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TDMA vs. others radiation? Someone tell me I'm crazy.

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Anonymous
September 2, 2004 9:21:49 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular,alt.cellular-phone-tech,alt.cellular.nextel,alt.cellular.attws,alt.medical (More info?)

Here's the story, improbable as it seems. A few years ago I got an
Ericsson TDMA phone from AT&T wireless, and decided to try out Sprint as
well. I liked Sprint better, but in browsing comments about the phone I
got with them (a Samsung) I noticed people complaining and headaches and
such due to an SAR toward the top of the scale. Not really knowing that
SAR isn't a great indicator of actual radiation, I opted to stick with
AT&T. However, I did notice something odd when I had the Samsung - a
kind of sinus pressure whenever the phone was around. Later, I chalked
it up as psychosomatic, though I'd never had sinus pressure like that
before.

A few years later, having gone through a number of TDMA phones (Nokias)
with AT&T, I decided to switch to Nextel. I got a Motorola i830 a few
weeks ago, and oddly enough, I noticed the sinus problem coming back.
Also, if I kept it in my pocket for an hour or so, I'd notice a distinct
tingling on my leg. Having searched the internet and found no one with
a similar problem, I second-guessed myself for quite a while. But it
seemed like getting rid of the phone for a few hours cleared up the head
pressure. So I spent a few days with my not-yet-cancelled AT&T phone,
and the pressure went away completely. I decided to give Verizon and
CDMA a chance, and I'm feeling the sinus-pressure again.

Here's my question: Is there any explanation for this? Is it possible
that I am hyper-sensitive to the electromagnetic radiation put out by
iDen and CDMA handsets but not TDMA? Even stranger, the pressure isn't
triggered by talking on the phone, but just by having it on nearby.

I know this sounds insane, considering that phones put out a minimal
amount of radiation while they're on standby, but this is driving me
crazy. AT&T is dropping TDMA soon (in favor of GSM), and I need to
switch somewhere. Does anyone have any insight? Thanks in advance.

More about : tdma radiation crazy

Anonymous
September 2, 2004 3:44:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular,alt.cellular-phone-tech,alt.cellular.nextel,alt.cellular.attws,alt.medical (More info?)

Law Benjamin <damnitalltohell@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<damnitalltohell-7639D2.22214301092004@news.verizon.net>...
> Here's the story, improbable as it seems. A few years ago I got an
> Ericsson TDMA phone from AT&T wireless, and decided to try out Sprint as
> well. I liked Sprint better, but in browsing comments about the phone I
> got with them (a Samsung) I noticed people complaining and headaches and
> such due to an SAR toward the top of the scale. Not really knowing that
> SAR isn't a great indicator of actual radiation, I opted to stick with
> AT&T. However, I did notice something odd when I had the Samsung - a
> kind of sinus pressure whenever the phone was around. Later, I chalked
> it up as psychosomatic, though I'd never had sinus pressure like that
> before.
>
> A few years later, having gone through a number of TDMA phones (Nokias)
> with AT&T, I decided to switch to Nextel. I got a Motorola i830 a few
> weeks ago, and oddly enough, I noticed the sinus problem coming back.
> Also, if I kept it in my pocket for an hour or so, I'd notice a distinct
> tingling on my leg. Having searched the internet and found no one with
> a similar problem, I second-guessed myself for quite a while. But it
> seemed like getting rid of the phone for a few hours cleared up the head
> pressure. So I spent a few days with my not-yet-cancelled AT&T phone,
> and the pressure went away completely. I decided to give Verizon and
> CDMA a chance, and I'm feeling the sinus-pressure again.
>
> Here's my question: Is there any explanation for this? Is it possible
> that I am hyper-sensitive to the electromagnetic radiation put out by
> iDen and CDMA handsets but not TDMA? Even stranger, the pressure isn't
> triggered by talking on the phone, but just by having it on nearby.
>
> I know this sounds insane, considering that phones put out a minimal
> amount of radiation while they're on standby, but this is driving me
> crazy. AT&T is dropping TDMA soon (in favor of GSM), and I need to
> switch somewhere. Does anyone have any insight? Thanks in advance.

iDEN is a form of TDMA, so if anything I would expect the same (or
similar) symptoms for IS-136 ("TDMA") and iDEN, but different symptoms
for CDMA. FWIW, GSM is also a form of TDMA.
September 3, 2004 3:31:33 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.nextel (More info?)

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 05:21:49 GMT, Law Benjamin
<damnitalltohell@hotmail.com> wrote:

>Here's the story, improbable as it seems. A few years ago I got an
>Ericsson TDMA phone from AT&T wireless, and decided to try out Sprint as
>well. I liked Sprint better, but in browsing comments about the phone I
>got with them (a Samsung) I noticed people complaining and headaches and
>such due to an SAR toward the top of the scale. Not really knowing that
>SAR isn't a great indicator of actual radiation, I opted to stick with
>AT&T. However, I did notice something odd when I had the Samsung - a
>kind of sinus pressure whenever the phone was around. Later, I chalked
>it up as psychosomatic, though I'd never had sinus pressure like that
>before.
>
>A few years later, having gone through a number of TDMA phones (Nokias)
>with AT&T, I decided to switch to Nextel. I got a Motorola i830 a few
>weeks ago, and oddly enough, I noticed the sinus problem coming back.
>Also, if I kept it in my pocket for an hour or so, I'd notice a distinct
>tingling on my leg. Having searched the internet and found no one with
>a similar problem, I second-guessed myself for quite a while. But it
>seemed like getting rid of the phone for a few hours cleared up the head
>pressure. So I spent a few days with my not-yet-cancelled AT&T phone,
>and the pressure went away completely. I decided to give Verizon and
>CDMA a chance, and I'm feeling the sinus-pressure again.
>
>Here's my question: Is there any explanation for this? Is it possible
>that I am hyper-sensitive to the electromagnetic radiation put out by
>iDen and CDMA handsets but not TDMA? Even stranger, the pressure isn't
>triggered by talking on the phone, but just by having it on nearby.
>
>I know this sounds insane, considering that phones put out a minimal
>amount of radiation while they're on standby, but this is driving me
>crazy. AT&T is dropping TDMA soon (in favor of GSM), and I need to
>switch somewhere. Does anyone have any insight? Thanks in advance.


I can tell you this. I started having the sinus symptoms last year. I
also had an employee report the same. They went away when ever I took
a vacation as I use the phone for business. I had them with an i 1000,
an i 90 and an i 730. The only way to minimize this was to you an
earphone/microphone such a Jabra. As for the problem with the
tingling, I did not have those symptoms but I did have a pain in the
hip where the phone was attached to its holster. I attributed it to
the seat belt in my vehicle constantly pressing the phone into my hip.
Once I removed the phone while driving, that pain went away. I went to
an eye ear nose and through Dr. and am getting treatment for a sinus
problem. I will not go into detail but I am not sure that its related.


Fred
Related resources
Anonymous
September 3, 2004 4:02:26 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.nextel (More info?)

fred wrote:
>
> On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 05:21:49 GMT, Law Benjamin
> <damnitalltohell@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Here's the story, improbable as it seems. A few years ago I got an
> >Ericsson TDMA phone from AT&T wireless, and decided to try out Sprint as
> >well. I liked Sprint better, but in browsing comments about the phone I
> >got with them (a Samsung) I noticed people complaining and headaches and
> >such due to an SAR toward the top of the scale. Not really knowing that
> >SAR isn't a great indicator of actual radiation, I opted to stick with
> >AT&T. However, I did notice something odd when I had the Samsung - a
> >kind of sinus pressure whenever the phone was around. Later, I chalked
> >it up as psychosomatic, though I'd never had sinus pressure like that
> >before.
> >
> >A few years later, having gone through a number of TDMA phones (Nokias)
> >with AT&T, I decided to switch to Nextel. I got a Motorola i830 a few
> >weeks ago, and oddly enough, I noticed the sinus problem coming back.
> >Also, if I kept it in my pocket for an hour or so, I'd notice a distinct
> >tingling on my leg. Having searched the internet and found no one with
> >a similar problem, I second-guessed myself for quite a while. But it
> >seemed like getting rid of the phone for a few hours cleared up the head
> >pressure. So I spent a few days with my not-yet-cancelled AT&T phone,
> >and the pressure went away completely. I decided to give Verizon and
> >CDMA a chance, and I'm feeling the sinus-pressure again.
> >
> >Here's my question: Is there any explanation for this? Is it possible
> >that I am hyper-sensitive to the electromagnetic radiation put out by
> >iDen and CDMA handsets but not TDMA? Even stranger, the pressure isn't
> >triggered by talking on the phone, but just by having it on nearby.
> >
> >I know this sounds insane, considering that phones put out a minimal
> >amount of radiation while they're on standby, but this is driving me
> >crazy. AT&T is dropping TDMA soon (in favor of GSM), and I need to
> >switch somewhere. Does anyone have any insight? Thanks in advance.
>
> I can tell you this. I started having the sinus symptoms last year. I
> also had an employee report the same. They went away when ever I took
> a vacation as I use the phone for business. I had them with an i 1000,
> an i 90 and an i 730. The only way to minimize this was to you an
> earphone/microphone such a Jabra. As for the problem with the
> tingling, I did not have those symptoms but I did have a pain in the
> hip where the phone was attached to its holster. I attributed it to
> the seat belt in my vehicle constantly pressing the phone into my hip.
> Once I removed the phone while driving, that pain went away. I went to
> an eye ear nose and through Dr. and am getting treatment for a sinus
> problem. I will not go into detail but I am not sure that its related.

Two words: Group therapy. <g>

Notan
Anonymous
September 10, 2004 8:01:49 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular,alt.cellular-phone-tech,alt.cellular.nextel,alt.cellular.attws,alt.medical (More info?)

Law Benjamin wrote:

> A few years later, having gone through a number of TDMA phones (Nokias)
> with AT&T, I decided to switch to Nextel. I got a Motorola i830 a few
> weeks ago, and oddly enough, I noticed the sinus problem coming back.
> Also, if I kept it in my pocket for an hour or so, I'd notice a distinct
> tingling on my leg. Having searched the internet and found no one with
> a similar problem, I second-guessed myself for quite a while. But it
> seemed like getting rid of the phone for a few hours cleared up the head
> pressure. So I spent a few days with my not-yet-cancelled AT&T phone,
> and the pressure went away completely. I decided to give Verizon and
> CDMA a chance, and I'm feeling the sinus-pressure again.
>
> Here's my question: Is there any explanation for this? Is it possible
> that I am hyper-sensitive to the electromagnetic radiation put out by
> iDen and CDMA handsets but not TDMA? Even stranger, the pressure isn't
> triggered by talking on the phone, but just by having it on nearby.

Then I'd have to say it's not the "radiation" coming from the phone,
especially on CDMA. I'm not sure what the slot cycle settings are for
iDEN or TDMA, but I know that a CDMA phone isn't transmitting 90% of the
time that it's on standby. In fact, on standby, the RF portion of a
CDMA phone is mainly in "sleep" mode, waking up only once about ever 4
to 6 seconds to *receive* on its paging channel, listening to see if
there's a phone call pending. About once every two minutes or so
(sometimes as long as five or ten), the CDMA handset will send out a
short burst of data, less than half a second in length if not way
shorter, to re-register with the network and say "I'm still here." The
interval between registrations are more frequent when you're moving
between various cells, but just having a cell phone lay on a table means
it will be largely inert transmitter-wise, until a call is placed or
received on it.

Again, I'm not sure of the exact intervals for TDMA or iDEN, but I
imagine they're similar. Even though the signaling schema are
different, the concept that a phone should be mostly silent on standby
is the same, mainly to save battery power and maximize spectrum
efficiency (a lot of phones idly transmitting nothing would make for
needlessly busy spectrum and would greatly reduce the amount of time a
phone can go without having to be plugged in to a charger).

It's possible there's something else you might be sensitive to in these
phones. The LCD is still being powered even when the phone is in sleep
mode, as well as various timing circuits, and the processor the runs
whatever apps and non-phone-related functions that the phone is equipped
with. Newer GSM, iDEN and CDMA phones definitely have beefier
processors and a lot more non-voice, non-radio stuff is going on in them
than your old TDMA phone. But then you would probably be allergic to
Palm PDAs and MP3 players, as a lot of them use the same ARM-based
processors as most current-model cell phones.

While I might be open to the possibility that these phones *may* have a
an effect on overall health, I would be hard pressed to accept that a
transmitter is affecting you when it's not doing anything.

I might also be willing to accept that certain frequency ranges are
affecting you more than others, but that's kinda thrown out the window,
too. AT&T's TDMA network operates in the 800Mhz band in most areas,
having been carried over from the older analog networks it was built on
top of. But then, Nextel is also 800Mhz, and so is parts of Verizon's
CDMA network. T-Mobile and Sprint are in the low 1.9Ghz range, and
you're apparently feeling the same symptoms. And again, a frequency
can't really have an effect on you if it's not being transmitted.

What about 2.4Ghz? Have you felt these symptoms talking on a 2.4Ghz
cordless home phone, or while inside of say, a Starbucks, where people
are pretty much bathing in 2.4 GHz Wifi radio?

And, are you sure this isn't psychosomatic? The mind can do pretty
amazing things, and can feel a lot of symptoms if it's convinced that it
should be feeling them.


> I know this sounds insane, considering that phones put out a minimal
> amount of radiation while they're on standby, but this is driving me
> crazy. AT&T is dropping TDMA soon (in favor of GSM), and I need to
> switch somewhere. Does anyone have any insight? Thanks in advance.

You are aware that GSM uses TDMA as a signalling format, right? The
specifics of what is transmitted are slightly different, but at its
core, GSM is basically a repackged, feature-laden version of TDMA. iDEN
also uses a TDMA signalling scheme, though its data rates are different
and a bit more heavily compressed.


Here's what I would recommend. I would take a Sprint, or Nextel, or
Verizon, or any phone of your choosing, and have a friend of yours
fiddle with the phone for a bit. Once he or she is done, they can
either leave the phone off or on (but without you knowing what they did
with the phone). then, have them lay the phone on a table or something
near you, face down or positioned so you cannot see that state of the phone.


Then note your symptoms accordingly. To verify, you might want to have
this done a few times, having your friend vary the state of the phone,
sometimes on, sometimes off. If the symptoms correlate all of the time
with the phone being on, and never occur when the phone is off, then
somehow the phone is giving you symptoms. If not, then something else
is going on.









--
E-mail fudged to thwart spammers.
Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply.
September 10, 2004 11:30:04 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular,alt.cellular-phone-tech,alt.cellular.nextel,alt.cellular.attws,alt.medical (More info?)

On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 16:01:49 -0400, Isaiah Beard
<sacredpoet@sacredpoet.com> wrote:

>Then I'd have to say it's not the "radiation" coming from the phone,
>especially on CDMA. I'm not sure what the slot cycle settings are for
>iDEN or TDMA, but I know that a CDMA phone isn't transmitting 90% of the
>time that it's on standby. In fact, on standby, the RF portion of a
>CDMA phone is mainly in "sleep" mode, waking up only once about ever 4
>to 6 seconds to *receive* on its paging channel, listening to see if
>there's a phone call pending.

If CDMA phones are so efficient why do battery times on CDMA phones
not nearly match the standby and talk time of TDMA and GSM phones?

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