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how do I starve a town?

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January 23, 2005 2:16:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.

I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
build up my own ethnically cleansed town.

Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to being
entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.

How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?

thanks
Boris

More about : starve town

Anonymous
January 23, 2005 2:16:12 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
>
> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
> build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
>
> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
> citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
> to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
> being
> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
>
> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?

It can't be done. What you are doing is the only way to do it.
Anonymous
January 23, 2005 3:41:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
>
> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
> build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
>
> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
> citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
> to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
being
> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
>
> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?

You can't stop it from reallocating the citizens. You could starve the one
citizen, add your own worker and repeat. And hope that when it starves the
next citizen that it is a forigen citizen and not one of your own... Short
of razing the city and planting your own spy, you will have to constantly go
back and rearrange your citizens...
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January 23, 2005 9:32:42 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 00:41:54 GMT, "Tzar Sasha"
<tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>
>"Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
>news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
>> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
>>
>> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
>> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
>> build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
>>
>> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
>> citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
>> to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
>being
>> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
>>
>> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
>
>You can't stop it from reallocating the citizens. You could starve the one
>citizen, add your own worker and repeat. And hope that when it starves the
>next citizen that it is a forigen citizen and not one of your own... Short
>of razing the city and planting your own spy, you will have to constantly go
>back and rearrange your citizens...
>

That won't work. If you add any citizens, those will be the first to
die if you continue to starve the city. You can build workers in the
city to speed up the process a bit, but there's nothing you can do
about the reallocating.
Anonymous
January 23, 2005 8:01:22 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Boris <boris@home.com> wrote in
news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30:

> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of
> them.
>
> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try
> to starve the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add
> some workers to build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
>
> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer
> reallocates its citizens to start producing food. I don't want
> this. So every turn, I have to go round captured towns and switch
> citizens from producing food to being entertainers or whatever.
> This is wearisome.
>
> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?

You can't. But you shouldn't have to do this every turn. The city
should only relocate workers when there is a population change.
Ideally you'll be rush building (slave) workers while starving the city
so you should be micromanaging the city every other turn to do this.
And thinking about it, I'm glad that starving a city to death
requires micromanagement.

--
ICQ: 8105495
AIM: KeeperGFA
EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
"If we did the things we are capable of,
we would astound ourselves." - Edison
Anonymous
January 23, 2005 9:12:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

In article <Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
boris@home.com says...
> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
> build up my own ethnically cleansed town

Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring in
one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
the slaves, but what the hey.

I always keep a number of settlers around for this purpose, if and when
I am trying to take over large tracts of land. The only time I won't do
this, it's to preserve a city with a wonder - then I garrison heavily
and make sure to produce much culture and I haven't had a problem with
defections since I installed 'Conquests' and the latest patches. In
vanilla CivIII that was a real bugbear - you'd garrison a big city, and
they'd defect on the firs turn (even if you had a huge cultural
superiority) and you'd lose all your garrison troups into the bargain!
They don't seem to do that so indiscriminately any more.

Unhappiness (becaues you are at war with their ethnic faction) is much
more of a problem in conquered cities and that's why I tend to raze -
that and the free slaves.

-Peter
Anonymous
January 23, 2005 9:12:04 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 18:12:03 +1300, Peter Huebner
<no.one@this.address> wrote:

>In article <Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
>boris@home.com says...
>> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
>> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
>> build up my own ethnically cleansed town
>
>Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
>little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring in
>one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
>placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
>the slaves, but what the hey.

If you want to keep the town, rush-build workers. Coupled with
starving -- which isn't a fast process -- this can drop the population
nicely.




--
*-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/&gt;
*Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/&gt;
January 23, 2005 9:12:04 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Peter Huebner <no.one@this.address> wrote:

> Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
> little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring in
> one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
> placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
> the slaves, but what the hey.

If you raze (or abandon) a city with foreign nationals, it totally pisses
off that civ's leader (assuming he's not already pissed at you.) It also
tends to upset the other leaders, so, if you do too much razing, they all
eventually end up furious.

> -Peter

--
Daran

The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that
English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words;
on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them
unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary. -- James D. Nicoll
January 23, 2005 9:12:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Daran <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in
news:ivfcc2-tb5.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net: Thanks for the replies
everyone.

I think Peter's reply is very instructive - I've tried raing cities, but
this just makes getting a peace treaty much harder. I used to try
"defending" by counter-attacking and then razing the odd city or two,
just to worry them, but it really does make getting peace harder.

The AI is very moral - not letting you commit genocide or ethnically
cleanse your cities.

Let's keep the politics out of gaming ...

Boris


> Peter Huebner <no.one@this.address> wrote:
>
>> Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
>> little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring
>> in one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
>> placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
>> the slaves, but what the hey.
>
> If you raze (or abandon) a city with foreign nationals, it totally
> pisses off that civ's leader (assuming he's not already pissed at
> you.) It also tends to upset the other leaders, so, if you do too much
> razing, they all eventually end up furious.
>
>> -Peter
>
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 2:36:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
>
> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
> build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
>
> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
> citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
> to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
> being
> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
>
> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
>
> thanks
> Boris

As others have said you have to manually rearange the workers before each
end turn to starve the city down.
Because I used to forget to do it each end turn and and also I forget where
the city is, I now do this:-

On capture, I rename the cities to A1, next A2 etc.
Then, prior to each end turn, I use city manager to find these cities - set
sort by city name order.
I adjust the workers of all "Ax" cities if pop. is greater than 1 to cause
starvation.
Once an "Ax" city has got down to pop. 1 I give it a real name.

Works well for me.


Bye the way................
The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of workers on
a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with Shift + C but then
some other workers elsewhere get selected (not in my pollution clearing
stack) and start chopping down forests.

If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why does it not
finish the job on the tile before other workers get selected and start doing
some unwanted thing. This needs fixing because it really pisses me off.

Suggestions anyone?
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 6:31:37 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

In article <Xns95E783A8F9C6Dboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
boris@home.com says...
> Daran <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in
> news:ivfcc2-tb5.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net: Thanks for the replies
> everyone.
>
> I think Peter's reply is very instructive - I've tried raing cities, but
> this just makes getting a peace treaty much harder. I used to try
> "defending" by counter-attacking and then razing the odd city or two,
> just to worry them, but it really does make getting peace harder.
>
> The AI is very moral - not letting you commit genocide or ethnically
> cleanse your cities.

Hmmm. I don't go to war unless I am attacked, or unless I really mean
it. Which means I don't give a flying fig for how the other leader feels
about me - by the time I ask him/her if they want peace I have them over
a barrel and they will give me everything they own (and hate my rotten
guts, but so be it).

Even if I play nice, which is what I prefer to do, I find the attitude
of the other leaders will turn sour after a while even if we had
excellent relations to start with. And I have moral objections to going
on blowing resources and techs up their collective arses just to keep
them sweet. (pardon my language)

;-)

-P.
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 7:28:26 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Fishman ><(((°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in message
news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
>
<snip>

> Bye the way................
> The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of workers
on
> a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with Shift + C but then
> some other workers elsewhere get selected (not in my pollution clearing
> stack) and start chopping down forests.
>
> If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why does it
not
> finish the job on the tile before other workers get selected and start
doing
> some unwanted thing. This needs fixing because it really pisses me off.
>
> Suggestions anyone?
>
>

If you have automated workers and add more workers to do the same job, the
computer will move the automated workers to another job site. There is a
limit to the number of workers that the AI will place on a tile. I'm sure
it was written in so that more tiles would get worked by the AI. However,
you can get more working on a tile if you control them yourself OR give the
workers specific automated tasks such as the Shift-C (clear pollution) you
mentioned.
Most automated workers will only work at two per tile. However, "road to",
"rail to" and "clear pollution" definitely differ from the norm.

If you don't want the workers to do some specific tasks then you need to
control them yourself, until you've taken care of it or it no longer
matters.
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 12:45:26 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Tzar Sasha" <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:KP_Id.12637$Vj3.3575@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
>
> "Fishman ><(((°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in message
> news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
>>
> <snip>
>
>> Bye the way................
>> The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of workers
> on
>> a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with Shift + C but then
>> some other workers elsewhere get selected (not in my pollution clearing
>> stack) and start chopping down forests.
>>
>> If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why does it
> not
>> finish the job on the tile before other workers get selected and start
> doing
>> some unwanted thing. This needs fixing because it really pisses me off.
>>
>> Suggestions anyone?
>>
>>
>
> If you have automated workers and add more workers to do the same job, the
> computer will move the automated workers to another job site. There is a
> limit to the number of workers that the AI will place on a tile. I'm sure
> it was written in so that more tiles would get worked by the AI. However,
> you can get more working on a tile if you control them yourself OR give
> the
> workers specific automated tasks such as the Shift-C (clear pollution) you
> mentioned.
> Most automated workers will only work at two per tile. However, "road
> to",
> "rail to" and "clear pollution" definitely differ from the norm.
>
> If you don't want the workers to do some specific tasks then you need to
> control them yourself, until you've taken care of it or it no longer
> matters.
>
>

I am controlling all workers manually - none are automated.
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 4:21:48 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Fishman ><\(\(\(°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in
news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net:

>
> "Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
> news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
>> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of
>> them.
>>
>> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try
>> to starve the town down to a population of 1, and then want to
>> add some workers to build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
>>
>> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer
>> reallocates its citizens to start producing food. I don't want
>> this. So every turn, I have to go round captured towns and switch
>> citizens from producing food to being
>> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
>>
>> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
>>
>> thanks
>> Boris
>
> As others have said you have to manually rearange the workers
> before each end turn to starve the city down.
> Because I used to forget to do it each end turn and and also I
> forget where the city is, I now do this:-
>
> On capture, I rename the cities to A1, next A2 etc.
> Then, prior to each end turn, I use city manager to find these
> cities - set sort by city name order.
> I adjust the workers of all "Ax" cities if pop. is greater than 1
> to cause starvation.
> Once an "Ax" city has got down to pop. 1 I give it a real name.
>
> Works well for me.
>
>
> Bye the way................
> The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of
> workers on a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with
> Shift + C but then some other workers elsewhere get selected (not
> in my pollution clearing stack) and start chopping down forests.
>
> If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why
> does it not finish the job on the tile before other workers get
> selected and start doing some unwanted thing. This needs fixing
> because it really pisses me off.
>
> Suggestions anyone?

Patch your game? I never have this issue. Workers that start a
turn (free to work) on the same tile always come up in the command
queue together.

--
ICQ: 8105495
AIM: KeeperGFA
EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
"If we did the things we are capable of,
we would astound ourselves." - Edison
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 4:48:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Kevin 'Keeper' Foster" <thekeeper@canada.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95E85511014A6kdfosterrogerscom@130.133.1.4...
> "Fishman ><\(\(\(°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in
> news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net:
>
>>
>> "Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
>> news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
>>> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of
>>> them.
>>>
>>> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try
>>> to starve the town down to a population of 1, and then want to
>>> add some workers to build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
>>>
>>> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer
>>> reallocates its citizens to start producing food. I don't want
>>> this. So every turn, I have to go round captured towns and switch
>>> citizens from producing food to being
>>> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
>>>
>>> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
>>>
>>> thanks
>>> Boris
>>
>> As others have said you have to manually rearange the workers
>> before each end turn to starve the city down.
>> Because I used to forget to do it each end turn and and also I
>> forget where the city is, I now do this:-
>>
>> On capture, I rename the cities to A1, next A2 etc.
>> Then, prior to each end turn, I use city manager to find these
>> cities - set sort by city name order.
>> I adjust the workers of all "Ax" cities if pop. is greater than 1
>> to cause starvation.
>> Once an "Ax" city has got down to pop. 1 I give it a real name.
>>
>> Works well for me.
>>
>>
>> Bye the way................
>> The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of
>> workers on a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with
>> Shift + C but then some other workers elsewhere get selected (not
>> in my pollution clearing stack) and start chopping down forests.
>>
>> If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why
>> does it not finish the job on the tile before other workers get
>> selected and start doing some unwanted thing. This needs fixing
>> because it really pisses me off.
>>
>> Suggestions anyone?
>
> Patch your game? I never have this issue. Workers that start a
> turn (free to work) on the same tile always come up in the command
> queue together.
>
> --
> ICQ: 8105495
> AIM: KeeperGFA
> EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
> "If we did the things we are capable of,
> we would astound ourselves." - Edison


Am running V 1.22 - not aware of any patches beyond this.?
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 6:46:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 18:12:03 +1300, Peter Huebner
<no.one@this.address> wrote:

>In article <Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
>boris@home.com says...
>> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
>> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
>> build up my own ethnically cleansed town
>
>Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
>little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring in
>one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
>placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
>the slaves, but what the hey.

Incidently, it seems that you don't need to raze cities to get
slaves. As far as I can tell, if you build a worker out of a foreign
citizen you get slave.
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 11:42:16 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Boris <boris@home.com> wrote in message
Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
>
> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
> build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
>
> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
> citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
> to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
being
> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
>
> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
>
> thanks
> Boris

If I have understood it rightly, citizens are reallocated every time
population changes - both by losing and by getting more people, to
re-optimize citizen activity. Thus, citizens will not be reallocated, for
instances, while the food box is being emptied.

For the same reason, newly improved squares will not be used before the next
population change - unless you manually reallocate your citizens. A partial
(and annoying) exception is with polluted squares: the AI will stop using
them automatically, but when your workers clean them you'll have to but them
back in use manually.

IMHO, the best way to reduce the population of a city is rush-building
workers (that are cheap) while starving the city. A strong cultural lead
will always be useful, of course.

Alfredo
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 11:51:16 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Alfredo Tutino" <powernews@libero.it> wrote in
news:I4dJd.7591$V17.241654@twister1.libero.it:

> For the same reason, newly improved squares will not be used
> before the next population change - unless you manually reallocate
> your citizens. A partial (and annoying) exception is with polluted
> squares: the AI will stop using them automatically, but when your
> workers clean them you'll have to but them back in use manually.

FYI - if your city governor is in control, pollution tiles will be
reworked as soon as they are clean.

--
ICQ: 8105495
AIM: KeeperGFA
EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
"If we did the things we are capable of,
we would astound ourselves." - Edison
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 12:49:41 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 12:56:26 -0000, Boris <boris@home.com> wrote:
> Daran <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in
> news:ivfcc2-tb5.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net: Thanks for the replies
> everyone.
>
> I think Peter's reply is very instructive - I've tried raing cities, but
> this just makes getting a peace treaty much harder. I used to try
> "defending" by counter-attacking and then razing the odd city or two,
> just to worry them, but it really does make getting peace harder.

I came to a realization in the last week or so - I've had two
recently-captured cities flip. No, 3. It's not really a problem;
by the time they flip, I've taken the next city or two from them,
so I have them surrounded by my own ROI. None of those cities were
heavily defended, maybe 3 units or so. I just bombard with radar
artillery, kill of a bunch of citizens, and go in and re-take it.
Solves the starvation problem, I don't make other leaders pissed off
by razing the city, and if there's a wonder, I still preserve that.
I lose most of the improvements anyway when I take or lose the city,
so I'm not seeing a downside.

Is there a downside to this? They take over the city with limited
forces, I get it back in one turn, and I reduce the population to a
more manageable level, while not tying up (and risking) a dozen or so
units.

Dave Hinz
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 12:50:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

'Tzar Sasha" <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:KP_Id.12637$Vj3.3575@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
>
> "Fishman ><(((°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in message
> news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> >
> <snip>
>
> > Bye the way................
> > The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of
workers
> on
> > a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with Shift + C but
then
> > some other workers elsewhere get selected (not in my pollution clearing
> > stack) and start chopping down forests.
> >
> > If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why does it
> not
> > finish the job on the tile before other workers get selected and start
> doing
> > some unwanted thing. This needs fixing because it really pisses me off.
> >
> > Suggestions anyone?
> >
> >
>
> If you have automated workers and add more workers to do the same job, the
> computer will move the automated workers to another job site. There is a
> limit to the number of workers that the AI will place on a tile. I'm sure
> it was written in so that more tiles would get worked by the AI. However,
> you can get more working on a tile if you control them yourself OR give
the
> workers specific automated tasks such as the Shift-C (clear pollution) you
> mentioned.
> Most automated workers will only work at two per tile. However, "road
to",
> "rail to" and "clear pollution" definitely differ from the norm.
>
> If you don't want the workers to do some specific tasks then you need to
> control them yourself, until you've taken care of it or it no longer
> matters.
>
>
The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear pollution
all have the same keys. change the clear pollution command to use a
different keystroke to clearing vegetation".

Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...

how about "re-mappable keyboard shortcuts for unit orders" as the
enhancement request (I play angband and you can remap every order on a game
which uses almost every key - most in both upper and lower case).

newbies will ignore it - long term players will love it.

Garrie
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 12:51:28 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 03:31:37 +1300, Peter Huebner <no.one@this.address> wrote:
>
> Hmmm. I don't go to war unless I am attacked, or unless I really mean
> it. Which means I don't give a flying fig for how the other leader feels
> about me - by the time I ask him/her if they want peace I have them over
> a barrel and they will give me everything they own (and hate my rotten
> guts, but so be it).

I enjoy getting another nation to help me beat up on someone, work them
down to one city, and then bargaining for peace. Get all the techs that
they'll give, all their money, and the other civ wipes 'em out.

Is there any kind of bonus or punishment for wiping out another civ?
Should I finish 'em off, should I let someone else do it, or does it
not matter?
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 12:55:13 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 21:50:38 +1100, Garrie Irons <girons@optusnet.deletethis.andthis.com.au> wrote:
>>
> The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear pollution
> all have the same keys. change the clear pollution command to use a
> different keystroke to clearing vegetation".

the letters J and P are on different keys on _my_ keyboard?!?!?!

> Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...

It's already there, at least on civ3 on the Mac.

Dave Hinz
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 4:46:57 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Loren Pechtel <lorenpechtel@removethis.hotmail.com> wrote in
news:sa1bv0pq2g0cdekbor6ur1t8lphiv5lr6i@4ax.com:

> On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 18:12:03 +1300, Peter Huebner
> <no.one@this.address> wrote:
>
>>In article <Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
>>boris@home.com says...
>>> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try
>>> to starve the town down to a population of 1, and then want to
>>> add some workers to build up my own ethnically cleansed town
>>
>>Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
>>little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then
>>bring in one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve
>>on city placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you
>>don't get all the slaves, but what the hey.
>
> Incidently, it seems that you don't need to raze cities to
> get
> slaves. As far as I can tell, if you build a worker out of a
> foreign citizen you get slave.

That's true, until your own citizens grow. So if you can take the
time, and control (prevent) population growth, this is a better method
as you will get more slaves out of it without taking the rep hit for
razing.

--
ICQ: 8105495
AIM: KeeperGFA
EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
"If we did the things we are capable of,
we would astound ourselves." - Edison
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 4:48:59 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote in
news:35l961F4ou0nbU15@individual.net:

> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 21:50:38 +1100, Garrie Irons
> <girons@optusnet.deletethis.andthis.com.au> wrote:
>>>
>> The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear
>> pollution all have the same keys. change the clear pollution
>> command to use a different keystroke to clearing vegetation".
>
> the letters J and P are on different keys on _my_ keyboard?!?!?!
>
>> Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...
>
> It's already there, at least on civ3 on the Mac.

On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and pollution.

IIRC, there is also overlap on the SHIFT-D key for workers and
diplomacy.

--
ICQ: 8105495
AIM: KeeperGFA
EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
"If we did the things we are capable of,
we would astound ourselves." - Edison
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 12:45:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

I've yet to see both forest & wetland in the same tile. :) 

Polution has priority using the hot keys.

I've never exprimented to see if polution in a tile when it was forest
choped impacted the 10 shields are not.
January 25, 2005 8:32:43 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Peter Huebner <no.one@this.address> wrote:

> In article <Xns95E783A8F9C6Dboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
> boris@home.com says...
>> Daran <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in
>> news:ivfcc2-tb5.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net: Thanks for the replies
>> everyone.
>>
>> I think Peter's reply is very instructive - I've tried raing cities, but
>> this just makes getting a peace treaty much harder. I used to try
>> "defending" by counter-attacking and then razing the odd city or two,
>> just to worry them, but it really does make getting peace harder.
>>
>> The AI is very moral - not letting you commit genocide or ethnically
>> cleanse your cities.
>
> Hmmm. I don't go to war unless I am attacked, or unless I really mean
> it. Which means I don't give a flying fig for how the other leader feels
> about me - by the time I ask him/her if they want peace I have them over
> a barrel and they will give me everything they own (and hate my rotten
> guts, but so be it).

A leader will hate you for ever if you just once capture a city from him by
conquest. (it doesn't upset them if their cities defect to you during
peacetime. Don't know about wartime defections, this has never come up.)

However, it's not just the civ you're at war with whose attitude may be
affected. *Any* civ with nationals in a city you raze or abandon will get
totally pissed at you, and the other civs will become progressivly more
upset, the more cities you raze.

The AI's attitude toward you is important. The more angry they are, the
longer they take before they become willing to negotiate for peace, so if
you're looking for a short war followed by an extortive treaty, then it pays
you not to have them too upset. Also you can't win a diplo if the majority
of surviving civs are pissed at you. (Of course, you could just anihilate
the angry ones before calling the vote.)

> Even if I play nice, which is what I prefer to do, I find the attitude
> of the other leaders will turn sour after a while even if we had
> excellent relations to start with. And I have moral objections to going
> on blowing resources and techs up their collective arses just to keep
> them sweet. (pardon my language)

So do I, but in my experience, their attitudes vary over time and according
to what you're doing. Trading a lot helps, as do ROPs, formal alliences,
and just being at war against a common enemy.

> ;-)
>
> -P.

--
Daran

The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that
English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words;
on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them
unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary. -- James D. Nicoll
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 9:15:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On 25 Jan 2005 01:48:59 GMT, Kevin 'Keeper' Foster <thekeeper@canada.com> wrote:
> Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote in
> news:35l961F4ou0nbU15@individual.net:
>
>> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 21:50:38 +1100, Garrie Irons
>> <girons@optusnet.deletethis.andthis.com.au> wrote:
>>>>
>>> The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear
>>> pollution all have the same keys. change the clear pollution
>>> command to use a different keystroke to clearing vegetation".
>>
>> the letters J and P are on different keys on _my_ keyboard?!?!?!
>>
>>> Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...
>>
>> It's already there, at least on civ3 on the Mac.
>
> On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and pollution.

Does shift-P and shift-J not work to say "go clean up all the pollution
/jungle until you're done"? Odd that it'd be implemented on one platform
and not the other?
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 9:50:26 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

< cut>
> >
> The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear
pollution
> all have the same keys. change the clear pollution command to use a
> different keystroke to clearing vegetation".
>
> Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...
>
> how about "re-mappable keyboard shortcuts for unit orders" as the
> enhancement request (I play angband and you can remap every order on a
game
> which uses almost every key - most in both upper and lower case).
>
> newbies will ignore it - long term players will love it.
>
> Garrie

I like it.

Alfredo
Anonymous
January 26, 2005 1:28:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Daran" <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in message
news:recic2-2i2.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net...
> A leader will hate you for ever if you just once capture a city from him
by
> conquest. (it doesn't upset them if their cities defect to you during
> peacetime. Don't know about wartime defections, this has never come up.)
>
> However, it's not just the civ you're at war with whose attitude may be
> affected. *Any* civ with nationals in a city you raze or abandon will get
> totally pissed at you, and the other civs will become progressivly more
> upset, the more cities you raze.
>

Actually, I've captured cities with multiple nationalites and only the one
I'm fighting is "pissed" at me. I think it might be due to trade deals and
alliances against the civ the city was taken from. Only after the war is
over and peace declared do the other civs start getting upset, but only for
a few trades...
The best cities to capture where you don't have to starve are the cities
with a majority of nationals from a "dead" race. They will be so happy that
you "rescued" them from their conquerers that they join you freely.
Anonymous
January 26, 2005 1:28:55 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Tzar Sasha" <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:GKzJd.13051$Vj3.9970@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
>
> "Daran" <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in message
> news:recic2-2i2.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net...
>> A leader will hate you for ever if you just once capture a city from him
> by
>> conquest. (it doesn't upset them if their cities defect to you during
>> peacetime. Don't know about wartime defections, this has never come up.)
>>
>> However, it's not just the civ you're at war with whose attitude may be
>> affected. *Any* civ with nationals in a city you raze or abandon will
>> get
>> totally pissed at you, and the other civs will become progressivly more
>> upset, the more cities you raze.
>>
>
> Actually, I've captured cities with multiple nationalites and only the one
> I'm fighting is "pissed" at me. I think it might be due to trade deals
> and
> alliances against the civ the city was taken from. Only after the war is
> over and peace declared do the other civs start getting upset, but only
> for
> a few trades...
> The best cities to capture where you don't have to starve are the cities
> with a majority of nationals from a "dead" race. They will be so happy
> that
> you "rescued" them from their conquerers that they join you freely.

Civs actually like you having thier citizens in your cities. The problem is
in having any foriegn nationals at all (even a dead civ) in your cities make
it more suseptable to flipping.
Anonymous
January 26, 2005 3:02:12 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

In article <Xns95E8D3C1FB26Akdfosterrogerscom@130.133.1.4>,
thekeeper@canada.com says...
>
> On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and pollution.
>

But then, if you chose to display the 'advanced' worker icons, you get
three distinct icons for these actions. Go figure.

-P.
Anonymous
January 26, 2005 3:02:13 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

"Peter Huebner" <no.one@this.address> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c60ee5f6f08942c9896e1@news.nzl.ihugultra.co.nz...
> In article <Xns95E8D3C1FB26Akdfosterrogerscom@130.133.1.4>,
> thekeeper@canada.com says...
> >
> > On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and pollution.
> >
>
> But then, if you chose to display the 'advanced' worker icons, you get
> three distinct icons for these actions. Go figure.
>
That is true. And I always use the "advanced" buttons. I've never had a
problem as what was originally mentioned. Perhaps the advanced buttons keep
the workers on specific task...
Anonymous
January 26, 2005 7:02:31 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote in
news:35ngm8F4n39u4U3@individual.net:

> On 25 Jan 2005 01:48:59 GMT, Kevin 'Keeper' Foster
> <thekeeper@canada.com> wrote:
>> Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote in
>> news:35l961F4ou0nbU15@individual.net:
>>
>>> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 21:50:38 +1100, Garrie Irons
>>> <girons@optusnet.deletethis.andthis.com.au> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>> The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and
>>>> clear pollution all have the same keys. change the clear
>>>> pollution command to use a different keystroke to clearing
>>>> vegetation".
>>>
>>> the letters J and P are on different keys on _my_ keyboard?!?!?!
>>>
>>>> Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...
>>>
>>> It's already there, at least on civ3 on the Mac.
>>
>> On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and
>> pollution.
>
> Does shift-P and shift-J not work to say "go clean up all the
> pollution /jungle until you're done"? Odd that it'd be implemented
> on one platform and not the other?

Yes those work. CTRL-C is for the current tile only.

--
ICQ: 8105495
AIM: KeeperGFA
EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
"If we did the things we are capable of,
we would astound ourselves." - Edison
Anonymous
January 26, 2005 2:26:34 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

In article <35ngm8F4n39u4U3@individual.net>, DaveHinz@spamcop.net
says...
>
> Does shift-P and shift-J not work to say "go clean up all the pollution
> /jungle until you're done"? Odd that it'd be implemented on one platform
> and not the other?
>
>

I am pretty sure shift-P no longer works in Conquests/PC, anyway ... I
remember being utterly confused by that because I had 'learned' that
hotkey.
Then I wasn't sure if I had misremembered :-}

-P.
January 27, 2005 6:08:08 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Tzar Sasha <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> Actually, I've captured cities with multiple nationalites and only the one
> I'm fighting is "pissed" at me.

Now try abandoning the city (or reload the turn you captured it, and raze it
instead). You'll find that the others hate you for it too.

--
Daran

The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that
English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words;
on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them
unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary. -- James D. Nicoll
!