fury druid question

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My fury druid have reached the points where he have maxed fury, ww, lycan
and oak sage.

What should i go for grizzly or dire wolf ?

The grizzly doesn't kill anything in hell, but is a beauty tank that holds
of monsters while spl_Wolfman and Sigurd kills. Sigurd is my good barb
merc using full sazabi's set.

I need something to hold back those wraith types monsters that are PI in
hell and mana burners while i take them down one by one.

--
Sonni
 
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On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 13:29:53 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:

> My fury druid have reached the points where he have maxed fury, ww, lycan
> and oak sage.
>
> What should i go for grizzly or dire wolf ?
>
> The grizzly doesn't kill anything in hell, but is a beauty tank that holds
> of monsters while spl_Wolfman and Sigurd kills. Sigurd is my good barb
> merc using full sazabi's set.
>
> I need something to hold back those wraith types monsters that are PI in
> hell and mana burners while i take them down one by one.

I posted a discussion a few months ago about why Dire Wolves are
better for decoys - there are more of them and they have more overall
life after a few skills points, especially considering their synergy.

Btw - maxing WW is a waste for a Fury Druid if you can
get some AR from another source, as the additional IAS
off weapon doesn't help your Fury speed (mostly only
weapon speed matters).
 

eb

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If you max'ed Oak sage then the grizzly is your best bet. Cookie-cutter
combos are Grizzly/Oak sage or DireWolf/Heart of Wolverine.
I've always done the HoW/dire wolf combo, but I've yet to reach Hell so I
don't know if that's the best.
Oak sage should GREATLY tank your Grizzly to hold monsters at bay while you
can pick them off.

Let me know when you are online so we can play with my elemental druid and
your werewolf :).
With my wolves and HoW maxed and your Oak sage/grizzly, should be an nasty
combo.


EB

"Sonni Skammelsen" <news@sonni.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.11.22.12.29.52.231483@sonni.org...
> My fury druid have reached the points where he have maxed fury, ww, lycan
> and oak sage.
>
> What should i go for grizzly or dire wolf ?
>
> The grizzly doesn't kill anything in hell, but is a beauty tank that holds
> of monsters while spl_Wolfman and Sigurd kills. Sigurd is my good barb
> merc using full sazabi's set.
>
> I need something to hold back those wraith types monsters that are PI in
> hell and mana burners while i take them down one by one.
>
> --
> Sonni
 
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On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 09:22:08 -0600, Last2Know wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 13:29:53 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>
>> My fury druid have reached the points where he have maxed fury, ww, lycan
>> and oak sage.
>>
>> What should i go for grizzly or dire wolf ?
>>
>> The grizzly doesn't kill anything in hell, but is a beauty tank that holds
>> of monsters while spl_Wolfman and Sigurd kills. Sigurd is my good barb
>> merc using full sazabi's set.
>>
>> I need something to hold back those wraith types monsters that are PI in
>> hell and mana burners while i take them down one by one.
>
> I posted a discussion a few months ago about why Dire Wolves are
> better for decoys - there are more of them and they have more overall
> life after a few skills points, especially considering their synergy.
>

I have an other druid using dire wolves, and at level 10 they are one hit
killed by normal lister.
here i have a level 6 grizzly that nm lister and friends can't kill, so i
will not change from grizzly to dire wolves here, but how much do i get
from putting points into dire wolves or directly into bear.

> Btw - maxing WW is a waste for a Fury Druid if you can
> get some AR from another source, as the additional IAS
> off weapon doesn't help your Fury speed (mostly only
> weapon speed matters).

With 4 pieces of the IK set i get 250 extra AR and multiplied with the AR
bonus from WW i still need tp put points into dex to get to 95% chance to
hit monsters, so what should i use to get the additional 350% AR WW gives
me?
I can remember any item giving that much extra AR.

--
Sonni
 
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On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 16:50:52 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 09:22:08 -0600, Last2Know wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 13:29:53 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>>
>>> My fury druid have reached the points where he have maxed fury, ww, lycan
>>> and oak sage.
>>>
>>> What should i go for grizzly or dire wolf ?
>>>
>>> The grizzly doesn't kill anything in hell, but is a beauty tank that holds
>>> of monsters while spl_Wolfman and Sigurd kills. Sigurd is my good barb
>>> merc using full sazabi's set.
>>>
>>> I need something to hold back those wraith types monsters that are PI in
>>> hell and mana burners while i take them down one by one.
>>
>> I posted a discussion a few months ago about why Dire Wolves are
>> better for decoys - there are more of them and they have more overall
>> life after a few skills points, especially considering their synergy.
>>
>
> I have an other druid using dire wolves, and at level 10 they are one hit
> killed by normal lister.
> here i have a level 6 grizzly that nm lister and friends can't kill, so i
> will not change from grizzly to dire wolves here, but how much do i get
> from putting points into dire wolves or directly into bear.

If you have one wolf killed, you are still
left with two decoys compared to one in the case of the grizz,
so from a decoy point of view you are still ahead at that point.
But how many real skill points do you have in Dire Wolves?
They only get synergy from real skill points. Unless you
think the info on Arreat Summit is wrong, you can look it
up and see that the total hit points of the Dire Wolves
passes the Grizzly at around lvl 4 or so of hard skill
points (I forget exactly).

>> Btw - maxing WW is a waste for a Fury Druid if you can
>> get some AR from another source, as the additional IAS
>> off weapon doesn't help your Fury speed (mostly only
>> weapon speed matters).
>
> With 4 pieces of the IK set i get 250 extra AR and multiplied with the AR
> bonus from WW i still need tp put points into dex to get to 95% chance to
> hit monsters, so what should i use to get the additional 350% AR WW gives
> me?

Since you are using a two-handed weapon rather than a shield
you need more than I did. But Ravenfrost rings is one
good source of massive AR and +100 AR large charms are
pretty common too. Lots of amulets also have Dex boost.

95% chance to hit is very high (theoretical max) and hard to achieve
unless your char is as high level as the monster. I usually
settle for something more like 85%.
 
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Last2Know wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 16:50:52 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>
>
>>On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 09:22:08 -0600, Last2Know wrote:
>>
>>
>>>On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 13:29:53 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>My fury druid have reached the points where he have maxed fury, ww, lycan
>>>>and oak sage.
>>>>
>>>>What should i go for grizzly or dire wolf ?
>>>>
>>>>The grizzly doesn't kill anything in hell, but is a beauty tank that holds
>>>>of monsters while spl_Wolfman and Sigurd kills. Sigurd is my good barb
>>>>merc using full sazabi's set.
>>>>
>>>>I need something to hold back those wraith types monsters that are PI in
>>>>hell and mana burners while i take them down one by one.
>>>
>>>I posted a discussion a few months ago about why Dire Wolves are
>>>better for decoys - there are more of them and they have more overall
>>>life after a few skills points, especially considering their synergy.
>>>
>>
>>I have an other druid using dire wolves, and at level 10 they are one hit
>>killed by normal lister.
>>here i have a level 6 grizzly that nm lister and friends can't kill, so i
>>will not change from grizzly to dire wolves here, but how much do i get
>>from putting points into dire wolves or directly into bear.
>
>
> If you have one wolf killed, you are still
> left with two decoys compared to one in the case of the grizz,
> so from a decoy point of view you are still ahead at that point.
> But how many real skill points do you have in Dire Wolves?
> They only get synergy from real skill points. Unless you
> think the info on Arreat Summit is wrong, you can look it
> up and see that the total hit points of the Dire Wolves
> passes the Grizzly at around lvl 4 or so of hard skill
> points (I forget exactly).
>

Yes after one hit i still have to more, but after 2 more hits i have
zero, wereas the grizzly still stands at the end of the battle, and
wolves was in normal and grizzly in nm.

My grizzly have 1 hardpoint, whereas my wolves is 10 hardpoints.

>
>>>Btw - maxing WW is a waste for a Fury Druid if you can
>>>get some AR from another source, as the additional IAS
>>>off weapon doesn't help your Fury speed (mostly only
>>>weapon speed matters).
>>
>>With 4 pieces of the IK set i get 250 extra AR and multiplied with the AR
>>bonus from WW i still need tp put points into dex to get to 95% chance to
>>hit monsters, so what should i use to get the additional 350% AR WW gives
>>me?
>
>
> Since you are using a two-handed weapon rather than a shield
> you need more than I did. But Ravenfrost rings is one
> good source of massive AR and +100 AR large charms are
> pretty common too. Lots of amulets also have Dex boost.
>

I have to use many +100 AR charms, ravenfrosts and amulets to get the
same payback as i get from an extra 350% AR, just the 250 AR from IK is
tranformed to 875 AR, so thats around 2 perfect ravens and 3 +100 AR GC.

> 95% chance to hit is very high (theoretical max) and hard to achieve
> unless your char is as high level as the monster. I usually
> settle for something more like 85%.

95% is max, thats what you aim for just like the 75% block with a shield :)
It's pretty close i am they same level as the monsters, started act1 as
level 75 and just finished act2 hell as level 79, so i think that close
enough :)

--
Sonni
 
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On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 18:08:57 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:

> Last2Know wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 16:50:52 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>>
>>
>>>On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 09:22:08 -0600, Last2Know wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 13:29:53 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>My fury druid have reached the points where he have maxed fury, ww, lycan
>>>>>and oak sage.
>>>>>
>>>>>What should i go for grizzly or dire wolf ?
>>>>>
>>>>>The grizzly doesn't kill anything in hell, but is a beauty tank that holds
>>>>>of monsters while spl_Wolfman and Sigurd kills. Sigurd is my good barb
>>>>>merc using full sazabi's set.
>>>>>
>>>>>I need something to hold back those wraith types monsters that are PI in
>>>>>hell and mana burners while i take them down one by one.
>>>>
>>>>I posted a discussion a few months ago about why Dire Wolves are
>>>>better for decoys - there are more of them and they have more overall
>>>>life after a few skills points, especially considering their synergy.
>>>>
>>>
>>>I have an other druid using dire wolves, and at level 10 they are one hit
>>>killed by normal lister.
>>>here i have a level 6 grizzly that nm lister and friends can't kill, so i
>>>will not change from grizzly to dire wolves here, but how much do i get
>>>from putting points into dire wolves or directly into bear.
>>
>>
>> If you have one wolf killed, you are still
>> left with two decoys compared to one in the case of the grizz,
>> so from a decoy point of view you are still ahead at that point.
>> But how many real skill points do you have in Dire Wolves?
>> They only get synergy from real skill points. Unless you
>> think the info on Arreat Summit is wrong, you can look it
>> up and see that the total hit points of the Dire Wolves
>> passes the Grizzly at around lvl 4 or so of hard skill
>> points (I forget exactly).
>>
>
> Yes after one hit i still have to more, but after 2 more hits i have
> zero, wereas the grizzly still stands at the end of the battle, and
> wolves was in normal and grizzly in nm.
>
> My grizzly have 1 hardpoint, whereas my wolves is 10 hardpoints.

If it is the same char, then the grizzly is also benefiting from the
life synergy of the 10 hard pts in wolves, but I still can't
make sense of that anyway, as no monster attack should be
able to one hit kill a level 10+ Dire Wolf even without Oak Sage,
and anything that does should kill the Grizzly.
But if they are actually dieing from many hits over a long time
period then the grizz self-healing could factor in.
 
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"Sonni Skammelsen" <news@sonni.org> wrote in message
news:cf6tnc.8tn.ln@www1.sonni.org...
> Yes after one hit i still have to more, but after 2 more hits i have zero,
> wereas the grizzly still stands at the end of the battle, and wolves was
> in normal and grizzly in nm.
>
> My grizzly have 1 hardpoint, whereas my wolves is 10 hardpoints.

That's odd. I have 3 hard points in spirit/dire/grizzly and I played entire
NM with dire wolves, used grizzly against end bosses.
Only place where they died fast was CS.

> 95% is max, thats what you aim for just like the 75% block with a shield
> :)
> It's pretty close i am they same level as the monsters, started act1 as
> level 75 and just finished act2 hell as level 79, so i think that close
> enough :)

I just finished act1 at 75, chance to hit is 91% but I think I'll start
loosing this pretty soon, my dex is about 100. I'll have to start hunting AR
charms.
 
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On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 01:34:17 +0100, NuWorld wrote:

> "Sonni Skammelsen" <news@sonni.org> wrote in message
> news:cf6tnc.8tn.ln@www1.sonni.org...
>> Yes after one hit i still have to more, but after 2 more hits i have zero,
>> wereas the grizzly still stands at the end of the battle, and wolves was
>> in normal and grizzly in nm.
>>
>> My grizzly have 1 hardpoint, whereas my wolves is 10 hardpoints.
>
> That's odd. I have 3 hard points in spirit/dire/grizzly and I played entire
> NM with dire wolves, used grizzly against end bosses.
> Only place where they died fast was CS.
>

Seems like i'm doing something wrong, my dire wolves never seems to last
for long, but my grizzlies seems to last forever.

>> 95% is max, thats what you aim for just like the 75% block with a shield
>> :)
>> It's pretty close i am they same level as the monsters, started act1 as
>> level 75 and just finished act2 hell as level 79, so i think that close
>> enough :)
>
> I just finished act1 at 75, chance to hit is 91% but I think I'll start
> loosing this pretty soon, my dex is about 100. I'll have to start hunting AR
> charms.

When i finished Duriel i had 87% chance of hit, and that was with 45 point
in dex, i only put 10 there so far, but it's going to be where i put
points from now on.
 
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On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 19:04:20 -0600, Last2Know wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 18:08:57 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>
>> Last2Know wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 16:50:52 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 09:22:08 -0600, Last2Know wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 13:29:53 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>My fury druid have reached the points where he have maxed fury, ww, lycan
>>>>>>and oak sage.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>What should i go for grizzly or dire wolf ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The grizzly doesn't kill anything in hell, but is a beauty tank that holds
>>>>>>of monsters while spl_Wolfman and Sigurd kills. Sigurd is my good barb
>>>>>>merc using full sazabi's set.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I need something to hold back those wraith types monsters that are PI in
>>>>>>hell and mana burners while i take them down one by one.
>>>>>
>>>>>I posted a discussion a few months ago about why Dire Wolves are
>>>>>better for decoys - there are more of them and they have more overall
>>>>>life after a few skills points, especially considering their synergy.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I have an other druid using dire wolves, and at level 10 they are one hit
>>>>killed by normal lister.
>>>>here i have a level 6 grizzly that nm lister and friends can't kill, so i
>>>>will not change from grizzly to dire wolves here, but how much do i get
>>>>from putting points into dire wolves or directly into bear.
>>>
>>>
>>> If you have one wolf killed, you are still
>>> left with two decoys compared to one in the case of the grizz,
>>> so from a decoy point of view you are still ahead at that point.
>>> But how many real skill points do you have in Dire Wolves?
>>> They only get synergy from real skill points. Unless you
>>> think the info on Arreat Summit is wrong, you can look it
>>> up and see that the total hit points of the Dire Wolves
>>> passes the Grizzly at around lvl 4 or so of hard skill
>>> points (I forget exactly).
>>>
>>
>> Yes after one hit i still have to more, but after 2 more hits i have
>> zero, wereas the grizzly still stands at the end of the battle, and
>> wolves was in normal and grizzly in nm.
>>
>> My grizzly have 1 hardpoint, whereas my wolves is 10 hardpoints.
>
> If it is the same char, then the grizzly is also benefiting from the
> life synergy of the 10 hard pts in wolves, but I still can't
> make sense of that anyway, as no monster attack should be
> able to one hit kill a level 10+ Dire Wolf even without Oak Sage,
> and anything that does should kill the Grizzly.
> But if they are actually dieing from many hits over a long time
> period then the grizz self-healing could factor in.

No it's not the same druid.
But now we are starting to get where i wanted to go.
Does the grizzly get more hitpoints from putting skills into grizzly or
into dire wolves, thats all i wanted to know :)

--
Sonni
 
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On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 10:16:23 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 19:04:20 -0600, Last2Know wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 18:08:57 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>>
>>> Last2Know wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 16:50:52 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 09:22:08 -0600, Last2Know wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 13:29:53 +0100, Sonni Skammelsen wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>My fury druid have reached the points where he have maxed fury, ww, lycan
>>>>>>>and oak sage.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>What should i go for grizzly or dire wolf ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The grizzly doesn't kill anything in hell, but is a beauty tank that holds
>>>>>>>of monsters while spl_Wolfman and Sigurd kills. Sigurd is my good barb
>>>>>>>merc using full sazabi's set.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I need something to hold back those wraith types monsters that are PI in
>>>>>>>hell and mana burners while i take them down one by one.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I posted a discussion a few months ago about why Dire Wolves are
>>>>>>better for decoys - there are more of them and they have more overall
>>>>>>life after a few skills points, especially considering their synergy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I have an other druid using dire wolves, and at level 10 they are one hit
>>>>>killed by normal lister.
>>>>>here i have a level 6 grizzly that nm lister and friends can't kill, so i
>>>>>will not change from grizzly to dire wolves here, but how much do i get
>>>>>from putting points into dire wolves or directly into bear.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If you have one wolf killed, you are still
>>>> left with two decoys compared to one in the case of the grizz,
>>>> so from a decoy point of view you are still ahead at that point.
>>>> But how many real skill points do you have in Dire Wolves?
>>>> They only get synergy from real skill points. Unless you
>>>> think the info on Arreat Summit is wrong, you can look it
>>>> up and see that the total hit points of the Dire Wolves
>>>> passes the Grizzly at around lvl 4 or so of hard skill
>>>> points (I forget exactly).
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes after one hit i still have to more, but after 2 more hits i have
>>> zero, wereas the grizzly still stands at the end of the battle, and
>>> wolves was in normal and grizzly in nm.
>>>
>>> My grizzly have 1 hardpoint, whereas my wolves is 10 hardpoints.
>>
>> If it is the same char, then the grizzly is also benefiting from the
>> life synergy of the 10 hard pts in wolves, but I still can't
>> make sense of that anyway, as no monster attack should be
>> able to one hit kill a level 10+ Dire Wolf even without Oak Sage,
>> and anything that does should kill the Grizzly.
>> But if they are actually dieing from many hits over a long time
>> period then the grizz self-healing could factor in.
>
> No it's not the same druid.
> But now we are starting to get where i wanted to go.
> Does the grizzly get more hitpoints from putting skills into grizzly or
> into dire wolves, thats all i wanted to know :)

The Grizzly gets +25% life bonus for each hard point in Dire Wolf
and +5% resist all for each hard point in Grizzly (Dire Wolf would
get +5% resist all for each hard point in Dire Wolf).
Putting points in Grizzly increases its damage. Putting
points in Spirit Wolf increases its AR and Defense.

http://www.battle.net/diablo2exp/skills/druid-summoning.shtml
 
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On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 08:39:31 -0600, Last2Know wrote:

>[snip a lot]
>> No it's not the same druid.
>> But now we are starting to get where i wanted to go.
>> Does the grizzly get more hitpoints from putting skills into grizzly or
>> into dire wolves, thats all i wanted to know :)
>
> The Grizzly gets +25% life bonus for each hard point in Dire Wolf
> and +5% resist all for each hard point in Grizzly (Dire Wolf would
> get +5% resist all for each hard point in Dire Wolf).
> Putting points in Grizzly increases its damage. Putting
> points in Spirit Wolf increases its AR and Defense.
>
> http://www.battle.net/diablo2exp/skills/druid-summoning.shtml

Yes, but something is weird with that page.
It says a grizzly have 975 life, and i have 1 point in direwolves too to
get the grizzly and it show that my grizzly have 1425 life, which is also
correct after what they write.

But then comes the thing where as got into troubles.
When i have a unused skill point the skill tree shows that the grizzly
will get +1800 life if i put a point there, but it shouldn't get more life
by doing that.

By putting the point into dire wolves will get the grizzly up to 1660 life.

So is it a display bug or is grizzly life going up with skill points even
if arreat summit says no?

--
Sonni
 
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"Sonni Skammelsen" <news@sonni.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.11.23.09.14.23.280794@sonni.org...
> When i finished Duriel i had 87% chance of hit, and that was with 45 point
> in dex, i only put 10 there so far, but it's going to be where i put
> points from now on.

I had to put 65 points because of rare silver-edged axe I'm using, with
items it's close to 100. Btw, what weapon do you use? I'm thinking of
upgrading perfect Steeldriver to elite if this axe won't cut it in Hell.
 
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"Sonni Skammelsen" <news@sonni.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.11.23.15.05.08.954013@sonni.org...
> On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 08:39:31 -0600, Last2Know wrote:
>
> So is it a display bug or is grizzly life going up with skill points even
> if arreat summit says no?

I think it's like with golems, each golem gains more life by adding point in
one, same happens with druid summons. Dire wolf synergy bonus comes on top
of that.
 
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NuWorld wrote:

> "Sonni Skammelsen" <news@sonni.org> wrote in message
> news:pan.2004.11.23.09.14.23.280794@sonni.org...
>
>>When i finished Duriel i had 87% chance of hit, and that was with 45 point
>>in dex, i only put 10 there so far, but it's going to be where i put
>>points from now on.
>
>
> I had to put 65 points because of rare silver-edged axe I'm using, with
> items it's close to 100. Btw, what weapon do you use? I'm thinking of
> upgrading perfect Steeldriver to elite if this axe won't cut it in Hell.
>
>

I'm using IK maul, IK boots, IK gloves and IK belt.
This gives some good bonuses, incl. elemental damage to PI.
Used upgraded Steeldriver until level 76 where i could use IK maul.

--
Sonni