Is XFX a good choice?

[bob_torrent]

I will let you answer the question for yourselves!

Here is my experience...

Last week ordered an "XFX Geforce 6800 GT 256MB GDDR Dual DVI and TV Out" graphics card.

Here XFX's own website claims 1000MHz DDR data rate specifically!
http://www.xfxforce.com/media/seriesSpecSheet/4d56cbb0042f756901043029e8280003/Product Sheet (T40A_UDF).pdf
Numerous other pages on XFX's website claims the 1000MHz data rate GDDR3 memory speed!

In fact I can find no information to the contrary!

The online retailer claims the same!

The BOX the card arrived in claims 1000MHz memory data rate!

The card it's self though is only 900MHz memory data rate (450MHz clock speed)!!!!!!!!!

So I thought... "Odd.... I'd better contact them; perhaps it has been flashed with the wrong BIOS!"

So I contacted them the day AFTER buying the card... Anyway to cut an already long post short... The outcome after 1 week... XFX have stated that they are now shipping this new variant of a Geforce 6800 GT that only runs at 900 MHz, but I should feel free to overclock it to the 1000 MHz speeds! They have not updated the model number and every piece of literature claims the memory runs at 1000MHz... Very odd! (Doesn’t overclocking invalidate my warrantee????)

I have returned the card in disgust and have ordered a PNY card as a replacement! I hope that is not afflicted with the same 10% speed drop!

I have informed the UK Advertising standards association, and hopefully they will investigate and take action against what, I perceive, as possibly down right fraudulent sales tactics!!!! (My opinion only and I hope I am proved wrong as this is disgusting!)

Anyway.. I will never have any dealings with XFX again, so long as I live, and I really could not recommend them to any of my friends! I could understand if they brought out a new variant, but they shouldn't try to pass this off as the old variant!

Rob O.


Edited to clarify I meant he memory data rate speeds here!<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by bob_torrent on 09/16/05 10:38 AM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[bob_torrent]

Sorry! Clarified my random mumblinga above a little!

;-)

Rob

 

[HardWareBoss]

Those dirty RATS!!!!!!! You let them know about their goof. Then they tell you the new cards will be 900.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

^^^^^^^ THATS THE CARD I MAY BE GETTING IN MY RMA REPLACEMENT?

(\__/)
(='.'=) <A HREF="http://snipurl.com/fxwr" target="_new">Welcome to the House of Horrors, welcome to the House of a 1000 Corpses</A>
(")_(")

 

[davemar14]

Hmm, better check to see if my eVGA 6800GT is running at 350/1000.

My System:
<A HREF="http://amdgamingrig.dyndns.org" target="_new">http://amdgamingrig.dyndns.org</A>

 

[bob_torrent]

Well YOU may not care, once you've overclocked your card!

Personally I don't bother overclocking anything. System stability is far more important too me, and yes I know many people out there overclock with no problems! I just choose not too... (My personal choice!)

But lets say you do overclock, remember that if they are running the card at 900MHz it's probably because they have slower RAM installed, to save a few measly bucks and inflate their margins on the card. So it's going to hinder your overclocking too! Do you care now?

Personally, I beleive, this is fraudulent! Put 900MHz on the box, on the advert and then let you choose if you want that... Or will you buy the competitors that is already runnign at 1000MHz? (Same price! In fact the PNY card I'm swapping too is £10 CHEAPER!!!!!!!!!!!)

Ok lets put it this way! You buy a 2 liter car, only to find out it's an 1.8 liter with a 2.0 badge! (10% again).
Would you care? I think you may! But there WILL be someone out there that doesn't! I'm sure! ;-)

Cheers
Rob

 

[bob_torrent]

I don't need to be educated about this... I understand perfectly how overclocking works! Yoru assumign the card is underclocked!!! Why woudl they do that? It saves them no money... The only reason, I can see them doing this woudl be because for some reason (cost saving) the cards do not all run reliably at 1000 MHz.... Either slower memory or differenet PCB manufacturer, where the quality aint quite as good and signal integraty is an issue at 1000MHz... So to prevent a too large a number of returns they have slowed it down a little... Either way, it's goign to be for cost reasons they have done this....

I haven't taken the HSF off to take a look at the RAM as I didn't want to risk not being able to RMA the card...

There is no point just "underclocking" the card... Whats a typical speed these cards shoudl overlcock too anyway?

PS. I understand semiconductors to a greater level than you give me credit for mate! Don't make sweeping statments like that please!

PPS. STUF? Whats that stand for? Or did you mean STFU?(I coudl work that one out!) ;-)

Rob

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by bob_torrent on 09/19/05 06:01 AM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[bob_torrent]

Is the HSF usually thermal epoxy'd on or just thermal grease?

If ti's easy enough to remove and replace, I will....

Why would they start, mid product, to underclock the cards?

Rob

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by bob_torrent on 09/19/05 06:44 AM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[Unolocogringo]

Not allways Wusy. My BFG6800 OC was labeled as having 2.2ns ram. Couldnt for the life of me get it running at 2.2ns-900mhz speeds.
Pulled of the heatsink and Ta-Da 2.8ns memory on the card.
Had to file a complaint with the BBB, and threaten to sue.
Finally they ship me a used card in a used static bag, with a bent slot connector.
My last purchase from BFG.

I aint signing nothing!!!

 

[function9]

If there's one company that would make XFX look like quality it's PNY.

 

[Unolocogringo]

The 2 PNY cards that I have owned were actually RElabeled MSI cards.

I aint signing nothing!!!

 

[pauldh]

My first, only, and last <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=440381#440381" target="_new">XFX GF6 card</A>.

<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=658042" target="_new">3DMark05</A> <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=3781954" target="_new">3DMark03</A>

 

[mpasternak]

I've had a similar experience with RMA'ing a XFX card.

XFX is in fact a brand name for a parts manufacturer named Pine Technologies. Huge company. well, my 6600GT blew up unexpectedly. First I called the number on their website and got "SAMTACK COMPUTERS". which is Pine Technologies Local canadian branch. they told me i shouldnt call them, they don't deal with end users. they made me go back to the store even though it was 4 months later. the store did RMA it for me and sent it in to XFX / Pine / Samtack. which, funnily is litterally down the street from me. i was told by Pine to expect 2 - 4 weeks for turnaround. well, 3 months later they returned the card to me. Not even the same card. they gave me a BFG 6600GT OC instead. which after I researched found out that BFG is ALSO a brand name for PINE. so when you buy a XFX or BFG card you're in fact buying a Pine Product.

to make matters worse... back in the mid 90s I worked for Samtack Computers in their production / RMA department... I should have KNOWN this type of turnaround was expected.


well in the 3 months it took for them to get my my card back i broke down and bought a 6800GT, but I avoided XFX this time,

 

[RX8]

I must be dam lucky my xfx OC all the way to 880mhz, core to 380 and unlocked and its a xfx, plus the ram is supposidly 1.6ns.

<font color=purple> Dont expect Miracles humans made them. The blind are easily led by the blind </font color=purple>

 

[RX8]

as soon as this rma arrived i slapped artic 5 cooler on numb nuts but then again you only have a 9800pro, and air cooler on your cpu. GENIUS \/

<font color=purple> Dont expect Miracles humans made them. The blind are easily led by the blind </font color=purple>

 

[bob_torrent]

Well I hope the PNY doesn't let me down even if it isn't as good a quality as XFX!

I am measuring quality in this case in relation too, are they delivering what they claim! I'm not interested in overclockign the card at all!

I might take a look under the RAM heatsink to see what the memory is... But to be honest, I'm not sure I can be bothered! Basically it isn't what they advertised... i.e. I feel ripped off!

Rob

 

[bob_torrent]

I hope your right mate! i really do!

I'm definately going to take a look under the "cover" at the memory on the XFX card.... I'm interested now... Especially as 2.2ns RAM would match with a 900MHz DDR data rate almost perfectly!

This is my theory.. They have swapped the memory to 2.2ns as this saves them a few bucks.... Then they just keep quiet and sell it as a full-up GT. This way they increase their profit margins in a VERY competative pricing market!

Especially as in ALL likely hood it will o/c to 1000MHz fine! Also not everyone will notice the 900Mhz memory speed! And those that due are most likely to o/c anyway.....

But I acknowledge that you may be right about it being 2.0ns samsung chips.... In which case I see no reason for them to change the spec like that... Other than the fact that a mid-life cost reduction has somehow effected the reliability when run at 1000MHz....

If it's not a mid-life cost reduction that they have attempted then I can't see what it does for them and can only harm their credibility!

But having worked in this industry for a while now, I have come to recognise that it's not always the brightest sparks that run the show, so I can't rule it out! ;-)

Anyway.. Will get back once I have investigated... purely in the interests of the "community" of course!

Rob

 

[bob_torrent]

Well Wusy.... You were right...

The memory chips ont eh board are Samsung K4J5532QF-GC20....

So go bloody figure! They must bee testing the boards and speed binning the boards due to SI issues then... Otherwise they are shooting themselves int eh bloody foot slowing the cards down for no reason!

It's nuts!

But anyway, this card goes back today to be replaced with a PNY version... So long it runs at 1000MHz I will be happy....

I also tried overclocking the XFX card.. it seemed to work fine at 1000MHz, but at 1030 MHz the machine crashed!

The GPU got too 419 MHz too....

(I was just curious... What speeds do people typically get out of the DDR when OC'ing????)

PS they hadn't used white thermal past.. i was some weird "fabric" patches... Certianly not phase change material.. It was very fiberouse, but was impregnated with something too... Liek having a cosy blanket between the memory and HSF....

Odd...

Anwyay just though I would confirm your prior statemnt Samsung K4J5532QF-GC20's!

Rob

 

[bob_torrent]

Well it sounds pretty much in line with what the card gave then.... 1030MHz DDR....

Well the XFX is now.... GONE... (just been picked up) and I now have the PNY sat here... If it runs 1000MHz stock.. I'll be happy... plus it was cheaper! So much for XFX selling underclocked cards cheaper than the comp.!

Go figure... XFX.. What are you doing underclocking cards?????

Sheesh!

Well thansk for your help anway wusy!

PS. Be carefull your heads gettign that big your gonna start having difficulty walking through door ways!

;-)


Rob

 

[mrface]

There's nothing I do not know...

you dont know who your real father is; btw tell your mom i said hello. :lol:

<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com/nutshell.mp3" target="_new">"Like a scrotum, there it is in a nutshell."</A>
<font color=red>Roll Tide!</font color=red>
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Apathetic As<i></i>shole.}=-</A>

 

[bob_torrent]

Well the PNY card doesn't look as impressive as the XFX card... But it is 1000MHz by default... The XFX seemed to have more components around the power supply area of the board....

Also just out of interest I decided to install coolbits... PNY overclocks much higher...

Just doing a quick test, as I did with the XFX card.

XFX card max OC:
Memory - 1.03Ghz
GPU - 410MHz
PNY Card max OC:
Memory - 1.1Ghz
GPU - 420Mhz
The 1.1GHz memory clock is the first value I tried, it ran stable for 4 runs through 3DMark and I've not pushed it any higher, maybe it will go, maybe it won't....

At 420Mhz GPU everything comes falling down after maybe 10 minutes of 3D Mark.. So possibly cooling? At 430MHz I get artifacting pretty quickly in 3DMark 2005..... (30 seconds....)

Anyway I'm back to stock speeds now! and very happy with my RMA exchnage/purchase!

As there is no real differnece (components wise) between XFX and PNY, I cna only GUESS that during final production testing of the boards, XFX underclocks any cards that are marginal, or fail under worst case conditions and sells them regardless gaining a production yield of saleable parts! They claim they should be a few $$$$'s cheaper. But I didn't see that in the price, as the PNY was actually cheaper than XFX... Also there is NO way to tell the 1000MHz cards from the 900Mhz cards! Decidedly dodgy practice from the guys at XFX either way!!!!!!

From support call with XFX they claim it was a mix-up... But they weren't exactly falling overthemselves to put the situation right! I gave them ample opportunity!

Go PNY... Stop trying to rip me off XFX (just my opinion!)

Rob

 

[bob_torrent]

You sure your not Scottish? They are renown for being tight! (penny pinching)


;-)

(Just kidding, if there are any Scotts reading this!)

Rob

 

[pauldh]

No offense will be taken. I've got a quilt-wearing, bag-pipe playing brother-in-law. He'll be the first to proudly say Scotts are cheap.

<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=658042" target="_new">3DMark05</A> <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=3781954" target="_new">3DMark03</A>

 

[mrface]

but youre not jewish...[/poor taste]

<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com/nutshell.mp3" target="_new">"Like a scrotum, there it is in a nutshell."</A>
<font color=red>Roll Tide!</font color=red>
<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Apathetic As<i></i>shole.}=-</A>

 

[mpasternak]

HEY!!!
I take offense to that jewishc omment

we're not cheap! we just don't know the meaning of retail