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X800PRO faster than X800XL

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April 2, 2005 1:34:31 AM

Please correct me if im missing something, but I thought that the XL with the extra pipelines was superior to the X800PRO. Its not!!!!!! The X800 Pro is kicking the XL's butt in the ORB! The highest that I have seen the core on an XL is 499 they are clocking the cores on the PRO's in the 550 range. This SUX!

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More about : x800pro faster x800xl

a b U Graphics card
April 2, 2005 1:42:49 AM

The pipelines are the advanatage for the X800XL, the Low-K dialectric insulation is the overclocking advanatage for the PRO.

If the X800XL were on a 110nm LowK core, you'd likely see speeds far beyond the X850XTPE, but as the freqency increases so does the circuit crosstalk, and voila disharmony at a far lower speed. I wouldn't be surprised though if ATi also under volted the core or something in order to keep it held back a bit. I haven't heard of voltmods offering that much yet, but it's still early.

It is surprising that in many cases the 130nm GF6800GT and Ultras can OC farther than the X800XL, since they too do not have the benifit of Low-Kd. I wouldn't be surprised if there's hidden ponteital yet. Then again who knows how they packed those transistors, maybe there's a built in 'flaw' to keep them from getting too good for their own good? :wink:


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April 2, 2005 1:46:16 AM

They arent talking about anything significant as far as volt mods in the ORB. If you hear of something let me know. Its going to be a long night. It may come down to putting the whole friggin system in the freezer :lol: 

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a b U Graphics card
April 2, 2005 1:50:33 AM

LOL!

MMMmm RadeonCicle!

Volt mods usually come a bit after the reference designs, once people have pocked around enough with probes etc. I wouldn't be surprised if somehow the X800XL isn't undervolted or something, but could be something else. Or maybe the X800xl just SUXOR! :tongue:

Long live the GMA900! :evil: 


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new"><font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
a b U Graphics card
April 2, 2005 3:27:17 AM

There's a VoltMOD I've seen, but the guys at Rage3D don't see much return from doing it (other than heat). I think it's still more geared for the R420 and R480 cards IMO;

<A HREF="http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/voltmo..." target="_new">http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/voltmo...;/A>



- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new"><font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil: 
April 2, 2005 3:39:08 AM

Thanks, I will check it out. The temps dropped outside around 15C and its made a big difference with the OC. I just cranked out 5848 in 3DMark05 464/610. Im going to wait a couple more hours and see if the temp drops some more. Im not far from catching the top spot in the X800XL category.

Intel P4 550(3.4)<font color=red>@4.2 posted 4.8</font color=red>
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Ballistix PC2 5300@<font color=red>DDR2 780</font color=red>
ATI Radeon X800XL <font color=red>459/609</font color=red>
TT 680W PSU
April 2, 2005 3:58:17 AM

The ole governer. Just remove it. Well said reply.
Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
April 2, 2005 7:04:58 AM

I hope GGA is right about the potential volt mod :frown:

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April 2, 2005 8:31:46 AM

Its still a great card, but it really chaps my arse that the X800Pro is kicking the X800XL all over the place. Have you built that system yet?

I hit 4.8 in case I didnt tell you. barely even got a screen shot before it crashed.


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Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
April 2, 2005 6:09:57 PM

Halfway, grumble grumble... kids, grumble grumble... work, grumble grumble... I'm gonna try to finish today before i go to work at 3pm PST. It's now 11AM PST. Gives me probably about 2 hours. God, my body aches right now. I've been trying to dig a 100' drainage ditch in my yard to deal with some water pooling around my house when it rains, and it SUCKS!! Apparaently my house was built on a fuggin granite quarry or something...*rubs sore back*

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April 4, 2005 2:48:42 AM

Actually that is the Voltmod that was done to the the X800XL thats in the lead in the ORB. Thanks for the link. Im close enough that this may be all I need to jump in the lead. Im running 5th right now, and some of the members over there have already started to flame me. Some of those guys have a complex about outsiders putting pressure on the #1 spots. I made sure that they new where home was for me :wink: Notice that I plugged THG in the title <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/servlet/Index?pageid=/orb..." target="_new">http://service.futuremark.com/servlet/Index?pageid=/orb...;/A> Im The 5th or 6th one down the list.

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April 4, 2005 3:23:28 AM

Thanks! It takes some work keeping up with the AMD crowd. Im running 5th in 03 also, but 01 is a totally different story. Im not even on the radar in that one. What is it about 01 that would keep me so far off the chart. From the scores it seems that PCMark 04 is geared heavely in Intels favor, it must lean on high clock speed.

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April 4, 2005 3:26:34 AM

Im thinking about loading a clean install of Win 2KPro and giving it a shot just to see what happens.

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April 4, 2005 5:29:44 AM

well you kinda deserve that.. upgrading from a pro to the XL.. what the hell were you thinking

they arent THAT far apart in performance anyway!

its like me goign from 6800GTs to a Ultra.. who gives a damn.. shouldve waited for next gen and got something that really is an improvement

waste of time and money to take those little itty bitty jumps, this one turned out to be REALLY small it seems
April 4, 2005 5:40:54 AM

Who said that I upgraded from a PRO to an XL? I didnt say that. I have never owned an X800 PRO.

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April 4, 2005 6:01:14 AM

I started this post for 2 reasons. One was because of that long wait for the X800XL to not only hit the shelves but also to get down to the MSRP. There are a ton of X800 PROS beating the X800XL in benchmarks. I think that out of the box the XL is the better card, but the core doesnt OC nearly as well as the PRO. So basically I could have had a more competitive OCing card alot sooner, or at least thats the impression that I am under at this point. BTW building and maintaining a high performance system has become my #1 Hobby[/cough addiction] :tongue: I really could care less about how well it plays games because not only do I really suck at games I dont even own one. :lol:  I build a few systems on the side for people and it actually has turned into a nice little sideline income, but more important than that, it has become a very good way for me to unwind and chill out after dealing with patients and their problems. Im a wannabe shrink-in-training :tongue:

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Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
April 4, 2005 6:48:59 AM

Ok now that's just wrong man, WRONG!! :tongue:

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Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
April 4, 2005 6:52:47 AM

Jesus man, you're a friggin machine. What's with the drive to be #1 anyways? Must be a lot of tension at work, eh? Damn, I'll be surprised if you <b> DON'T </b> take the lead. Btw, she's all built, just have to setup BIOS and install everything, and then it should be good. I swear next time I do this I'm gonna take a week vacation when I have all my parts, lol :smile:

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April 4, 2005 8:22:32 AM

The only reason that im after the #1 spot hard and heavy is because as soon as I posted a top 10 score some of the locals started making pissy little comments about me. There are some nice people there that are more than happy to help if you have a question, but there are some real pricks also. I will send you a link to one of the flames, I havent looked at the thread again since I blasted the guy back. It should be interesting. The competition thing started between me and 2 other guys that dont know me. They are super nice and gave some tips that put me ahead of their scores we were trading spots every 5 or 6 hours and it was all good. Then all of a sudden some of the others saw me "The Noob" and its gotten a little out of hand. Im through trying to defend myself, thats what they want me to do. Im just going to keep scratching at the scores. They havent said anything directly, but one the guys thats actually cool sent me an e-mail telling me that some of the heat was because I had TomsHardware in the title of my score "Intel P4 550 mozzartusm@TomsHardware" From the sound of it a couple of them think that we are all losers. Of course you understand that this just motivates me even more.

Congrats on the system, take your time and be very methodical when you begin to install the OS and then drivers and software. Think about how you want the system to be setup before you start. Some planning or just thinking it out will go a long way at this point. Maybe im just to picky about the way I set mine up. One of my big issues is having to many programs in my startup.
BTW, it looks like the 5Ghz plan is not going to happen. I finally got to 4.8 although very unstable and have come to the conclusion that the Mobo is OCd as far as it will go. Thats the end of the line as far as I know so thats it for the clock speed, but im still rippin SiSandra apart.

SiSandra Memory benchmark= Ram INT/RAM FLOAT - 11513MBs/12205MBs this is one of the higher scores but not the highest. Crucial Ballistix 256X2 PC2 5300@DDR2 780 4/4/4/6/4 Voltage 2.0

Intel P4 550(3.4)<font color=red>@4.2 posted 4.8</font color=red>
ASUS P5AD2-E-Prem
Ballistix PC2 5300@<font color=red>DDR2 780</font color=red>
ATI Radeon X800XL <font color=red>459/609</font color=red>
TT 680W PSU
April 4, 2005 8:58:10 AM

Keep chipping away at it dude!

______________
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April 4, 2005 9:01:32 AM

I just saw on the Drudge report that Prince Charles isnt planning on changing his wedding date even if it falls on the same day as the Popes funneral. How is that going to set with the British public?

Intel P4 550(3.4)<font color=red>@4.2 posted 4.8</font color=red>
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Ballistix PC2 5300@<font color=red>DDR2 780</font color=red>
ATI Radeon X800XL <font color=red>459/609</font color=red>
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April 4, 2005 9:07:42 AM

Personally I don't care. I think the idea of having a royal family is archaic.

As for the publics reaction, I'm not sure as I didn't even know about it until about 30secs ago when you posted! :lol: 

______________
Welcome to my Shed of Pleasure
April 4, 2005 9:11:42 AM

um, britain is more protestant than catholic so it wont be as big a deal as you think ;) 

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great minds think alike, fools seldom differ...
April 4, 2005 9:12:27 AM

Britain isn't very religious.

______________
Welcome to my Shed of Pleasure
April 4, 2005 9:35:42 AM

how can you say britain isn't very religious, there are religions from everywhere here, britain isn't considered religious because there isn't any religion which is a vast majority

well thats the cities anyway, rural areas of the country everyone my age is and athiest or whatnot

----------------------------------------------
great minds think alike, fools seldom differ...
April 4, 2005 9:52:56 AM

Sounds like BS to me. The pope will lie in state for 9 days. That's the standard. While it may be poor form for Chuck to wed during this period, they aint going to move the pope's burial ahead, just to conflict with the wedding.
April 4, 2005 10:08:48 AM

Quote:
how can you say britain isn't very religious


I live here, I can say what I like!

In Britain our grass is orange, and the sky is red.

______________
Welcome to my Shed of Pleasure
April 4, 2005 10:50:22 AM

i live here aswell so i guess that means i can complain how i like, and you forgot the water is brown

----------------------------------------------
great minds think alike, fools seldom differ...
April 4, 2005 11:10:49 AM

Indeed, takes like coke!

______________
Welcome to my Shed of Pleasure
April 4, 2005 11:33:24 AM

Water that tastes like coke!? I'm moving to Britain! :tongue:

Some people are like slinkies....
Not really good for anything but you cant help smile when you see one tumble down the stairs.
April 4, 2005 1:08:19 PM

By that he means that after drinking you puke, get agitated, sweat profusely and get paranoid.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>
April 4, 2005 1:18:02 PM

Sounds like someone is alergic to coke!

______________
Welcome to my Shed of Pleasure
April 4, 2005 3:21:51 PM

Jock Icthy :lol: 

Intel P4 550(3.4)<font color=red>@4.2 posted 4.8</font color=red>
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TT 680W PSU
April 4, 2005 6:43:17 PM

coke's bad enough even if your not allergic to it

thats just my mind set on the thing cos i got a brace and worry about my teeth a whole lot more that i need to

and to be on topic i have a sapphire x800pro (non-vivo) and it does clock to 550/580 with relative ease on artic silencer 4 with artic silver, still not daring to do the pipe unlock yet cos i got an earlier board

----------------------------------------------
great minds think alike, fools seldom differ...
April 4, 2005 7:03:58 PM

still not a good idea to upgrade this gen, this late.

but if you dont play games.... hmmmmmmmm

its your money

(kind of an expensive hobby esp if you dont play games)
April 4, 2005 9:45:05 PM

They mix in alcohol as well? Definately moving.

Some people are like slinkies....
Not really good for anything but you cant help smile when you see one tumble down the stairs.
a b U Graphics card
April 4, 2005 10:44:54 PM

Nice, Dude you're top 5 :cool: (6th Suxor! :wink: )

I'm sure that my card 'would've been top 5 when I got it (ocs rather well, especially for air), but since the low-k core XTs also appear as R9600series, there's no chance in heck anymore.

It'll be interesting to see what the volt mod has to bring you, but I think even bios tweaking will expose more, there' just something not quite right about the apparent limits on the XL IMO.

The thing about the X800PRO versus XL is also the price differences, still more expensive for a PRO buy a healthy margin too.

Even in games, wehn OC'ed it'll have advanatages over the OC'ed X800PRO, however a moded and OC'd pro will rock it of course.

I'd be interested in seeing where it is that the X800PRO is getting this huge benifit. I know there's unrealistic weight on Test 1 (Wings of Fury) and as such clockspeed maycome into greater play than pipeline width. I'll check it out a little more tonight if I can grab a minute.

Anywhoo good luck with the benchmarking, interesting ou don't play games. Benchmarking has it's own rewards that's for sure, and to me it's no different than tinkering with a car.

Also good luck with the Psych-work. Are you Jungian, Freudian or new school principally? :wink:



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April 5, 2005 1:23:12 AM

Can I scratch them?

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April 5, 2005 7:17:22 AM

I wouldnt get another card in the same range, if I was getting another one it would be a larger jump or nothing at all.

Intel P4 550(3.4)<font color=red>@4.2 posted 4.8</font color=red>
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Ballistix PC2 5300@<font color=red>DDR2 780</font color=red>
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April 5, 2005 9:27:39 AM

Im trying to comfortable with the idea of doing the volt mod. This is a first for me so im still a bit nervous. I just got an e-mail from the guy thats in either 3rd or 4th place. He boosted his core about 18 Mhz with the mod, but then fried the card the very next night. He said that he got some lead on the wrong contact.

Quote:
Also good luck with the Psych-work. Are you Jungian, Freudian or new school principally?

LOL, I call it Psycho-work because I feel pyscho after some of the sessions. Depending on who is listening at the time[/Professors] I am probably more Fruedian. If im on campus then the answer would be "Watson" Behaviorism. The colleges have become so liberal these days that there isnt very much toleration for someone that thinks otherwise. I know how to play the game, and if it means letting them beleive that I buy into their school of thought then so-be-it. Frued is the father of Psychology in my opinion and I beleive that every school of thought since his time should be thankful that he came along when he did. Im of the opinion that no matter how different the other schools of thought may be, they probably exist today thanks to him. Some branched off of his work, others directly rejected his work. Either way, the sparks that were ignited fuled the fire that is responsible for Psychology today. Did you know that Frued hated being called or thought of as a Psychiatrist/Psychologist? He enjoyed Philosophy, but concentrated on Biology and Physiology. He started his private practice as a Nuerologist. He also loved cocain and worked hard to promote it. He used it to treat many things such as depression and fatigue. He often is blamed for todays drug problems but in reality isnt the source. Who could have know at the time how dangerous it would turn out to be.

Quote:
Anywhoo good luck with the benchmarking, interesting ou don't play games. Benchmarking has it's own rewards that's for sure, and to me it's no different than tinkering with a car.



LOL, the only thing that I am probably worse at playing would be basketball. Video games tend to make me a very unpleasent person. I pressure tuned my first Atari :lol:  In case your not familiar with the concept of how to pressure tune a system: When you have had all that you can take and it still doesnt work the way you think that it should, try throwing it agianst a brick wall[Pressure tuned} :tongue: Ocing took the place of my tinkering on cars. Now that I dont live in the same town as my family, I dont have the luxury of a car shop :frown:


Intel P4 550(3.4)<font color=red>@4.2 posted 4.8</font color=red>
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Ballistix PC2 5300@<font color=red>DDR2 780</font color=red>
ATI Radeon X800XL <font color=red>459/609</font color=red>
TT 680W PSU
April 5, 2005 6:46:04 PM

"He also loved cocain and worked hard to promote it. He used it to treat many things such as depression and fatigue. He often is blamed for todays drug problems but in reality isnt the source. Who could have know at the time how dangerous it would turn out to be."

Well, dentists used to use it, and why do you think it's called COCA-Cola?
Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
April 6, 2005 7:45:52 AM

Dude, you go kick their asses man, and rub it in good when you do :smile:

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April 6, 2005 12:35:39 PM

Dude, Cocaine was criminilized due to politicians reacting from the outcry of southerners fear of the Negro's. They claimed that Negro's were getting high on cocaine and working up themselves in a frenzy and ravaging and raping their white wives. They used this law to repress and enslave the blacks further. It was not based on medical statistics or even reality.

And Pot was outlawed to persecute the Mexicans, even though medical field reported and found no negative effects at the time. The facts were disregarded in lieu of prejudice.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>
April 6, 2005 6:16:07 PM

Quote:
chaps my arse




ROFLMAO!@!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


*splatters coffee everywheres*

-------
Work sucks.
April 6, 2005 7:19:23 PM

Quote:
still not a good idea to upgrade this gen, this late.

The best time to upgrade is when your current setup isn't doing what you need it to do, which depends on the individual. Besides that, next-gen cards won't be announced until June at the earliest, and then won't arrive for a while after that.

Upgrading at the tail-end of a gen is also often a good idea because prices are typically quite a bit lower than they were previously. To get X800XL performance, you used to have to buy an X800XT or at least a 6800GT, which were *much* more expensive when this gen was fresh...

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April 8, 2005 5:08:38 AM

Quote:
Well, dentists used to use it, and why do you think it's called COCA-Cola?

Whats your point Sherlock? Its still used for medical purposes. Thanks for the Coca-Cola tidbit of info, but I doubt very seirously that you would even have a clue as to what the different bottles looked like back then. I just happen to live 40 miles from one of the oldest Coca=Cola botteling sites. That would be the old Saratoga factory if you want to double-check me. Ive even got one of the bottles. Its got one very small chip on it, other than that its in very good condition.

Intel P4 550(3.4)<font color=red>@4.2 posted 4.8</font color=red>
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Ballistix PC2 5300@<font color=red>DDR2 780</font color=red>
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April 8, 2005 5:15:01 AM

Quote:
*splatters coffee everywheres*

So does that make my post NSFW :lol: 

Intel P4 550(3.4)<font color=red>@4.2 posted 4.8</font color=red>
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TT 680W PSU
April 8, 2005 6:06:26 AM

Nah I think its better to get in on new gens early on. Yeah you pay a bit more, but you enjoy it longer too while its still a hot item.

If you upgrade on tail end cycle like now.. you get a decent card at a decent price but you end up getting sometimes totally trumped on the new gen and you have old features.

It really doesnt matter how you upgrade (late or early) I dont really care BUT..
on the X800s they make no sense at all, right now.

<i><b>A 2003 feature set in 2005 doesnt make sense. </b></i>
Wait for R520 if you demand on ATI. Otherwise, the GF6 lineup is the smarter choice (and if you are going PCIE, you always have the SLI option which is the fastest way to go possible).

But most ppl that have waited this long prob dont upgrade every gen anyway.
If you want to see the newer games <i><b>the way developers intended</b></i>, and want to continue to see them the way the devs intended (see SC:Chaos Theory), you need DX9C hardware.

Buy for todays standards, not yesterdays. Esp if you waited this long and will likely wait till the end of the NEXT cycle at earliest to upgrade again (at earliest).
!