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UT2007 Now UT III

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January 28, 2007 1:06:10 AM

Sorry I don't have good news to announce but:

Unreal Tournament 2007 has now been officially changed to Unreal Tournament III : Necris Rising

Also after watching this interview it seems that it may in fact get pushed back again to Fall... instead of the rumored June as everyone had hoped.

Interview with Reins and Producer

More about : ut2007 iii

January 29, 2007 4:23:08 PM

What really pissed me off is in their latest trailer theres a sign says from the studio that brought you Gears of War. That just to show you the priorities when it comes to PC gamers vs console gamers. I wish they would start making PC exclusive games like Crysis, and FEAR was for a while. How come consoles can have exclusives but PC games always get ported over to consoles. The last time i checked PC gamers are a much larger group than the console gamers all together.

Microsoft said it on their press conference PC Gamers : 220million people Xbox360: 11-12 million people. Yet the precious consoles always more important the the PC gamers. I don't get it. :evil: 

As for the push back it has a lot to do with the still unreleased ATI DX10 video card and the crap Vista drivers. They probably want to wait until the drivers are good on Vista before they release their game. If you look around all the DX10 games got pushed back to Q2 and Q3 of 2007.
January 29, 2007 7:14:06 PM

Quote:
What really pissed me off is in their latest trailer theres a sign says from the studio that brought you Gears of War. That just to show you the priorities when it comes to PC gamers vs console gamers. I wish they would start making PC exclusive games like Crysis, and FEAR was for a while. How come consoles can have exclusives but PC games always get ported over to consoles. The last time i checked PC gamers are a much larger group than the console gamers all together.


How quickly we are forgotten... and I agree completely... why not "Brought to you by the Studio that Brought you Unreal Tournament GAME OF THE YEAR" :x

Quote:
Microsoft said it on their press conference PC Gamers : 220million people Xbox360: 11-12 million people. Yet the precious consoles always more important the the PC gamers. I don't get it. :evil:  .


I would assume because the console kiddies are buying many more games than the contented PC gamers with 1 to 5 games tops in their library.

Quote:
As for the push back it has a lot to do with the still unreleased ATI DX10 video card and the crap Vista drivers. They probably want to wait until the drivers are good on Vista before they release their game. If you look around all the DX10 games got pushed back to Q2 and Q3 of 2007.


Again I believe you are correct, DX 10 drivers have not been ironed out and UT has boasted all over their site to be a DX 10 game. This has however given Epic Games some time to improve upon content and a few changes have been made these last few months due in part to commentary from the media and forum members.
Related resources
January 29, 2007 7:25:18 PM

Quote:
What really pissed me off is in their latest trailer theres a sign says from the studio that brought you Gears of War. That just to show you the priorities when it comes to PC gamers vs console gamers. I wish they would start making PC exclusive games like Crysis, and FEAR was for a while. How come consoles can have exclusives but PC games always get ported over to consoles. The last time i checked PC gamers are a much larger group than the console gamers all together.


It's called marketing. I know it rubs you the wrong way to see mention of a console game, but that sells games to people who don't follow industry developments very well. Gears of War sold 3 million units so far, so gaming newbs will be stoked by the mention of it. Besides, UT3 is coming to PC, PS3, and 360, so it's not a stretch to mention GoW.

As for PC exclusives, akhilles had a thread a while back that sadly got very little attention. (2007 PC Game Line-up) There are a lot of PC exclusives coming.
January 29, 2007 7:41:01 PM

Quote:
There are a lot of PC exclusives coming.


And the only one in particular I care about. UT is basically the only option for high speed action FPS... without the BS kiddie story lines. BF2142 and Quake doesn't feel right to me.

Thanks for the link VB
January 29, 2007 8:19:48 PM

Quote:
It's called marketing.


Well even if it is called marketing how come that they dont market to the PC gamer crowd which is 220 million vs 12 million console crowd. I know theres the piracy issue on the PC and all that stuff but even if 90% of PC gamers (most unlikely) use pirated software and only 10% of them pays for the games that is still a much larger number vs the console gamers. I just dont get it how could they make more money on console gaming than on PC gaming.

To me PC gaming is the one that moves the whole gaming industry forward since all the cutting edge hardware gets to be released to the PC and after we are done with it they used a slightly modified versions of those hardware in consoles. We are the ones who has to pay the high prices for everything inlcuding new hardware every few years new video cards (my video card cost more than a PS3 console) and now new OS, where the console kidos gets to enjoy everything, on the cheap. Which is fine but i feel offended by after spending all that money and being a PC gamer in the past 25 years since the good old commodore 64 days we are the ones that put to the 2nd spot after the console gamers.

Basically we are the ones paving the road for the console games. Most of those titles are came from the PC that are all best sellers now on the console. Also they are so out for the fact that GoW sold 3 million copies well WOW on the PC has 8 million subscribers and that is not a one time payment thing like GoW where you buy the game and thats it WOW is and MMO so you pay the monthly fee after you bought the game. So to me theres a lot more money to be made on the PC side of gaming than on the console and yet we are the ones that developers don't give a sh1te about the most.

I really hope DX10 and some of the games in 2k7 will change all that and PC gaming will be back on the top again at the cutting edge where it belongs.


Sorry for the rant and the long post just had to let it out :) 
January 29, 2007 8:59:37 PM

Owhmmmmm...... Owhmmmmm....... wooooooosaaaaahhhh, just let it out man.

Its not that PC gaming is considered 2nd teir by thier numbers... its that PCs are looked upon as something other than a gaming platform unfortunately.

Its all about the marketing, and yes, PC game marketing is almost non existant... mainly due to online resources. TV Time slots are expensive and even the very large game developers feel they have more growth potential in the console market because these kids are gonna grow up some day... and keep using consoles... unless they become educated of course.

Consoles are easier to play... learning to use the keyboard and mouse takes a great deal of coordination which takes too much time for the average attention span of a 16 yo or younger to master.

I think as far as PCs leading the way for consoles... I guess one could argue that Atari was among the first... but have there really been breakthrough ideas regarding games come out in the last 7 - 8 years... if you count MMOs - they haven't really tapped into that on the console yet.

Onslaught was a nice twist in UT... though I think another game had already come out with Vehicles mixed fighting.

And don't forget the TI99... cutting edge tech!
January 29, 2007 9:31:28 PM

Quote:
Well even if it is called marketing how come that they dont market to the PC gamer crowd which is 220 million vs 12 million console crowd.


Could you provide a link to that PC/console gamers info? I ignored it the first time, but both of you kept going on it, so I'll say my piece.

This statistic from MS is biased. Don't jump all over it. It seems to me it was likely used to describe the potential of bringing Live Anywhere into the PC demographic. That said, it has no bearing on marketing whatsoever.

First, the definition of PC gamers is not given. Every version of Windows comes with solitaire, pinball, etc. Does that mean that everyone who uses Windows is a PC gamer? There are a lot of PC users that download games like Bejeweled as well. Does that make them PC gamers? Well, in terms of Live Anywhere, it most certainly does, as many arcade games on Xbox Live Arcade would be instant hits with those in that userbase. But in the case of UT3, it does not, as it caters to a crowd of hardcore, not casual, gamers. The same ones who want GoW, on 360 or PC.

Second, they only used one console, and a new one at that, to represent all console gamers. The 360 has only been out a year and doesn't come close to representing how many people are actually console gamers. To get a closer estimate they should have looked at the PS2. But that wouldn't help them if they were talking about Live Anywhere as all Sony systems, as well as the original Xbox and any other consoles besides the 360, are incompatible with the new initiative.

Never take any statistics from MS/Sony/Nintendo without a source and without knowing what they actually intend to prove from the stats.


I will try to keep my comments on the rest of your post brief.

If you think consoles steal hardware innovations from PC, perhaps I need to remind you about the video hardware in the 360, the Cell in PS3, and the Wii-mote. They steal ideas from each other, but innovations are on both sides of the line.

If you think console gaming is cheap, perhaps it's time to convert to the dark side and learn first hand. :twisted: It isn't cheap. Nothing worth doing is. The solution is to spend money only on what you think is worth it.

GoW and WoW, besides having "of War" in their titles, have nothing in common and are non-comparable. An MMO out for a year and a TPS out for a couple months should not be compared in sales or revenue. But UT3 is comparable to GoW, and Epic compared it because they both appeal to shooter fans.

There are two reasons consoles are getting so much attention right now, they're new and they're easier to develop for than they ever have been. Although the development will get easier with experience, their new-ness will wear off. It always has and always will as hardware stagnates and users become less enthused by the hype. We're right now on the peak of that oscillation. Wait for the trough of console gaming and you'll feel at home again.
January 29, 2007 9:53:00 PM

I agree with you in some of your point of view except this:
Quote:

If you think consoles steal hardware innovations from PC, perhaps I need to remind you about the video hardware in the 360, the Cell in PS3, and the Wii-mote. They steal ideas from each other, but innovations are on both sides of the line.

If you think console gaming is cheap, perhaps it's time to convert to the dark side and learn first hand. :twisted: It isn't cheap. Nothing worth doing is. The solution is to spend money only on what you think is worth it.


As far as i know the video hardware of the PS3 and Xbox and Xbox 360 was developed by Nvidia and Ati they are both the main and biggest graphics card developers for PC's not just gaming. If the video hardware was either sony or Microsoft own invention then yeah but they bought a technology that came from the PC world. Maybe they are a little different from the PC version but the hardware itself came straight from the PC. Hell all those new consoles are just PC's geared towards gaming nothing else.


As for console gaming is cheap. It sure is. On the price of a 8800GTX vide card i can get a PS3 or almost 2 Xbox360 consoles. Now on the consoles ones you have your consoles all you have to do is buy the games. Not on the PC. I don't think you can play the latest and greatest games on your 5 years old PC. Pretty much every 2-3 years you need to upgrade everything in your PC in order to get the best looks out of the newest games, not on the console. I dont want to get into this argument because that would be a whole other thread but i was fed up with that crap that is going on with PC gaming a few months ago and i went out to get myself a brand new shiny Xbox 360. After 2 days of playing GoW i returned the Xbox and got my money back. That tells you everything.

Dont give me wrong i love PC gaming and i dont mind spending money on my PC (unlike my wife she does mind me spending money on it) but i just hate to see when hardcore PC game maker firms advertise their games with "console gaming is where its at" stamped all over it.

As for how many gamers playing on windows and if they play solitaire i am not sure but here is the video i was talking about where i saw the numbers i mentioned earlier: http://www.gamespot.com/search.html?qs=ces%20microsoft&...
January 29, 2007 10:22:03 PM

The graphics chip in the 360 (Xenos) was made by ATI (PS3 and Xbox was nVidia). They used a different department to develop it as it had a different RAM architecture, allowing for full-scene anti-aliasing and alpha blending with no performance hit, and utilized unified shaders, a technology which neither company used until nVidia released the G80 and one which ATI still hasn't released for PC. Using PC hardware companies and using PC hardware are completely different.

I can understand your finacial point of view, but I don't share it as a 8800 GTX isn't even close to an option for me, or most gamers. $250 is the graphical sweet spot for me. $200 for CPUs and mobo. My experience with console gaming may be different than yours, but I think I've spent over 1500 on my 360, splitting the cost of shared components with my PC, like the monitor and speaker system, and not including games.

Quote:
i was fed up with that crap that is going on with PC gaming a few months ago and i went out to get myself a brand new shiny Xbox 360. After 2 days of playing GoW i returned the Xbox and got my money back. That tells you everything.


Did you forget that was me you talked to about that? :lol:  (Need some HELP PLEASE !)
January 29, 2007 11:09:13 PM

Quote:

Did you forget that was me you talked to about that? :lol:  (Need some HELP PLEASE !)


Nope i did not forget that. :)  I remember you. I said it before i really appreciated you advice and i went through with my decision and like i already said in this forum i am not against PC gaming since i went through the whole Xbox experience, and like i mentioned on that other thread i came back to PC gaming because the console made me realize that PC gaming is what keeps me entertained. I understand you like console games i did not.
January 29, 2007 11:56:54 PM

I had a PS2... I thought it would be more challenging than the PC since I was unfamiliar with using the controller. I also hoped that the shooter experience on the console would provide me some relief from a stagnant shooter shortage on the PC before UT2004 came out.

One week of it and I looked at my new purchase in disgust. I just don't get it. What is the draw to consoles? The games were slow and the AI reminded me of those old days playing Atari 2600.

I'm sure it has gotten better now... I have seen kids at Walmart playing the PS3 and the graphics look great, but being still so linear - lacking the dimensions i have come to be accustomed to... it would take a serious change for me to even consider consoles ever again.

As I wait patiently for UTIII.............
February 2, 2007 1:05:21 PM

Its not Quake 3.

/End.
February 2, 2007 2:11:30 PM

:? Do you want it to be?
February 2, 2007 2:26:35 PM

Yes and I will tell you why :D 

There hasnt been an online FPS like Q3, in terms of coding, fluidity, intuitive movement and balance. All Unreal tournament has done is convince the masses that bigger and better will come (progress); when of course this is not the case.

When it aint broke dont fix it. This statement is true, the problem is because there are people out there making new things that are bigger brighter and better; we all naturally believe they all WILL be better; and sometimes this is not true!

Its Friday afternoon, and my thoughts end with

Q3>Unreal 2xxx.
February 2, 2007 3:17:22 PM

UT1 > Q3 :wink:
February 2, 2007 3:56:32 PM

Quote:
UT1 > Q3 :wink:


Seconded!

I could not quite get into quake III... the perspective of the weapon view in first person felt cheap... maybe it was the overall look of the weapons... I don't know.

I liked the transporter.

But UT99 became game of the year for good reason... musical scores, fluidity(as well), and a crap load of players.

UTIII promises to go back to the feel of UT99, with the exception of slower strafing & Dodging - I certainly hope so.

I appreciate your loyalty to Quake dj. I wouldn't attempt to explain why YOU like it... I stay out of those arguments of speculation.

UTIII will likely offer roughly the same gameplay as Quake... and having one or the other offers little difference.

And besides... I will more than likely get QuakeWars for the comparison.
February 3, 2007 2:57:48 PM

Interesting points analyst, I did try UT just after starting Q3, and they were very different games beyond the obvious fps online shooter moniker.

What I appreciated more than anything about Q3 was the effort that had gone into the coding of the game. If we look at big titles now such as F.E.A.R and Battlefield and compare them in terms of how they use a PC's hardware compared to Q3 it is simply sloppy; requiring a much much higher spec comparable PC to play them at an enjoyable frame rate. Not only that but the netcode for Q3 in my opinion has not been bettered.

I enjoyed unreal and had a go at UT but at the time when these two games were taking off with ISDN connections becoming available Q3 was; and still is in a league of its own; to conclude I will accept that all games have an 'online lifespan'; and neither game is remotely as popular as they once were but Q3 is still played regularly on European servers and still has a community. This stretches back to early 1999 when it was released; and I think that speaks for itself.

As a footnote, the only other online game I have found since with the same wow factor was Battlefield 1942...simply brilliant!!

M
February 12, 2007 7:18:05 PM

Hi YA,

I played UT2004 : my first 1rst person shooter, of course the Pilgrim did well at it. then I played Half Life 2: it was OK but not as real as unreal. Now, I have played FEAR leaving me to at least realize that unreal is the best game out there!

Am I wrong? Now I want to re-load it (that'l take a day or tew)

Is there an unreal 3? can an knowlegeble player direct to information that will get me up to speen on unreal so I can make people suffer again?

Thanks.
!