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Thoughts on Revolution?

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Anonymous
September 11, 2005 6:18:53 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

Who's excited, who's not, and what are you looking forward to hearing
more about?

More about : thoughts revolution

Anonymous
September 11, 2005 6:31:25 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

"> 2) HD takes up a lot more processing power than standard NTSC -
Possibly
> , POSSIBLY leading to framerate issues (we'll have to wait and see).

And so does anything that involves better graphics - extra polygons,
extra
details, extra stuff. HD is no different in this. "

Actually no. Nintendo's got certain tricks up their sleeve to get past
this.

Displacement mapping is a very powerful technique. You all know what
bump mapping is, it's an enhanced normal map that can give an illusion
of a bump. Game Example: Halo 2. That game uses alot of bump mapping.
Displacement Maps create "real" bumps. The bumps that it creates can
create shadows. With displacement maps you can create models that look
like it has millions of polygons. The pic below is a good example of a
displacement map. The model only uses 281 polygons. With this technique
you dont need a powerful graphics chip. The only thing you need is a
graphics chip that supports this technique. This technique will be
supported by future graphics cards. Lets hope Nintendo will be
implenting this on their graphics chip(for the Revolution). With
displacement maps and cube mapping the revolution can create gorgeous
graphics. Graphics that can compete and/or surpass the PS3 with only a
fraction of the price. This is how Nintendo can create a low price
console.

Hmm, no HTML tags? Fine, check this out for an example:

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b2/marcopolo123/Displ...

It's not about power, it's about what techniques you use.

Patent: [0034] The present invention solves this problem by providing
techniques and arrangements in a graphics rendering system for the
efficient generation of texture coordinate displacements for
implementing at least an emboss-style bump-mapping texture effect
without the need for the host CPU application software to compute the
required texture coordinate displacements. An enhanced API
(applications program interface) vertex attribute function capable of
specifying three surface normals per vertex (i.e., the Normal, Tangent
and Binormal) is utilized and the host CPU application software need
only compute the required additional Tangent and Binormal surface
vectors per vertex in object-space (model-space), in addition to
providing the surface Normal and other conventional per-vertex
attributes.

And of course, Gamecube's Cube Mapping (combines prerendered graphics
with real-time processing (eg RE4)) will return more advanced than
ever, and combining it with Displacement should have an interesting
effect.
September 12, 2005 7:00:42 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

"Michael Cargill" <mikementalist@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:3ojgmbF688fqU1@individual.net...
> "greenyammo" <greenyammo@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:mGUUe.20375$k22.9593@fe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>
> To be honest, it is very hard to get a controller wrong.
>
How about Xbox's first controller/doorstop?
Related resources
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 12:18:10 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

<elctropro@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1126474285.253973.196210@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> "> 2) HD takes up a lot more processing power than standard NTSC -
> Possibly
> > , POSSIBLY leading to framerate issues (we'll have to wait and see).
>
> And so does anything that involves better graphics - extra polygons,
> extra
> details, extra stuff. HD is no different in this. "
>
> Actually no. Nintendo's got certain tricks up their sleeve to get past
> this.

Are you trying to somehow disprove my point that improving the graphics
takes up more processing power...?
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 12:18:11 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

"Michael Cargill" <mikementalist@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:3om2puF6cigmU1@individual.net...
> <elctropro@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1126474285.253973.196210@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
>> "> 2) HD takes up a lot more processing power than standard NTSC -
>> Possibly
>> > , POSSIBLY leading to framerate issues (we'll have to wait and see).
>>
>> And so does anything that involves better graphics - extra polygons,
>> extra
>> details, extra stuff. HD is no different in this. "
>>
>> Actually no. Nintendo's got certain tricks up their sleeve to get past
>> this.
>
> Are you trying to somehow disprove my point that improving the graphics
> takes up more processing power...?

I think he's successfully proven that increased complexity in world detail
does not necessarily require as much of an increase in processing power as
an increase in screen resolution does.

--
figmentPez
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 12:19:55 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

"Rob" <robertnospamaccomando@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ub6Ve.11148$FW1.9826@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>
> "Michael Cargill" <mikementalist@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
> news:3ojgmbF688fqU1@individual.net...
> > "greenyammo" <greenyammo@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:mGUUe.20375$k22.9593@fe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
> >
> > To be honest, it is very hard to get a controller wrong.
> >
> How about Xbox's first controller/doorstop?

To be honest I never saw the problem with the original Xbox controller. It
fit fine into my hands, though the Controller S is far better.

I also never saw why people didn't like the Dreamcast controller and, other
than all the silly extra buttons, didn't have any issues with the Atari
Jaguar controller.
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 1:53:27 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

"figmentPez" <NoSpam@papernapkin.com> wrote in message
news:4_kVe.6561$S26.2737@tornado.texas.rr.com...
> "Michael Cargill" <mikementalist@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
> news:3om2puF6cigmU1@individual.net...
> > <elctropro@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >
> > Are you trying to somehow disprove my point that improving the graphics
> > takes up more processing power...?
>
> I think he's successfully proven that increased complexity in world detail
> does not necessarily require as much of an increase in processing power as
> an increase in screen resolution does.

I never said it did - the OP was stating that HDTV would increase the need
for processing power. I was just pointing out that to use that as an
argument against it, you would be arguing against better graphics in
general.
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 2:32:05 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

"Michael Cargill" <mikementalist@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:3om8cjF6leeqU1@individual.net...
> "figmentPez" <NoSpam@papernapkin.com> wrote in message
> news:4_kVe.6561$S26.2737@tornado.texas.rr.com...
>> "Michael Cargill" <mikementalist@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
>> news:3om2puF6cigmU1@individual.net...
>> > <elctropro@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >
>> > Are you trying to somehow disprove my point that improving the graphics
>> > takes up more processing power...?
>>
>> I think he's successfully proven that increased complexity in world
>> detail
>> does not necessarily require as much of an increase in processing power
>> as
>> an increase in screen resolution does.
>
> I never said it did - the OP was stating that HDTV would increase the need
> for processing power. I was just pointing out that to use that as an
> argument against it, you would be arguing against better graphics in
> general.

HDTV resolutions do increase the need for processing power over that of
standard definition resolutions, the need to increase processing power for
more world detail is a completely seperate issue. All things equal, for the
same amount of world detail, it takes more processing power to produce a
final image of 1280x720 than it does for a resoultion of 854x480, it would
likely also take more processing power to produce a 1280x720 image than an
854x480 image with 4xAA (and anisotripic filtering) if PC games are any
indication.

--
figmentPez
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 4:12:41 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

> HDTV resolutions do increase the need for processing power over that of
> standard definition resolutions, the need to increase processing power for
> more world detail is a completely seperate issue. All things equal, for the
> same amount of world detail, it takes more processing power to produce a
> final image of 1280x720 than it does for a resoultion of 854x480, it would
> likely also take more processing power to produce a 1280x720 image than an
> 854x480 image with 4xAA (and anisotripic filtering) if PC games are any
> indication.

LOL Why are you repeating what's already been said and agreed on, and why
doesn't anyone understand what Michael is trying to say?!!! HD will require
more processor power, but so will other improvements in graphics, be it
increase in polygons, texture detail, resolution, etc.
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 4:12:42 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

"ln" <ln@spam.com> wrote in message
news:k94ywpupuaiw.jsvsbh1jhwij.dlg@40tude.net...
>
>> HDTV resolutions do increase the need for processing power over that of
>> standard definition resolutions, the need to increase processing power
>> for
>> more world detail is a completely seperate issue. All things equal, for
>> the
>> same amount of world detail, it takes more processing power to produce a
>> final image of 1280x720 than it does for a resoultion of 854x480, it
>> would
>> likely also take more processing power to produce a 1280x720 image than
>> an
>> 854x480 image with 4xAA (and anisotripic filtering) if PC games are any
>> indication.
>
> LOL Why are you repeating what's already been said and agreed on, and why
> doesn't anyone understand what Michael is trying to say?!!! HD will
> require
> more processor power, but so will other improvements in graphics, be it
> increase in polygons, texture detail, resolution, etc.

Are you stupid or something? Yes, improving graphics requires more
processing power. But HD only adds to the amount needed, it's not like HD
comes for free with an increase in other areas.
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 5:29:32 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

>> LOL Why are you repeating what's already been said and agreed on, and why
>> doesn't anyone understand what Michael is trying to say?!!! HD will
>> require
>> more processor power, but so will other improvements in graphics, be it
>> increase in polygons, texture detail, resolution, etc.
>
> Are you stupid or something? Yes, improving graphics requires more
> processing power. But HD only adds to the amount needed, it's not like HD
> comes for free with an increase in other areas.

Calm down. Could you point to where I implied that HD comes free? In fact I
more or less stated HD will be add to the amount needed. Basically you
repeated what I said, and called me stupid.

I'll say it again for your benefit.
HD will require more processing power, but so does any other graphical
'effect'. It's one of the hurdles if you want an improvement in the visual
output. You've now got me stating the bleedin' obvious too. I hope you're
proud.
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 9:54:05 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.video.nintendo (More info?)

"ln" <ln@spam.com> wrote in message
news:o ofatxom6zfc$.9qacqd4u4t4o$.dlg@40tude.net...
>> Are you stupid or something? Yes, improving graphics requires more
>> processing power. But HD only adds to the amount needed, it's not like HD
>> comes for free with an increase in other areas.
>
> Calm down. Could you point to where I implied that HD comes free? In fact
> I
> more or less stated HD will be add to the amount needed. Basically you
> repeated what I said, and called me stupid.
>
> I'll say it again for your benefit.
> HD will require more processing power, but so does any other graphical
> 'effect'. It's one of the hurdles if you want an improvement in the visual
> output. You've now got me stating the bleedin' obvious too. I hope you're
> proud.

Yes, I'm quite proud of my ability to see that in the console market, where
a majority of people will not be using HD resoultions it's better to focus
the processing power on world detail and other aspects rather than pumping
it into higher resolution. Ultimately more gamers will be able to see an
854x480 image with 4xAA and 8xAniso (and other filter effects) than will be
able to see a 1280x720 image with no AA or Ansio. Is this so hard to
understand? HD resoultions take extra processing power, processing power
costs time and money, lack of processing power leads to bad frame rates and
uresponsive games. Sadly, too many people just want better looking still
images, and more features to bullet point on packaging. Also, Sony is pretty
desperate to sell HDTVs.

--
figmentPez
September 19, 2006 9:40:31 AM

i'm exited, because i want to see what the WII and the new remote can do.
but i'm worried, too! what if the gamers don't accept the new concept???
!