R520 Design 'revealed' by the InQ

TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 1, 2005

In additional to Mozzartusm's post the InQ has revealed some interesting bits about the R520's core design.

<A HREF="http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26619" target="_new">http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26619</A>

Interesting to see if their progression helps with culling before processing which the GF6 and 7 do rather well and it's one of the things that helps them in D3.

Interesting design and I'd like to know how the features interact because it's likely far from linear.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

Gamer_369 · Oct 1, 2005

Just from a first glance, it looks ideally efficient, and the Ultra threading dispatching processor seems to appear attractive, as well:

From INQ -

Before the data comes from the setup engine to be processed in the pixel Shader engine, it will meet an "Ultra" threading dispatch processor. It’s a key part of the chip that will tell R520 data where to go, and the data will hear and obey.

mozzartusm · Oct 1, 2005

How long after the first ones go out do you think it will be before all of the simple folk will have a chance at buying one?

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Gamer_369 · Oct 1, 2005

ATI said that they want a release / oriented launch much like nVidia's. So hopefully it shouldn't take long to obtain them. We'll have to wait and see, but I guarantee consumers will be much more anal about making sure they get products on/near the release this time, as nVidia elegantly did so.

Edited by Gamer_369 on 09/30/05 09:02 PM.

TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 1, 2005

The 512MB XT I think will be as scarce as an XTPE last generation. The 256MB XT I would expect to be as available as the GTX (as in expect to see alot online, but none in retail initially). Of course they could surprise and have larger volume, but if so, then I'd ask "why wait 'til October, when you could've done last day of September?"

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

Gamer_369 · Oct 1, 2005

That's what the INQ. reported a few days/weeks ago, but I couldn't find the article so I just abstained from stating it.

But that would make sense why nV is emphasizing their 512 MB verions as "Available at launch."

TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 1, 2005

Something else from HKePC's site is HDMI support at the chip level. This could offer some interesting option for output, especially on a refreshed AIW card;

<A HREF="http://www.hkepc.com/bbs/attachment.php?aid=290632&noupdate=yes" target="_new">http://www.hkepc.com/bbs/attachment.php?aid=290632&noupdate=yes</A>

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 1, 2005

Yeah, but the whole thing is 'available at launch' is a pretty sketchy term. With the G70, they weren't available everywhere, they were available online, with then becoming available in retail stores. This allows ramping up of distribution (online e-tailers have a central shipping site/source). It's the right strategy, because those who go to BestBuy and simply get it because it's NEW and the most expensive, wouldn't give a Rat's-A$$ if it were last year's model because they don't know better. Whereas the people who DO care about availabilty at launch are the people who would go and shop online if they had to. Of course this limits people like HB's nice 90-day trial policy from BestBuy. :lol:

I suspect that nV launching 512MB is nothing more than telling BFG/XFX/eVGA, ok boys, start making the 512MB model. So getting those to market wouldn't be a shock, and the 256MB market has already largely been satisfied where people wouldn't switch to 512 from 256mb. But if ATi launches both at the prices that have been quoted, you can imagine alot of people simply saying I want the 512MB version, because it's obviously better (which would be the case for a change), hopefully alot of the people impressed by numbers and not by researched model type, will buy the X1800LEs and leave the XTs to the market that can appreciate them.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

RX8 · Oct 1, 2005

i second the X1800LE over the x1800xt, if i had the money i would probably buy the le it just seems better value to the already stated scarce amounts of xt`s reported.

 Dont expect Miracles humans made them. The blind are easily led by the blind

RX8 · Oct 1, 2005

i second the X1800LE over the x1800xt, if i had the money i would probably buy the le it just seems better value to the already stated scarce amounts of xt`s reported.

 Dont expect Miracles humans made them. The blind are easily led by the blind

TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 1, 2005

You obviously misunderstood what I was saying, but if you want the LE, well then go ahead. But don't say it as if you're seconding a recommendation, because if you would choose the LE over the XT without the modability option, then that's the opposite of what most people here would do (escept maye Wusy who'd try to mod it until the end :lol: ).

BTW, who says they XTs were reported scarce, no one has hard evidence of availability yet. It makes ecnmic sense that there will be less, but who knows how many will be available of any of them.

BTW, nice double post. :tongue:

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

RX8 · Oct 1, 2005

this forum has a buy then it would not let be delete.

It was reported in the inq cant be bothered to give u the link use the search option, the amount of xt chips are low because of the production rate of good quality chips which ATI has been having some trouble with for god knows how long, you should know that!

yes i would choose the le and mod it to what ever the highest it could go.

 Dont expect Miracles humans made them. The blind are easily led by the blind

TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 1, 2005

Hmm production problems were old news, now.
The newer news is that production has moved on. And you should know that.

As for the InQ you and anyone else can go to the graphics section, no need to use the search function, which you seem to have problems with.

As for the forum which you also seem to be having trouble with, I was able to post and delete to re-bump the thread so what you say is not true and I think you need to locate the "delete this post" button.

EDIT: <A HREF="http://img273.imageshack.us/img273/750/bumped7df.jpg" target="_new">Here's the post I just deleted to show it working</A>

As for choosing the LE to mod it, well we know how effective that's been of late with the better lockdowns by both nV and ATi. Even Wusy can attest to the fact that modable versions are getting rarer than before. And second I wouldn't bother getting an LE with 256MB because the memory is unlikely to be the same expensive stuff on the XT. But of course being a big number that'll impress some people regardless of speed.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

Edited by TheGreatGrapeApe on 10/01/05 11:50 AM.

RX8 · Oct 1, 2005

You know what i dont give a sh1t, seriuosly cut the sarcasum because for a 40year old you dont act like one (if your not 40 u sure look 40 in your photos). and since when do you work for ati? they have had so many problems with the "UP AND COMING RELEASES" it makes nvidia look like proffessionals!

As for the double post when i spotted it i went to edit and delete 3x it kept saying some error message and contact webmaster, may be you need to take a cold shower and take some1s word for it! ohh i forgot you know better.

yes i have a problem clicking on the graphics section, your so smart you worked it out your a clever old man, wow your so smart you must have a IQ of 196 or more.

 Dont expect Miracles humans made them. The blind are easily led by the blind

TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 2, 2005

(if your not 40 u sure look 40 in your photos)

Like it matters?

You wanna go down this road? Fine...

If I'm 40 or 14 it still doesn't change what was said here, nor my opinion of you, yours of me, or anyone else's of either of us. That you would think so means that regardless of your age you've still a ways to go before you balls drop and you reach maturity.

and since when do you work for ati?

And since when do you work for ATi that you should know anything outside of that that is reported by 3rd parties? Either you ignore the releaes becuase you do not see them or you have a personal motivation.

they have had so many problems with the "UP AND COMING RELEASES" it makes nvidia look like proffessionals!

That may be so, but you tend to go beyond assumptions on the release than any of the reports would offer and with an easily visible goal. You want to talk about the problems of Q1 as if they were today's, and then you build on that. When I make statements I back them up, and don't use a cop out of not being able to use a search function, and when I make assumptions it's pretty clear and even then they are supported with facts and logic.

As for the double post when i spotted it i went to edit and delete 3x it kept saying some error message and contact webmaster, may be you need to take a cold shower and take some1s word for it! ohh i forgot you know better.

You're the one who obviously needs a cold shower to clear your head. As for taking your word for it, why would I, whenever there's need for some kind of support for your statement it's lacking. Editing the post is just another easily shown example, whereas the InQ is easily explained, and your mention of it's article smacks of the outdated reference it is.

yes i have a problem clicking on the graphics section, your so smart you worked it out your a clever old man, wow your so smart you must have a IQ of 196 or more.

If you were smarter maybe you'd know that IQ means very little for adults, but perhaps it takes an adult to know that.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

knownalien · Oct 2, 2005

It makes ecnmic sense that there will be less,

If my assumption is right, it makes sense for the vendors, not ATI. ATI makes the same amount of money on the cards. It's the vendors who will turn around and price hike the cards. If true, ATI get's hurt because less people buy the cards at first. I think, and this includes me, people get real resentful when vendors do this. It's like buy tickets to a show from a scalper.

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Gamer_369 · Oct 2, 2005

<A HREF="http://theinquirer.net/?article=26275" target="_new">http://theinquirer.net/?article=26275</A>

"Such cards (x1800 xt) might not be in the stores at launch date, the plan is to have them two to three weeks after the launch, but ATI will hace X1800XL cards at the time of its announcements."

Edited by Gamer_369 on 10/01/05 11:42 PM.

RX8 · Oct 2, 2005

I will walk away with my head up high and not further this dispute. I applogise if it got heated on my part.

 Dont expect Miracles humans made them. The blind are easily led by the blind

knownalien · Oct 2, 2005

if the delay in bulk shipments somehow keeps vendors from overcharging us for these cards then I am cool with it. I am guessing these will be $500 cards.

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TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 2, 2005

ATI makes the same amount of money on the cards. It's the vendors who will turn around and price hike the cards. If true, ATI get's hurt because less people buy the cards at first.

Well I guess if you think about it technically it's neither ATi nor the Vendor, but ATi's OEM partner (board manufacturers) that will be thedetermining factor. To ATi whether it's a 512MB or 128MB version makes little difference as they are shipping the chips, and it's the OEM partner who has to decide which card gets the added expense of the +256MB worth of memmory, and at that point it's a question of how much they can sell it to the vendors, wether the margin is enough to have large supply.

For ATi it matter in their BuiltByATi role, where they play all three of those roles, and they have to worry about those things.

I agree with you that e-/retailers could mess with this if they add price gouging to this as that would change the expected volumes from the board partners, and then they would change production due to limited turn-over, and like most things, the higher the volume the better chance to make the most profits from economies of scale. The X1800XT 512MB could be only slightly more expensive than a 256MB version if they move enough and then they'd be more profitable for Sapphire, Foxconn, et al to make and then they'd be more than happy to produce a ton of them, but initially no one is going to commit most of their resources to the elite very top of the line part so expect there to be less available, and depending on demand, you will see changes and potential shortages depending on how they move, and that will depend on a few factors inluding their choice of initial delivery method; and what may be good for ATi might not please the ethusiast market. Putting alot of 512MB in retail where 'Daddy' just goes out and buys the biggest/best for his kid or himself with little knowledge of the uses you might see alot of XTs move that way where if they were online you could meet the demand of people who truely want them because they know they'll 'need' them for what they want to do. The former may or may not move more chips and cards (BBA) for ATi, but the later is what keeps people in the forums and such happy and satisfied wth availability.

Of course if they've been able to build stockpiles, and production is full blown, then regardless of 'reasonable' demand there shouldn't be shortages of any kind, especially if they stockpiled alot in anticipation of moving production to the R580.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 2, 2005

I agree that they (the top XT) might not be in many stores at launch (but liekly at e-tailers in the same way as the G70), but that doesn't appear to be due to scarcity so much as ATi's policy (similar to the X800 launch) of waiting until closer to launch to set final clocks for their top part. It has little to do with scarcity of the cards/chips as it has to do with last minute tinkering to ensure (to ATi's liking) they are still attractive at 'stock' compared to the 80-series drivers.

If they didn't care about speeds you'd have a part that like the mid-range usually has alot of overhead, and in this case likely the XLs will have great overclocking cores but be limited by the quality of their memory, and as such ATi won't wait until the last minute to set the speeds because they aren't concerned with the core overclocking because it can equal the speed of the XT, but as long as the memory is 50+mhz slower even overclocked then it won't cut into XT sales for the true übber buyers, and even for the enthusiasts who wouldn't usually buy such a card, but they've been waiting long enough dammit so their gonna buy the best they can finally (though some of those no doubt were lost to GF7800 sales).

However while there might be a slight delay to finalize speeds, once they are set then they ship en masse, it's not a question of scarcity of the chips themselves as was stated, but a question of waiting until the last minute to ship the cards so that they will win the stock comparisons on the reviews sites.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

TheGreatGrapeApe · Oct 2, 2005

Ditto.

- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp (or internët account) ! - <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com/" target="_new">RED GREEN</A> GA to SK :evil:

knownalien · Oct 3, 2005

for what it's worth, I buy ONLY from ATI. It's a bad habit and I am stubborn.

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WingDing · Oct 3, 2005

I have many, many bad habits.

(\__/)
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ChipDeath · Oct 3, 2005

I have many, many bad habits.

They were in good condition when the nuns had them.

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R520 Design 'revealed' by the InQ

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