Raeeon VE 64MB DDR

[tullyganny]

Hi all,
My friend just bought a Radeon VE 64MB DDR card. I thought the 3D graphics were coole enough but not an awful lot better than the Banshee 16MB he had before that. I was expecting the difference to be huge? Should it have been? I noticed the jaggies a lot in games like Serious Sam, perhaps they are there with all cards out today? Well I'm buying a new PC soon and was going to but that card but I am having serious doubts about it now. Is there a huge difference between it and the normal Radeon 64MM DDR (no VE) in terms of 3D performance. I want the card for gaming for sure and I don't want to shell out all that money (£150 Irish money) for a card that is not all that good for gaming! Anyone know much about the Radeon VE?

Thanx,
Mark

 

[ajmcgarry]

The Radeon VE is primarily meant for use with 2 monitors and Ati cut out parts of the chip to add the twin monitor capability at an attractive price <A HREF="http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/01q1/010316/atiradeon-05.html" target="_new">link</A>

The Normal Radeon chip is a lot better performing.


Where did you get the quote for the Radeon 64MM DDR (no VE).
I'm in Ireland too and was thinking of getting a similar card.






<font color=blue>Little Miss Muffet was arachnaphobic</font color=blue>

 

[tullyganny]

Good to hear from another Irish person! Well my friend bought that card off of Gateway. However he thought (and so did I) that it was the normal Radeon, i.e. the good one, you know. Gateway did advertise it as the VE so it was not false advertising or anything! Its a pitty I didn't find out this about it before he bought it!

Mark

 

[ajmcgarry]

Yeah I've looked at the site a number of times.
They seem to change what's on offer from month to month.
They did have the normal Radeon and Geforce 2 GTS, but now they are offering the Radeon VE and Geforce 2 MX versions.

Best you can do is try to sell it with as minimal loss as possible and by the proper Radeon. Or better yet wait till the end of summer and buy the Radeon 2. It's going to blow everything out of the water. Just check the posts in this forum.

<font color=blue>Little Miss Muffet was arachnaphobic</font color=blue>

 

[tullyganny]

Yeah he might be able to sell it, hopefully! Well Gateway are changing their graphics lineup all the time, I wish they would just leave it alone, you know. At the moment there is no good performance card they are offering. I will have to ask them will they get me a specific card e.g. a Geforce2 GTS or something similar or I won't buy any system off of them. Someone told me that they will get a specific card for you if you want it but I'm not so sure. Would you go with the Geforce 2 MX they are offering over the Radeon VE? I'm totally confused now as to what to do but I'm glad I found out about that Radeon VE now rather than later when I had the machine paid for, you know.

I haven't heard anything about Radeon 2 at all, your the first person that has mentioned it. Have you anymore info. about it? I doubt I will be able to afford that when it comes out, I suppose it will be in the Geforce 3 price category, right?

Mark

 

[ajmcgarry]

Any details on the Radeon 2 are sketchy at the moment. Ati are keeping the whole thing secret. There is some info on the technology that Ati are developing though.
<A HREF="http://www.tomshardware.com/technews/technews-20010530.html#0754" target="_new">link1</A>
<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1476" target="_new">link2</A>
Probably expect a price around US$250.

I would steer clear of the MX get the GTS at least. The Geforce does not offer much better quality picture than old nVidia chips like the Riva 128 and TNT chips. Get a fast one if you get one at all.
If you order it from one of the companies listed in <A HREF="http://www.pricewatch.com" target="_new">Pricewatch</A> you should still save over the Irish price even when you add the shipping cost (should be around $15). The currency conversion is slightly in to benefit but not a whole lot at the moment.


At the end of the day if you are an out and out gamer and just want speed (fps) then get a Geforce based card. If you want to sacrifice 20% of that speed for better quality then get the Radeon. In most cases except for at very high resolutions (1600x1200) the extra speed of the Geforce is not visible to the human eye anyways.


Don't just take my word for it though. <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=faq&notfound=1&code=1" target="_new">The full argument</A>


<font color=blue>Little Miss Muffet was arachnaphobic</font color=blue>

 

[tullyganny]

So basically your saying go for either the GTS, PRO, or a Radeon but none of the cards that Gateway are offering? Thanx for all the advice by the way, I hope I'm not bothering you!

What do you reckon to this site? I think its class, you don't find sites lke this one everyday. Before I buy any piece of hardware I always come here first.

Mark

 

[ajmcgarry]

Yep, depends on your needs basically as to which one. Radeon offers superior image quality in both 3D and windows 2D and the best DVD playback. Remember that the Gateway Monitor (probably the EV 17" right, have one myself) is limited to 1280x1024 at around 70 hertz so a card that runs Quake 3 at 1600x1200 at 100 fps will not be much use to you. There's even a guy in this forum that complained of his Geforce MX 400 buring out 2 of his monitors.


Check out the benchmarks here -> <A HREF="http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/00q4/001204/geforce2ultra-04.html" target="_new">Bench</A>
Note that the Radeon loses almost no speed going from 16bit colour (low detail) to 32bit colour(high detail). This is because it is more efficient with its HyperZ technology.

If you go with a Geforce then make sure you get a Retail version and not an OEM version as these perform better. (They are clocked higher and have faster memory chips). OEMs are the likes of DELL and Gateway offerings as opposed to Retail which come in a branded box (eg Elsa, Leadtek, Gainward, Hercules etc)


This is a good site. But don't rely on the one source. Most people in this forum go to <A HREF="http://Anandtech.com" target="_new">http://Anandtech.com</A> and others aswell. Check them out. And read as much of the links that I have provided before making a decision.

At the moment I'm blowing the Radeon trumpet. And Nvidia are crapping their pants over the Radeon 2 and the Kyro 2 & 3. There is even a published white paper from nVidia on the web about it.
But make your own conclusions.

Glad to help.




<font color=blue>Little Miss Muffet was arachnaphobic</font color=blue>

 

[ajmcgarry]

Whatever card you get make sure you download <A HREF="http://www.entechtaiwan.com/ps.htm" target="_new">Powerstrip</A>
It's great for overclocking and configuring all graphics cards.

<font color=blue>Little Miss Muffet was arachnaphobic</font color=blue>

 

[Guest]

Why not go for a Radeon LE and flash the bios to that of a regular radeon,then clock it up to regular radeon speeds (about 180/180) and enable hyperz.
Word of warning though, you can only find the Le in oem format as far as I know.

Fullspizz People

 

[ajmcgarry]

Yeah that's an option but I didn't want to confuse the matter to much. Not all the Radeon LE's will overclock to 183/183. Although for US$80 you can't really complain if it gets even close to that.
For the full lowdown on the Radeon LE read <A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1473" target="_new">here</A>




<font color=blue>Keep your hands above the covers at all times!</font color=blue>

 

[tullyganny]

Once again thanx for all the info. Sorry about not replying sooner but I am just back in to work now! Well I am a bit biased towards the Radeon myself, so it will probably be that one I will go for. As regards the EV700 monitor thank you for letting me know about that little drawback, I hadn't a notion about that at all!

I mailed Gateway about them putting in a specific graphics card for me or none at all so I could buy my own but they have not got back to me. Whatever about getting me a specific card I would imagine that they will not sell a system without some sort of graphics board. If that's the best thay can do I will have to take it with the TNT2 and then buy a better card myself. Is the Geforce 2 MX and Radeon VE very much better than the TNT2? At least things have been made a little bit easier for me now that I can get some advice from you guys!

Just a question though, do you always but your cards/ peripherals over the Internet? Is there much of a saving in doing this? I was just wondering.

Mark

 

[ajmcgarry]

Is the Geforce 2 MX and Radeon VE very much better than the TNT2?

A lot of people would argue both ways. Some would say that the Geforce2 is just a faster version of the TNT2. On paper the specs are a lot different, the TNT would not be able to handle todays newer games and would be boundery at everthing else. I haven't enough experience of the VE to comment properly but I expect that it's more than just a slower Radeon going by the diagram in one of links I provided.



<font color=blue>Keep your hands above the covers at all times!</font color=blue>

 

[ajmcgarry]

Just a question though, do you always but your cards/ peripherals over the Internet? Is there much of a saving in doing this?

A lot of stuff I do. Anything that is is small or light is worth it. There's no point buying a monitor or a case. I can be hard to find international suppliers though.
Example 256MB of RAM from Crucial cost me IR£80 including shipping. From Gateway it would have been more like IR£200.
There's just not enough suppliers in Ireland. Some of the stuff though I get from a mate who fixes computer, often times free

<font color=blue>Keep your hands above the covers at all times!</font color=blue>

 

[tullyganny]

Cheers for the low down on buying on the Net. That is a class saving with the 256MB of Ram. I wonder would I be better off to build my own system rathetr than buying off Gateway? Get the monitor, case and all the big things at a supplier here in Galway and then get the other small things off the net?

Mark

 

[ajmcgarry]

Do the math on it first. Check out a few sites and always take into account the shipping and the currency conversion. There is a saving to be made but it's still not the same as what you would get if you lived in the States.
The good thing with Gateway at the moment is that they are willing to through in nice surround sound speakers with some of their packages. Most notably the AMD 1.3Ghz machine.

They drop the Graphics card and add some speakers, go figure.


<font color=blue>Keep your hands above the covers at all times!</font color=blue>

 

[Guest]

Yes, I would if I were you, because you could customise it to your exact spec.I built my own T/bird 850@1gig,Abit kt7a (which I got from overclocking store-in the uk).However if you're not too sure then I would say get a manufactured one.
Hey I'm up to journeyman,, whooooooo
Fullspizz People<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by fullspizz on 06/01/01 06:02 AM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[tullyganny]

Cheers I'll scout around and see how cheap I can get things!

Good luck,
Mark