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A GUIDE ON CHOOSING LINUX

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September 16, 2003 1:23:21 PM

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My computer is so fast it proves the theory of relativity wrong... :eek:  <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by grassapa on 10/02/03 10:59 AM.</EM></FONT></P>

More about : guide choosing linux

September 18, 2003 4:46:23 AM

Just what I was looking for. Maybe add some links? Thanks for the time. Tom
Anonymous
September 18, 2003 8:20:05 PM

Personally, I did all the research myself, and made up my own mind. Maybe I'm the exception though. :wink: I didn't realize that this question got asked do much. To me it was a no brainer to decide for myself what I wanted.

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September 28, 2003 11:02:44 PM

bump

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My computer is so fast it proves the theory of relativity wrong... :eek: 
September 30, 2003 4:20:55 AM

This sticky is so old you shouldn't even bother reading it. Go to DistroWatch for some useful information. Also, if you're interested in updating this sticky PM me

I am tired of people filling this forum with the eternal question of "what linux should i get?" This information is easily accesible on the internet but people are just lazy to look for it therefore they post here and make other people look for them. Well, I have done that simple job for you guys, so here is a list of the major distributions, their pros and cons and at the end my opinions. Fredi, or any admin, can you make this a sticky post?

This is taken straight from distrowatch.com:

=========Mandrake Linux==============
Mandrake Linux, started by Gaël Duval, is a distribution that has experienced enormous rise in popularity since its first release in July 1998. The developers took the Red Hat distribution, changed the default desktop to KDE and added an easy-to-use installer, breaking the myth that Linux is hard to install. Mandrake's hardware detection features and disk partitioning utilities are considered by many to be the best in the industry and many users found themselves running Mandrake where other distributions failed to provide the required usability.

Mandrake Linux has since matured to become a popular distribution among those new to Linux and among home users looking for an alternative operating system. The Mandrake development is completely open and transparent with new packages appearing in the so-called "cooker" directory on a daily basis. When a new release is entering a beta stage, a cooker snapshot is accepted as the first beta. The beta testing process used to be short and intensive, but starting with version 9.0, it has become longer and more thorough. The beta mailing lists are extremely busy, but you are still likely to receive a very fast response to any bug or concern that you report.

The result of this type of development is a leading-edge release - a highly up-to-date Linux distribution. As a trade-off, the users are likely to notice more bugs and perhaps less stability than with other distributions. Many people find this trade-off acceptable on their desktops - they get the very latest software and the occasional application crash is something they can live with. As soon as the development is completed, the software is available for free download from mirrors around the world.

Pros: User-friendly, graphical configuration utilities, enormous community support, NTFS partition resizing.
Cons: Some releases are buggy, the company is in financial difficulties.
Software package management: RPM
Free download: Yes
<A HREF="http://www.mandrakelinux.com" target="_new">http://www.mandrakelinux.com&lt;/A>

========RED HAT=============
For many, the name Red Hat epitomises Linux, as it is probably the best-known Linux company in the world. Founded in 1995 by Bob Young and Marc Ewing, Red Hat, Inc. has only recently started showing signs of profitability, due to services rather than the distribution itself. Yet, Red Hat Linux is a first choice for many professionals and is likely to be a major player for a long time. They wisely resisted any rapid expansion plans during the "dot-com" boom times in 1998 - 1999, concentrating on their core business. This type of prudent management, if continued, is likely to guarantee stability and dependability.

What is so special about Red Hat Linux? It is a curious mix of conservative and leading-edge packages put together on top of many knowledge-intensive utilities developed in-house. The packages are not the most up-to-date; once a new beta version is announced, the package versions are frozen, except for security updates. The result is a well-tested and stable distribution, the beta program and bug reporting facility are open to the public and there are several mailing lists. Red Hat Linux has become a dominant Linux distribution on servers around the world.

One other reason for Red Hat's success is the variety of popular services the company offers. The software packages are easy to update via Red Hat Network, a free repository of software and valuable information. A vast range of support services is available through the company and, while not always cheap, you are virtually assured of an excellent support by highly skilled support personnel. The company has even developed a certification program to further popularise its distribution - the RHCE (Red Hat Certified Engineer) training and examinations are now available in most parts of the world. All these factors have contributed to the fact that Red Hat is now a recognised brand name in the IT industry.

Pros: Widely used, excellent community support, lots of innovation.
Cons: Limited product life-span of the free edition, poor multimedia support.
Software package management: RPM
Free download: Yes
<A HREF="http://www.redhat.com" target="_new">http://www.redhat.com&lt;/A>

============SUSE LINUX===============
SuSE is another company with desktop focus, although a range of less visible enterprise class products are also available. The distribution has received positive reviews for its installer and YaST configuration tools, developed by SuSE's own developers. The documentation, which comes with the boxed product, has repeatedly been labeled as the most complete, thorough and usable by far. Linux Journal awarded SuSE Linux 7.3 the "Product of the Year 2001" title. The distribution has achieved substantial market share in Europe and North America, but it is not marketed in Asia and other parts of the world.

SuSE's development takes place completely behind closed doors and no public betas are provided for testing. They have a policy of not making the software available for download long after the boxed versions are in stores. Even so, SuSE does not provide easily install-able ISO images of their distribution, relying on packaged software for the vast majority of their user base.

Pros: Professional attention to detail, easy-to-use YaST configuration tools.
Cons: Only available in parts of the world from software resellers or via FTP install, includes proprietary components, which prevents re-distribution.
Software package management: RPM
Free download: SuSE does not provide ISO images for download. However, the Professional edition of their distribution is available for installation via FTP, usually about 1 - 2 months after the official release. The FTP installation is not difficult, but requires broadband connection.
<A HREF="http://www.suse.com" target="_new">http://www.suse.com&lt;/A>

===========GENTOO=================
Gentoo Linux was created by Daniel Robbins, a former Stampede Linux and FreeBSD developer. It was the author's exposure to FreeBSD and its autobuild feature called "ports", which inspired him to incorporate ports into Gentoo under the name of "portage". A detailed account of these beginnings of Gentoo can be found in this three-part series called Making the distribution. Gentoo's first stable release was announced in March 2002.

Gentoo Linux is a source-based distribution, the only one on this list. While the installation media provide various levels of pre-compiled binary packages to get a basic Linux system up and running, the idea behind Gentoo is to compile all source packages on the user's computer. The main advantage of this is that all software is highly optimised for the computer architecture it is built on. Also, updating the installed software to newer version is a matter of typing a simple command and the software packages kept in a central repository are usually kept highly up-to-date. On the other hand, installing Gentoo and turning it into a full-blown distribution with the latest graphical desktops, multimedia and development tools is tedious and long - count on several days even on a fast computer.

Pros: Painless installation of individual software packages, highly up-to-date, the "geek feeling" of building a distribution tailored to user's needs.
Cons: Long and tedious system installation, occasional instability and risk of breakdown, unsuitable for mission critical servers.
Software package management: SRC
Free download: Yes
<A HREF="http://www.gentoo.org" target="_new">http://www.gentoo.org&lt;/A>

=============DEBIAN==============
Debian GNU/Linux, started by Ian Murdock in 1993, is a completely non-commercial project; perhaps the purest form of the ideals that started the free software movement. Hundreds of volunteer developers from all over the world contribute to the project, which is well managed and strict, assuring a quality distribution known as Debian.

At any time during the development process, there are three branches in the main directory tree - "stable", "testing" and "unstable" (also known as "sid"). When a new version of a package appears, it is placed in the unstable branch for first testing. If it passes, the package moves to the testing branch, which undergoes rigorous testing lasting many months. This branch is only declared stable after a very thorough testing. As a result of this, the distribution is possibly the most stable and reliable, albeit not the most up-to-date. While the stable branch is perfect for use on mission critical servers, many users prefer to run the more up-to-date testing or unstable branches on their personal computers.

Debian's other main claim to fame is the reputation for being hard to install, unless the user has an intimate knowledge about the computer's hardware. Compensating this failing is "apt-get", a convenient installer for Debian packages. Many Debian users joke that their installer is so bad, because they only need it once - as soon as Debian is up and running, all future updates of any scale can be accomplished via the apt-get utility.

Pros: 100% free, excellent web site and community resources, well-tested, painless software installation with apt-get.
Cons: Archaic installer, the stable version is out-dated.
Software package management: DEB
Free download: Yes
<A HREF="http://www.debian.org" target="_new">http://www.debian.org&lt;/A>

============KNOPPIX===============
Developed by Klaus Knopper in Germany, it is safe to say that Debian-based Knoppix has raised the bar of standards to a new level, especially with its automatic hardware detection that puts many well established commercial Linux distributions to shame. Its hands-free booting, enormous selection of software, its on-the-fly decompression technique and the ability to install it on a hard disk have turned Knoppix into an indispensable tool. It can be used as a rescue disk, a tool to demonstrate Linux to those who haven't seen it or a tool to test a new computer before purchase. It can even be used as a full-blown Linux distribution for every-day tasks.

New versions of Knoppix are released frequently, on average about one new release each 1 - 2 weeks. Updates include bug fixes as well as the latest software packages from Debian's unstable branch.

Knoppix has been covered extensively in Linux media - see the Knoppix page for a detailed listing and make sure that you don't miss our Interview with Klaus Knopper as well as our contribution to LWN.net: Knoppix - the Great Linux Advocate.

Pros: Excellent hardware auto-detection, runs directly from CD without hard disk installation, can be used as a recovery tool.
Cons: Low speed and performance if run directly from the CD.
Software package management: DEB
Free download: Yes
<A HREF="http://www.knoppix.net" target="_new">http://www.knoppix.net&lt;/A>

============SLACKWARE===============
Slackware Linux, created by Patrick Volkerding in 1992, is the oldest surviving Linux distribution. It offers no bells and whistles, sticking with a text-based installer and no graphical configuration tools. Where other distributions tried hard to develop easy-to-use front ends for many common utilities, Slackware offers no hand-holding and everything is still done through configuration files. Because of this, Slackware is only recommended to those novice users who intend to spend some time on learning about Linux.

Nevertheless, Slackware has a magic appeal to many users. It is extremely stable and secure - very suitable for server deployment. Experienced Linux administrators find that the distribution is less buggy as it uses most packages in their pristine forms and without too many in-house enhancements which have a potential to introduce new bugs. Releases are infrequent (about once a year), although up-to-date packages are always available for download after the official release. Slackware is a fine distribution for those who are interested in deeper knowledge of Linux internals.

Perhaps the best characteristic of this distribution I have heard is this: If you need help with your Linux box, find a Slackware user. He is more likely to fix the problem than a user familiar with any other distribution.

Pros: Highly stable and bug-free, strong adherence to UNIX principles.
Cons: All configuration is done by editing text files, limited hardware auto-detection.
Software package management: TGZ
Free download: Yes
<A HREF="http://www.slackware.com" target="_new">http://www.slackware.com&lt;/A>

===============LYCORIS=============
Lycoris, formerly Redmond Linux, was founded by Joseph Cheek, the company's CTO and former Linuxcare and Microsoft employee. The goal was to create an easy-to-use distribution that would make the transition from Windows to Linux as painless as possible. Lycoris Desktop/LX achieves this through hundreds of customisations, including clones for My Computer and Network Neighborhood, as well as an attractive default theme that strongly resembles Windows XP. The distribution is currently based on Caldera OpenLinux.

Lycoris Desktop/LX ships with limited number of packages, usually one application per task, and a Control Panel for common system administration tasks. Critics have argued that some packages are outdated, but the developers maintain that user-friendly enhancements are their major focus.

Pros: Beginner-friendly, designed to resemble Windows.
Cons: Some outdated packages, requires per-seat licensing for commercial use.
Software package management: RPM
Free download: Yes
<A HREF="http://www.lycoris.org" target="_new">http://www.lycoris.org&lt;/A>

AND heres the website for links to their pages and more info
<A HREF="http://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=major" target="_new">http://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=major&lt;/A>

========================================================

In my opinion, consider the following:
- Start with Redhat or mandrake, easy to set up, minimal hardware complications, and its a good way to start learning about linux. If you decide to really get into the guts of linux, try slackware or gentoo linux ONLY AFTER YOU HAVE BEEN FAMILIAR WITH BASIC LINUX UNDERSTANDING, otherwise, you shouldnt try. Start with Redhat and mandrake to learn basic commands and functions and familiarize yourself with your hardware. This is important, since distros like slackware and gentoo requires you to have a solid knowledge of your own hardware if you want it to be set up PROPERLY.
Also, stay away from Lycoris and distros that are very windows like. The point here is to try to get away from windows and for you to learn something new here.

Thats about it, have fun and good luck.

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My computer is so fast it proves the theory of relativity wrong... :eek: 
September 30, 2003 4:20:55 AM

Try sending <b><font color=red>Fredi<b></font color=red> a Personal Message if you want this to be a sticky. I read the first few sentences of your guide and it looks interesting so far.

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
October 16, 2003 8:58:33 AM

Where can I find an iso of mandrake? The site requires you to pay like 5 bucks a month in order to get the iso...
October 16, 2003 12:52:43 PM

<A HREF="http://www.mandrakelinux.com/en/ftp.php3" target="_new">No it doesn't.</A>

Just click on the button beside "I'm already a member of the Club or plan on registering soon, please send me to the download page" and you've got the ftp list.
Some day I'll be rich and famous for inventing a device that allows you to stab people in the face over the internet.
October 25, 2003 5:45:14 PM

try the best download linux isos i ever had:
http://linuxiso.org/
there are so many distro, like suse, mandrake, gentoo, slackware, lycoris, etc can be download (linked).

CMC
November 17, 2003 8:28:54 PM

I just tried out turbolinux 7.0 workstation and think its a great distro. Plus its huge in Asia...I suggest everyone look into it. Just a suggestion :tongue:

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<b>It is always brave to say what everyone thinks. </b> <i>Georges Duhamel</i>

TKS
November 23, 2003 4:59:54 AM

Excellent breakdown of the "major" distros. I would add that people with an AMD 64 chip, and an Nvidia video card(ATI hasn't released 64bit drivers yet for linux :(  ), should look at Suse's 64bit distro(check their site for app/hardware compatibility info and email them if you don't find answers before you buy). You can get the other distro's to run a 64 bit kernel with 64 bit apps, but if you're a newbie, I wouldn't recommend this route.

Of course, let me make clear to any newbies, you don't NEED to run the 64bit version, you can run any 32 bit x86 version of Linux on that chip. It's just you will get substantial performance benefits with the 64bit version.
November 25, 2003 6:16:34 PM

I would disagree on gentoo not being suitable for a mission critical server enviroment. It's definetly not suitable for an inexperienced admin to setup for a mission critical server, however a novice admin shouldn't be setting up mission critical servers in the first place. In the hands of a competent admin it is an excellent system for many reasons, first and formost it lets you build each package for the specific hardware which results in a drastic increase in performance over non-optimized systems, secondly it lets you install a very minimal number of packages in most cases which has multiple effects including but not limited to less local and remote root exploits, less issues updating to newer versions of code when changes occur that require an update, etc. Basically, it's the custom form of linux for the sysadmin who wants to remain sane. I wish we had gentoo when I was at my previous job, building a custom version of linux from the ground up is nasty stuff. We guarentee'd 99.99% uptime on our custom linux systems and gentoo could have done it better faster and more reliably.

Edit: debian also has been significantly upgraded in the last few years by the inclusion of the apt. It's easier to use these days than rpm ;) 

Shadus<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by shadus on 11/25/03 03:18 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
January 13, 2004 7:35:15 PM

Sweet, the first download site is in my home town, you download it from the university here University of Missouri Rolla, I should waltz over there and just ask for a copy or something :) 

My Rig:
AthlonXP 2000+ 1.677ghz
GeForce Verto FX5200 128mb ddr
Maxtor 7200RPM 80GB, Some POS 40gb
384mb sdram(unknown)
Cendyne 52x24x52 CD-RW
Lite-On 4x DVD-RW
Go EMachines...:( 
January 20, 2004 12:13:08 PM

I would like to add that Trustix is a nice distro for those of you who are interested in or like security. The main goal of this distro is security and it takes a lot of ideas from BSDs, especially OpenBSD, and includes many nice security tools. (On a side note: It's interesting that you recommend Gentoo for servers, Shadus, as I have the complete opposite view of it. Gentoo folks tend to be running very unstable (i.e. recent versions) and when I hired admins it always made me very suspicious if they tooted Gentoo.)

Dev

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January 30, 2004 2:33:02 PM

Great article, thanks for taking the time!
February 10, 2004 9:49:03 AM

I have to agree with the premise that Gentoo is definitely ready for Mission critical servers. What Gentoo offers is a server that doesn't have all the fluff. You can choose the services you want running, and that's all that is running. You can monitor all your services quite easily, and not a lot of distro specific quirks get in the way.

Updating your packages is simple and painless, and if something goes wrong with an update, it's quite easy to step back to an earlier version of the package without any interruption of services (other than what the initial update may have caused).

Gentoo has it right when it comes to package management. There's no need to be on the bleeding edge when using Gentoo, yet you have the option.

As an Administrator, you can choose any version of a package you wish, from the most recent, to the tried and true. If you know what you are doing, Gentoo is by far the strongest distro out there.

Krigg
April 2, 2004 8:33:43 PM

Why don't everybody use Knoppix (hd installed) instead of Mandrake/Redhat/Fedora Core?

I installed Knoppix (3.3 Feb-24-2004) in HDD today. Though installation script was basic and without much option, it was easy to use. It took only ~5/6 mins to install 2.5 GB stuff in my HDD. It comes with great preinstalled software. I've heard DEB packages are easier to use and less problematic than RPM packages, but haven't tried installing DEB packages yet.

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April 2, 2004 8:49:16 PM

If one wants to learn something new drop them in the deep end! YOU WILL LEARN QUICKLY! Really, that is true. Back in 96 I had to learn Unix Very, Very Quickly. The only "Uinix" at my desposal at the time was Slakware 2.x ? Installed it and re-installed it (thought I did something wrong) only to find out the result was the same. I then spent about 6 weeks just to get the Xserver to see my Graphics card and display properly (OK maybe 2 weeks) but hell that felt good!
Sound (you must be kidding). Until I found RED HAT 5.0, this was a brease. Video detected, sound card detected etc. So Red Hat found a convert? Not Quite, you see I still belive in Open Source always will, But I feel that it is up to the individual to choose their OS. Yes I like Red Hat and will stick with them. My advise to any new Linux User is to Vsit all the major players web sites and decide for your selves as to which you would feel the most comfortable with. Download, borrow etc, various vendors offerings and Play to your hears content. You will find a Distro that is suited for your needs.
April 15, 2004 4:02:08 AM

Man, another person who used Slackware as their first linux. I definitely did. I progressed almost the same way you did. My progression is
Slackware 2.0
Slackware 3.0
Redhat 5.0
RedHat 5.1
RedHat 5.2
RedHat 6.0
Mandrake 6.1
RedHat 6.2
RedHat 7.0
RedHat 7.1
RedHat 7.2
RedHat 7.3
RedHat 8 <- for a very short time
Gentoo Linux <- my current and favorite distro.

I stopped using RedHat because I tend to lean towards bleeding edge stuff (esp on my server) and I used a lot of software not offered by RedHat and I got sick of dealing with RPMS and their dependencies. I have no complaints about Gentoo; they are incredibly fast when it comes to updates and new software which is what I like especially for my gaming linux machine and my linux laptop.
May 5, 2004 8:45:58 PM

Well, I have to say thanks, even if nobody agree 100% on this, it might save me a lot of time explaining friends wich distro they should take.
June 14, 2004 4:48:10 AM

I don't consider people to generally be lazy, I just find them to be overworked and what little time they have normally isn't centered on unproven entity in many of their lives.

Why people can't get at the information is typically because linux is fragmented. There are too many sources with too little (or two much) info, depending on how you look at it and who you are. I think if people aren't finding it it is because it is hard to identify where the important aspects of it are. It is hard to understand what to focus on when learning because there's so much fragmentation.

User support is rather weak for linux compared to that of windows and alot of what is written is written in geek-speak making it hard for people to focus and to get to the important facts. Remember, not all things people write is important.

That's an ok list of distro's except that it doesn't explain how painful some distro's are to install and how easy some others are. For instance, Fedora Core is easy to install, so is mandrake but debian, gentoo, and slackware suck, especially for those looking for easy installs that will complete quickly and be up and running error free from the time it is installed.
October 24, 2004 5:28:32 AM

What do you mean about Red Hat having limited free distro longevity or whatever? Also, I am looking to install linux, I like bleeding edge, what does Mandrake give me that is "Bleeding edge" that I can't get with Redhat? A friend who has Gentoo suggested Redhat, but I don't know.
October 24, 2004 10:10:46 PM

grassapa,


I suggest that this list be redone to support the top 5-10 distros over the last year or six months at <A HREF="http://distrowatch.com" target="_new">http://distrowatch.com&lt;/A>. This should be especially important to update with FC2 now being the freeman's Redhat and RedHat no longer being free.


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<b>It is always brave to say what everyone thinks. </b> <i>Georges Duhamel</i>

TKS
February 16, 2005 10:42:47 AM

Learnt of this site from a fren and wanted to share it: http://www.resolvo.com/moveover/

Tried the Windows to Linux automated migration tool called Moveover. Really useful as it saved mi the hassle of manually migrating all my files including music and video files, database, email, address book, email configurations and wall paper. Only bad thing is that it can only be used on 3 distro: Suse, JDS, Fedora. Lucky for mi i was trying to move to Suse.
April 8, 2005 6:52:05 PM

Mandrake is now Mandriva and is no longer FREE.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>
April 8, 2005 9:49:08 PM

That is quite interesting I must say. Mandrake was the first distro that I used many years ago.
May 23, 2005 9:08:36 PM

Those of you looking to have grassapa answer you or update his post may want to notice that his last post on this thread was Sept. of 2003. He may not be listening. :smile:


<font color=green> AMD- Intel's choice for Best CPU manufacturer </font color=green>
a b 5 Linux
January 22, 2006 4:18:14 PM

Could someone please edit the post and add Fedora Core and Ubuntu, etc?

Thanks!

Semper Fi Linux on!
March 16, 2006 12:57:52 AM

Better yet, just put a link right on top pointing to Distrowatch.com, since that's where the origional info was from. It's alot easier than pasting the site back here.

BTW, I noticed one of the earlier posts mentioned jumping in the deep end by starting with Slackware. While I'll admit I started with Red Hat, I found the new deep end - Linux From Scratch. This distro is distributed in book form. You can download the book or read it online, following the directions to download the sourch of each individual component and compile it yourself. They do offer a live CD, but the only purpose is a platform that will let you format the HDD, download the source, and compile it on the system your installing it on. I found it because the Dyne II distro (pre-beta - look for Dyne:Bolic) is following the book.

Jarrett
a b 5 Linux
March 16, 2006 3:01:52 AM

Quote:
Better yet, just put a link right on top pointing to Distrowatch.com, since that's where the origional info was from. It's alot easier than pasting the site back here.

BTW, I noticed one of the earlier posts mentioned jumping in the deep end by starting with Slackware. While I'll admit I started with Red Hat, I found the new deep end - Linux From Scratch. This distro is distributed in book form. You can download the book or read it online, following the directions to download the sourch of each individual component and compile it yourself. They do offer a live CD, but the only purpose is a platform that will let you format the HDD, download the source, and compile it on the system your installing it on. I found it because the Dyne II distro (pre-beta - look for Dyne:Bolic) is following the book.

Jarrett



LFS and Gentoo are certainly fun but probably not for the average user :-D

We should probably update this post or put up a new one and request that it be made sticky.

Semper Fi Carry^H^H^H^H^H Linux on! :-D
May 1, 2006 3:11:46 PM

Personally, I wouldn't be against a newbie trying Gentoo, as they'd probably learn more about Linux in 30mins with it than 3hrs with SUSE/Ubuntu. Sure, it doesn't hold your hand quite as much, but the installer on the LiveCD doesn't require that much hard thinking, and once installed I find emerge + use flags much easier and more efficient than other package management systems I've tried. Also, it has forums with people that actually help without being patronising, and a relatively comprehensive handbook + wiki.

Sure, the person may not get it right the first time, and may not be playing their music files as quickly as with SUSE etc, but I'd still tell people to go a little deeper. Because, in the end, if you want XP use XP, but if you want something different then go *different* :) 

Synergy6
a b 5 Linux
May 1, 2006 3:48:13 PM

Quote:
Personally, I wouldn't be against a newbie trying Gentoo, as they'd probably learn more about Linux in 30mins with it than 3hrs with SUSE/Ubuntu. Sure, it doesn't hold your hand quite as much, but the installer on the LiveCD doesn't require that much hard thinking, and once installed I find emerge + use flags much easier and more efficient than other package management systems I've tried. Also, it has forums with people that actually help without being patronising, and a relatively comprehensive handbook + wiki.

Sure, the person may not get it right the first time, and may not be playing their music files as quickly as with SUSE etc, but I'd still tell people to go a little deeper. Because, in the end, if you want XP use XP, but if you want something different then go *different* :) 

Synergy6



Most people do not have the patience or the temperament to use gentoo. For those people the ready-made distros are more appropriate. Gentoo is great and a great learning tool but unfortunately most people are not willing to learn.

This is one of the main reasons people stick with M$ garbage because they are afraid to try something new.

Sad but at least partially true :-(
May 1, 2006 5:55:16 PM

Quote:

Most people do not have the patience or the temperament to use gentoo. For those people the ready-made distros are more appropriate. Gentoo is great and a great learning tool but unfortunately most people are not willing to learn.

This is one of the main reasons people stick with M$ garbage because they are afraid to try something new.

Sad but at least partially true :-(


True. But if they had no interest in Linux, why look at this thread? :)  I think most people that had any interest in experimenting could do pretty well with Gentoo. And as long as they weren't ridiculously stupid with partitioning, for which Gentoo has a mode which won't delete any other partitions if free space is available, the worst case scenario is just wiping it and going back to WinXP. Nothing lost, perhaps a little knowledge gained.

Personally, I use Gentoo for IRC/msn/surfing etc, and XP for gaming and some other things. Sure, I could try cedega/wine, but I find XP itself faster and easier to use than trying to emulate it.

Synergy6
a b 5 Linux
May 1, 2006 9:43:14 PM

Quote:

Most people do not have the patience or the temperament to use gentoo. For those people the ready-made distros are more appropriate. Gentoo is great and a great learning tool but unfortunately most people are not willing to learn.

This is one of the main reasons people stick with M$ garbage because they are afraid to try something new.

Sad but at least partially true :-(


True. But if they had no interest in Linux, why look at this thread? :)  I think most people that had any interest in experimenting could do pretty well with Gentoo. And as long as they weren't ridiculously stupid with partitioning, for which Gentoo has a mode which won't delete any other partitions if free space is available, the worst case scenario is just wiping it and going back to WinXP. Nothing lost, perhaps a little knowledge gained.

Personally, I use Gentoo for IRC/msn/surfing etc, and XP for gaming and some other things. Sure, I could try cedega/wine, but I find XP itself faster and easier to use than trying to emulate it.

Synergy6


WINE = WINE IS NOT AN EMULATOR

Any distro is fine :-D
May 1, 2006 11:45:14 PM

Quote:


WINE = WINE IS NOT AN EMULATOR

Any distro is fine :-D


LoL, awesome, I've been berated for saying that before. Anyway, the point stands. I still find it easier to use XP for some things, such as gaming.
Synergy6
a b 5 Linux
May 1, 2006 11:55:47 PM

Quote:


WINE = WINE IS NOT AN EMULATOR

Any distro is fine :-D


LoL, awesome, I've been berated for saying that before. Anyway, the point stands. I still find it easier to use XP for some things, such as gaming.
Synergy6


[code:1:e7e4d98452]
package Main::AWESOME;open(I,"<$ARGV[0]");sub AWESOME{while(1){while(<I>){@a=$_;}print @a;}}$Linux=$Linus_Torvalds=AWESOME();
[/code:1:e7e4d98452]


XP is better for running XP games that's about it.

Some native Linux games run very well indeed it varies from game to game.
May 2, 2006 1:18:44 AM

Quote:

XP is better for running XP games that's about it.


"It" in this case being the vast majority of videogames. Sure there are exceptions, like ET, AA, D3 etc, but they are exceptions nonetheless. AA in this case being an interesting example, as it is likely being discontinued, and is already behind schedule by months. If you take a game like Oblivion, by far the easiest and most efficient way to run it in all it's glory is on XP.
Synergy6
a b 5 Linux
May 2, 2006 4:41:44 AM

Quote:

XP is better for running XP games that's about it.


"It" in this case being the vast majority of videogames. Sure there are exceptions, like ET, AA, D3 etc, but they are exceptions nonetheless. AA in this case being an interesting example, as it is likely being discontinued, and is already behind schedule by months. If you take a game like Oblivion, by far the easiest and most efficient way to run it in all it's glory is on XP.
Synergy6


It is a chicken and egg problem.

My point is Linux and BSD CAN be a great platform for games if developers start supporting them.
May 2, 2006 2:07:18 PM

Quote:
My progression is
Slackware 2.0
Slackware 3.0
Redhat 5.0
RedHat 5.1
RedHat 5.2
RedHat 6.0
Mandrake 6.1
RedHat 6.2
RedHat 7.0
RedHat 7.1
RedHat 7.2
RedHat 7.3
RedHat 8 <- for a very short time
Gentoo Linux <- my current and favorite distro.



Am I the only person here who started on Redhat and later switched to Slackware ? :( 
May 2, 2006 2:40:35 PM

The Problem is that GNU and UNIX based operating systems lack the market share.

I ask this hypothitcal question:

Say you are a game developer, are you going to take the time and MONEY to compile, optimize, extra codeing BS to get a game to work natively with Linux?

I doubt you would as a game developer. Becasue the majority of the time your cost goes up and profit goes down, and if your working to get the game complet ahead of secule and under budget to get you bounse, thats one more hoop to go though to get that extra CASH.

Now maybe I'm just being cynical about this, but its just the way I feel about it. Granted I'm new to the Open Source World, but I dont think I'll be going back to M$ except for gameing, and maybe some thing that requires MicroSucks compatibility.

Just my 2 cents.
May 2, 2006 3:05:56 PM

Quote:

My point is Linux and BSD CAN be a great platform for games if developers start supporting them.


Oh, very true. But when it comes to a guide on choosing Linux, I generally stay in the realm of the present/near future, not the overly futuristic, probably fantasy land where Linux has better overall videogame support than Windows.
a b 5 Linux
May 2, 2006 9:09:30 PM

Quote:
The Problem is that GNU and UNIX based operating systems lack the market share.

I ask this hypothitcal question:

Say you are a game developer, are you going to take the time and MONEY to compile, optimize, extra codeing BS to get a game to work natively with Linux?

I doubt you would as a game developer. Becasue the majority of the time your cost goes up and profit goes down, and if your working to get the game complet ahead of secule and under budget to get you bounse, thats one more hoop to go though to get that extra CASH.

Now maybe I'm just being cynical about this, but its just the way I feel about it. Granted I'm new to the Open Source World, but I dont think I'll be going back to M$ except for gameing, and maybe some thing that requires MicroSucks compatibility.

Just my 2 cents.




But here's the thing, if you write good working portable / cross-platform code recompiling your game ( s ) for any platform can actually be reasonably easy.


With the proliferation of so many different game consoles, etc if you want a commercially successful title you have to make sure it works on at least 2 or 3 different platforms.

Sony may ship the new playstation with Linux already on it :-D

Would be kewl :-D
May 3, 2006 12:30:36 AM

GT4 seemed to do pretty well on only one console. MGS2/3 spent 6+ months PS2 only, actually sold quite well. Same with GTA3, GTA:VC, GTA:SA. The Sims sold pretty well too, it was PC only for quite a while.
Etc.
a b 5 Linux
May 3, 2006 12:37:22 AM

Quote:
GT4 seemed to do pretty well on only one console. MGS2/3 spent 6+ months PS2 only, actually sold quite well. Same with GTA3, GTA:VC, GTA:SA. The Sims sold pretty well too, it was PC only for quite a while.
Etc.



I'm not a console person at all, but if the consoles get game developers to write better more portable code I'm all for it.

The PS3 may kick some serious tail with Linux :-D
May 3, 2006 7:42:21 PM

Quote:

But here's the thing, if you write good working portable / cross-platform code recompiling your game ( s ) for any platform can actually be reasonably easy.


With the proliferation of so many different game consoles, etc if you want a commercially successful title you have to make sure it works on at least 2 or 3 different platforms.

Sony may ship the new playstation with Linux already on it :-D

Would be kewl :-D


As I said befor, NIX style systems don't have enough of the desktop/consumer market share. So for the game/aplication developers, what is the point in haveing your programs take the time writeing in the extra code to make it cross platform campatible? But I'm probley just being a little to cynical for my age.

As for PS3 with Linux preinstalled, that would be truely bad ass.
a b 5 Linux
May 4, 2006 12:22:00 AM

Quote:

But here's the thing, if you write good working portable / cross-platform code recompiling your game ( s ) for any platform can actually be reasonably easy.


With the proliferation of so many different game consoles, etc if you want a commercially successful title you have to make sure it works on at least 2 or 3 different platforms.

Sony may ship the new playstation with Linux already on it :-D

Would be kewl :-D


As I said befor, NIX style systems don't have enough of the desktop/consumer market share. So for the game/aplication developers, what is the point in haveing your programs take the time writeing in the extra code to make it cross platform campatible? But I'm probley just being a little to cynical for my age.

As for PS3 with Linux preinstalled, that would be truely bad ass.



My point is, well written portable code does not need to be re-written from scratch every time you need to make it work on another platform.

There are many Unix programs which work just fine on just about any Unix platform including, Linux and BSD and some even work on windoze as well.

If the developers know what they are doing they should be able to write portable code without spending a lot of extra time or $ doing so.
a b 5 Linux
June 10, 2006 8:06:19 PM

Right, OpenGL + SDL is a fine example of such a framework that works with little to no conversion across many systems.

Edit: linky
a b 5 Linux
June 11, 2006 1:56:13 PM

Quote:
Right, OpenGL + SDL is a fine example of such a framework that works with little to no conversion across many systems.

Edit: linky




That's the way things should be done :-D
June 13, 2006 2:01:25 AM

Slackware junkie, here.

Started in late '97 with Slackware '96, as it was oft referred to. Official name was 3.2. I've tried numerous distros, but it's like driving an automatic after driving a stick for so long...

I hop in front of the keyboard, power up, and smash my foot against the floor where I would expect the clutch.

It's just nice to have such a level of control over your operating system. Also a really good way to learn the innards of Linux, if you don't mind headaches.

Cheers,
a b 5 Linux
June 14, 2006 1:23:12 PM

Quote:
Slackware junkie, here.

Started in late '97 with Slackware '96, as it was oft referred to. Official name was 3.2. I've tried numerous distros, but it's like driving an automatic after driving a stick for so long...

I hop in front of the keyboard, power up, and smash my foot against the floor where I would expect the clutch.

It's just nice to have such a level of control over your operating system. Also a really good way to learn the innards of Linux, if you don't mind headaches.

Cheers,




Hehe :-D

A temporary headache is worth it tho because you are rewarded in the end :-D
!