how do I starve a town?

Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.

I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
build up my own ethnically cleansed town.

Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to being
entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.

How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?

thanks
Boris
34 answers Last reply
More about starve town
  1. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
    news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
    > There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
    >
    > I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
    > the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
    > build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
    >
    > Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
    > citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
    > to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
    > being
    > entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
    >
    > How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?

    It can't be done. What you are doing is the only way to do it.
  2. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
    news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
    > There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
    >
    > I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
    > the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
    > build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
    >
    > Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
    > citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
    > to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
    being
    > entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
    >
    > How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?

    You can't stop it from reallocating the citizens. You could starve the one
    citizen, add your own worker and repeat. And hope that when it starves the
    next citizen that it is a forigen citizen and not one of your own... Short
    of razing the city and planting your own spy, you will have to constantly go
    back and rearrange your citizens...
  3. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 00:41:54 GMT, "Tzar Sasha"
    <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

    >
    >"Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
    >news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
    >> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
    >>
    >> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
    >> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
    >> build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
    >>
    >> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
    >> citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
    >> to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
    >being
    >> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
    >>
    >> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
    >
    >You can't stop it from reallocating the citizens. You could starve the one
    >citizen, add your own worker and repeat. And hope that when it starves the
    >next citizen that it is a forigen citizen and not one of your own... Short
    >of razing the city and planting your own spy, you will have to constantly go
    >back and rearrange your citizens...
    >

    That won't work. If you add any citizens, those will be the first to
    die if you continue to starve the city. You can build workers in the
    city to speed up the process a bit, but there's nothing you can do
    about the reallocating.
  4. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    Boris <boris@home.com> wrote in
    news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30:

    > There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of
    > them.
    >
    > I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try
    > to starve the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add
    > some workers to build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
    >
    > Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer
    > reallocates its citizens to start producing food. I don't want
    > this. So every turn, I have to go round captured towns and switch
    > citizens from producing food to being entertainers or whatever.
    > This is wearisome.
    >
    > How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?

    You can't. But you shouldn't have to do this every turn. The city
    should only relocate workers when there is a population change.
    Ideally you'll be rush building (slave) workers while starving the city
    so you should be micromanaging the city every other turn to do this.
    And thinking about it, I'm glad that starving a city to death
    requires micromanagement.

    --
    ICQ: 8105495
    AIM: KeeperGFA
    EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
    "If we did the things we are capable of,
    we would astound ourselves." - Edison
  5. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    In article <Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
    boris@home.com says...
    > I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
    > the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
    > build up my own ethnically cleansed town

    Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
    little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring in
    one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
    placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
    the slaves, but what the hey.

    I always keep a number of settlers around for this purpose, if and when
    I am trying to take over large tracts of land. The only time I won't do
    this, it's to preserve a city with a wonder - then I garrison heavily
    and make sure to produce much culture and I haven't had a problem with
    defections since I installed 'Conquests' and the latest patches. In
    vanilla CivIII that was a real bugbear - you'd garrison a big city, and
    they'd defect on the firs turn (even if you had a huge cultural
    superiority) and you'd lose all your garrison troups into the bargain!
    They don't seem to do that so indiscriminately any more.

    Unhappiness (becaues you are at war with their ethnic faction) is much
    more of a problem in conquered cities and that's why I tend to raze -
    that and the free slaves.

    -Peter
  6. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 18:12:03 +1300, Peter Huebner
    <no.one@this.address> wrote:

    >In article <Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
    >boris@home.com says...
    >> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
    >> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
    >> build up my own ethnically cleansed town
    >
    >Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
    >little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring in
    >one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
    >placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
    >the slaves, but what the hey.

    If you want to keep the town, rush-build workers. Coupled with
    starving -- which isn't a fast process -- this can drop the population
    nicely.




    --
    *-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
    ** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
    *Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>
  7. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    Peter Huebner <no.one@this.address> wrote:

    > Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
    > little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring in
    > one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
    > placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
    > the slaves, but what the hey.

    If you raze (or abandon) a city with foreign nationals, it totally pisses
    off that civ's leader (assuming he's not already pissed at you.) It also
    tends to upset the other leaders, so, if you do too much razing, they all
    eventually end up furious.

    > -Peter

    --
    Daran

    The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that
    English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words;
    on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them
    unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary. -- James D. Nicoll
  8. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    Daran <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in
    news:ivfcc2-tb5.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net: Thanks for the replies
    everyone.

    I think Peter's reply is very instructive - I've tried raing cities, but
    this just makes getting a peace treaty much harder. I used to try
    "defending" by counter-attacking and then razing the odd city or two,
    just to worry them, but it really does make getting peace harder.

    The AI is very moral - not letting you commit genocide or ethnically
    cleanse your cities.

    Let's keep the politics out of gaming ...

    Boris


    > Peter Huebner <no.one@this.address> wrote:
    >
    >> Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
    >> little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring
    >> in one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
    >> placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
    >> the slaves, but what the hey.
    >
    > If you raze (or abandon) a city with foreign nationals, it totally
    > pisses off that civ's leader (assuming he's not already pissed at
    > you.) It also tends to upset the other leaders, so, if you do too much
    > razing, they all eventually end up furious.
    >
    >> -Peter
    >
  9. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
    news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
    > There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
    >
    > I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
    > the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
    > build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
    >
    > Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
    > citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
    > to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
    > being
    > entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
    >
    > How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
    >
    > thanks
    > Boris

    As others have said you have to manually rearange the workers before each
    end turn to starve the city down.
    Because I used to forget to do it each end turn and and also I forget where
    the city is, I now do this:-

    On capture, I rename the cities to A1, next A2 etc.
    Then, prior to each end turn, I use city manager to find these cities - set
    sort by city name order.
    I adjust the workers of all "Ax" cities if pop. is greater than 1 to cause
    starvation.
    Once an "Ax" city has got down to pop. 1 I give it a real name.

    Works well for me.


    Bye the way................
    The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of workers on
    a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with Shift + C but then
    some other workers elsewhere get selected (not in my pollution clearing
    stack) and start chopping down forests.

    If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why does it not
    finish the job on the tile before other workers get selected and start doing
    some unwanted thing. This needs fixing because it really pisses me off.

    Suggestions anyone?
  10. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    In article <Xns95E783A8F9C6Dboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
    boris@home.com says...
    > Daran <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in
    > news:ivfcc2-tb5.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net: Thanks for the replies
    > everyone.
    >
    > I think Peter's reply is very instructive - I've tried raing cities, but
    > this just makes getting a peace treaty much harder. I used to try
    > "defending" by counter-attacking and then razing the odd city or two,
    > just to worry them, but it really does make getting peace harder.
    >
    > The AI is very moral - not letting you commit genocide or ethnically
    > cleanse your cities.

    Hmmm. I don't go to war unless I am attacked, or unless I really mean
    it. Which means I don't give a flying fig for how the other leader feels
    about me - by the time I ask him/her if they want peace I have them over
    a barrel and they will give me everything they own (and hate my rotten
    guts, but so be it).

    Even if I play nice, which is what I prefer to do, I find the attitude
    of the other leaders will turn sour after a while even if we had
    excellent relations to start with. And I have moral objections to going
    on blowing resources and techs up their collective arses just to keep
    them sweet. (pardon my language)

    ;-)

    -P.
  11. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Fishman ><(((°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in message
    news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
    >
    <snip>

    > Bye the way................
    > The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of workers
    on
    > a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with Shift + C but then
    > some other workers elsewhere get selected (not in my pollution clearing
    > stack) and start chopping down forests.
    >
    > If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why does it
    not
    > finish the job on the tile before other workers get selected and start
    doing
    > some unwanted thing. This needs fixing because it really pisses me off.
    >
    > Suggestions anyone?
    >
    >

    If you have automated workers and add more workers to do the same job, the
    computer will move the automated workers to another job site. There is a
    limit to the number of workers that the AI will place on a tile. I'm sure
    it was written in so that more tiles would get worked by the AI. However,
    you can get more working on a tile if you control them yourself OR give the
    workers specific automated tasks such as the Shift-C (clear pollution) you
    mentioned.
    Most automated workers will only work at two per tile. However, "road to",
    "rail to" and "clear pollution" definitely differ from the norm.

    If you don't want the workers to do some specific tasks then you need to
    control them yourself, until you've taken care of it or it no longer
    matters.
  12. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Tzar Sasha" <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
    news:KP_Id.12637$Vj3.3575@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
    >
    > "Fishman ><(((°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in message
    > news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
    >>
    > <snip>
    >
    >> Bye the way................
    >> The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of workers
    > on
    >> a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with Shift + C but then
    >> some other workers elsewhere get selected (not in my pollution clearing
    >> stack) and start chopping down forests.
    >>
    >> If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why does it
    > not
    >> finish the job on the tile before other workers get selected and start
    > doing
    >> some unwanted thing. This needs fixing because it really pisses me off.
    >>
    >> Suggestions anyone?
    >>
    >>
    >
    > If you have automated workers and add more workers to do the same job, the
    > computer will move the automated workers to another job site. There is a
    > limit to the number of workers that the AI will place on a tile. I'm sure
    > it was written in so that more tiles would get worked by the AI. However,
    > you can get more working on a tile if you control them yourself OR give
    > the
    > workers specific automated tasks such as the Shift-C (clear pollution) you
    > mentioned.
    > Most automated workers will only work at two per tile. However, "road
    > to",
    > "rail to" and "clear pollution" definitely differ from the norm.
    >
    > If you don't want the workers to do some specific tasks then you need to
    > control them yourself, until you've taken care of it or it no longer
    > matters.
    >
    >

    I am controlling all workers manually - none are automated.
  13. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Fishman ><\(\(\(°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in
    news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net:

    >
    > "Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
    > news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
    >> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of
    >> them.
    >>
    >> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try
    >> to starve the town down to a population of 1, and then want to
    >> add some workers to build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
    >>
    >> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer
    >> reallocates its citizens to start producing food. I don't want
    >> this. So every turn, I have to go round captured towns and switch
    >> citizens from producing food to being
    >> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
    >>
    >> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
    >>
    >> thanks
    >> Boris
    >
    > As others have said you have to manually rearange the workers
    > before each end turn to starve the city down.
    > Because I used to forget to do it each end turn and and also I
    > forget where the city is, I now do this:-
    >
    > On capture, I rename the cities to A1, next A2 etc.
    > Then, prior to each end turn, I use city manager to find these
    > cities - set sort by city name order.
    > I adjust the workers of all "Ax" cities if pop. is greater than 1
    > to cause starvation.
    > Once an "Ax" city has got down to pop. 1 I give it a real name.
    >
    > Works well for me.
    >
    >
    > Bye the way................
    > The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of
    > workers on a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with
    > Shift + C but then some other workers elsewhere get selected (not
    > in my pollution clearing stack) and start chopping down forests.
    >
    > If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why
    > does it not finish the job on the tile before other workers get
    > selected and start doing some unwanted thing. This needs fixing
    > because it really pisses me off.
    >
    > Suggestions anyone?

    Patch your game? I never have this issue. Workers that start a
    turn (free to work) on the same tile always come up in the command
    queue together.

    --
    ICQ: 8105495
    AIM: KeeperGFA
    EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
    "If we did the things we are capable of,
    we would astound ourselves." - Edison
  14. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Kevin 'Keeper' Foster" <thekeeper@canada.com> wrote in message
    news:Xns95E85511014A6kdfosterrogerscom@130.133.1.4...
    > "Fishman ><\(\(\(°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in
    > news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net:
    >
    >>
    >> "Boris" <boris@home.com> wrote in message
    >> news:Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
    >>> There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of
    >>> them.
    >>>
    >>> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try
    >>> to starve the town down to a population of 1, and then want to
    >>> add some workers to build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
    >>>
    >>> Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer
    >>> reallocates its citizens to start producing food. I don't want
    >>> this. So every turn, I have to go round captured towns and switch
    >>> citizens from producing food to being
    >>> entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
    >>>
    >>> How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
    >>>
    >>> thanks
    >>> Boris
    >>
    >> As others have said you have to manually rearange the workers
    >> before each end turn to starve the city down.
    >> Because I used to forget to do it each end turn and and also I
    >> forget where the city is, I now do this:-
    >>
    >> On capture, I rename the cities to A1, next A2 etc.
    >> Then, prior to each end turn, I use city manager to find these
    >> cities - set sort by city name order.
    >> I adjust the workers of all "Ax" cities if pop. is greater than 1
    >> to cause starvation.
    >> Once an "Ax" city has got down to pop. 1 I give it a real name.
    >>
    >> Works well for me.
    >>
    >>
    >> Bye the way................
    >> The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of
    >> workers on a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with
    >> Shift + C but then some other workers elsewhere get selected (not
    >> in my pollution clearing stack) and start chopping down forests.
    >>
    >> If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why
    >> does it not finish the job on the tile before other workers get
    >> selected and start doing some unwanted thing. This needs fixing
    >> because it really pisses me off.
    >>
    >> Suggestions anyone?
    >
    > Patch your game? I never have this issue. Workers that start a
    > turn (free to work) on the same tile always come up in the command
    > queue together.
    >
    > --
    > ICQ: 8105495
    > AIM: KeeperGFA
    > EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
    > "If we did the things we are capable of,
    > we would astound ourselves." - Edison


    Am running V 1.22 - not aware of any patches beyond this.?
  15. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 18:12:03 +1300, Peter Huebner
    <no.one@this.address> wrote:

    >In article <Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
    >boris@home.com says...
    >> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
    >> the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
    >> build up my own ethnically cleansed town
    >
    >Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
    >little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then bring in
    >one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve on city
    >placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you don't get all
    >the slaves, but what the hey.

    Incidently, it seems that you don't need to raze cities to get
    slaves. As far as I can tell, if you build a worker out of a foreign
    citizen you get slave.
  16. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    Boris <boris@home.com> wrote in message
    Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30...
    > There are some annoying features about Civ3 and this is one of them.
    >
    > I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try to starve
    > the town down to a population of 1, and then want to add some workers to
    > build up my own ethnically cleansed town.
    >
    > Problem: as soon as the town starts starving, the computer reallocates its
    > citizens to start producing food. I don't want this. So every turn, I have
    > to go round captured towns and switch citizens from producing food to
    being
    > entertainers or whatever. This is wearisome.
    >
    > How do I stop towns reallocating my citizens?
    >
    > thanks
    > Boris

    If I have understood it rightly, citizens are reallocated every time
    population changes - both by losing and by getting more people, to
    re-optimize citizen activity. Thus, citizens will not be reallocated, for
    instances, while the food box is being emptied.

    For the same reason, newly improved squares will not be used before the next
    population change - unless you manually reallocate your citizens. A partial
    (and annoying) exception is with polluted squares: the AI will stop using
    them automatically, but when your workers clean them you'll have to but them
    back in use manually.

    IMHO, the best way to reduce the population of a city is rush-building
    workers (that are cheap) while starving the city. A strong cultural lead
    will always be useful, of course.

    Alfredo
  17. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Alfredo Tutino" <powernews@libero.it> wrote in
    news:I4dJd.7591$V17.241654@twister1.libero.it:

    > For the same reason, newly improved squares will not be used
    > before the next population change - unless you manually reallocate
    > your citizens. A partial (and annoying) exception is with polluted
    > squares: the AI will stop using them automatically, but when your
    > workers clean them you'll have to but them back in use manually.

    FYI - if your city governor is in control, pollution tiles will be
    reworked as soon as they are clean.

    --
    ICQ: 8105495
    AIM: KeeperGFA
    EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
    "If we did the things we are capable of,
    we would astound ourselves." - Edison
  18. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 12:56:26 -0000, Boris <boris@home.com> wrote:
    > Daran <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in
    > news:ivfcc2-tb5.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net: Thanks for the replies
    > everyone.
    >
    > I think Peter's reply is very instructive - I've tried raing cities, but
    > this just makes getting a peace treaty much harder. I used to try
    > "defending" by counter-attacking and then razing the odd city or two,
    > just to worry them, but it really does make getting peace harder.

    I came to a realization in the last week or so - I've had two
    recently-captured cities flip. No, 3. It's not really a problem;
    by the time they flip, I've taken the next city or two from them,
    so I have them surrounded by my own ROI. None of those cities were
    heavily defended, maybe 3 units or so. I just bombard with radar
    artillery, kill of a bunch of citizens, and go in and re-take it.
    Solves the starvation problem, I don't make other leaders pissed off
    by razing the city, and if there's a wonder, I still preserve that.
    I lose most of the improvements anyway when I take or lose the city,
    so I'm not seeing a downside.

    Is there a downside to this? They take over the city with limited
    forces, I get it back in one turn, and I reduce the population to a
    more manageable level, while not tying up (and risking) a dozen or so
    units.

    Dave Hinz
  19. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    'Tzar Sasha" <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
    news:KP_Id.12637$Vj3.3575@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
    >
    > "Fishman ><(((°>" <nospam@butfish.com> wrote in message
    > news:LxWId.263$w%4.5@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
    > >
    > <snip>
    >
    > > Bye the way................
    > > The most wearisome thing for me is when I have a massive stack of
    workers
    > on
    > > a tile clearing pollution and I start clearing it with Shift + C but
    then
    > > some other workers elsewhere get selected (not in my pollution clearing
    > > stack) and start chopping down forests.
    > >
    > > If there is enough workers on a tile to finish the job why o why does it
    > not
    > > finish the job on the tile before other workers get selected and start
    > doing
    > > some unwanted thing. This needs fixing because it really pisses me off.
    > >
    > > Suggestions anyone?
    > >
    > >
    >
    > If you have automated workers and add more workers to do the same job, the
    > computer will move the automated workers to another job site. There is a
    > limit to the number of workers that the AI will place on a tile. I'm sure
    > it was written in so that more tiles would get worked by the AI. However,
    > you can get more working on a tile if you control them yourself OR give
    the
    > workers specific automated tasks such as the Shift-C (clear pollution) you
    > mentioned.
    > Most automated workers will only work at two per tile. However, "road
    to",
    > "rail to" and "clear pollution" definitely differ from the norm.
    >
    > If you don't want the workers to do some specific tasks then you need to
    > control them yourself, until you've taken care of it or it no longer
    > matters.
    >
    >
    The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear pollution
    all have the same keys. change the clear pollution command to use a
    different keystroke to clearing vegetation".

    Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...

    how about "re-mappable keyboard shortcuts for unit orders" as the
    enhancement request (I play angband and you can remap every order on a game
    which uses almost every key - most in both upper and lower case).

    newbies will ignore it - long term players will love it.

    Garrie
  20. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 03:31:37 +1300, Peter Huebner <no.one@this.address> wrote:
    >
    > Hmmm. I don't go to war unless I am attacked, or unless I really mean
    > it. Which means I don't give a flying fig for how the other leader feels
    > about me - by the time I ask him/her if they want peace I have them over
    > a barrel and they will give me everything they own (and hate my rotten
    > guts, but so be it).

    I enjoy getting another nation to help me beat up on someone, work them
    down to one city, and then bargaining for peace. Get all the techs that
    they'll give, all their money, and the other civ wipes 'em out.

    Is there any kind of bonus or punishment for wiping out another civ?
    Should I finish 'em off, should I let someone else do it, or does it
    not matter?
  21. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 21:50:38 +1100, Garrie Irons <girons@optusnet.deletethis.andthis.com.au> wrote:
    >>
    > The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear pollution
    > all have the same keys. change the clear pollution command to use a
    > different keystroke to clearing vegetation".

    the letters J and P are on different keys on _my_ keyboard?!?!?!

    > Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...

    It's already there, at least on civ3 on the Mac.

    Dave Hinz
  22. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    Loren Pechtel <lorenpechtel@removethis.hotmail.com> wrote in
    news:sa1bv0pq2g0cdekbor6ur1t8lphiv5lr6i@4ax.com:

    > On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 18:12:03 +1300, Peter Huebner
    > <no.one@this.address> wrote:
    >
    >>In article <Xns95E6ECBAA270Eboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
    >>boris@home.com says...
    >>> I have captured a town, I don't want to risk a defection, so try
    >>> to starve the town down to a population of 1, and then want to
    >>> add some workers to build up my own ethnically cleansed town
    >>
    >>Why bother? If it's a large town, I raze it and get all those nice
    >>little slaves as free workers that won't need support. I then
    >>bring in one of my own settlers and build new. Can often improve
    >>on city placement into the bargain ... if it's a small town you
    >>don't get all the slaves, but what the hey.
    >
    > Incidently, it seems that you don't need to raze cities to
    > get
    > slaves. As far as I can tell, if you build a worker out of a
    > foreign citizen you get slave.

    That's true, until your own citizens grow. So if you can take the
    time, and control (prevent) population growth, this is a better method
    as you will get more slaves out of it without taking the rep hit for
    razing.

    --
    ICQ: 8105495
    AIM: KeeperGFA
    EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
    "If we did the things we are capable of,
    we would astound ourselves." - Edison
  23. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote in
    news:35l961F4ou0nbU15@individual.net:

    > On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 21:50:38 +1100, Garrie Irons
    > <girons@optusnet.deletethis.andthis.com.au> wrote:
    >>>
    >> The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear
    >> pollution all have the same keys. change the clear pollution
    >> command to use a different keystroke to clearing vegetation".
    >
    > the letters J and P are on different keys on _my_ keyboard?!?!?!
    >
    >> Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...
    >
    > It's already there, at least on civ3 on the Mac.

    On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and pollution.

    IIRC, there is also overlap on the SHIFT-D key for workers and
    diplomacy.

    --
    ICQ: 8105495
    AIM: KeeperGFA
    EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
    "If we did the things we are capable of,
    we would astound ourselves." - Edison
  24. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    I've yet to see both forest & wetland in the same tile. :)

    Polution has priority using the hot keys.

    I've never exprimented to see if polution in a tile when it was forest
    choped impacted the 10 shields are not.
  25. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    Peter Huebner <no.one@this.address> wrote:

    > In article <Xns95E783A8F9C6Dboristhedecapitator@216.168.3.30>,
    > boris@home.com says...
    >> Daran <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in
    >> news:ivfcc2-tb5.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net: Thanks for the replies
    >> everyone.
    >>
    >> I think Peter's reply is very instructive - I've tried raing cities, but
    >> this just makes getting a peace treaty much harder. I used to try
    >> "defending" by counter-attacking and then razing the odd city or two,
    >> just to worry them, but it really does make getting peace harder.
    >>
    >> The AI is very moral - not letting you commit genocide or ethnically
    >> cleanse your cities.
    >
    > Hmmm. I don't go to war unless I am attacked, or unless I really mean
    > it. Which means I don't give a flying fig for how the other leader feels
    > about me - by the time I ask him/her if they want peace I have them over
    > a barrel and they will give me everything they own (and hate my rotten
    > guts, but so be it).

    A leader will hate you for ever if you just once capture a city from him by
    conquest. (it doesn't upset them if their cities defect to you during
    peacetime. Don't know about wartime defections, this has never come up.)

    However, it's not just the civ you're at war with whose attitude may be
    affected. *Any* civ with nationals in a city you raze or abandon will get
    totally pissed at you, and the other civs will become progressivly more
    upset, the more cities you raze.

    The AI's attitude toward you is important. The more angry they are, the
    longer they take before they become willing to negotiate for peace, so if
    you're looking for a short war followed by an extortive treaty, then it pays
    you not to have them too upset. Also you can't win a diplo if the majority
    of surviving civs are pissed at you. (Of course, you could just anihilate
    the angry ones before calling the vote.)

    > Even if I play nice, which is what I prefer to do, I find the attitude
    > of the other leaders will turn sour after a while even if we had
    > excellent relations to start with. And I have moral objections to going
    > on blowing resources and techs up their collective arses just to keep
    > them sweet. (pardon my language)

    So do I, but in my experience, their attitudes vary over time and according
    to what you're doing. Trading a lot helps, as do ROPs, formal alliences,
    and just being at war against a common enemy.

    > ;-)
    >
    > -P.

    --
    Daran

    The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that
    English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words;
    on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them
    unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary. -- James D. Nicoll
  26. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    On 25 Jan 2005 01:48:59 GMT, Kevin 'Keeper' Foster <thekeeper@canada.com> wrote:
    > Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote in
    > news:35l961F4ou0nbU15@individual.net:
    >
    >> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 21:50:38 +1100, Garrie Irons
    >> <girons@optusnet.deletethis.andthis.com.au> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>> The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear
    >>> pollution all have the same keys. change the clear pollution
    >>> command to use a different keystroke to clearing vegetation".
    >>
    >> the letters J and P are on different keys on _my_ keyboard?!?!?!
    >>
    >>> Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...
    >>
    >> It's already there, at least on civ3 on the Mac.
    >
    > On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and pollution.

    Does shift-P and shift-J not work to say "go clean up all the pollution
    /jungle until you're done"? Odd that it'd be implemented on one platform
    and not the other?
  27. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    < cut>
    > >
    > The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and clear
    pollution
    > all have the same keys. change the clear pollution command to use a
    > different keystroke to clearing vegetation".
    >
    > Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...
    >
    > how about "re-mappable keyboard shortcuts for unit orders" as the
    > enhancement request (I play angband and you can remap every order on a
    game
    > which uses almost every key - most in both upper and lower case).
    >
    > newbies will ignore it - long term players will love it.
    >
    > Garrie

    I like it.

    Alfredo
  28. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Daran" <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in message
    news:recic2-2i2.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net...
    > A leader will hate you for ever if you just once capture a city from him
    by
    > conquest. (it doesn't upset them if their cities defect to you during
    > peacetime. Don't know about wartime defections, this has never come up.)
    >
    > However, it's not just the civ you're at war with whose attitude may be
    > affected. *Any* civ with nationals in a city you raze or abandon will get
    > totally pissed at you, and the other civs will become progressivly more
    > upset, the more cities you raze.
    >

    Actually, I've captured cities with multiple nationalites and only the one
    I'm fighting is "pissed" at me. I think it might be due to trade deals and
    alliances against the civ the city was taken from. Only after the war is
    over and peace declared do the other civs start getting upset, but only for
    a few trades...
    The best cities to capture where you don't have to starve are the cities
    with a majority of nationals from a "dead" race. They will be so happy that
    you "rescued" them from their conquerers that they join you freely.
  29. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Tzar Sasha" <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
    news:GKzJd.13051$Vj3.9970@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
    >
    > "Daran" <daranSPAMg@lineone.net> wrote in message
    > news:recic2-2i2.ln1@wheresmeshirt.clara.net...
    >> A leader will hate you for ever if you just once capture a city from him
    > by
    >> conquest. (it doesn't upset them if their cities defect to you during
    >> peacetime. Don't know about wartime defections, this has never come up.)
    >>
    >> However, it's not just the civ you're at war with whose attitude may be
    >> affected. *Any* civ with nationals in a city you raze or abandon will
    >> get
    >> totally pissed at you, and the other civs will become progressivly more
    >> upset, the more cities you raze.
    >>
    >
    > Actually, I've captured cities with multiple nationalites and only the one
    > I'm fighting is "pissed" at me. I think it might be due to trade deals
    > and
    > alliances against the civ the city was taken from. Only after the war is
    > over and peace declared do the other civs start getting upset, but only
    > for
    > a few trades...
    > The best cities to capture where you don't have to starve are the cities
    > with a majority of nationals from a "dead" race. They will be so happy
    > that
    > you "rescued" them from their conquerers that they join you freely.

    Civs actually like you having thier citizens in your cities. The problem is
    in having any foriegn nationals at all (even a dead civ) in your cities make
    it more suseptable to flipping.
  30. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    In article <Xns95E8D3C1FB26Akdfosterrogerscom@130.133.1.4>,
    thekeeper@canada.com says...
    >
    > On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and pollution.
    >

    But then, if you chose to display the 'advanced' worker icons, you get
    three distinct icons for these actions. Go figure.

    -P.
  31. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    "Peter Huebner" <no.one@this.address> wrote in message
    news:MPG.1c60ee5f6f08942c9896e1@news.nzl.ihugultra.co.nz...
    > In article <Xns95E8D3C1FB26Akdfosterrogerscom@130.133.1.4>,
    > thekeeper@canada.com says...
    > >
    > > On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and pollution.
    > >
    >
    > But then, if you chose to display the 'advanced' worker icons, you get
    > three distinct icons for these actions. Go figure.
    >
    That is true. And I always use the "advanced" buttons. I've never had a
    problem as what was originally mentioned. Perhaps the advanced buttons keep
    the workers on specific task...
  32. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote in
    news:35ngm8F4n39u4U3@individual.net:

    > On 25 Jan 2005 01:48:59 GMT, Kevin 'Keeper' Foster
    > <thekeeper@canada.com> wrote:
    >> Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote in
    >> news:35l961F4ou0nbU15@individual.net:
    >>
    >>> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 21:50:38 +1100, Garrie Irons
    >>> <girons@optusnet.deletethis.andthis.com.au> wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>> The problem I am reading is "clear jungle, clear forest and
    >>>> clear pollution all have the same keys. change the clear
    >>>> pollution command to use a different keystroke to clearing
    >>>> vegetation".
    >>>
    >>> the letters J and P are on different keys on _my_ keyboard?!?!?!
    >>>
    >>>> Sounds like a user interface change request for Civ 4 to me...
    >>>
    >>> It's already there, at least on civ3 on the Mac.
    >>
    >> On the PC, CTRL-C is for clearing wetlands, forests and
    >> pollution.
    >
    > Does shift-P and shift-J not work to say "go clean up all the
    > pollution /jungle until you're done"? Odd that it'd be implemented
    > on one platform and not the other?

    Yes those work. CTRL-C is for the current tile only.

    --
    ICQ: 8105495
    AIM: KeeperGFA
    EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
    "If we did the things we are capable of,
    we would astound ourselves." - Edison
  33. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    In article <35ngm8F4n39u4U3@individual.net>, DaveHinz@spamcop.net
    says...
    >
    > Does shift-P and shift-J not work to say "go clean up all the pollution
    > /jungle until you're done"? Odd that it'd be implemented on one platform
    > and not the other?
    >
    >

    I am pretty sure shift-P no longer works in Conquests/PC, anyway ... I
    remember being utterly confused by that because I had 'learned' that
    hotkey.
    Then I wasn't sure if I had misremembered :-}

    -P.
  34. Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

    Tzar Sasha <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

    > Actually, I've captured cities with multiple nationalites and only the one
    > I'm fighting is "pissed" at me.

    Now try abandoning the city (or reload the turn you captured it, and raze it
    instead). You'll find that the others hate you for it too.

    --
    Daran

    The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that
    English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words;
    on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them
    unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary. -- James D. Nicoll
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