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A hard question...about file transfer

Last response: in Windows XP
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Anonymous
January 31, 2005 9:49:17 AM

Archived from groups: microsoft.public.windowsxp.messenger (More info?)

I don`t know if there is any one can answer my question.My problem is I can`t
receive any file by using FT. And according to my research , I found the
reason is the interaction of UPnP between WM and my modem.I captured the
message of MSNMS protocol WM sent out,it seems that my WM trying to be a FTP
server,but the truth is my PC is a private IP.Here is my question how WM
detect if the IP is a public IP or there is a NAT out there.
My PC is XP sp1 ,WM5.0428,UPnP enable.
My modem also support UPnP.

BEST Regard~~
Wuted
February 2, 2005 3:14:32 AM

Archived from groups: microsoft.public.windowsxp.messenger (More info?)

Wuted wrote:
> I don`t know if there is any one can answer my question.My problem is I can`t
> receive any file by using FT. And according to my research , I found the
> reason is the interaction of UPnP between WM and my modem.I captured the
> message of MSNMS protocol WM sent out,it seems that my WM trying to be a FTP
> server,but the truth is my PC is a private IP.Here is my question how WM
> detect if the IP is a public IP or there is a NAT out there.
> My PC is XP sp1 ,WM5.0428,UPnP enable.
> My modem also support UPnP.
>
> BEST Regard~~
> Wuted

since your PC has a private IP, you must have a NAT somewhere (either on
a hardware router/gateway, or in XP's Internet Connection Sharing), but
Win Messenger does not need to detect that or need to translate the IP.
Win Messenger just sends and receives stuff, and lets the NAT translate
the IP and forward the sent/received packets. this normally would work
smoothly, if the ports are not blocked by a firewall.

i know Win Messenger uses ports 6891 to 6900 for file transfer, but i
don't know if Win Messenger attempts to open these if they are closed.
maybe somebody smarter than me can answer this. page 739 of Windows XP
Inside Out states "you must add rules to open these ports" and give
instructions on how to do this on page 758. does that mean you must add
rules to your firewall to open these ports, because Win Messenger makes
no attempt to open these dynamically ? whether it does or not, it
should work for you, if you add rules to your firewall to open ports
6891-6900.

i haven't tried it because i have been told here that Limited User
accounts do not have the right to open/close ports. Only Admin accounts
have that right. And since i never surf the wild wild web with an Admin
account, that's the reason (a) i have never tried it, and (b) i don't
use a hardware firewall or XP's built-in firewall. i prefer using
ZoneAlarm because (a) i don't want a one-size-fits-all rule, (b) i don't
want to be forced to expose my Admin account to the internet, especially
with an IM chat program, (c) i don't want to pass every connection
attempt straight through the firewall, without question, (d) i want to
be prompted for my approval whenever a connection is attempted, and (e)
i want to be prompted when programs attempt to reach out to the
internet, in case one does without my knowledge or approval. with
ZoneAlarm i don't even have to know port numbers for Win Messenger, MSN
Messenger, NetMeeting, Dialer, FTP, XP AutoUpdate, antivirus autoupdate,
or any other program.
February 2, 2005 4:01:53 AM

Archived from groups: microsoft.public.windowsxp.messenger (More info?)

JW wrote:
> Wuted wrote:
>
>> I don`t know if there is any one can answer my question.My problem is
>> I can`t receive any file by using FT. And according to my research , I
>> found the reason is the interaction of UPnP between WM and my modem.I
>> captured the message of MSNMS protocol WM sent out,it seems that my WM
>> trying to be a FTP server,but the truth is my PC is a private IP.Here
>> is my question how WM detect if the IP is a public IP or there is a
>> NAT out there.
>> My PC is XP sp1 ,WM5.0428,UPnP enable.
>> My modem also support UPnP.
>>
>> BEST Regard~~
>> Wuted
>
>
> since your PC has a private IP, you must have a NAT somewhere (either on
> a hardware router/gateway, or in XP's Internet Connection Sharing), but
> Win Messenger does not need to detect that or need to translate the IP.
> Win Messenger just sends and receives stuff, and lets the NAT translate
> the IP and forward the sent/received packets. this normally would work
> smoothly, if the ports are not blocked by a firewall.
>
> i know Win Messenger uses ports 6891 to 6900 for file transfer, but i
> don't know if Win Messenger attempts to open these if they are closed.
> maybe somebody smarter than me can answer this. page 739 of Windows XP
> Inside Out states "you must add rules to open these ports" and give
> instructions on how to do this on page 758. does that mean you must add
> rules to your firewall to open these ports, because Win Messenger makes
> no attempt to open these dynamically ? whether it does or not, it
> should work for you, if you add rules to your firewall to open ports
> 6891-6900.
>
> i haven't tried it because i have been told here that Limited User
> accounts do not have the right to open/close ports. Only Admin accounts
> have that right. And since i never surf the wild wild web with an Admin
> account, that's the reason (a) i have never tried it, and (b) i don't
> use a hardware firewall or XP's built-in firewall. i prefer using
> ZoneAlarm because (a) i don't want a one-size-fits-all rule, (b) i don't
> want to be forced to expose my Admin account to the internet, especially
> with an IM chat program, (c) i don't want to pass every connection
> attempt straight through the firewall, without question, (d) i want to
> be prompted for my approval whenever a connection is attempted, and (e)
> i want to be prompted when programs attempt to reach out to the
> internet, in case one does without my knowledge or approval. with
> ZoneAlarm i don't even have to know port numbers for Win Messenger, MSN
> Messenger, NetMeeting, Dialer, FTP, XP AutoUpdate, antivirus autoupdate,
> or any other program.

i see Jonathan Kay answered this earlier for cases using the firewall
built into XP SP2. my answer only referred to the firewall built into
XP SP1. He said the following:

Hi Joe,

Actually yes, it should work under limited users just fine. Admin
privileges were only
required before when the firewall was engaged (it still would've worked
through an UPnP NAT).
The SP2 firewall allows you to simply set an Exception for Windows
Messenger to fully access
the connection (so this isn't an issue anymore).
____________________________________________
Jonathan Kay
Microsoft MVP - Windows Messenger/MSN Messenger
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