Newbie, tactics advice

[Vellu]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

I recently bought this awesome game (found it dirt cheap at a local
superstore) some I'm sort of new to it. I have played Civ1 and Civ2 so I'm
not completely clueless.

My guestion is about different victory strategies. War/Dominance/Culture
seems straight forward enough, and I've played the successfully in this way.
However I'd like to try a scientific superiority tactic aswell. Using
similar methods as in C1/C2 doesn't seem to be enough though. In CIV2 I
could easily (atleast in lower difficulty levels) reach computers/fighters
level of science at about mid 1800's. In Civ3 however I'm having trouble
even reaching modern era at the turn of the 20th century which isn't even
comparable to real life.

There doesn't seem to enough funds to support high science research without
sacrificing military strength (to really bare minimun defence only) and
limiting city improvements to science based. Could going Republic/Democracy
as early as possible (limiting possible expansion through warfare) help?
These require fairly high amount of happiness inducing improvements
though...

Is there something I'm missing, or is CIV3 just designed this way (extremely
fast science progress not possible)?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

The key to rapid science advancement is trading with the AI. There are
several strategies that work but basically, get use to selling techs.

Enjoy!!

 

[Vellu]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Trading tech for gold to keep up science funding? Is that what you mean?
(can't really trade tech for tech except in early stages)

"The Stare" <wat1@not.likely.frontiernet.net> wrote in message
news:8GGXc.2478$RO5.2213@news01.roc.ny...
>
> The key to rapid science advancement is trading with the AI. There are
> several strategies that work but basically, get use to selling techs.
>
> Enjoy!!
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

In article <icMXc.443$wK3.135@read3.inet.fi>, "Vellu" <velimala@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Trading tech for gold to keep up science funding? Is that what you mean?
>(can't really trade tech for tech except in early stages)

Tech for whatever you can get. If you get gold you can increase your science
funding. If you get Luxuries you can decrease your entertainment funding and
increase your science. Foreign workers are always nice, you don't have to pay
them. Later on you may be heading down one branch of the Tech tree while the
AI's are going down the other that would allow you to trade techs.


Mike G

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

In article <qtFXc.204$wK3.89@read3.inet.fi>, "Vellu" <velimala@hotmail.com> wrote:
>I recently bought this awesome game (found it dirt cheap at a local
>superstore) some I'm sort of new to it. I have played Civ1 and Civ2 so I'm
>not completely clueless.
>
>My guestion is about different victory strategies. War/Dominance/Culture
>seems straight forward enough, and I've played the successfully in this way.
>However I'd like to try a scientific superiority tactic aswell. Using
>similar methods as in C1/C2 doesn't seem to be enough though. In CIV2 I
>could easily (atleast in lower difficulty levels) reach computers/fighters
>level of science at about mid 1800's. In Civ3 however I'm having trouble
>even reaching modern era at the turn of the 20th century which isn't even
>comparable to real life.

The guys that get the starship launches before 1500 are playing at the higher
levels. At those levels the AI's research comes at a discount. Above Regent
it takes less beakers for the AI to research a tech than for the human.


>There doesn't seem to enough funds to support high science research without
>sacrificing military strength (to really bare minimun defence only) and
>limiting city improvements to science based. Could going Republic/Democracy
>as early as possible (limiting possible expansion through warfare) help?
>These require fairly high amount of happiness inducing improvements
>though...

The key science improvement is the Marketplace. For the purposes of
scientific research it is more important than a Library. Do you have one in
each city?

You want to do everything possible to enhance your commerce production.
Build roads every where. Build harbors. Build enough happiness
(Temples, Cathedrals, Coliseums) so you have no entertainers.

FYI, the Commercial/Scientific C3C is Greece.


>Is there something I'm missing, or is CIV3 just designed this way (extremely
>fast science progress not possible)?

It is possible to get a starship launch before 1500.


Mike G

 

[daran]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 12:06:46 GMT Vellu <velimala@hotmail.com> wrote in
message <qtFXc.204$wK3.89@read3.inet.fi>...

> I recently bought this awesome game (found it dirt cheap at a local
> superstore) some I'm sort of new to it. I have played Civ1 and Civ2 so I'm
> not completely clueless.
>
> My guestion is about different victory strategies. War/Dominance/Culture
> seems straight forward enough, and I've played the successfully in this
> way. However I'd like to try a scientific superiority tactic aswell. Using
> similar methods as in C1/C2 doesn't seem to be enough though. In CIV2 I
> could easily (atleast in lower difficulty levels) reach computers/fighters
> level of science at about mid 1800's. In Civ3 however I'm having trouble
> even reaching modern era at the turn of the 20th century which isn't even
> comparable to real life.
>
> There doesn't seem to enough funds to support high science research
> without sacrificing military strength (to really bare minimun defence
> only) and limiting city improvements to science based. Could going
> Republic/Democracy as early as possible (limiting possible expansion
> through warfare) help? These require fairly high amount of happiness
> inducing improvements though...
>
> Is there something I'm missing, or is CIV3 just designed this way
> (extremely fast science progress not possible)?

In my current Demi-god level game in Conquest (equivalent to, or perhaps
ever harder, IMO than deity level in Pre-conquests Civ3), I am joint first
in tech. It has just turned 1600AD, and I'm researching fission. So it's
possible.

However, I achieved this, perhaps counterintuitively, by setting science to
10% (or just a single scientist, which gives you one tech every 40 (plain
Civ) or 50 (Conquests) turns) for most of the game, and allowing myself to
fall behind in tech. Instead, I used to cash to rushbuild improvements.

There are two reasons why this works. Firstly, tech on its own is of no
value to your civilisation. What matters is what it enables you to do. So
if a tech gives you a new unit, that's of no value unless you're using those
units to kick ass. And if it enables a new improvement, you've got to go
out and build them. What's the value in being the only civ that knows the
secret of banking, if you haven't built your marketplaces?

The other reason is that tech is a depreciating asset. The more other civs
that know it already, the cheaper it is to aquire, either through research
or purchase. That translates as: the later you aquire it, the cheaper.

To optimise this method, at all possible times, each city should be building
the improvement which will most improve it's productivity - shields and
cash. most non-scientific, non-military improvments do that. Some have a
direct benefit, such as marketplaces. Others have an indirect benefit by
speeding your cities; growth, or enabling the to get bigger. You should
also rushbuild those cities for which the improvemnt will have the greatest
overal effect. It's also worth building scientific improvements for the
culture, even though you're not doing significant research, but they are a
low priority except in citues which are vulnerable to defection.

The right time to acquire tech is when you've run out of things to build.

By applying this method, punctuated by short, decisive, acquisitive wars,
I've built my civ from bottom of the heap, to No. 1 in population, 1st in
production, and joint 1st in tech. Many of my 50 or so cities are producing
at over 50 shields/turn, and if I put tax to 100%, I'm taking in over 2500
gold/turn.

--
Daran

"I long to accomplish a great and noble task, but my chief duty is to
accomplish humble tasks as though they were great and noble.  The world is
moved along, not only by the mighty shoves of its heroes, but also by the
aggregate of the tiny pushes of each honest worker." -- Helen Keller

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 12:06:46 GMT, "Vellu" <velimala@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>I recently bought this awesome game (found it dirt cheap at a local
>superstore) some I'm sort of new to it. I have played Civ1 and Civ2 so I'm
>not completely clueless.
>
>My guestion is about different victory strategies. War/Dominance/Culture
>seems straight forward enough, and I've played the successfully in this way.
>However I'd like to try a scientific superiority tactic aswell. Using
>similar methods as in C1/C2 doesn't seem to be enough though. In CIV2 I
>could easily (atleast in lower difficulty levels) reach computers/fighters
>level of science at about mid 1800's. In Civ3 however I'm having trouble
>even reaching modern era at the turn of the 20th century which isn't even
>comparable to real life.
>
>There doesn't seem to enough funds to support high science research without
>sacrificing military strength (to really bare minimun defence only) and
>limiting city improvements to science based. Could going Republic/Democracy
>as early as possible (limiting possible expansion through warfare) help?
>These require fairly high amount of happiness inducing improvements
>though...
>
>Is there something I'm missing, or is CIV3 just designed this way (extremely
>fast science progress not possible)?

Civ3 does make it harder to do research -- it costs more to get it.
It makes up for that by increasing the value of trading with the AI.
Without trading well for tech -- and other things -- you aren't likely
to get your research fast.

Also, the AI does research better at higher difficulty levels. That
actually increases the value of trading, but it also means that the AI
can more easily beat you, leading you in tech -- and using that
advantage to defeat you.

Besides trading tech, resource trading also make a difference.

Moving out of Despotism as soon as possible is a good idea.
Republic is better for research, Monarchy a little better for
expansion and war (Conquests increases the advantage of Monarchy), but
either one is way better for research.

The goodie huts give tech as well, and finding them early can speed
up the ancient period nicely. Couple that with trade with the AI --
all of whom start with two techs -- and the climb up the tech tree
will go much faster.

You need enough income to allow your science to max out - 90-100%
to get a tech in the minimum time of four turns. Developing your
cities with roads is absolutely essential -- every square in use needs
a road -- and either mining or irrigation for productivity.
Marketplaces are also vital -- they improve luxuries and income, both
of which are necessary in order to fund high science.

Good trading, however, matters much more. You can buy a tech from
one AI, then sell it to two others and make a profit, some of the
time. In any case, making deals for tech is essential, because the
game *is* designed around that.
--
*-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
*Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>

 

[Vellu]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Thanks for the tips everyone, though not "quite" spaceship at 1500's I do
have tanks at early 1800's which is a step in the right direction. (I didn't
play purely scientific, a fair amount of conquering (two large continents,
and the other one is inhabited by only me) has taken place aswell.)

"Jeffery S. Jones" <jeffsj@execpc.com> wrote in message
news:8vc1j0dst1clv2e8lhl8clfkp2l86nngmc@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 12:06:46 GMT, "Vellu" <velimala@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >I recently bought this awesome game (found it dirt cheap at a local
> >superstore) some I'm sort of new to it. I have played Civ1 and Civ2 so
I'm
> >not completely clueless.
> >
> >My guestion is about different victory strategies. War/Dominance/Culture
> >seems straight forward enough, and I've played the successfully in this
way.
> >However I'd like to try a scientific superiority tactic aswell. Using
> >similar methods as in C1/C2 doesn't seem to be enough though. In CIV2 I
> >could easily (atleast in lower difficulty levels) reach
computers/fighters
> >level of science at about mid 1800's. In Civ3 however I'm having trouble
> >even reaching modern era at the turn of the 20th century which isn't even
> >comparable to real life.
> >
> >There doesn't seem to enough funds to support high science research
without
> >sacrificing military strength (to really bare minimun defence only) and
> >limiting city improvements to science based. Could going
Republic/Democracy
> >as early as possible (limiting possible expansion through warfare) help?
> >These require fairly high amount of happiness inducing improvements
> >though...
> >
> >Is there something I'm missing, or is CIV3 just designed this way
(extremely
> >fast science progress not possible)?
>
> Civ3 does make it harder to do research -- it costs more to get it.
> It makes up for that by increasing the value of trading with the AI.
> Without trading well for tech -- and other things -- you aren't likely
> to get your research fast.
>
> Also, the AI does research better at higher difficulty levels. That
> actually increases the value of trading, but it also means that the AI
> can more easily beat you, leading you in tech -- and using that
> advantage to defeat you.
>
> Besides trading tech, resource trading also make a difference.
>
> Moving out of Despotism as soon as possible is a good idea.
> Republic is better for research, Monarchy a little better for
> expansion and war (Conquests increases the advantage of Monarchy), but
> either one is way better for research.
>
> The goodie huts give tech as well, and finding them early can speed
> up the ancient period nicely. Couple that with trade with the AI --
> all of whom start with two techs -- and the climb up the tech tree
> will go much faster.
>
> You need enough income to allow your science to max out - 90-100%
> to get a tech in the minimum time of four turns. Developing your
> cities with roads is absolutely essential -- every square in use needs
> a road -- and either mining or irrigation for productivity.
> Marketplaces are also vital -- they improve luxuries and income, both
> of which are necessary in order to fund high science.
>
> Good trading, however, matters much more. You can buy a tech from
> one AI, then sell it to two others and make a profit, some of the
> time. In any case, making deals for tech is essential, because the
> game *is* designed around that.
> --
> *-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
> ** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
> *Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>

 

[Vellu]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Ps. At later stages of the game when you start to have really big cities,
which is better (science wise): tax collectors (= you can keep science
funding higher?) or scientists?

"Vellu" <velimala@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:AhfYc.26$Sc6.17@read3.inet.fi...
> Thanks for the tips everyone, though not "quite" spaceship at 1500's I do
> have tanks at early 1800's which is a step in the right direction. (I
didn't
> play purely scientific, a fair amount of conquering (two large continents,
> and the other one is inhabited by only me) has taken place aswell.)
>

 

[daran]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sun, 29 Aug 2004 15:29:53 GMT Vellu <velimala@hotmail.com> wrote in
message <RDmYc.179$Sc6.136@read3.inet.fi>...

> Ps. At later stages of the game when you start to have really big cities,
> which is better (science wise): tax collectors (= you can keep science
> funding higher?) or scientists?

This depends upon which version of the game you're playing and whether you
have more technological improvement than financial improvements or vice
versa.

In the latest patch of Conquests, you get two coins or three beakers from a
specialist, which tips the balance fairly decisively in favour of science.
In earlier versions (I don't know when this was changed) you get one coin or
one beaker.

If you are using an earlier version, then you should opt for scientists (in
every city) if your main commerce producing cities have more marketplaces,
banks, and stock exchanges than they do libraries, universities, and labs.
And vice versa.

--
Daran

"I long to accomplish a great and noble task, but my chief duty is to
accomplish humble tasks as though they were great and noble.  The world is
moved along, not only by the mighty shoves of its heroes, but also by the
aggregate of the tiny pushes of each honest worker." -- Helen Keller