Looking for a close to DIPLOMACY win/loss save game. Anyon..

[Mike]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit to
a game with it on. You can email your save game to
mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Mike" <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:a1k2o0l6q0i9680gsppcqekmqaot5m2i8r@4ax.com...
>I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
> anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
> win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit to
> a game with it on. You can email your save game to
> mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.


It's too difficult. I played with diplomacy on once, built the United
Nations, which triggered a vote that I lost 4-1 thus ending the game right
there. Needless to say, I switched it off from there on out.

-Rob

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Around 10/29/2004 1:10 AM, Rob Maxwell proclaimed for posterity:

> "Mike" <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:a1k2o0l6q0i9680gsppcqekmqaot5m2i8r@4ax.com...
>
>>I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
>>anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
>>win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit to
>>a game with it on. You can email your save game to
>>mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.
>
>
>
> It's too difficult. I played with diplomacy on once, built the United
> Nations, which triggered a vote that I lost 4-1 thus ending the game right
> there. Needless to say, I switched it off from there on out.
>
> -Rob

I leave it on all the time, but try to be sure to be the one to build it
(if the game goes that far) so I can control whether or not to have the
vote.

--
Brandon Supernaw - <bhsupernaw@sbcglobal.net>
---------------------------------------------

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Mike" <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:a1k2o0l6q0i9680gsppcqekmqaot5m2i8r@4ax.com...
>I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
> anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
> win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit to
> a game with it on. You can email your save game to
> mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.

Playing with this option on but never intending to take a vote can make the
game more challenging. The UN is the only game breaking wonder and you must
make sure you are the one that builds it. It does not force you to take a
vote. You may opt not to and it will then ask every 5 or 10 turns or
something like that.

 

[Mike]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 07:18:31 GMT, "The Stare"
<wat1@not.likely.frontiernet.net> wrote:

>Playing with this option on but never intending to take a vote can make the
>game more challenging. The UN is the only game breaking wonder and you must
>make sure you are the one that builds it. It does not force you to take a
>vote. You may opt not to and it will then ask every 5 or 10 turns or
>something like that.

I think I may just leave it off then after all. A game breaking wonder
just sounds really stupid to me.

 

[Buck]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 16:05:43 -0400, Mike <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote:

>I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
>anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
>win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit to
>a game with it on. You can email your save game to
>mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.



I have one diplomacy many times. However, I learned very early on not
to play to win a particular victory. I set my victory conditions to
several different options. Since I can't convince the AI to play my
way, I leave the options open. If I make the most friends, I might
try the diplomacy victory, if not I might try the science victory, or
possibly domination or last survivor victory.

Good luck
Buck

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 17:52:44 -0400, Mike <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote:

>I think I may just leave it off then after all. A game breaking wonder
>just sounds really stupid to me.

People here have said if the AI requests a vote than they already know
you are going to lose.

I have never turned it on myself. One of the Conquest games has this
as a victory condition and I won with it. I guess it helps when
everyone hates the next runner up.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 02:10:51 -0400, "Rob Maxwell"
<robu-san@excite.com> wrote:

>
>"Mike" <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>news:a1k2o0l6q0i9680gsppcqekmqaot5m2i8r@4ax.com...
>>I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
>> anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
>> win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit to
>> a game with it on. You can email your save game to
>> mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.
>
>
>It's too difficult. I played with diplomacy on once, built the United
>Nations, which triggered a vote that I lost 4-1 thus ending the game right
>there. Needless to say, I switched it off from there on out.

It isn't that bad. Remember, if you build/own the UN, you control
whether or not to call the vote. Never call it unless you are sure
you can win.

Or if you don't mind reloading a save game. Save before finishing
it, call the vote, then reload if you lose.

It is tricky to tell if you'll win the vote, but not impossible.
The two biggest civs will be the main candidates -- make sure that
you're one of them. Second, make sure that more people like you
rather than your opponent. A simple -- if sad -- way to make sure of
that is to start a war against your competitor, then get more allies.
The AI never votes for a civ it is at war with.

It is game breaking in that the AI "intuitively" knows if it will win
the vote, so if it owns the UN it will call for a vote if it can win.
The only way to stop this is to make sure that you get the UN.

That, in effect, adds another tech/wonder race to the end game.
Like the space victory, except that only one player can control the
outcome.

I've had diplo victories, but have no idea if have any saved games
with them.
--
*-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
*Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>

 

[alex]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Mike" <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote in message news:a1k2o0l6q0i9680gsppcqekmqaot5m2i8r@4ax.com...
> I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
> anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
> win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit to
> a game with it on. You can email your save game to
> mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.

Ok, Mike, as a result of your request I turned ON diplomatic,
and posted my current .sav to alt.binaries.games.civ2
(C3C 1.22 / Archipelago/ Americans/ Deity/ End in 2250AD).

It's not exactly what you asked for, that pain in the *ss AKA the UN is
still 20 or 30 turns away, but I believe that if I take no action Babylonians
will win the popular (as well as the electoral college) vote.

Currently I am leaning towards a terrorist attack on whatever Babylonian city
will build the UN. I could probably amass several dozens of guerilla and
artillery units next to that city, abusing ROP; and raze it to the ground right
after they Finnish the UN. A radical ultimate solution. My problem (besides moral
issues and ruined reputation) is that I do not know if I'd have that single turn
between the UN is completed and the vote is called. I had not have that diplomatic
option ON for a while.

 

[Mike]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 00:01:20 GMT, "alex" <invalid@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

>Ok, Mike, as a result of your request I turned ON diplomatic,
>and posted my current .sav to alt.binaries.games.civ2
>(C3C 1.22 / Archipelago/ Americans/ Deity/ End in 2250AD).

Ok I found it. Thank you very much.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"alex" <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:kpzid.38639$QJ3.25921@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
>
> "Mike" <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:a1k2o0l6q0i9680gsppcqekmqaot5m2i8r@4ax.com...
>> I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
>> anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
>> win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit to
>> a game with it on. You can email your save game to
>> mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.
>
> Ok, Mike, as a result of your request I turned ON diplomatic,
> and posted my current .sav to alt.binaries.games.civ2
> (C3C 1.22 / Archipelago/ Americans/ Deity/ End in 2250AD).
>
> It's not exactly what you asked for, that pain in the *ss AKA the UN is
> still 20 or 30 turns away, but I believe that if I take no action
> Babylonians
> will win the popular (as well as the electoral college) vote.

Imperialist pigs anyway.

> Currently I am leaning towards a terrorist attack on whatever Babylonian
> city
> will build the UN. I could probably amass several dozens of guerilla and
> artillery units next to that city, abusing ROP; and raze it to the ground
> right
> after they Finnish the UN. A radical ultimate solution. My problem
> (besides moral
> issues and ruined reputation) is that I do not know if I'd have that
> single turn
> between the UN is completed and the vote is called. I had not have that
> diplomatic
> option ON for a while.

Made the game more interesting didn't it?

You won't have that turn to attack IF the ai knows it can win a vote. The UN
is a wonder *YOU must* build or figure out a way to get 1/2 the civs at war
with whoever is going to build it.

 

[alex]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

> > Currently I am leaning towards a terrorist attack on whatever Babylonian
> > city
> > will build the UN. I could probably amass several dozens of guerilla and
> > artillery units next to that city, abusing ROP; and raze it to the ground
> > right
> > after they Finnish the UN. A radical ultimate solution. My problem
> > (besides moral
> > issues and ruined reputation) is that I do not know if I'd have that
> > single turn
> > between the UN is completed and the vote is called. I had not have that
> > diplomatic
> > option ON for a while.
>
> Made the game more interesting didn't it?

I respectfully disagree. Just more tense. I spent 100 turns chasing the
Great Library, then 100 turns techno chase, then 50 turns the UN chase.
It turned out though that AI was not intersted at all in bulding the UN,
so I built it myself and easily won the vote 5-1-(1 abstained). The guy
who abstained was me: I was not prepared to take the chair and the
responsibility of world peacekeeping with 14 guerillas and 5 tanks.

BTW, it looks like a good idea to pretand building the Manhattan Project,
and switch to the the UN at the very last moment. Otherwise the AI will
try to sabotage the gamebreaker.

> You won't have that turn to attack IF the ai knows it can win a vote. The UN
> is a wonder *YOU must* build or figure out a way to get 1/2 the civs at war
> with whoever is going to build it.
>
>

 

[Buck]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 01:27:32 GMT, "alex" <invalid@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

>> > Currently I am leaning towards a terrorist attack on whatever Babylonian
>> > city
>> > will build the UN. I could probably amass several dozens of guerilla and
>> > artillery units next to that city, abusing ROP; and raze it to the ground
>> > right
>> > after they Finnish the UN. A radical ultimate solution. My problem
>> > (besides moral
>> > issues and ruined reputation) is that I do not know if I'd have that
>> > single turn
>> > between the UN is completed and the vote is called. I had not have that
>> > diplomatic
>> > option ON for a while.
>>
>> Made the game more interesting didn't it?
>
>I respectfully disagree. Just more tense. I spent 100 turns chasing the
>Great Library, then 100 turns techno chase, then 50 turns the UN chase.
>It turned out though that AI was not intersted at all in bulding the UN,
>so I built it myself and easily won the vote 5-1-(1 abstained). The guy
>who abstained was me: I was not prepared to take the chair and the
>responsibility of world peacekeeping with 14 guerillas and 5 tanks.
>
>BTW, it looks like a good idea to pretand building the Manhattan Project,
>and switch to the the UN at the very last moment. Otherwise the AI will
>try to sabotage the gamebreaker.
>
>> You won't have that turn to attack IF the ai knows it can win a vote. The UN
>> is a wonder *YOU must* build or figure out a way to get 1/2 the civs at war
>> with whoever is going to build it.
>>
>>
>
My first Election, I didn't realize what was happening. I voted for
an opponent.

Buck

PS I won

 

[alex]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Mike" <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote in message news:rp3mo0l5u7v8ak5c98723lmatuj1b3m9s0@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 00:01:20 GMT, "alex" <invalid@invalid.invalid>
> wrote:
>
> >Ok, Mike, as a result of your request I turned ON diplomatic,
> >and posted my current .sav to alt.binaries.games.civ2
> >(C3C 1.22 / Archipelago/ Americans/ Deity/ End in 2250AD).
>
> Ok I found it. Thank you very much.

Sorry I was wrong. Babylonians did not want the UN and it took
47 turns instead of expected 20-30 turns. The .sav just before
the UN victory is in alt.binaries.games.civ2 as usually.

 

[Mike]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 01:27:34 GMT, "alex" <invalid@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

>Sorry I was wrong. Babylonians did not want the UN and it took
>47 turns instead of expected 20-30 turns. The .sav just before
>the UN victory is in alt.binaries.games.civ2 as usually.

Well I did not even try your last save yet. I grabbed the other one.
Thank you again.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

> >I respectfully disagree. Just more tense. I spent 100 turns chasing the
> >Great Library, then 100 turns techno chase, then 50 turns the UN chase.
> >It turned out though that AI was not intersted at all in bulding the UN,
> >so I built it myself and easily won the vote 5-1-(1 abstained). The guy
> >who abstained was me: I was not prepared to take the chair and the
> >responsibility of world peacekeeping with 14 guerillas and 5 tanks.
> >
Just wondering.... If you win the UN vote, you win the game. Why worry about
peacekeeping with your small army? I built the UN and when the question
popped up as to if I wanted to call a vote, I regretfully said "Yes". It was
between me and Japan's leader. He won; the only vote for me was mine. Of
course, I was at war with India and Russia at the time. I wiped them out on
the reload and won the Space Race.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Rob Maxwell" <robu-san@excite.com> wrote in
news:2ue57lF28es9jU1@uni-berlin.de:

>
> "Mike" <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:a1k2o0l6q0i9680gsppcqekmqaot5m2i8r@4ax.com...
>>I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
>> anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
>> win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit
>> to a game with it on. You can email your save game to
>> mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.
>
>
> It's too difficult. I played with diplomacy on once, built the United
> Nations, which triggered a vote that I lost 4-1 thus ending the game
> right there. Needless to say, I switched it off from there on out.
>
> -Rob
>
>


I found it the easiest and my preferred modern era victory (hate the
space race).

Essentially, a case of behaving yourself especially immediately before a
vote. Never break alliances or mutual protection pacts. You can forget
it if the former though I have won a diplomatic victory after
inadvertently breaking an mpp. Never break an rop.

Build up trade, give other civs luxuries or techs again preferably just
before a vote. Ally against aggressive civs.

As someone else has mentioned, a pretty sure fire way of winning is to
isolate your competitor by allying against it.


--
Joe Soap

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sat, 13 Nov 2004 14:00:27 GMT, Joe Soap <jsoap@toilet.com> wrote:

>"Rob Maxwell" <robu-san@excite.com> wrote in
>news:2ue57lF28es9jU1@uni-berlin.de:
>
>>
>> "Mike" <Mike@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:a1k2o0l6q0i9680gsppcqekmqaot5m2i8r@4ax.com...
>>>I never play with this win condition on. It seems kind of cheesy. Does
>>> anyone have a modern era or close to modern era save game with this
>>> win condition turned on? I want to see it in action before I commit
>>> to a game with it on. You can email your save game to
>>> mikesol@optonline.net. Thanks.
>>
>>
>> It's too difficult. I played with diplomacy on once, built the United
>> Nations, which triggered a vote that I lost 4-1 thus ending the game
>> right there. Needless to say, I switched it off from there on out.
>>
>> -Rob
>>
>>
>
>
>I found it the easiest and my preferred modern era victory (hate the
>space race).
>
>Essentially, a case of behaving yourself especially immediately before a
>vote. Never break alliances or mutual protection pacts. You can forget
>it if the former though I have won a diplomatic victory after
>inadvertently breaking an mpp. Never break an rop.
>
>Build up trade, give other civs luxuries or techs again preferably just
>before a vote. Ally against aggressive civs.
>
>As someone else has mentioned, a pretty sure fire way of winning is to
>isolate your competitor by allying against it.


This reminds me. If you create an MPP, and destroy an opponent, no
problem, but if you create a military alliance against an opponent and
then destroy that opponent, you get hated by the world.

Try firing off 5 nukes and then call for an election.

Buck
For What its Worth,

Buck



Here I sit all anxious hearted, waiting around to just get started.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"The Stare" <wat1@not.likely.frontiernet.net> wrote in news:b9mgd.1314
$dO1.581@news01.roc.ny:

> You may opt not to and it will then ask every 5 or 10 turns or
> something like that.


About 12 turns I've found.


--
Joe Soap

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Jeffery S. Jones <jeffsj@execpc.com> wrote in
news:5s67o01707kd6i9i7e41t7ghtvi6j33chq@4ax.com:

> It is game breaking in that the AI "intuitively" knows if it will win
> the vote, so if it owns the UN it will call for a vote if it can win.
> The only way to stop this is to make sure that you get the UN.

It won't always win when it calls a vote, at least in my experience.



--
Joe Soap

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sat, 13 Nov 2004 14:03:10 GMT, Joe Soap <jsoap@toilet.com> wrote:

>Jeffery S. Jones <jeffsj@execpc.com> wrote in
>news:5s67o01707kd6i9i7e41t7ghtvi6j33chq@4ax.com:
>
>> It is game breaking in that the AI "intuitively" knows if it will win
>> the vote, so if it owns the UN it will call for a vote if it can win.
>> The only way to stop this is to make sure that you get the UN.
>
>It won't always win when it calls a vote, at least in my experience.

I've never noticed it losing when it calls for the vote.

But usually, I try to hold the UN, so I don't see this happen very
often. I fear that if I let the AI get the UN, it is going to call
the vote and win -- so obviously, I have to do something to stop that
from happening.


--
*-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
*Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

The Great Gazoo <thegreat@ga.zoo> wrote in
news:g6ecp0tqv5t4ctdnjlaii6f7fts74lk77l@4ax.com:

> Try firing off 5 nukes and then call for an election.


Never let off a nuke yet.

I'm a bit of hippie, see


--
Joe Soap

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Jeffery S. Jones <jeffsj@execpc.com> wrote in
news:dl6cp0di7m5hujqth93l4r9epbs91md42e@4ax.com:

> I've never noticed it losing when it calls for the vote.

No, neither have I.

>
> But usually, I try to hold the UN, so I don't see this happen very
> often. I fear that if I let the AI get the UN, it is going to call
> the vote and win -- so obviously, I have to do something to stop that
> from happening.
>

Same here. As I said in another post, it's my preferred modern era victory.
I regard the space race as tedious and something of a failure. imo,
domination, conquest and cultural victories require the most skill,
followed by the UN; I only go for the space race if I can't win any other
way.

btw, why do you think that isolating a UN opponent by allying against it is
sad? Good technique, I would have thought.



--
Joe Soap

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sun, 14 Nov 2004 12:47:55 GMT, Joe Soap <jsoap@toilet.com> wrote:

>The Great Gazoo <thegreat@ga.zoo> wrote in
>news:g6ecp0tqv5t4ctdnjlaii6f7fts74lk77l@4ax.com:
>
>> Try firing off 5 nukes and then call for an election.
>
>
>Never let off a nuke yet.
>
>I'm a bit of hippie, see


They aren't liked at all. Hippy or not, i don't care to see someone in
this world even consider using nukes, but I can handle using them in a
game

Buck

For What its Worth,

Buck

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sun, 14 Nov 2004 12:56:55 GMT, Joe Soap <jsoap@toilet.com> wrote:

>Jeffery S. Jones <jeffsj@execpc.com> wrote in
>news:dl6cp0di7m5hujqth93l4r9epbs91md42e@4ax.com:
>
>> I've never noticed it losing when it calls for the vote.
>
>No, neither have I.
>
>>
>> But usually, I try to hold the UN, so I don't see this happen very
>> often. I fear that if I let the AI get the UN, it is going to call
>> the vote and win -- so obviously, I have to do something to stop that
>> from happening.
>>
>
>Same here. As I said in another post, it's my preferred modern era victory.
>I regard the space race as tedious and something of a failure. imo,
>domination, conquest and cultural victories require the most skill,
>followed by the UN; I only go for the space race if I can't win any other
>way.

I find the space race entirely too easy -- unless I'm behind in
tech, in which case, it at least speeds up the end game, rather than
waiting for the AI to kill me Even there, the fact that you can
counter it by taking the capital does allow you to win the race, even
though you're behind in tech, as long as you can survive long enough
to finish it -- while taking out everyone else.

>btw, why do you think that isolating a UN opponent by allying against it is
>sad? Good technique, I would have thought.

Good technique, but not nice diplomacy.
--
*-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
*Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>