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PROB!

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August 22, 2001 7:59:04 PM

HEY, i just got my new msi-831 in the mail today. i ran to my room so that i could install that sucker. i poped out my trusty stealth3, and stuck that geforce2pro in. i followed the standard rukes when changing video cards. set to standard vga, and shut down, install card, and start computer. when the computer started up, and i tried to install the drivers on the cd, the computer told me that the hardware was not in the computer. so i browsed the cd, and found three, count them, three drivers that say they work on the card. so i chose one, and used that. then, i rebooted the computer to make sure the installation was complete. it started up fine, and looked great. then, i tried to run unreal tournament. it started up , and was still using s3metal which works fine on the stealth, but i decided to change that. i did the detect video adapter in tournament, and it still said that i had the s3 card. so i changed it to run in openGL. when the game started up, it crashed. locked up when it says "PRECACHING" and the beginning of that song was looping. i restarted the computer, and decided maybe i should update the drivers for the card. i ran the msi live update thing, and it downloaded and installed drivers. but now, when the computer starts up, the display stops on the 98 splash screen. and i can hear the sound like windows has started up. i booted into safe mode, and removed the card, and when the computer started up again, it just reinstalled the drivers. so, out of frustration, i am running the s3 again, so that i can at least run in normal and find some help on the internet. what should i do?....flash the cards bios, use the nvidia drivers, which i already downloaded, just in case.
also, how can i remove the old msi drivers so that i dont have to deal with it reinstalling itself?
i would like help soon, because i will be leaving tonight.
thanks in advance.
-DAvid

More about : prob

August 22, 2001 8:19:23 PM

i am on hold right now with tech supp.
PLEASE HELP!
this sucks.
-DAvid
August 22, 2001 8:35:16 PM

i am leaving my house in a half an hour, and i will need my computer when i return, and would like to have this thing at least running in normal mode before i leave. i am sorry if i am being a jerk by requesting help so forcefully, but i need this thing running.
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a b U Graphics card
August 23, 2001 3:17:43 AM

Use the nVidia drivers. Just run the install program.

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August 23, 2001 4:22:32 AM

how do i completely remove the msi drivers?
and with the nvidia drivers, will i be able to use my th out?
also, i tried to download the drivers from nvidia, and i clicked the microsoft certified ones, and when i double clicked the .exe, it said it was an invalid windows file. and wont run. it sucks. should i get the ones that arent verified?
i have tried two different times to download that driver form nvidia. if anyone knows a better place to get actual drivers, let me know.
-DAvid
a b U Graphics card
August 23, 2001 4:39:08 AM

The easiest way to get rid of the old drivers is to use a NEWER VERSION from nVidia. But there are programs to remove it also. I have been known at times to go into safe mode and delete all the driver files for a card.

I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 23, 2001 4:45:48 AM

ok...i just downloaded the non certified ones from nvidia, and it is an exe, but it still said that it was a non-valid windows format. therefore, rendering the install of these drivers impossible.
this is really sad, a card manufacturer cant even give the card drivers that work right. that is really dumb.
do you think that if i download the drivers from nvidia's ftp server, that it would be a different file, and maybe not corrupted?
a b U Graphics card
August 23, 2001 5:18:06 AM

I've came up with bad files myself a few times. Try downloading it again.

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August 23, 2001 5:22:57 AM

OKAY!...i think i figured this shiz out.
i downloaded the 12.6 version from rizenet. and then i installed that, but the problem still was there, locked up when i tried to run quake3. but hey..i thought, maybe i should reinstall the via 4in1 drivers. i installed the agp driver in normal mode instead of turbo mode, and BAM, major difference. now quake3 works. i am about to test unreal tournament. wow, i am relieved. i thought the card was defective for a second. whew. also, this thing has 5ns ddr running at 401mhz (according to the info page on the properties). should i put ram sinks on them? also, is it worth it to upgrade the gpu heatsink and fan?
like should i go to fry's and buy a blue orb? and the thermal take ram sinks with the ram spacers?
-DAvid
a b U Graphics card
August 23, 2001 5:30:31 AM

Congratulations on your 2x configuration, this is a common problem with VIA chipset boards and is not so easily fixable, I'm sure there are some members in here who will throw you a bag of tricks!

I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 23, 2001 5:34:45 AM

what is up with via....i bought this board with the via chipset because it was supposed to be better for gaming....but damn...this thing sure does cause me some problems.
whatever. i got it working. now all i have to do is try the tvout.
if i was to set it to use the tvout, and shut down my computer, and then hooked it up to my tv, and started up, would it display on it?, or do i have to have the tv right next to it?
-DAvid
a b U Graphics card
August 23, 2001 5:46:15 AM

You should enable dual mode in clone if you want the picture to be the same on the TV as the monitor. The setting is in advanced display settings. It will ask you to restart to enable it, do that.

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a b U Graphics card
August 23, 2001 6:01:42 AM

BTW I usually recommend an ALi motherboard for stability/compatability. Or Intel chipsets are better yet, but very few people in here want to run the Intel processor required for them. I made the switch last year when VIA was the only choice on the market for AMD, I had so many problems with my VIA/AMD system it would take forever to set it up. There were about 18 things I had to fix every time I set up, then data integrity problems would cause me to have to start over again every few weeks. And each time I would forget something. Oh, and I had to remove several card, set up, then install the cards one-by one in order to get it to configure properly. It had an ISA slot so I used my AWE64 card, if it was in during software installation I could never get sound out of it no matter how it was configured, but it seemed to work fine if I installed it after Windows was set up. So forth and so on, I would always forget something, end up with a hard crash that would wipe a file, and end up having to either scrounge around fo rthe file on another PC and replace the damaged one, or reinstall again.
Things have gotten a lot better with VIA since then, but they are still far from perfect. The best ALi motherboard (A7A266) still has that anoying heat detection problem that causes it to go into thermal protection mode (aka forced system lock) unless you have it overcooled, but hey, I'd still rather use it and get the extra cooling than put up with VIA problems. Maybe these new SiS board will be even better?

I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 23, 2001 6:17:36 AM

damn, i spoke too soon..
I didnt check to see if everything was working. when i went to set it up in dual mode, there was no tv out support even detected. that was using the nvidia drivers. so i figured that since it was doing stupid things in turbo mode, i could try the msi drivers again. i set it to use them ,and then when the computer restarted, it basically stopped refreshing the screen, and just the splash screen was being displayed, and the blue bar on the bottom stopped moving. then i heard the windows startup sound. and when i went to safemode to see if i could revert back to the nvidia drivers, it wouldnt keep the change. and each time i would start up in safe mode, it would ask me to set the color depth and screen res. how can i remove all the video card drivers that are installed, and start from scratch?
i really hope that i will not have to reformat and install everything again. ugh....
yeah, i hooked my older sister up with a 1ghz athlon with a sis board. it only does 133 ram, but she isnt a hardcore gamer, i dont even remember her playing a game at all. and that thing is rock solid. doesnt overheat, and runs for days without a hitch. she seems happy with it.
the integrated graphics suck major ass, but it works!
now i have to figure what the hell is going on with my system.
when i had this card running, i played a bit of quake3, and man, it ran wayyyyyyyy faster than my stealth 3, now i dont want to go back. but that is what i am using to run in normal mode, so i guess for now i am stuck.
but i bought this card to be able to use the tv out. i need to get some of my animations off my computer so that i can make up my portfolio. i am planning to go to an art school and get the creds to become a pro animator.
-DAvid
a b U Graphics card
August 23, 2001 6:36:38 AM

The following files are loaded with the nVidia driver, if you can't track down the removal program on the net, you can remove them yourself in safe mode:

NVarch16.dll
NVarch32.dll
NVcore.vxd
Nvdd32.dll
Nvdisp.drv
Nvdmcpl.dll
Nvinst32.dll
Nvmini.vxd
Nvmini2.vxd
Nvmode.dll
Nvopengl.dll
Nvqtwk.dll
Nvagp.inf
NVIDIANVAGP.ing
Nvcpl.hlp


Pwhew!



I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 24, 2001 7:35:40 AM

Now i am really dissapointed. the card is running, and i had to go to great lengths to got at it. first, i tried removing all those files. i did it in safe mode, and that went fine. then i reinstalled the card, but it still had that problem for some reason. the card would lock up on the windows splash screen. then i figured that maybe it was time to get a fresh start on things. so....i formatted my windows partition, and reinstalled everything. i took all of my cars out except for the video card. then i installed them one by one. and the only one to give me any hitches was the sound card. (diamond mx-300) but it seems to be working fine. i can run quake3 fine. no errors, and it keeps a solid framerate, (60-70 in 1024x768 32 bit color, details high(keep in mind that my system is SLOW!, amd k6-2 500!)) so i was quite happy. also, regular 2d things were quite zippy. but then i tried to run test drive 5. this is a d3d game. when i ran that, i couldnt see the cars. i could see through some stuff, and i could see the cars shadows and smoke. also, i could see the cars that were racings tires. everything that i could see were really really high detail, and the anti-aliasing was great. but it was hard to race because i couldnt see. i have direct x 8.0a ,i have the latest via drivers, the bios on my motherboard is up to date, and when i tried to update the driver for the video card using the msi live update thing, it stopped downloading. it really pissed me off. could my problem, i am trying to rule everything out. i know the via motherboard could cause some problems, but could the low wattage of my psu be the prob (250 atx). i dont think the problem is really heat because i have an 80mm fan on the side of my case blowing directly on the card. i would like to solve this problem as soon as possible, and if there is anyone who knows a solution, let me know.
here is what my system is...
AMD k6-2 500
192 megs pc-100 sdram (3 x 64)
Epox Mvp3c-2 mobo
250w psu
linksys lne100tx lan card
diamond mx-300 sound card
80mm fan on side blowing on cards
golden orb on cpu
40x matshida cdrom
Maxtor udma66, 2meg buffer, 5400 rpm 10 gig
mitsumi 1.44 floppy
windows 98 SE (updated from 98)

-DAvid

I am really tired of crap that doesn't work....can't they get it right?
a b U Graphics card
August 24, 2001 9:01:10 AM

Oh, that makes it easy then-it's probably your motherboard! Seriously, they had problems with the MVP3 chipset supporting an TNT2 Ultra, VIA said it was a power issue with the AGP slot not getting enough amperage, but it affected so many boards I think it may have simply been an MVP3 issue. On the other hand the amperage issue does seem valid on one point-the MX seems to run on many of these boards, while the GTS, PRO, and the original 256 does not. The MX being the lowest current draw card of the GeForce series, I think it requires fewer watts than even the TNT2 Ultra do to the smaller transistors on the chip.
I don't know what to tell you there-obviously getting a new motherboard and processor is expensive, and you've already put a lot into the system.
BTW the MX300 is an Aureal Vortex 2 (AU8830) card which is NOT 100% compatable with VIA chipsets. So now you have a great sound card that won't run on an Athlon motherboard properly, and a great video card that won't run on an MVP3 properly. I would normally suggest that these parts would work great on a BX motherboard, except that Intel processors are expensive and necessary for the BX. What to do?
I saw an IBM Xeon 450 system for sale at Compgeeks for $300. The reason I bring this up is that it has a DUAL XEON motherboard (with only one processor in it). Now the Pentium II Xeon 450 processor cost only $24 on Pricewatch, you could actually build a DUAL 450 XEON system with your video card and sound card, great for bragging rights! Otherwise, ditch the soundcard and get a new processor/motherboard, or ditch the video card and get something that requires a little less amperage, and fight with the sound card if necessary, just because they are not 100% compatable doesn't mean you can't MAKE them work!
Oh, you do have one other option-get a heavy duty power supply and wire the 3.3v current directly into the 3.3v portion of the AGP slot! Hey, it's been done!

I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 24, 2001 10:25:47 AM

well, i like my sound card. but i was planning on getting a new one anyway. i just got this video card, so i think i will keep that. getting a job soon, and will be planning on buying an athlon and a mobo. i will also have to buy a new psu. i found a 400w psu online for 35 bucks, and i can get an athlon with a mobo for pretty cheap. so intermittent hangs and other problems with the gts/pro chip is because of the damn mvps chipset. what a kick in the pants..but oh well.
also, i think that maybe adding a card that is not going to work right on my motherboard brought out the incompatibilities of the sound card. because i never had a problem with the sound card. also, will running the gts/pro card in this computer harm the gpu? like i know that if a mobo doesnt get enough juice, then sometimes it can damage components. and if that is the case, then i will just pack up the msi and reinstall my stealth3 until i can get a mobo/proccessor/psu.
thank god there are computer shows like twice a month near me.
i started to think about heat issues when the card was hanging up, but then, when i shut it off after running quake 3, the card is warm, but not hot. i think that having that 80mm fan blowing directly on it helps a lot..
i dont know why people dog the stealth3 so much..that card kicked out some pretty good framerates, and picture qality on my system. kept up with my friends ati rage fury maxx on quake3, except when i ran it in higer than 800x600...but that is because of the memory bandwidth, and the maxx has two damn proccessors. i always laughed at him because mine cost 60 bucks, and his cost 125 bucks....
-DAvid

-Vacuums suck...really...-
a b U Graphics card
August 24, 2001 10:09:13 PM

If the motherboard is ATX you can actually help it by wiring in some juper wires from the 3.3v power supply connection to the 3.3v connectors on the AGP slot. Entire websites have been devoted to that task.

I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 24, 2001 11:48:38 PM

i will look into that. but what about this deal...it would be a definate upgrade from what i have right now, and it isnt too expensive. also, i would be able to put an atlon on it later on. this place is selling this same combo with an athlon 1.4 (266) http://www.1stclasstech.com/ecsk7s5adur8.html
it seems like a sweet deal to me, considering that i could use my ram i have right now, and even upgrade to ddr later on. also, it is a sis chipset, so i dont think that it should have those damn incompatibilities.
let me know what you think....
tomshardware liked that mobo..
and a duron 800, while it isnt an athlon 1.4, it is still better than a k62-500!
-DAvid

-Vacuums suck...really...-
August 25, 2001 1:13:38 AM

oh yeah, where are these hardwiring 3.3v to agp websites. i have been searching on dogpile all day, and cant find one...
-DAvid

-Vacuums suck...really...-
a b U Graphics card
August 25, 2001 4:43:15 AM

The motherboard deal sounds quite good. I have been considering advising these boards for my friends, except that they have not been around long enough to show their full worth. The fact that they have been around a couple weeks with no know issues yet is a good sign. And the good news about it is that you can still use your old MX300 and your GF2 Pro both in it without compatability issues. BTW I recommend NOT upgrading your sound card unless you have to. I have not found anything better sounding than my SQ2500, which has the same sound chip. I do recommend using the tweak settings until you get the sound "just right".
As for the 3.3v hotwire, it's been about two years since I actually read them, so if you can't find them you still have a couple options left: look up the specs on an AGP connector and an ATX power connector, or use a volt meter to find them. I believe the power wires are in the short front portion of the AGP slot. You can solder from point to point a jumper wire on the back of the board, a relatively thin wire should do the job.

I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 25, 2001 6:15:07 AM

i think i might not risk screwing up my video card. i think i will just wait until i can afford that motherboard. and yeah...i do like the sound quality of my mx-300. mp3's sound awesome, and the software that came with it works great. i really cant wait until i can take total advantage of this video card. i think tonight i will try the tv-out on the tv downstairs. it is going to be pain though because i have to carry my monitor downstairs. ugh..too bad the tv in my room doesnt have svideo in....BASTARDS!
and i really wish that via would get things worked out. they make some fast chips!...its a shame. whatever...i have had intel, ali, and via....now i think i need to give sis a chance.
-DAvid

-Vacuums suck...really...-
a b U Graphics card
August 25, 2001 6:29:09 AM

Not only did they neglect to add an S-Video input, but also THEY KILLED KENNY! BASTARDS!
Now about SiS, they do have a history-of producing compatable chipsets-that are the worst performing and most unstable on the market. Usually with the worst integrated graphics on the market. But they are seriously trying to do an about face on the 735. And I think they have the technical knowlege to do so. But they still have to prove themselves to me. The fact that no problems have been reported thus far is very incouraging!

I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 25, 2001 7:04:05 AM

i built my sister a 1 ghz athlon system with a motherboard equipped with i think the sis 730 chipset. it runs rock solid, but like you said, the graphics suck ass!
my 500 was whooping her 1000 in almost anything. i think the only thing that she beats me in is flash stuff. but that is beacuse flash uses the processor more. it is really sad. fortunately for her, the only thing that she uses it for is word processing, aim, mp3's, web browsing, and e-mail. so, i think that she will be fine for a while. as for me, i am actually creating flash stuff, playing intense 3d games, and doing all the stuff that she does too.
-DAvid

-Vacuums suck...really...-
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