the circuit boards are some serious pieces of equipment for handling such small sensitive components.
The reason that component was cut in half was it got stuck in a feeder jam. Some placement robots have up to 200 feeders on them and the feeders each have a real of electronic components on them that looks exactly like an old style movie real.
As the real is fed through to the robotics placement heads and each component is consumed to a location on a circuit board you get the waste tape that feeds off the real. In this case some of the tape that gets cut off automatically deep within the robot got jammed in the cutting jaws.
It probably caused a sensor to detect a parts exhaust on that feeder and stopped the robot. The tech running the robot knew the reel was not empty and selected to re-start the robot and the tape skipped on the feeder being cut and advanced the component into the cutting jaws.
In small chip resistors or capacitors 1 block steps on a stopped robot are ok but the operator should have known not to 1 block step a large component but by that time this computer chip (plcc) got the chop.
<font color=red>GOD</font color=red> <font color=orange>LOVES</font color=orange> <font color=red>CANADA</font color=red>
The robots that assemble these components onto the circuit boards are some serious pieces of equipment for handling such small sensitive components.
The reason that component was cut in half was it got stuck in a feeder jam. Some placement robots have up to 200 feeders on them and the feeders each have a real of electronic components on them that looks exactly like an old style movie real.
As the real is fed through to the robotics placement heads and each component is consumed to a location on a circuit board you get the waste tape that feeds off the real. In this case some of the tape that gets cut off automatically deep within the robot got jammed in the cutting jaws.
It probably caused a sensor to detect a parts exhaust on that feeder and stopped the robot. The tech running the robot knew the reel was not empty and selected to re-start the robot and the tape skipped on the feeder being cut and advanced the component into the cutting jaws.
In small chip resistors or capacitors 1 block steps on a stopped robot are ok but the operator should have known not to 1 block step a large component but by that time this computer chip (plcc) got the chop.
<font color=red>GOD</font color=red> <font color=orange>LOVES</font color=orange> <font color=red>CANADA</font color=red>
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