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IBM Lays Off 2,400 People As Jobs Go Overseas

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  • IBM
  • Job Market
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March 3, 2010 5:42:22 PM

Same old story, different company. :( 
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March 3, 2010 5:48:55 PM

wildwellSame old story, different company.

It's not EVEN different company... IBM has been laying off US workers in favor of datacenters in India, Russia, and Argentina for several years now.
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March 3, 2010 5:55:45 PM

:( 
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March 3, 2010 5:59:23 PM

This is so sad.
How does IBM expect Americans to afford their products when they fire them all?
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March 3, 2010 5:59:31 PM

its companies like this and others who are helping destroy our North American economy, were in a major recession/depression right now and people are losing the jobs to foreigners who will work for little next to nothing. I wish that the people overseas would realize that there getting screwed too, all they are doing is setting the president that people will work for little or nothing, they should be getting paid a lot more money. If there were actually REAL tariffs on internationally traded companies they would be much more inclined to stay in North America rather then go overseas to exploit poor people, which in turn, makes us just as poor.
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March 3, 2010 5:59:37 PM

Globalization vs Local Taxes/Tax incentives vs Unions vs Recession. Ok fight!
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Anonymous
March 3, 2010 6:01:20 PM

I hope IBM fails entirely.
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March 3, 2010 6:04:54 PM

Just wait when tariffs really hammer these traitorous conglomerates. They drive down wages at home while they enslave people over seas for pennies on the dollar, a wonderful world right only for some deranged globalist.
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March 3, 2010 6:20:49 PM

our model of macroeconomics needs some (re)adjustments... This nonsense about cheap labour going to other nations simply doesn't make any sense anymore, it's getting out of control. At what point does it go so far out of balance where it doesn't even make any sense at all. I mean, if you take away 2,400 jobs, that's 2,400 less people buying things to make your economy viable and competitive. I know that's a simplified example, but I just don't get it. I was laid off a while back and as a result I spend a lot less than I did before, so how much money is really being saved if now people are also buying less products? Sheesh...
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March 3, 2010 6:26:23 PM

welcome to capitalism....
Its strange isn't it..we "hate" government regulation on the corporate sector but end up scratching our heads when the companies run after profits and lay off employees here in the US....
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March 3, 2010 6:30:54 PM

omnimodis78our model of macroeconomics needs some (re)adjustments... This nonsense about cheap labour going to other nations simply doesn't make any sense anymore, it's getting out of control. At what point does it go so far out of balance where it doesn't even make any sense at all. I mean, if you take away 2,400 jobs, that's 2,400 less people buying things to make your economy viable and competitive. I know that's a simplified example, but I just don't get it. I was laid off a while back and as a result I spend a lot less than I did before, so how much money is really being saved if now people are also buying less products? Sheesh...


well this is how it works.... 2400 loose jobs(2400X5=12,000 loose income), unemployment grows...supply of labor far exceeds demand, price (=wages) or labor goes down, it goes so down that it goes below india's and then companies cut jobs in India (create major economic havoc there) and start hiring in the US.... and the cycle continues....
In the end, companies, CEOs, Share holders go from rich to super rich and employees in US and India(and the world) suffer and pick up the pieces.
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March 3, 2010 6:30:58 PM

Its a good thing we provide them with tax breaks so they can invest the money in overseas jobs.
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March 3, 2010 6:35:37 PM

crabvomitI hope IBM fails entirely.


So you want 397,000 people to be out of their jobs because they outsourced less than 1% of their workforce? Maybe they had to do it to stay competitive, just a thought.
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March 3, 2010 6:44:45 PM

This has been a growing trend for the last decade. IBM is not the only company now moving many jobs over seas for cheaper labor. EDS did it for several years, HP and DELL have been doing it for years, Allstate Insurance started doing it last year.

This isn't something that is going to end any time soon...........
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March 3, 2010 6:58:03 PM

So where are the Party of No right now?
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March 3, 2010 7:09:37 PM

The trick is to lower the minimum wage here and raise tariffs on overseas jobs to keep those jobs here. People would rather have a lower paying job than no job, except for those who get welfare and wont get a job for fear of losing their free money.
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Anonymous
March 3, 2010 7:11:50 PM

“A Native American grandfather talking to his young grandson tells the boy he has two wolves inside of him struggling with each other. The first is the wolf of peace, love and kindness. The other wolf is fear, greed and hatred. "Which wolf will win, grandfather?" asks the young boy. "Whichever one I feed," is the reply.”

- Native American Proverb

I wonder which one corporations have been feeding?
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March 3, 2010 7:13:43 PM

Here's to the IBM CEO and Executive Mangement rotting in hell. Cheers!

Any company that thinks off-shoring their work is going to improve their position is lead by complete idiots. I have seen the work results of these moves and its a joke.

"We can save X amount of dollars by off-shoring". You can lose X amount of business by building, developing and supporting crap products too. Any company that off-shores should seriously have their management reviewed for incompetence.



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March 3, 2010 7:21:45 PM

The comments here are ridiculous. There are tons of educated people outside of the U.S. that are willing to work for a fraction of the cost Americans are willing to work. And you say the companies are being greedy?

For the record, I am American.
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March 3, 2010 7:22:44 PM

"The trick is to lower the minimum wage here and raise tariffs on overseas jobs to keep those jobs here. People would rather have a lower paying job than no job, except for those who get welfare and wont get a job for fear of losing their free money."

I'm gonna have to disagree with the lowering the minimum wage here, tarriffs alone would curb companies from moving outside the country, lowering our wages would only further the demise of our economy here, like someone mentioned earlier, people who make less money spend less money. if can't feed the economy by purchasing goods and services the economy will dwindle and die. Not to mention that its circular, if we allow these companies to do business like this we will all become slaves working for pennies. A company who has operations in North America should be bound by the same regulations that they have here. Its like how Shell has to abide by strict environmental laws in North America, but they can pollute all they want in South America, poisoning drinking water and causing serious hardships for the people who live there. its a double standard.
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March 3, 2010 7:24:38 PM

"The comments here are ridiculous. There are tons of educated people outside of the U.S. that are willing to work for a fraction of the cost Americans are willing to work. And you say the companies are being greedy?

For the record, I am American."

You might think differently when you lose your job.
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March 3, 2010 7:26:08 PM

People have unrealistic expectations of how much they are worth in the US. It's the same reason so many people remained unemployed for so long instead of getting crap retail jobs at Sears.
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March 3, 2010 7:28:17 PM

thejester420"The trick is to lower the minimum wage here and raise tariffs on overseas jobs to keep those jobs here. People would rather have a lower paying job than no job, except for those who get welfare and wont get a job for fear of losing their free money."I'm gonna have to disagree with the lowering the minimum wage here, tarriffs alone would curb companies from moving outside the country, lowering our wages would only further the demise of our economy here, like someone mentioned earlier, people who make less money spend less money. if can't feed the economy by purchasing goods and services the economy will dwindle and die. Not to mention that its circular, if we allow these companies to do business like this we will all become slaves working for pennies. A company who has operations in North America should be bound by the same regulations that they have here. Its like how Shell has to abide by strict environmental laws in North America, but they can pollute all they want in South America, poisoning drinking water and causing serious hardships for the people who live there. its a double standard.



You are missing something very important: inflation. If we are overpaid (earn more than we produce) then what the market dictates; the value of the US dollar will decline.
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March 3, 2010 7:28:25 PM

Come on folks, how can there be rich unless there are large number of poor, how can there be uber rich unless there are vast numbers of poor. We should hold a telethon for these corporate CEO's, CFO's, COO's etc. They have it hard trying to make themselves uber rich and their shareholders rich and trying to guise is as keeping their corporations afloat. Slavery was only outsourced folks it wasn't eradicated.
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March 3, 2010 7:33:48 PM

Its something that could end soon depending on the economic situation within the US. The biggest problem is the attached costs with the employees. You have the salary ofcourse, but you also have to deal with Payroll taxes and Union benefits. If you are a businessman doing business in the US is nothing but charity, it doesn't make sense to hire in the US unless you have to. If the grocery store could hire its cashiers to work from India they would.

The only ways this will change is if the US reforms labor laws, drops minimum wage, reduces payroll taxes, or its economy collapses. There needs to be a serious retraction of the US Federal government so the cost of living within the US can drop.
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March 3, 2010 7:36:11 PM

"You are missing something very important: inflation. If we are overpaid (earn more than we produce) then what the market dictates; the value of the US dollar will decline."

OK, but ask yourself, what causes inflation? why its the foreign banks that own and dictate or currency, controlling interest rates and the value of the dollar. The dollar is collapsing and losing value by design. we are definitely not overpaid, the dollar has lost almost all of its value, if anything we need to be paid more. i don't see how becoming a third world country will help anyone, including the corporations
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March 3, 2010 7:45:55 PM

All the big heads at IBM want raises, so outsourcing is the only answer. The rich get richer. A thicker wallet is the only thing on their mind, not American loyalty. Thier lives would just fall apart if they can't have a different car to drive every day of the week.
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March 3, 2010 7:46:35 PM

thejester420"You are missing something very important: inflation. If we are overpaid (earn more than we produce) then what the market dictates; the value of the US dollar will decline."OK, but ask yourself, what causes inflation? why its the foreign banks that own and dictate or currency, controlling interest rates and the value of the dollar. The dollar is collapsing and losing value by design. we are definitely not overpaid, the dollar has lost almost all of its value, if anything we need to be paid more. i don't see how becoming a third world country will help anyone, including the corporations


Several causes of inflation: overspending, printing more money, establishing minimum wage, excess financing, consuming more than you produce as a country, etc.

You really think paying everyone more is NOT going to cause inflation!?!?

If you don't realize that then there is no point in continuing this....good luck thinking you are worth more than you really are.
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March 3, 2010 8:00:10 PM

I think im worth a 6 figure income..and thankfully Im in a union and they think so too so therefore I get it.
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March 3, 2010 8:02:14 PM

TwoDigitalIt's not EVEN different company... IBM has been laying off US workers in favor of datacenters in India, Russia, and Argentina for several years now.


I know, I live in one of those countries, so yay ! more jobs for us !
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March 3, 2010 8:21:40 PM

So we can blame you for the shoddy support, half ass'd products we get these days?

At least we now have someone to blame. :) 
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March 3, 2010 8:27:22 PM

Again, this is not just computers and telemarketing jobs. Manufacturing is outsourced ridiculously in this country. We don't even make our own steel in this country any more, we ship in the cheap stuff or recycle the more expensive, which is sad considering how much of it we use. I hope we somehow find a massive diamond cache in Kansas or something, because the only thing we export to the world are environmental complaints and fat people.
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March 3, 2010 8:33:38 PM

damn you, IBM.
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March 3, 2010 8:35:07 PM

gayanwelcome to capitalism....Its strange isn't it..we "hate" government regulation on the corporate sector but end up scratching our heads when the companies run after profits and lay off employees here in the US....


or it is a sign that us Americans should work harder...
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March 3, 2010 8:35:34 PM

Damn you, IBM. Just keep screwing the US workforce and giving people an even harder time trying to find a decent job.
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March 3, 2010 8:59:11 PM

I blame Obama.
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March 3, 2010 9:34:45 PM

Nexus52085Damn you, IBM. Just keep screwing the US workforce and giving people an even harder time trying to find a decent job.


Actually its a well known fact that America has some of the hardest workers in the world. Its not about us being lazy at all its that we dont come cheap. Its much more expensive to live in a first world nation vs a third. We wont work for the wages they do in other countries. What they pay in other countries is considered under the poverty level in this country.
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March 3, 2010 9:35:44 PM

Damn it. Was trying to quote cheepstuff
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Anonymous
March 3, 2010 9:55:56 PM

yamagiru's comment was ignorant. This current batch of layoffs is not the only one. IBM has been systematically reducing its American headcount for about a decade now. Last year, around 10,000 of our people got let go. IBM's goal is at least 80% them and 20% or less of us. So, yeah, the closer to that they go, the less it hurts us any worse than their betrayal of America already has. Let'em fail.
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March 3, 2010 10:35:49 PM

You know all I have to say is good for them. Now maybe they get some work done. Dam sure no one going to do it here. Most ppl in the U.S. expect things, like more money for doing nothing more, and I can't see now that not part of the problem. We want to blame other for what we have done. We vote, and the ppl we let in are the same ppl that own these companies. Didn't you all know that The Bushes are in to oil. I wounder why we have started two wars with the countries that seem to have the power over oil. I know you all are not going to like what I have said, and all I have to say to you is "Whatever".
words of leafman420
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March 3, 2010 10:51:45 PM

Oh sorry its "can't see how" not "can't see now". :)  also them ppl over seas are starving, and need ppl to care for there troubles. Not have the "Haves", tell the "have nots" how they are making there life bad. I'm sure they have it worse off then any of us.
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March 3, 2010 11:48:13 PM

I work for IBM in Argentina. My getting this job meant 2 or 3 people in the US were fired. Maybe I should, but the fact is I don't feel bad for them. Perhaps is because I've always taken sides with the Rebellion and hated the Empire in Star Wars.
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March 3, 2010 11:48:26 PM

I work for IBM in Argentina. My getting this job meant 2 or 3 people in the US were fired. Maybe I should, but the fact is I don't feel bad for them. Perhaps is because I've always taken sides with the Rebellion and hated the Empire in Star Wars.
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March 3, 2010 11:49:51 PM

What do you guys expect? If every American was willing to pay more for an item and stopped shopping at wallmart and other huge discount chains then the jobs would stay here as it would make sense for companies like IBM and other huge companies to employ more Americans for higher wages. If pices go up it leads to profit then the profits are then distributed to the CEO and on the rest of the employment ladder. The current business model can't work that well in America so all of our high tech and manufacturing jobs are shipped overseas where it is so much cheaper. Big Business's just don't give a damn about national pride or ethics they are in it for the money. If you guys are worried about not getting a job, go to school get yourself a degree in in any science or mathematical field. This country strives on innovation. The trend now, is America invents the best stuff and has third world nations build it for us to use. Long gone the days where America builds the stuff it invents. My point is go to school and don't be a burn out!
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March 3, 2010 11:51:57 PM

There really aren't any rich greedy bastards in IBM who will get a bonus from switching its labor sector. IBM is like a collective that somehow gets things done. There are some at IBM who earn large salaries, but not on the scale of a top 100 richest people and they are usually getting then from commissions based on sales.
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March 3, 2010 11:52:02 PM

ncr7002I know, I live in one of those countries, so yay ! more jobs for us !


:)  Me 2
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March 4, 2010 12:00:30 AM

One important factor that people are missing is the company bottom line. If they have lower expenses (salaries), they shouldn't have to charge as much for their products.

There's nothing wrong with trying to achieve a good wage. However, it needs to be kept in perspective. This is one problem I have with increasing minimum wage. When these lower paid employees get their .25 more per hour, the employer will simply raise prices to help cover the additional expenses.

I used to work in a grocery store. Most of the people that worked there, earned close to minimum wage. Most also bought their groceries there. When minimum wage increased, so did the cost of the groceries. Their extra $10 per week was already absorbed in their grocery bill. Not to mention, they will pay more at the gas station, theater, fast food restaurants, and most other places that pay lower wages.
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Anonymous
March 4, 2010 12:11:35 AM

ok, there is some misinformation floating around. I work for IBM as a field technician. my branch lost about 15 people including my manager. These are not jobs that went anywhere, but because a lot of companies cut there IT budget because of the economy, we lost contracts. So if we don't have the contracts to do the repair, was IBM supposed to pay technicians to sit around all day with nothing to do? Also here is a thought that most of you missed, IBM doesn't make computers or laptops....we sold that part of the company to Lenovo a Chinese company. We make and sell servers/power 6/power 7/ System 390/ Storage/ Infrastructure. We don't make printers anymore, sold that to Ricoh.

So companies buy our product more than individuals in the private sector.

Also what isn't seen is most of the people that IBM laid off had over 30 years and full retirement, of the guys we lost 34 yrs of service was the least.
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March 4, 2010 12:42:12 AM

Pretty soon, there will not be a need to outsource anymore. That is because Globalization and "Free Trade"(No tariffs for businesses) is an invisible force moving masses of people across borders where cheap labor is needed. Why do you think border enforcement between US and MExico is non-existant? Capitalism wants the cheapest labor it can get, and exploited Mexicans provide plenty of it. Now you don't need to outsource your cashier job, as someone here mentioned.

Capitalism is different from the Old World system; Unlike the pre-capitalist world, which required Lords to house and feed their serfs/slaves/servants, capitalism requires people to house and feed themselves, and if they cannot, they fall through the crack. To them, we are just an expendable labor pool, a costly one at that(relative to the global market). As has been mentioned, who will purchase things now? Well, those countries where the jobs are being shifted. We do not manufacture anymore, we provide services mainly.
You got to think globally, this is leading to a wider gulf between the powerful/wealthy and the not-rich. It's to the point where politicians do not affect policy decisions anymore. They merely vote on pre-selected choices, just like we do for elections.

Politics: The process of distribution of scarce resources and values across society.

All you got to do is look at where resources are being allocated!
Corporate bailouts and War!(Man politicians and Corporations bed together, I swear). What happened to education? Are we becoming a dumber workforce? Or a dumber population? Who knows, but we will see the result of budget cuts to education in the next few decades indeed.

Governments here cut budgets rather than raise taxes because it has less affect on the rich. Plus people perceive it less negatively overall.

Enough of my rant :-p
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