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Why no more ATI VIVO card with newer radeon chip?

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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October 9, 2002 3:14:08 PM

I want to upgrade my radeon VIVO 7200 DDR with a newer one, but ATI doesnt seem to make 8500 and + based VIVO card. Why?

I have satellite TV and it doesnt use the tuner of the AIW because the nature itself of digital TV..need a digital decoder. So all I need is A/V wire set between the decoder and the video card to have TV on my computer. And with the UHF(no infrared) remote of my decoder, I can switch channel from anywhere in the house...like my computer room!

I would love to have a 9700 128 megs DDR VIVO...but fortunaly, my 7200 is still doing good.

-Always put the blame on you first, then on the hardware !!!
October 9, 2002 3:33:12 PM

From what I've seen, the AIW9700 has a s-video input which bypasses the tuner. You should be able to use the an adapter cable to plug into that input port if your sat-tuner doesn't have an s-vidio out port.

Besides, you can pick up an RF switch at Radio Shack to convert a video signal to chanel 3 on the tuner input anyway.

So unless I'm really missing some vastly important point somewhere, the AIW 9700 should be able to accept input from your sat-tuner just fine. :) 

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October 9, 2002 6:43:46 PM

Actually ANY All-In-Wonder card would suffice...even a AIW Rage 128...which I own....dotn use it currently..no need....
and as for that....the AIW Radeon 8500 and AIW Radeon 8500DV have digital Tuners.....and they also have RCA/Composite Input ASWELL as S-Video input...and same goes for output....

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October 9, 2002 6:56:53 PM

Well yeah. :)  I was just pointing out the most modern.

And that aside, you can still pick up an RF switch at Radio Shack and input any video source (depending on the RF switch you get) into chanel 3 of the tuner. So really, <i>any</i> TV card would suffice. :) 

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October 9, 2002 9:47:14 PM

Digital tuner and digital decoder are not the same. But my primary question is, why should I pay a lot more to have a tuner that is useless for me, a remote control that is useless in my case just to have more punch from my video card on which, ordinary A/V input is all I need. I havent even used the TV out of my VIVO card...

Maybe I will have to look from another maker for my next board.

In reply to:
"So unless I'm really missing some vastly important point somewhere, the AIW 9700 should be able to accept input from your sat-tuner just fine. :) "

Money wasted is an important point for me...:-)


-Always put the blame on you first, then on the hardware !!!
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Pat on 10/09/02 05:51 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
October 9, 2002 11:57:07 PM

He is perfectly right...and that was why i got my Radeon 64MBDDR VIVO in the past....aka 7200 DDR VIVO
Why does ATI force the end user on paying for Tuners if all he wants is video capturing??
The other weird thing is that the RADEON 64MBDDR VIVO was one of their best sellers in the past...BEST 3D performance [ at that time ], with the capability for video capturing, but they failed to release a similar product with the 8500 series..and seems the same will be with the 9700??
October 10, 2002 3:23:12 PM

The reason why companies like ATI don't offer pure VIVO versions of their video cards is because there is an almost complete lack of market for them.

<b>Most</b> people who want video in on a Radeon ____ are going to want TV input as well. In fact, <i>most</i> of the market will want the tv tuner and remote control long before they even consider the usefulness of a s-video in port.

<b>Most</b> people who do professional video use a true framegrabber where framerates are constant. (Check out Matrox's line of professional imagine hardware.) To use that stuff is expensive though, which is why ATI doesn't even try to market a combination 3d/framegrabber. Hell, even Matrox doesn't offer a Parhelia (their best 3D) with a framegrabber. Matrox's best combo solution is the very antiquated G400 graphics chip.

The next less expensive line for what is considered 'semi' professional video in is to use a Firewire solution. ATI <i>tried</i> to reach that group of people with their All In Wonder Radeon 8500DV. However, there just wasn't a large enough market for it, because most people who wanted a Firewire solution already had one from a PCI card or built into their motherboard. ATI lost money trying to make and sell these cards.

And so, the next step down from that, a VIVO type Radeon solution, is incredibly rare these days. They have inconsistant framerates and poorer video quality. (The two banes of videophiles.) Because of this, there just isn't enough of a market for that type of a card because it's so far under 'professional' standards that the only market for them would be people who just consider it fun. And of those people that are in it just because it is fun, they either settle for a PCI card for video capture, or they will buy an All In Wonder type of solution.

So companies like ATI don't offer pure VIVO/3D combos because simply, there just aren't enough people out there wanting to buy one to justify the costs of producing and selling them. Companies are in the business of making money after all. ;) 

The VIVO products only existed because for a time, they <i>were</i> the professional standard. Firewire and framegrabbers either didn't exist yet or were far too expensive for semi-professional use. Therefore, there was a large enough market for a VIVO/graphics combo card. Today, because of the lowered prices of framegrabbers combined with the dirt cheap price of PCI Firewire cards, there just isn't such a market. Thus, no more products along the VIVO/3D combo line.

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October 11, 2002 2:25:16 AM

Besides your valid points, I can recommend the MSI Geforce line, they often have VIVO for a few bucks more than the original version of the card, a real grab IMO, especially for the Ti200 price.

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October 12, 2002 6:25:44 PM

I agree, I would love to have a VIVO card again without the tuner. I Don't need a tuner when a cable box comes with the deal with its own remote and programming guide. I sold my Radeon 64 VIVO awhile back and I still miss it :frown: . To me buying the All-In-Wonder would be a waste of money since I would only be using the VideoIn feature, if I used the built in Tuner I would be losing out on hundreds of stations. Also the All-In-Wonder Radeon9700 can't do dual monitors! I think ATI has a hole in their product line up.

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by noko on 10/12/02 02:27 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
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