ATI RADEON cannot play Dolby DVDs!

jpscfl · Jul 22, 2002

Hey everyone... ATI tech support just made it official! There is a known problem with Dolby playback losing sync with the video. On my PC, everything starts correctly, but after an hour, the audio is almost 2 seconds behind the video! ATI's response: "We are aware of this problem, so in the meantime, just use regular stereo." How's that for tech support? Why have a dolby 5.1 system to playback regular stereo? To me, that's like buying a car that cannot turn left. If I brought that car to ATI for service, they would probably say: Yeah, we know about that, so instead of making a left turn, just make 3 rights. Apparently, this problem affects ALL ATI DVD players, the 7500 and 8500. System is 1.4ghz cpu, 512mb mem, running WinXP and/or Win98se...I tried both! If you are considering a software DVD player, I strongly suggest avoiding ATI!

USpatriot · Jul 22, 2002

You need to relax man... i'm sure the problem will be fixed. You can't expect a product to not have ANY problems as newer technology comes out....
What did you want ATI to tell you? What else can they say other than use regular stereo til they fix it?

jpscfl · Jul 22, 2002

I was told to avoid ATI, because of their horrible driver support, but I thought the 7500 was a cool product. What a mistake that was! I originally had a AMD K-6 running at 500mhz. I was using a Creative Labs DxR3 decoder board and I was able to play DVDs without any problems whatsoever. Then, I wanted to use video capture and was considering Creative's "Digital VCR" card, but thought...Why not just get an All-In-Wonder?
Well, the 7500 was not able to capture ANYthing because of "lack of horsepower," even though a 500mhz cpu was within their advertised specs. So, I built this 1.4ghz PC. Now, I believe I have enough power, but I still cannot get this ATI resource pig to run smoothly. If you think "just run the player w/o Dolby," is a viable solution, you obviously do not have a Dolby system. Why not suggest: Keep the Dolby, but shut off the TV, so audio-video sync will not be a problem? Since this affects every product they make, they should have tested this piece of junk before releasing it. As for "they will fix it..." Would you like to make a bet? All they care about now is releasing the 9000 stuff...Something I would not touch if it was given to me free of charge!

AMD_Man · Jul 22, 2002

Um, ok. Which DVD player are you using? I've never had a similar problem and I've never heard of anyone complaining about this problem. Obviously it's very rare, if it even exists. I can't believe that the first sign of a problem you start hating ATI! I mean, nVidia has had similar problems before too. ATI has the best support in the world, IMO. Who else has to your door service for free?

"A penny saved is a penny earned!"

jpscfl · Jul 22, 2002

Which DVD player? The ATI 7.6 and 7.7

You said: "I've never had a similar problem and I've never heard of anyone complaining about this problem. Obviously it's very rare, if it even exists."

Hmmmm I thought I said ATI confirmed this? ATI said this problem affects ALL ATI products and since I do not own ALL ATI products, I feel it's safe to say someone else MAY have this problem too.

"ATI has the best support in the world, IMO. Who else has to your door service for free?"

I have spent more on long distance phone calls for this "free support" than I originally spent for this card!
Does Nvidia have decent support? I would not know, nor would I care, since my other PC with a TI4600 is running just fine!

AMD_Man · Jul 22, 2002

Which DVD player? The ATI 7.6 and 7.7

You said: "I've never had a similar problem and I've never heard of anyone complaining about this problem. Obviously it's very rare, if it even exists."

Hmmmm I thought I said ATI confirmed this? ATI said this problem affects ALL ATI products and since I do not own ALL ATI products, I feel it's safe to say someone else MAY have this problem too.

Hmm, the ATI DVD Player never fully supported Dolby Digital 5.1. Get PowerDVD or WinDVD (the full editions not the light ones that come with hardware). They run perfectly with Dolby Digital sound.

"A penny saved is a penny earned!"

Oracle · Jul 22, 2002

AMD_MAN seems to be right. Here's an excerpt from the AIW 8500 feature page : "Actual Dolby® 5.1 AC-3 decoding is done by the external AC-3 decoder which is not included."
Can you expect a car to turn left when it was designed from the beginning to turn right?

Floppy disk?!? What the heck's a floppy disk?!?

jpscfl · Jul 22, 2002

Yes, the actual decoding is done by an external receiver. However, if the audio is sent later than the video, the external decoder will decode it later! If I want my car to turn right, I would prefer it to turn right when I turn the wheel, not 2 seconds later! I do not recall Sony Dolby receivers having the 2 second delay feature installed.

AMD_Man · Jul 23, 2002

Yes, the actual decoding is done by an external receiver. However, if the audio is sent later than the video, the external decoder will decode it later! If I want my car to turn right, I would prefer it to turn right when I turn the wheel, not 2 seconds later! I do not recall Sony Dolby receivers having the 2 second delay feature installed.

You realize the sound has nothing to do with the graphics card but rather the sound card. What sound card are you running?

"A penny saved is a penny earned!"

bront · Jul 23, 2002

Hey, if they just found the problem, give them time to fix it. Obviously, it it was a long standing problem, it would have been more publicized by now.

Also, is this simply a problem with ATI's DVD software? Or is it a problem with any DVD software using an ATI card?

Don't start a flame war while immersed in gasoline.

bront · Jul 23, 2002

I've never been a big fan of the ATI multimedia suite personaly. Had strange issues when playing back different video formats because settings would mysteriously be reset. That's been my only "Complaint" about ATI that I've had. Everything else has been fantastic.

Often times, the "Free" software that comes with products is free with a reason. There are plenty of very good DVD decoding softwares out there that will work perfecty in your setup.

Don't start a flame war while immersed in gasoline.

jpscfl · Jul 23, 2002

You may be right about them "just finding the problem." From the responses I have been receiving, it appears nobody has ever listened to a DVD using Dolby 5.1 except me?

I feel the Dolby sound is just as important as the DVD-quality video. I have not tried other DVD-player software packages because ATI told me they will interfere with their software. I suppose I can take AMD Man's suggestion and get a full version of WinDVD. But since I have the fancy ATI RF remote to play the TV, CD, VCD...Now I will have to get something else to play WinDVD remotely...

ATI's solution was perfect for my application...if only it worked! But from I have been hearing about their driver support, I know this issue will never be resolved. I made the mistake of buying this piece of junk, so I will most likely sh**can it and buy something that works out of the box, like Creative, or Visiontek, or Pinnacle.

Thanks to everyone for all the suggestions!

jpscfl · Jul 23, 2002

You realize the sound has nothing to do with the graphics card but rather the sound card. What sound card are you running?

The sound card has nothing to do with the Dolby output! The digital Dolby output comes directly from the Radeon card and goes directly into my Sony receiver. In this application, the sound card is used for TV, TV capture, CD, and VCD. I even tried removing the Audigy card, to see if that was interfering with the DVD playback and it still had the delayed audio.

AMD_Man · Jul 23, 2002

If this is a problem with the graphics card then I'm sure it will be fixed within a week or two. ATI has the best driver support on the planet at the moment (or so they promise). I'll look into it. I'll see if I can inquire at ATI.

"A penny saved is a penny earned!"

AMD_Man · Jul 23, 2002

Ohh, you're running it through a Dolby Digital Decoder and not the sound card? That explains a lot! Since the data is simply passed through the S/PDIF port, I'd say that it's probably some kind of software conflict. My system would once play sound event a whole half second late. After reformatting, the problem was fixed.

First, make sure your system is set up exactly as shown <A HREF="http://www.ati.com/support/connectors/aiwradeon7500/connectaiwradeon7500ac3.html" target="_new">here</A>. Secondly, I recommend reformatting. Odds are you didn't completely uninstall your old nVidia driver or whatever so a reformat should fix the problem.

"A penny saved is a penny earned!"

Crashman · Jul 23, 2002

MY guess is that it's a problem with ATI's player, not the hardware or drivers. I would try PowerDVD or WinDVD and see if the problem goes away, several people are distributing "free trial" copies of this software.

At least half of all problems are caused by an insufficient power supply!

AMD_Man · Jul 23, 2002

MY guess is that it's a problem with ATI's player, not the hardware or drivers. I would try PowerDVD or WinDVD and see if the problem goes away, several people are distributing "free trial" copies of this software.

I find it difficult to believe that ATI would let such a fundamental bug slip through, especially considering ATI has released 3 major versions of MMC (including the DVD player) since The AIW R7500.

"A penny saved is a penny earned!"

jpscfl · Jul 23, 2002

Reformatting? Hmmmm..I never tried that option, and funny you mentioned...I used to have a nvidia GeForce2 card in this PC. Maybe I still have some nvidia stuff lurking in the registry? I will try anything at this point, including formatting.

But another thing bugs me about this card. As your instructions indicate, I have to select either S/PDIF or 2 channel stereo. When I used the Creative card (DxR2 and DxR3 decoders), the Sony decoder "knew" which input to use. Regular TV sounded fine and when Dolby was present, the AC-3 decoder automatically kicked in without any intervention from me.

Now, with the Radeon, I have to manually select between regular sound and Dolby sound. So when the DVD starts, the audio is missing until the actual (Dolby-encoded) movie starts.

So should I wait for ATI to fix this? Should I get a full-version WinDVD or PowerDVD? Should I re-install my Creative Labs hardware DVD decoder and see how it behaves with the Radeon? Should I blow away the hard drive and reformat? Now if I could write a script that really starts the Creative player when the ATI DVD player is selected...

I asked ATI about combining the Radeon with a DxR3, but they were not familiar with that combo. I'm going to take a break for a few days to lower my BP, so thanks for all of your assistance. I'll send a post after I try some of your suggestions.

Crashman · Jul 23, 2002

MMC has always dealt me a bad hand!

At least half of all problems are caused by an insufficient power supply!

AMD_Man · Jul 23, 2002

But another thing bugs me about this card. As your instructions indicate, I have to select either S/PDIF or 2 channel stereo. When I used the Creative card (DxR2 and DxR3 decoders), the Sony decoder "knew" which input to use. Regular TV sounded fine and when Dolby was present, the AC-3 decoder automatically kicked in without any intervention from me.

That's because you were using a separate MPEG2 decoder. With the AIW R7500, you're basically choosing between relaying the sound to the sound card, or sending it through S/PDIF.

Now, with the Radeon, I have to manually select between regular sound and Dolby sound. So when the DVD starts, the audio is missing until the actual (Dolby-encoded) movie starts

No, not really. When you relay information through S/PDIF, all the 5.1 channels of sound go through, you don't have to actually select it.

So should I wait for ATI to fix this? Should I get a full-version WinDVD or PowerDVD? Should I re-install my Creative Labs hardware DVD decoder and see how it behaves with the Radeon? Should I blow away the hard drive and reformat? Now if I could write a script that really starts the Creative player when the ATI DVD player is selected...

I asked ATI about combining the Radeon with a DxR3, but they were not familiar with that combo. I'm going to take a break for a few days to lower my BP, so thanks for all of your assistance. I'll send a post after I try some of your suggestions.

The ATI card what your hardware decoder does and more. Stick with only the ATI card.
Try reformatting and reinstalling Windows. That usually fixes most problem comparable to yours.

"A penny saved is a penny earned!"

bront · Jul 23, 2002

You may be right about them "just finding the problem." From the responses I have been receiving, it appears nobody has ever listened to a DVD using Dolby 5.1 except me?

It could be, or it could be some other conflict. If you're the only one that seems to be having this problem, it's more likely that there is another problem.

Try doing some research at rage3d and other ATI forums. If you can't find anyone else with the issue, then there is probably be another problem.

Don't start a flame war while immersed in gasoline.

jpscfl · Jul 24, 2002

Well Guys, this will do it for me! I formatted the drive, loaded a fresh copy of WinXP and then loaded the most recent ATI installation CD (I have 4 of them now...which is another tribute to their "best driver support in the world." Original CD had read errors, so I purchased one from their on-line store. The first order was lost, the replacement CD arrived... cracked, the replacement for that CD did not load display drivers, because ATI 'accidently' sent a CD for a RagePro card, and now the recently-arrived CD is the one I'm using). Not bad...Paid 20 bucks for FedEx and had to wait 2 weeks for the correct, uncracked CD. "Why didn't I load drivers from the web? If you really want to know, I'll write another book telling you why!

So with the new OS, new ATI drivers...I still have the same problem! What a shock, eh? Then, I tried to install a Creative DXr3 decoder also, but with so many different available options...I could not find a combination of inputs/outputs to work. Here are some examples:

For sound: My sound card has several stereo inputs and outputs, S/PDIF, fiber, and coax. The Radeon has a "CD out," an "AC-3 out," along with a phono plug to plug into a sound card input. The DXr3 has several audio in/out and AC-3 dolby out. Well, that covers the mechanical connections. Now, we have device manager properties. Should the Radeon use Ravisent or ATI Rage theatre? Should I use stereo, Dolby or Pro-logic? Should the "line out" on the sound card be regular stereo or S/PDIF? Should "line- in" be connected to "CD" or "line" or "aux" or "mic?"

Now for the video! I looped the Radeon DVoutput (DV to vga conv) to the DXr3 input, then tried using the S-video output to the TV. But should I config the Radeon to use S-Video, VGA only, or both? My plan was to use the VGA output to listen/watch everything the RADEON has except for the DVD and use the Creative player and DXr3 to watch/listen Dolby DVDs. However, I could never get the right combination. And since nobody has ever tried this, I always wondered if I was wasting more time on a config that would never work.

Now for the video device mgr properties... Do you really want to know?

I thought I tried all combinations, but after several hours, I gave up! I wasted a month of my life with this Radeon and I will never, EVER, touch anything that ATI pukes out to the market. If the new Radeon advertises trillions of triangles/sec and costs $19.95, I will still buy Nvidia.

If anyone cares to know what works, what does not and what it takes to make them work, let me know.

Have fun guys! And as for ATI giving Nvidia "a kick in the pants," all I can say is BULLS*IT. Those dopes should have given up after the CGA video standard was released!

OzzieBloke · Jul 24, 2002

Whoa, mate, take a chill-pill. Okay, your setup doesn't work. Did you try the other DVD software out there? I know it's a ah heck that you won't have the use of a remote control anymore, but does that really matter? And ATI have been doing a stellar job with driver updates as of late, especially with the new, separate team designated for just that. Hardly good cause to say that ATI is a load of *peep* and condemn them for life. Odds are, they will have a fix out there soon, be it a driver update, or at worst, a recall. It could even be your hardware setup. Did you do a search for similar complaints? See what others have to say, if there are others with the same problem.

-

I plugged my ram into my motherboard, but unplugged it when I smelled cooked mutton.

AMD_Man · Jul 24, 2002

Here's an interesting question...are you sure you don't have an EAX effect enabled?

"A penny saved is a penny earned!"

AMD_Man · Jul 24, 2002

Then, I tried to install a Creative DXr3 decoder also, but with so many different available options...I could not find a combination of inputs/outputs to work. Here are some examples:

There's your first problem: Don't install the Creative card! The ATI Rage Threatre chip does everything itself. You're merely complicating matters for yourself.

This is what you need to set in the ATI DVD Player:

<A HREF="http://members.rogers.com/amd_man" target="_new">Link</A>

Also, try testing with another DVD. The DVD you are using may be corrupt. What sound card are you using? Actually, it would help if I knew your entire system specs? It may simply be that you're running something in the background that's hogging resources and your computer can't handle also playing the DVDs.

"A penny saved is a penny earned!"

ATI RADEON cannot play Dolby DVDs!

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